SOW| Breaking Down the State of the Redskins: Wide Receivers (w/ WR Depth Chart)

[rd421]

Moss is the perfect build for a slot receiver. He has slowed down a little, so his speed isn't as much of a trump card for corners anymore. However, when going up against linebackers and safeties, his quickness is still an asset, and he can exploit the coverage weaknesses of said linebackers and safeties.

I agree with this pretty much whole heatedly. IF Moss has regained a step due to being in better shape he could be a serious matchup problem for LB's.

In regards to using my own words- I quoted Kyle BC I wrote that Moss was doin well based on what I have heard from his coaches. I do try to leave emotional attachment out of it when breaking down stuff like this that's why I quoted someone else instead of saying ZOMFG TANAMAN IZ TEH GRAYTIS WR OF AL TAEM!!!

[Mahons21]

I agree with this pretty much whole heatedly. IF Moss has regained a step due to being in better shape he could be a serious matchup problem for LB's.

That's always been the case, the problem is you have to take hits from those LBs as well. Tana doesn't like taking those hits and IMO tends to gator arm some passes.

In regards to using my own words- I quoted Kyle BC I wrote that Moss was doin well based on what I have heard from his coaches. I do try to leave emotional attachment out of it when breaking down stuff like this that's why I quoted someone else instead of saying ZOMFG TANAMAN IZ TEH GRAYTIS WR OF AL TAEM!!!

Moss does well every camp, he's been far and away our best receiver. But why base it off what he's done in camp when we've seen him play in the slot before... It didn't just start this year... We've seen what he can do in the slot, I offered my observation, I was curious about yours. I've heard Kyle Shanny's in 50% of the articles I've read the past few days. If you don't have one that's fine, I don't see any reason to be a smartass.

EDIT: I felt I should note that I actually enjoyed your article, just disagreed with that portion of it.

[RandyHolt]

There is about zero chance that Banks makes the team over Armstrong. He has no value at WR to date he won't hang around again just to return.

You do know how many catches Armstrong had last year, right? I think its difficult to replicate those deep circus catches he had with McNabb. I think he will get cut, and Banks too.

My biggest concern - injuries. Hankerson and Morgan. We haven't graduated a young WR in what, decades now.

Assuming they stay healthy - my depth chart:

Garcon Moss Morgan Hankerson Robinson

Austin (returns)

[rd421]

That's always been the case, the problem is you have to take hits from those LBs as well. Tana doesn't like taking those hits and IMO tends to gator arm some passes.

Moss does well every camp, he's been far and away our best receiver. But why base it off what he's done in camp when we've seen him play in the slot before... It didn't just start this year... We've seen what he can do in the slot, I offered my observation, I was curious about yours. I've heard Kyle Shanny's in 50% of the articles I've read the past few days. If you don't have one that's fine, I don't see any reason to be a smartass.

EDIT: I felt I should note that I actually enjoyed your article, just disagreed with that portion of it.

Moss actually did not have a good camp last year he showed up super out of shape Mike was not happy at all. According to the coaches this is the best he has looked in years. And my smart @$$ness was not aimed at you lol. I typically get railed for being too homerish so im working on supporting my opinion (that moss is set up for a solid year after I was sure he was getting cut) with credible opinions like his coach talkin about how impressive he has been. Like I said in the article I think if he stats healthy he could have a Steve Smith esque season.

[rk3025]

Reliford is like most college players and need work on blocking for their QB.

[rd421]

You do know how many catches Armstrong had last year, right? I think its difficult to replicate those deep circus catches he had with McNabb. I think he will get cut, and Banks too.

My biggest concern - injuries. Hankerson and Morgan. We haven't graduated a young WR in what, decades now.

