ESPN: Colt McCoy, Browns agree to deal

[Oldskool]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5402260

Just one day before rookies are due to report for training camp, the Cleveland Browns secured their potential quarterback of the future.

Third-round pick Colt McCoy agreed to a four-year deal Thursday worth up to $5 million, according to a league source. The normal slot is approximately $3.275 million. But McCoy got the "quarterback premium," which shows the faith Cleveland has in McCoy as its long-term solution at quarterback.

McCoy was a four-year starter at the University of Texas. Last season he threw for 3,521 yards and 27 touchdowns and completed 70.6 percent of his passes. McCoy is expected to begin training camp as the third quarterback behind Browns starter Jake Delhomme and veteran backup Seneca Wallace.

James Walker covers the AFC North for ESPN.com.

[darrelgreenie]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5402260

Just one day before rookies are due to report for training camp, the Cleveland Browns secured their potential quarterback of the future.

Third-round pick Colt McCoy agreed to a four-year deal Thursday worth up to $5 million, according to a league source. The normal slot is approximately $3.275 million. But McCoy got the "quarterback premium," which shows the faith Cleveland has in McCoy as its long-term solution at quarterback.

McCoy was a four-year starter at the University of Texas. Last season he threw for 3,521 yards and 27 touchdowns and completed 70.6 percent of his passes. McCoy is expected to begin training camp as the third quarterback behind Browns starter Jake Delhomme and veteran backup Seneca Wallace.

James Walker covers the AFC North for ESPN.com.

I still think that Colt is as talented as any QB in this draft class and i think in 5 years he'll be considered one of the best from this draft class better then Bradford and Clausen.

[DWinzit]

I still think that Colt is as talented as any QB in this draft class and i think in 5 years he'll be considered one of the best from this draft class better then Bradford and Clausen.

I agree. Cleveland has made some poor draft selections over the years but I think this one may make some amends for their prior snafus.

[DefenderoftheStar]

quick question is it the QB's or the Browns? yes they've picked some bad ones, but go down their list. Just either horrible picks or the talent to know bad talent and still pick away.

Who are their scouts and are they cycled thru every year?

[No_Pressure]

I think that Colt McCoy will end up being a pretty solid NFL QB. I was disappointed that we weren't in a position to select him.

[The Brave Little Toaster Oven]

Colt McCoy will be pretty good...better than Clausen

[Hitman21ST]

But according to Holmgren he's not going to play this year...

[ATLredskin]

Colt McCoy sucks...he couldn't move the ball against Oklahoma and Nebraska defenses and then get injured on a basic football play. Wait until Baltimore and Pittsburgh come to town. Jimmy Clausen sucks too...Redskin fans so desperate for a QB change that they would settle for 5 more years of sucking if they drafted any of those 2 QBs. Thank God for Trent...

[Hitman21ST]

Colt McCoy sucks...he couldn't move the ball against Oklahoma and Nebraska defenses and then get injured on a basic football play. Wait until Baltimore and Pittsburgh come to town. Jimmy Clausen sucks too...Redskin fans so desperate for a QB change that they would settle for 5 more years of sucking if they drafted any of those 2 QBs. Thank God for Trent...

He won more games in the history of college football than anyone else.

He has the ability to put his team in position to win.

He was injured on a freak play, you can't really call him bad for that.

He's mobile and has a good arm.

How does he suck?

[Oldskool]

He won more games in the history of college football than anyone else.

And before Colt, such NFL QB legends as Kevin Green, Ken Dorsey and Ty Detmer held that honor.. Not a very good indicator.

He has the ability to put his team in position to win.

In the college ranks, you are correct. College ^= NFL.

He's mobile and has a good arm.

Well you have half that right. "Good" arm may be a stretch, even though he has good timing. In Cleveland, he's learning the "Erhardt-Perkins" system which is the same system used in New England. His lack of arm strength will hurt him here.

[Johns Bass]

But according to Holmgren he's not going to play this year...

That is Holmgren. He would rather suffer with a really bad QB than toss in a rookie just to try and get a few wins. Colt will be held back and developed - it is Holmgrens MO and it will not change in Cleveland.

[Hitman21ST]

That is Holmgren. He would rather suffer with a really bad QB than toss in a rookie just to try and get a few wins. Colt will be held back and developed - it is Holmgrens MO and it will not change in Cleveland.

Fair enough

[darrelgreenie]

Well you have half that right. "Good" arm may be a stretch, even though he has good timing. In Cleveland, he's learning the "Erhardt-Perkins" system which is the same system used in New England. His lack of arm strength will hurt him here.

I wonder how much imput and guidance Gil Haskel, Mike Holmgren longtime OC will have in the offense and the development of McCoy.

