Bozo the kKklown Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 (edited) I posted this in another thread, but I feel this needs a bigger platform. In light of the confused controversy with Rep. Illhan Omar, Israel has stepped up its apartheid politics by barring Arab parties from participating in the upcoming elections. Then Netanyahu himself declared that Israel is only for Jewish people. Why does the US still support Israel? They aren't a democracy anymore. They promote state sanction violence against its own citizens. I never thought we would see the day that Israel would become the people they ran from. Edited March 11, 2019 by BenningRoadSkin 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 Don't know what point he was trying to make, but that sounds like something Hitler probably said about Germany and Germans. Obviously he thinks Blatant Anti-Arab racism is the way to win more votes than he loses. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 This is where I say "American-Jew here. Friends/Family in Israel that aren't on the extreme right....... meaning the Hasidic or the Russian immigrant side, are horrified at what this guy is doing to stay in power." He is worse for that country than Trump is for us. Yes, the reality is that they are surrounded by countries that want their destroyed. Countries that would destroy each other if the West wasn't so involved with them. Their end game is self-destruction. Yes, it sucks that Israel has to live under different rules to be part of the democratic world. But, what is happening now is only hurting them in the long run. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebluefood Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 He says this when people are still walking around - even right in the nation he oversees - still have numbers tattooed on their arms because of this very sentiment. To hell with this wretched apartheid state. Free Palestine. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCSaints_fan Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Nuttyahoo strikes again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, BenningRoadSkin said: Why does the US still support Israel? Because Jezus. Edited March 12, 2019 by AsburySkinsFan 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Israel deserves better than Netanyahu. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 9 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said: Israel deserves better than Netanyahu. No more than we deserve better than Trump. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 4 hours ago, @SkinsGoldPants said: Yes, the reality is that they are surrounded by countries that want their destroyed. Countries that would destroy each other if the West wasn't so involved with them. Their end game is self-destruction. can you elaborate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 I’m not horrified by this like everyone else seems to be. It’s not that I agree with it, I don’t, but it’s just what I’ve always assumed to be true. Is he saying other people aren’t allowed in, (that would,change things) or is he just saying what I assume everyone already knew: that Israel is a Jewish State. Not majority Jewish, but a state for Jews. A place where all Jews, essentially, can claim citizenship via the law of return. Hard to be outraged by something you just assumed was the case already. Plus, allowing only one religion to have any sort of real power is the rule, not the exception, in the region of the world they’re in. Israel fits right in. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 9 hours ago, grego said: can you elaborate? Syria, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, etc. Would all prefer Israel didn't exist. I believe if Israel didn't exist, they'd prefer each other didn't exist. I also believe they are using the Palestinian people as a tool to keep tensions higher in the region. If they truly supported them, some place like Egypt wouldn't also be rejecting those refugees. It benefits them to keep those 5M people in a bad situation. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) If it benefits those other countries to keep the Palestinians in a bad situation then why doesn't Israel flip the script and end the bad situation? But hey, you know. What could possibly go wrong when the UN decides it is going to recreate a country that hadn't existed for nearly 2000 years and plop it down right back in the same area where that nation spent all its time fighting 2000 years ago? Oh and while we're at it lets throw in some Zionism and the Evangelical wet-dream that is the Left Behind mind**** of a theology. What could possibly go wrong....amIright?! Edited March 12, 2019 by AsburySkinsFan 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebluefood Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 4 hours ago, AsburySkinsFan said: If it benefits those other countries to keep the Palestinians in a bad situation then why doesn't Israel flip the script and end the bad situation? This is part of the reason why the Ride-or-Die Israel crew's argument is lacking to me. Palestinians are kept on the West Bank like prisoners and face fierce retribution for even relatively innocuous resistance. We've got men, women, and children - armed and unarmed - getting blown away by a military subsidized by the good ol' U.S.ofA and yet Palestinians are continually painted as this dangerous, antisemitic monolith (never mind that there are Jewish Palestinians along the West Bank). 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 minute ago, thebluefood said: This is part of the reason why the Ride-or-Die Israel crew's argument is lacking to me. Palestinians are kept on the West Bank like prisoners and face fierce retribution for even relatively innocuous resistance. We've got men, women, and children - armed and unarmed - getting blown away by a military subsidized by the good ol' U.S.ofA and yet Palestinians are continually painted as this dangerous, antisemitic monolith (never mind that there are Jewish Palestinians along the West Bank). The closest equivalent to the Palestinian situation is Native Americans in the 19th century and following. 3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozo the kKklown Posted March 12, 2019 Author Share Posted March 12, 2019 10 minutes ago, AsburySkinsFan said: The closest equivalent to the Palestinian situation is Native Americans in the 19th century and following. Or the Jim Crow south. Or Apartheid in South Africa. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 22 minutes ago, thebluefood said: This is part of the reason why the Ride-or-Die Israel crew's argument is lacking to me. Palestinians are kept on the West Bank like prisoners and face fierce retribution for even relatively innocuous resistance. We've got men, women, and children - armed and unarmed - getting blown away by a military subsidized by the good ol' U.S.ofA and yet Palestinians are continually painted as this dangerous, antisemitic monolith (never mind that there are Jewish Palestinians along the West Bank). What do you make of Hamas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebluefood Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 4 minutes ago, grego said: What do you make of Hamas? I dunno - what do you think about red herrings wrapped in bad faith arguments? 