Assuming they stay healthy - my depth chart:

Garcon Moss Morgan Hankerson Robinson

Austin (returns)

Ya no doubt Armstrong struggled but so did Banks and I'm talkin at PR/KR through most of the season Brian Mitchell told me that Brandon was trying too hard not fielding the ball clean and misreading his blocking. Not to mention that the new KR rules last year did make it tougher on him. Truth is neither are great options BUT I chose Armstrong over banks bc banks is worthless at WR he's never going to be Devin Hester like some would have us believe.

[RandyHolt]

Ya no doubt Armstrong struggled but so did Banks and I'm talkin at PR/KR through most of the season Brian Mitchell told me that Brandon was trying too hard not fielding the ball clean and misreading his blocking. Not to mention that the new KR rules last year did make it tougher on him. Truth is neither are great options BUT I chose Armstrong over banks bc banks is worthless at WR he's never going to be Devin Hester like some would have us believe.

Do you think AA can return punts?

Even amazing myself, I think there is a chance BB can make some plays at wideout. The play calls for him in the past though, were horrible. Any time he was in the game, the ball was going to him. I remember a reverse or end around on the goal line once. Fail. He must be used in the spread and be a deep threat, if for nothing else to open up the underneath. And I do think we are going to be going 4 or 5 wide much much more than probably in our teams history. Just a hunch, but I am optimistic that Shanny is going to use some formations 3 has excelled at in the past. He can run around, we are going to have some boys deeeep.

Nothing short, no slants, no reverses for BB, hoping he will break a tackle. Hell don't even throw him the ball, yet he will have to be on teams radars - he is just a burner. I think he has to be a deep threat. Armstrong is probably his prime competition, but I do think Moss may be headed downtown more this year. I want to see Moss be used deep much more, his alligator arms on the slant never did it for me. I love Moss, and think we all know he was at his best.... deep. Against Dallas!

[Hitman21ST]

Do you think AA can return punts?

Even amazing myself, I think there is a chance BB can make some plays at wideout. The play calls for him in the past though, were horrible. Any time he was in the game, the ball was going to him. I remember a reverse or end around on the goal line once. Fail. He must be used in the spread and be a deep threat, if for nothing else to open up the underneath. And I do think we are going to be going 4 or 5 wide much much more than probably in our teams history. Just a hunch, but I am optimistic that Shanny is going to use some formations 3 has excelled at in the past. He can run around, we are going to have some boys deeeep.

Nothing short, no slants, no reverses for BB. Hell don't even through him the ball, yet he will have to be on teams radars - he is just a burner. I think he has to be a deep threat. Armstrong is probably his prime competition, but I do think Moss may be headed downtown more this year. I want to see Moss be used deep much more, his alligator arms on the slant never did it for me. I love Moss, and think we all know he was at his best.... deep. Against Dallas!

He had better be WIDE open then, because he's not winning any jump balls whatsoever.

[RandyHolt]

The key to banks as a WR... is you guessed it. RG3. I have a feeling he will buying our receivers so much more time than they are used to...

I am calling it, a wideout waving his arm frantically wide open down the field at least once per game next year.

Since when have we won jump balls, anyways.

[rd421]

AA returning punts is irrelevant though he is just as fast as Banks. Aldrick would most likely get a shot at PR/KR. Brandon is not an NFL receiver period and Mike made it pretty clear that he is not getting by on returning anymore...

[mistertim]

Like I said in the article I think if he stats healthy he could have a Steve Smith esque season.

I agree that Moss has the potential to be an excellent slot receiver. However, the Steve Smith thing you bring up actually reminds me of one of the main differences between those two receivers and I think sort of supports Mahons21's point. Steve Smith is not a big dude but he is very physical and very fearless; he doesn't care about taking hits (and will actually deal them himself sometimes). Santana, as talented as he is, is not very physical and he is not very fearless. I've observed some of the same alligator arms and fumble issues in Moss as Mahons21 pointed out. He will sometimes shy away from contact which results in either incomplete passes, tipped balls, or fumbles (there are right and wrong ways to take a hit that help you hold on to the ball). In the slot Santana's speed vs LBs and Safeties will be his asset, but taking hits from the same guys could potentially negate that. I hope not, but it is a possibility I think.