If anyone knows how to develop a WCO QB its Mike Holmgren who has never drafted a QB in the 1st yet has produced several starting caliber QB in from his offensive system.

I agree that the E&P offense can be arm strength intensive, but just like any offense it can be geared around the QB. I suspect that sooner or later the offense will incorporate more quick rhythm passing concepts typical of a WCO or Daboll won't be around very long. Holmgren brought a QB that's been groomed in the WCO in Wallace and drafted a WCO QB in Colt McCoy.

*Arm strength i thought that Colt answered a lot of the critisms of his arm strength at his pro-day and it don't see a real difference between him and Bradford when it comes to arm strength.

Out of curiosity how would you rate this draft class arm strength?

[Hitman21ST]

I wonder how much imput and guidance Gil Haskel, Mike Holmgren longtime OC will have in the offense and the development of McCoy.

If anyone knows how to develop a WCO QB its Mike Holmgren who has never drafted a QB in the 1st yet has produced several starting caliber QB in from his offensive system.

I agree that the E&P offense can be arm strength intensive, but just like any offense it can be geared around the QB. I suspect that sooner or later the offense will incorporate more quick rhythm passing concepts typical of a WCO or Daboll won't be around very long. Holmgren brought a QB that's been groomed in the WCO in Wallace and drafted a WCO QB in Colt McCoy.

*Arm strength i thought that Colt answered a lot of the critisms of his arm strength at his pro-day and it don't see a real difference between him and Bradford when it comes to arm strength.

Out of curiosity how would you rate this draft class arm strength?

Do you count deep ball accuracy in with arm strength? He could be able to throw it 70 yards in the air (I know Colt can't, but bear with me) but if at 70 yards it could end up on either side of the field, that doesn't really accomplish much, does it?

[Oldskool]

I wonder how much imput and guidance Gil Haskel, Mike Holmgren longtime OC will have in the offense and the development of McCoy.

If anyone knows how to develop a WCO QB its Mike Holmgren who has never drafted a QB in the 1st yet has produced several starting caliber QB in from his offensive system.

As far as I can tell (not being a fan of the team really) Holmgren and Haskel are both front office guys (President and Senior advisor to President respectively). How much sway and daily interaction that they have over Mangini and his OC Brian Daboll (who is a E&P guy to the core) I can't say. Having 2 sets of cooks on the same dish can't be smart.

I agree that the E&P offense can be arm strength intensive, but just like any offense it can be geared around the QB. I suspect that sooner or later the offense will incorporate more quick rhythm passing concepts typical of a WCO or Daboll won't be around very long. Holmgren brought a QB that's been groomed in the WCO in Wallace and drafted a WCO QB in Colt McCoy.

Well they brought in Delhomme this year, IMO, because he came from another E&P system in Carolina and knows the offense and is better suited for it over Wallace (who really is a career backup). What they do and how they tweak the offense is really beyond me.

Arm strength i thought that Colt answered a lot of the critisms of his arm strength at his pro-day and it don't see a real difference between him and Bradford when it comes to arm strength.

Out of curiosity how would you rate this draft class arm strength?

McCoy really to me is a WCO only QB. Don't see him having the arm strength to drive the ball deep down field or to hit receivers down at the numbers. He's like a smaller Matt Leinart.

And you are right about Bradford's arm and McCoy's. The only difference between those two is physique. Bradford is lucky that he was taken by a team that runs a WCO.

The arm strength of this QB class this year is fairly average. There weren't any real gunslingers there.

[Conn]

Colt McCoy will be pretty good...better than Clausen

You bite your tongue!

[darklight1216]

quick question is it the QB's or the Browns? yes they've picked some bad ones, but go down their list. Just either horrible picks or the talent to know bad talent and still pick away.

Who are their scouts and are they cycled thru every year?

It's both. The qbs are just a few of the many bad players that the Browns produce.

That is Holmgren. He would rather suffer with a really bad QB than toss in a rookie just to try and get a few wins. Colt will be held back and developed - it is Holmgrens MO and it will not change in Cleveland.

That is a wise decision. Ray Lewis, LaMarr Woodley, Haloti Ngata, Casey Hampton and company would eat him alive.

[Spartacus87]

McCoy will be an average NFL QB. Spot starter at best, but more likely a capable backup. He's a smart, hardworking kid, but he's a bit on the small side and more importantly, he has a pop gun for an arm (which anyone could have seen if they watched just two or three Texas games during his career).

This really was a pretty unimpressive QB draft class. The next 2 years look far more stacked in QB talent.

[darrelgreenie]

Do you count deep ball accuracy in with arm strength?

Nope.

I don't even count throwing distance as a measure of arm strength.

I'm speaking purely in terms of velocity how fast can they get the ball from point A to point B.

