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Heinicke Hive: The LEGEND of Taylor Heinicke Thread

LetThePointsSoar

By LetThePointsSoar
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Renegade7

Renegade7

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This **** is going in circles.

 

If we commit to Taylor, hes going to get coaching and development to help with his accuracy issues.

 

But folks trying to stay objective in here are getting remmed for it, its not right.  Not much you can do with folks that are all in, pick your battles.

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Morneblade

Morneblade

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3 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

 

 

I've said this multiple times now, so I won't completely rehash it. But for me, the main issue with Heinicke is throwing earlier and with more anticipation instead of waiting and trying to make throws he simply doesn't have the arm talent to make. That was how all 3 of those dropped INTs happened yesterday.

 

Earlier is the real key here. He has been throwing with anticipation. He's been accurate. But he has been late on some throws, and it's been that that has caused the vast majority of issues. A perfect example is that throw to Terry coming across the field that was almost picked off at the sidelines. TH double clutched on it, like he didn't completely trust what he saw, and then gave the safety time to make a play. The throws that when he first sees it, it's a big gain.

 

This is something that, considering what he was doing last year, and not really working with the 1's until week 2, we can cut some slack on for now. But yes, this is something that he can absolutely improve on. We all agree on it.

 

Really.

 

All that being said, he was more accurate than Matty Ice yesterday, and our D is worse against the pass. Taylor played well, and he was great down the stretch.

 

AGAIN.

 

He out dueled a former league MVP. For a guy that was sleeping on his sisters couch this time last year, taking online classes, he's doing pretty well. And maybe he is not a franchise QB. Maybe he is not and HoF QB. But he's playing well. And we're winning because of him, not in spite of him. He's kept us in 3 or 4 games, while the defense hasn't even though of showing up yet.

 

Imagine, if you will, being a undrafted guy, that kicked around practice squads until you end up out of football. Then get talked out of retirement to then become a quarantine QB, to Playoff starter. To making a team, and now being the starter for the next several weeks.

 

With the vaunted Defense you were supposed to be able to lean on being completely absent. Knowing it was on YOU to win a shoot out every single game?

 

That's a lot of pressure.

 

Do you realize that we're 11th in points? Top 1/3? Who thought we'd have that going for us with even Fitz?

 

While trying to be objective, you're not really giving him credit for what he IS doing well. Which is quite a few things. He had a couple balls yesterday where he was late and things could have been real bad.

 

But Terry dropped a perfect pass on the last drive, that was almost a fumble, that would have been a big gain. Seals Jones dropped 2 passes yesterday. One was a perfect pass, the other was a ball placed where only he could get it. The last one forced killed a drive. I haven't seen one comment about those.

 

I dunno, maybe enjoy things a little more. TH has been fun to watch, and he's been good. Some times real good.

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ODU AGGIE

ODU AGGIE

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4 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

Why does it have to be quantified? He throws high a lot. He’s missed a few throws. Made a few good ones as well but he’s put receivers in dangerous positions more often than I’m comfortable with. Like I said, I hope it’s something that improves over the year. I’m not asking you to take your Taylor poster down from the wall not resign from his fan club.Why are people taking it personally when I say id like to see him improve against good competition before I’m comfortable with him going forward?

First, he does not throw high "a lot". He's missed a few throws? What QB doesn't miss a few throws? But seven times out of ten he completes the pass, and those are not misses. I don't have his picture on a wall, and if he has a fan club, I know nothing about it. Lastly, I'm not taking anything personally when you say "id like to see him improve against good competition before I’m comfortable with him going forward", because I don't even know if you ever said that. My comment was in response to your comment, "If you think accuracy equates completion percentage then there is no point even conversing", to which I replied, "OK. Convince me. How else are you going to quantify passing accuracy. I'm waiting."  At this point, I agree that there is no need to continue this inane conversation, because after you BS response, I give up on waiting for a logical answer to my question. Cheers!

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Stone Cold

Stone Cold

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1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

This **** is going in circles.

 

If we commit to Taylor, hes going to get coaching and development to help with his accuracy issues.

 

But folks trying to stay objective in here are getting remmed for it, its not right.  Not much you can do with folks that are all in, pick your battles.

You HAVE to commit to your QB.  He is the guy…for better or worse.  4 is OUR guy.  I can’t understand how he doesn’t have more cheerleaders in here.  He is exactly what we been hunting for.  I get it…he doesn’t have pedigree.  All he does is ball.  Kinda like when buddy ryan cut Chris carter bc all he did was catch tds

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PartyPosse

PartyPosse

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Just now, ODU AGGIE said:

First, he does not throw high "a lot". He's missed a few throws? What QB doesn't miss a few throws? But seven times out of ten he completes the pass, and those are not misses. I don't have his picture on a wall, and if he has a fan club, I know nothing about it. Lastly, I'm not taking anything personally when you say "id like to see him improve against good competition before I’m comfortable with him going forward", because I don't even know if you ever said that. My comment was in response to your comment, "If you think accuracy equates completion percentage then there is no point even conversing", to which I replied, "OK. Convince me. How else are you going to quantify passing accuracy. I'm waiting."  At this point, I agree that there is no need to continue this inane conversation, because after you BS response, I give up on waiting for a logical answer to my question. Cheers!

Taylor, is that you?

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PartyPosse

PartyPosse

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Stone Cold said:

You HAVE to commit to your QB.  He is the guy…for better or worse.  4 is OUR guy.  I can’t understand how he doesn’t have more cheerleaders in here.  He is exactly what we been hunting for.  I get it…he doesn’t have pedigree.  All he does is ball.  Kinda like when buddy ryan cut Chris carter bc all he did was catch tds

Because after 30 years of subpar play, I’d rather be cautiously optimistic than completely all in after 4 games. I’m rooting for him.