[KCClybun]

The problem with Banks is that if you put him in the game, you already know what's coming. Kyle's been creative enough trying to get the ball in the guys hands, but most of what he's going to be good for is reverses, trick plays, and throwing the ball really really far and hoping he can run under it. That's basically it; you'll get him killed going over the middle (even though he's kind of a tough dude), and do you want to take out Morgan, Moss, Hankerson and Garcon to put him on? Hell even Armstrong.

And then there's this... Revisiting Brandon Banks' 2011 Season; Should His Job be in Jeopardy?

So his numbers returning are down, and his role as a receiver is limited. Doesn't bode well, methinks.

[MWAI]

Moss is the perfect build for a slot receiver. He has slowed down a little, so his speed isn't as much of a trump card for corners anymore. However, when going up against linebackers and safeties, his quickness is still an asset, and he can exploit the coverage weaknesses of said linebackers and safeties.

Where is your evidence that Moss has slowed down? Are you just ASSUMING that he is slower based on last years number of receptions and the fact that Rex Grossman cannot throw deeper than 50 yards without getting a hernia. The truth of the matter is that Moss is probably faster than he was last year and about as fast as he was 5 years ago...NOW that he has lost those 15 pounds he has been playing with. Look for Santana to go deep again and his numbers should explode.

[rskin72]

First of all, enjoyed the article SOW. Couple of points.....

I agree with the poster who mentioned RGIII, and how he will factor in here. As our starter, i would look to see what wr or wr's he feels comfortable with during camp....especially when it comes to those wr's who may be cut. I think that it is difficult to judge our wr corp fairly by last season considering who was at qb.

I DID see Moss make some uncharateristic drops last season, but still think that he will be on our final roster.

I also liked the link on banks. It stated what i saw last season, especially on kick offs, that many times he would bring he ball out where it would have been smarter to down the ball. Think that he is going to have a tough time making the cut.....i would take AA over banks. I think with RGIIIas qb, you may see a return of some of those highlight catches AA had w mcnabb.

[Est.1974]

If Reliford actually works out and makes the 53, I think the odd man out will be Cooley - age, lack of speed, and cap hit all play a part. It would be Davis, Paul, Paulsen, and then Reliford (Cooley stays if Reliford doesn't make the roster)...................

Lance Lewis (I think he makes the roster over Banks, Armstrong, and Austin)

Yeah, maybe. Either way, I do think Shanny takes a chance on someone outside of the usual names touted about.

As for Banks, I'd say its difficult for us to judge his worth at WR just yet given he's not really been given much of a go since the 2010 preseason, I do recall a great over the middle catch by him at some point, but when he's got about 3 career receptions that not much to go on..

[Burgold]

[

It's about tyme he (Moss) was overhyped, year in and year out he's the most reliable reciever on this team and peopel here have had it in their minds to cut him years ago! :pfft:

In my opinion, Moss is very Jeckyl and Hyde. He will have a very good season and then follow it up by a mediocre one. He's done that several times, following up years that were loaded with drops, poor concentration, and injury (possibly due to poor training) only to follow it up by an excellent year.

Last year was a down year for Moss. Therefore, I expect him to be good this year. Age is a factor though.

[pjfootballer]

Where is your evidence that Moss has slowed down? Are you just ASSUMING that he is slower based on last years number of receptions and the fact that Rex Grossman cannot throw deeper than 50 yards without getting a hernia. The truth of the matter is that Moss is probably faster than he was last year and about as fast as he was 5 years ago...NOW that he has lost those 15 pounds he has been playing with. Look for Santana to go deep again and his numbers should explode.

:ols: Now that's funny!