Here's a better explanation and a great article:

http://www.testsportsclubs.com/cms/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=lY3poMskCsg%3D&tabid=94&mid=682

Basic physics can

show us how velocity

translates to the

football field, using

the 20-yard out as a benchmark for a

quarterback’s pro-readiness.

At the 2008 NFL Combine, Ravens first-round

pick and TEST client Joe Flacco — who had a

meteoric rise up the draft boards last spring —

set the mark for throwing velocity at 58 mph

[darrelgreenie]

As far as I can tell (not being a fan of the team really) Holmgren and Haskel are both front office guys (President and Senior advisor to President respectively). How much sway and daily interaction that they have over Mangini and his OC Brian Daboll (who is a E&P guy to the core) I can't say. Having 2 sets of cooks on the same dish can't be smart.

I hear what you're saying but those guys know more about coaching then they do about the FO.

And it seems like a waste to have 2 gifted offensive minds and one proven QB guru not give their input or guidance.

What they do and how they tweak the offense is really beyond me.

It certainly something i'm going to watch.

B/c offenses can grow and change.

If you look at McDaniels,an E&P guy, yet his offense with the Pats has been described as WCO from the shotgun it was rife with elements of the college spread offense, and i have a hunch that's his long term plan for Tebow in Denver.

I would imagine that Holmgren would impart some WCO concepts that he could translate into his E&P based offense.

McCoy really to me is a WCO only QB. Don't see him having the arm strength to drive the ball deep down field or to hit receivers down at the numbers. He's like a smaller Matt Leinart.

Yeah, i don't see him being effective in a Norv Turner style offense but then again Trent Green was successful and i think Colt at least has arm strength equal to Trent's.

I think the kid can make all the throws and would rank his arm strength on par or with QBs like Matt Hasselbeck, Schaub, Sanchez and just a notch below QBs like Romo sits to pee, Ryan.

And you are right about Bradford's arm and McCoy's. The only difference between those two is physique. Bradford is lucky that he was taken by a team that runs a WCO.....The arm strength of this QB class this year is fairly average. There weren't any real gunslingers there.

But, it seems as if the perception is that Bradford's arm is superior to McCoys and that Bradford can make all the throws but Colt can't.

[Oldskool]

I hear what you're saying but those guys know more about coaching then they do about the FO.

And it seems like a waste to have 2 gifted offensive minds and one proven QB guru not give their input or guidance.

For consistency in message and morale, you cannot have your FO dictating on-the-field plays and over ruling your coaching staff (See Snyder, Dan and Jones, Jerrah).

I have a feeling that Holmgren will be the HC and GM of the Browns before the end of the 2011 season.

It certainly something i'm going to watch. B/c offenses can grow and change. If you look at McDaniels,an E&P guy, yet his offense with the Pats has been described as WCO from the shotgun it was rife with elements of the college spread offense, and i have a hunch that's his long term plan for Tebow in Denver.

I would imagine that Holmgren would impart some WCO concepts that he could translate into his E&P based offense.

The E&P that McDaniels runs in Denver is almost exactly what he ran in NE. The E&P has ALLOT of spread intertwined in it and all modern offenses have elements of the WCO. I'm sure the Browns offense will be quite different than Denvers, NE or Carolina's simply due to their QB's and Holmgren as well.

Yeah, i don't see him being effective in a Norv Turner style offense but then again Trent Green was successful and i think Colt at least has arm strength equal to Trent's.

I think the kid can make all the throws and would rank his arm strength on par or with QBs like Matt Hasselbeck, Schaub, Sanchez and just a notch below QBs like Romo sits to pee, Ryan.

Hasselbeck, Schaub, Sanchez all have better arms than McCoy and have a bigger frame. This isn't a knock on his ability, it's what he was born with.

But, it seems as if the perception is that Bradford's arm is superior to McCoys and that Bradford can make all the throws but Colt can't.

If you've read any of my posts during the time before the draft, you should know that I do not think very highly of Bradford at all. The main thing that Bradford has over McCoy is size, which means he can probably make a few more plays than Colt can.

[Spartacus87]

Yeah, i don't see him being effective in a Norv Turner style offense but then again Trent Green was successful and i think Colt at least has arm strength equal to Trent's.

I think the kid can make all the throws and would rank his arm strength on par or with QBs like Matt Hasselbeck, Schaub, Sanchez and just a notch below QBs like Romo sits to pee, Ryan.

I can only accurately comment on Sanchez and Ryan, since those are two of the guys listed that I've seen play in college pretty recently for comparison's sake here, and both absolutely have stronger arms than McCoy.

Especially Sanchez. He made some pretty impressive throws in his starting season at USC.