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mistertim

mistertim

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16 minutes ago, ODU AGGIE said:

OK. Convince me. How else are you going to quantify passing accuracy. I'm waiting.

 

QB accuracy is something that's really really tough to quantify with one stat in a meaningful way because there are so many elements that can go into it. Types of throws, depth of throws, time to throw, talent of the surrounding cast, type of offensive system, etc. The only thing completion percentage takes into account is whether or not the pass was caught.

 

IIRC there are some analytics places that do really complicated breakdowns where they rate every pass as far as catchability and take all of that other stuff into account. I really don't remember who is it or where to find it though.

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Renegade7

Renegade7

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4 minutes ago, Stone Cold said:

You HAVE to commit to your QB.  He is the guy…for better or worse.  4 is OUR guy.  I can’t understand how he doesn’t have more cheerleaders in here.  He is exactly what we been hunting for.  I get it…he doesn’t have pedigree.  All he does is ball.  Kinda like when buddy ryan cut Chris carter bc all he did was catch tds

 

When I hear "he's our guy", I hear folks wanting to give him a contract extension after 5 games.  Folks really want to give this guy $30-$40 million a year and he hasn't beat a team with a winning record yet?  Yikes.

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TK

TK

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5 minutes ago, Stone Cold said:

Told my son when that happened that 4 IS learnin.  

My concern with that move is defenses are eventually going to key in on stopping that dive & he'll be out for weeks in concussion protocol. 

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Morneblade

Morneblade

Posted
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Just now, Renegade7 said:

 

When I hear "he's our guy", I hear folks wanting to give him a contract extension after 5 games.  Folks really want to give this guy $30-$40 million a year and he hasn't beat a team with a winning record yet?  Yikes.

 

Strawman much? Most I've seen was $10 million, literally NO ONE is saying 'LETS GIVE HIM MAHOMES/BRADY MONEY". Just like we're giving Fitz. Just stop.

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Stone Cold

Stone Cold

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Just now, Renegade7 said:

 

When I hear "he's our guy", I hear folks wanting to give him a contract extension after 5 games.  Folks really want to give this guy $30-$40 million a year and he hasn't beat a team with a winning record yet?  Yikes.

Cart before the horse.  We…well me…is pulling for him to get it.  4 doesn’t have even a half season of games started…I’ve seen enough.  Do I want him to get paid?…well, if he’s lookin $, that means he did his job well.  You’re not in on that?  Ok cool.  But why?

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Renegade7

Renegade7

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Posted
Just now, Morneblade said:

 

Strawman much? Most I've seen was $10 million, literally NO ONE is saying 'LETS GIVE HIM MAHOMES/BRADY MONEY". Just like we're giving Fitz. Just stop.

 

That's the market, its rediculous to suggest we can give him 10 if he's the guy.  

1 minute ago, Stone Cold said:

Cart before the horse.  We…well me…is pulling for him to get it.  4 doesn’t have even a half season of games started…I’ve seen enough.  Do I want him to get paid?…well, if he’s lookin $, that means he did his job well.  You’re not in on that?  Ok cool.  But why?

 

We arent there yet to be talking money because the sample size is too small.  Hes going to look money regardless, its a QB league and they all get overpaid, either by us or someone else.

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Morneblade

Morneblade

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Just now, Renegade7 said:

 

That's the market, its rediculous to suggest we can give him 10 if he's the guy.  

 

So how did we land Fitz for $10? Because he's not Rodgers.

 

No one is suggesting that TH is Rodgers, and not going to be that kind of money. Or do you disagree?

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mistertim

mistertim

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Just now, Stone Cold said:

Cart before the horse.  We…well me…is pulling for him to get it.  4 doesn’t have even a half season of games started…I’ve seen enough.  Do I want him to get paid?…well, if he’s lookin $, that means he did his job well.  You’re not in on that?  Ok cool.  But why?

 

There's a really weird contradiction there. First you admit that he's hardly had any playing time, then you go on to say you've seen enough. 

 

1 minute ago, Morneblade said:

 

He could have fooled everyone. Literally.

 

I seriously doubt he's rooting against Heinicke and/or the team doing well. Do you think I'm rooting against Heinicke because I point out some concerns with his play and I'm not all-in on pronouncing him as the guy at this point?

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Morneblade

Morneblade

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Just now, mistertim said:

 

There's a really weird contradiction there. First you admit that he's hardly had any playing time, then you go on to say you've seen enough. 

 

 

I seriously doubt he's rooting against Heinicke and/or the team doing well. Do you think I'm rooting against Heinicke because I point out some concerns with his play and I'm not all-in on pronouncing him as the guy at this point?

 

 

When you spend 90% of your posting about him being negative, yes. You look like you think he sucks.

 

News Flash: Even though I'm not sold on him being the QB of the future (yes, you read that right) I can be really excited for what I have seen from him. And I can acknowledge his flaws while also talking about the things he does well. Like beat teams with no defensive help. I can hope he continues playing like this. But I also need to see if he can be consistent with it over a larger sample size. And I don't need to be a Debbie Downer to do so.

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Renegade7

Renegade7

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

So how did we land Fitz for $10? Because he's not Rodgers.

 

No one is suggesting that TH is Rodgers, and not going to be that kind of money. Or do you disagree?

 

Fitz is a journeyman QB at the tail end of his career. A lot of yall are saying Taylor is better, so what makes you think he'll take less if he proves to be the guy?

 

Again the market is merciless, Kirk is counting $31 million against the cap this year and $45 million next.  Is Taylor better then Kirk? If he's the guy he better be.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/minnesota-vikings/kirk-cousins-9915/

Edited by Renegade7
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