---------- Post added June-27th-2012 at 08:12 AM ----------

Some of you forget that AA battled hamstring problems last year. Now that he's been able to come to the facility post lockout, his hamstrings should be healed and I think he can get back to his 2010 form.

[Son of Gadsden]

Love it. Best depth chart projection for receivers I have seen. I see nothing to argue with.

Though I have been high on Austin since we got him and really want him to make a roster spot, for some reason he isn't getting a shot. I'm not going to go all Devin Thomas on it though, I'm sure the coaches see (or rather have not seen) something I haven't. However, I wouldn't count him out at taking Banks' roster spot. He has shown he can return kicks and perform at receiver. I think it's a three way competition between Austin, Banks, and Robinson for the last spot.

[rd421]

Love it. Best depth chart projection for receivers I have seen. I see nothing to argue with.

Though I have been high on Austin since we got him and really want him to make a roster spot, for some reason he isn't getting a shot. I'm not going to go all Devin Thomas on it though, I'm sure the coaches see (or rather have not seen) something I haven't. However, I wouldn't count him out at taking Banks' roster spot. He has shown he can return kicks and perform at receiver. I think it's a three way competition between Austin, Banks, and Robinson for the last spot.

If TA wants a spot he better establish a connection with Griffin immediately. The kid has shown some flashes but he needs to be a consistent viable option.

[RandyHolt]

AA returning punts is irrelevant though he is just as fast as Banks. Aldrick would most likely get a shot at PR/KR. Brandon is not an NFL receiver period and Mike made it pretty clear that he is not getting by on returning anymore...

If Banks has no chance to succeed at wideout, why is Shanahan wasting everyone's time?

I think he has a chance, however small it may be. Or, perhaps Shanahan jumped the gun when he said he must produce at wideout. All it takes is another preseason filled with dazzling returns, and Shanahan will basically have no choice but to find a spot for him.

Know that I am predicting Banks does end up cut, but just have the feeling it won't happen without someone filling the PR spot. Who are the fans predictions of our PR next year, I am curious.

Austin, who I think is another cut candidate? Moss... maybe Buchanan?

[Botched]

Last year Robinson couldn't even hang on to kickoffs, and I don't remember him catching a pass in preseason. Even Banks has proven more as a receiver then he has.

Only way he should make the team is if he changes his number so we can call him AR15.

[sQuijeW]

i really like you rd421. good job

[Hitman21ST]

Where is your evidence that Moss has slowed down? Are you just ASSUMING that he is slower based on last years number of receptions and the fact that Rex Grossman cannot throw deeper than 50 yards without getting a hernia. The truth of the matter is that Moss is probably faster than he was last year and about as fast as he was 5 years ago...NOW that he has lost those 15 pounds he has been playing with. Look for Santana to go deep again and his numbers should explode.

No, last year's numbers had nothing to do with it. I'm basing that off that Moss can't just blow by corners anymore. He used to be able to smoke corners. Over the past three years or so he's lost a step, so he can't do that anymore. By no means am I saying he's slow, just that he's not as fast as he used to be.

[clarkskin]

garcon

moss

hankerson

morgan

robinson

banks

say goodbye to armstrong and austin, both have had chances and havent shown enough to warrant taking the place of the other guys on the list or been a big factor on special teams.

robinson didnt do much last year, but word is he is a hard worker and plays well in practice. he should get a good look this year in preseason and will likely have enough famliarity with the system to beat out the rooks (who will join the practice squad)

and im not really sure how banks is going to fit on this roster. perhaps as the last wr and the returner. barring any discipline problems, i still think he'll be around for this season as well.

im glad that the coaches moved paul to TE. we have a logjam of young guys at wr and i didnt want to lose him.

Except that Armstrong has actually turned into a very good special teams guy

[lanceman_1]

I think Banks will make the team again this year. Everytime the lot of us here think he is going to get cut he makes the team. The guy has been told his whole life that he is to small etc etc and that will motivate him more. I think he will show out in preseason..