[darrelgreenie]

For consistency in message and morale, you cannot have your FO dictating on-the-field plays and over ruling your coaching staff (See Snyder, Dan and Jones, Jerrah).

Of course, but giving input and guidance is quite different then over ruling the coaching staff which is not what i'm suggesting. What i'm saying is that regardless of system differences Holmgren/Haskell would be able to help Daboll in numerous aspects of being an OC.

The E&P that McDaniels runs in Denver is almost exactly what he ran in NE. The E&P has ALLOT of spread intertwined in it and all modern offenses have elements of the WCO. I'm sure the Browns offense will be quite different than Denvers, NE or Carolina's simply due to their QB's and Holmgren as well.

This the point i've been making for the past 2 posts.

The way a particular offense is guided can help or hurt the QB at its helm and, imo McCoy would do well in a McDaniels style E&P or one that is heavy in quick rhythm WCO style concepts.

Hasselbeck, Schaub, Sanchez all have better arms than McCoy and have a bigger frame. This isn't a knock on his ability, it's what he was born with.

I don't want to quible so i'll concede on the frame issue; but i've seen Hasselbeck standing side by side with Zorn 6'2 and Wallace 5'11 and have a hard time believing he's 6'4.

But, you're right he does have a smaller frame we'll just have to agree to disagree on arm strength.

Would you agree that he has enough arm strength to make the majority of the NFL throws?

"He looks like a bigger, stronger Drew Brees," said Razzano, a veteran of 21 NFL seasons as a scout, most recently with the Arizona Cardinals. "People are knocking Colt McCoy, and the first thing I hear is arm strength. Tony Romo sits to pee, Kurt Warner, they don't have a cannon. It's not about that. It's about timing, touch. And he throws a lot of deep balls. It's not a nickel-and-dime offense like some people make it out to be."

I watched a bunch of Texas games and have 2 knocks Colt:

o the system he played in, didn't often require him to make many of the difficult NFL type throws (but a few times a game I saw him make th throws that many people think he can't)

o he very inconsistent with his footwork

If your interested or bored out of your mind i did a layman's breakdown of one of Colts games awhile back to illistrate my point, I know it prol'y won't change your opinion but anyway:

Texas vs UCF this game short contains all Colts completed passes

1) R34/C54 Out on time/target-good step/plant drive+follow thru w/ people around him

2) Quick screen good

3)R7/C22 Comeback-good t/t,g s/p/d/f

4)R19/C39 good scramble kept eyes downfield steps into it on target

5)R46/C32 kinda half steps it/slings it but on t/t

6)R25/C41 good pass on t/t-s/p/d good coverage

7)R45/C37 half steps w/o plant/drive but slung it out there pretty good on t/t

8)R51/C23 more then a half-step but not a pronounced plant and drive, good pass (i think i'm starting to nit-pick here)

9)R1/C29 sprint/roll right step into throw but off balance nice pass though t/t

10) R29/C52 short/half step but on t/t tight window good accuracy

* showed nice athleticism

11)R37own/C38theirs out right t/t good s/p/d

12) roll right gets steps into throw on the run good coverage but better accuracy

13)R8/C-5 endzone good pocket poise on run tight window nice pass

14)R5endzone/C8 good anticipation/trust a bit off target good delivery

15)R5/C@their 45 Shipley toasted that DB nice route good delivery on target pass

16)R50/C40 good delivery

17)R37/C25 nice fluid delivery didn't 'fire' the ball but didn't have too

If you've read any of my posts during the time before the draft, you should know that I do not think very highly of Bradford at all. The main thing that Bradford has over McCoy is size, which means he can probably make a few more plays than Colt can.

My point is that although we agree that McCoy/Bradford have the same arm strength the perception, not by you, persists that Bradford has a better arm but McCoy can't make all the throws.

Just pointing out an incosistency in the sports media's presentation of both players.

[Spartacus87]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Could-the-Browns-cut-Colt-McCoy-?urn=nfl-265084

The winningest quarterback in college football history may be cut before he has a chance to take a single meaningful snap in the NFL.

Cleveland Browns rookie quarterback Colt McCoy(notes) is "on the bubble" to make the team's final 53-man roster, according to the Cleveland Plain Dealer. Coaches are reportedly more impressed with veteran newcomers Jake Delhomme(notes) and Seneca Wallace(notes), possibly leaving the third-round pick as a camp casualty.

If McCoy is cut, it would cap a stunning fall for one of the most decorated college quarterbacks in history. During his time at Texas, McCoy led the Longhorns to an NCAA-record 45 wins and set a single-season mark for completion percentage (76.7 in 2008). Before last season, many draft insiders had the QB as a top-10 pick and he was expected to contribute at the professional level.

[darklight1216]

^ That would be quite a surprise. I'm sure that some other team would pick him up though.