14 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said: Or the Jim Crow south. Or Apartheid in South Africa. Moments like this don't happen out of nowhere: 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 24 minutes ago, thebluefood said: I dunno - what do you think about red herrings wrapped in bad faith arguments? huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 hour ago, AsburySkinsFan said: The closest equivalent to the Palestinian situation is Native Americans in the 19th century and following. The only issue I have with that comparison is that Israel exists because of genocide and rampant anti-Semitism the world over. Are we saying that persecuted minorities should never be allowed to have a nation of their own, and for their own? I would say yes, because I think racial and religious discrimination are inherently bad ideas and will inevitably lead to negative outcomes. Would you agree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) ok, i'll try this- @skinsgoldpants posted that he was not happy with Netanyahu, while saying how tough it is for Israel, being surrounded by countries that wish for your destruction (I agree with those points). you mentioned that "Palestinians are painted as a dangerous, anti semitic monolith". between those two posts, it brought to mind the charter of hamas, the elected governing party of the Palestinian people, where, up until almost two years ago, it called for the destruction of Israel. so, in my quest to determine who's the baddie, I am faced with your statement that calls for people to not be thought of as a monolith (one I endorse wholeheartedly), while weighing the reality of what Israel has been facing in hamas. Edited March 12, 2019 by grego Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Strong “whataboutism” play from the usual suspect. The same poster who spent a full year in the BLM thread wanting to talk about nothing but Assata Shakur. Make a Hamas thread if you need to discuss it, I guess. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 5 hours ago, Destino said: The only issue I have with that comparison is that Israel exists because of genocide and rampant anti-Semitism the world over. Are we saying that persecuted minorities should never be allowed to have a nation of their own, and for their own? I would say yes, because I think racial and religious discrimination are inherently bad ideas and will inevitably lead to negative outcomes. Would you agree? How many wrongs does it take to finally make a right? How ironic it is considering the origins of the modern state of Israel that they would become the oppressor just two generations after their establishment. (Arguably sooner) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 This is a tough subject on many levels. My Rabbi has spoken out against some Israeli policies and voiced how tough it is to support some of what they are doing. Israel is not a paragon of perfect virtue. Some of its current leaders have definitely crossed lines that I wish they had not crossed. I do think that the problem though is more difficult than many say. In the 1970's, I had family in Israel working side by side with Palestinians in nuclear plants. Can you imagine? They worked together, played cards together, and had all the problems that human communities and neighbors face. In other words, it was a pretty good deal for everyone. At least, that's the way it was described to me and I'm sure I'll get grief for painting that portrait. Things and relations have gotten so much worse since then. Part of it is due to an unending series of terrorist attacks against Israel and Israelis. Part of it is from Israel reprisals. I've never been one to talk about the appropriateness of "commensurate" attacks. If Palestinians launch 300 rockets a day into Israel, but only twenty people die that doesn't mean that in Hammarubian way Israel can take only twenty lives in return. Moreover, because the attack doesn't come from an army, but comes from hidden methods in civilian areas, the response will lead to innocent deaths... unless the idea is that Israel must take terrorism on the chin and never respond. That said, it is intolerable and wrong the way Israel has blockaded and tried to prevent he supply of the Palestinian territories. The draconian methods being used to try to prevent terrorism is actually just a punitive method that encourages it. Israel has gone too far in my opinion. Is there anything wrong with the idea of a Jewish state? I'd argue no. However, there is much wrong with how they are choosing to act. They are not alone in their wrongness and it is nearly impossible to unweave the chicken from the egg and figure out who started it. I don't think it much matters. The ultimate question though, the ultimate moral question is what does Israel have the right to do to defend itself and where are the lines it should not cross. The question must also be asked of the other parties. What obligations do the Arab states have? I've probably blathered on too much and dug myself into a pit. I'll finish by saying I think Israel would be better off without Netanyahu. I think he is too entrenched in fear, hate, and scars. He can't lead the country forward towards peace because he has seen and been a part of too many bad things. I just caution when judging Israel that there are a lot of glass houses in that part of the world, a lot of contributors to the modern circumstance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 46 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said: Strong “whataboutism” play from the usual suspect. The same poster who spent a full year in the BLM thread wanting to talk about nothing but Assata Shakur. Make a Hamas thread if you need to discuss it, I guess. How is mentioning hamas out of bounds when discussing the Israeli Palestinian conflict? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 31 minutes ago, AsburySkinsFan said: How many wrongs does it take to finally make a right? How ironic it is considering the origins of the modern state of Israel that they would become the oppressor just two generations after their establishment. (Arguably sooner) Wrongs don’t make a right, but if you go all in on the villain routine people eventually seem to stop being all that interested in the latest bad news. Israel needs to pick a side because the papers love to point to the wrongs of nations claiming to be free democracies much more than they care to dwell on the evils occurring where it’s expected. Right now they’re trying to have it both way and making everyone hundreds of miles away in western democracies, terribly upset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now