artmonkforHOF Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 I wasnt pissed that we passed on Oher in the first place, since at the time of the draft Jansen was still pegged to be the starting RT with Heyer as a back up. I figured they might get some depth in the later rounds since there where so many serviceable linemen to be had in rounds 3 through 5. I only got pissed when there was no other OL drafted and then they cut Jansen, leaving Heyer as the starter. Reminded me of the previous years draft when I was pissed we passed on Phillip Merling at #21 and traded down for 2 second round picks. I said to myself at that time, well even if Merling is gone by our next pick (which he was) they surely where going to have to pick a DE in the second round, like C Campbell or someone, but then they go WR, TE, WR and I just about lost it. Turned off my TV, went to the bar around the corner and started to drink until the anger went away. My anger at not picking a DE that year was intensified when Daniels goes down in the OTA's or camp or whenever that was, and Vinny panics and pays a king's ransom for Jason Taylor. If this front office had any foresight whatsoever, then someone would have started rebuilding the O line 2 years ago. pick a few guys, see what they do in a back up role, if they are good you keep them, if not, you go out looking for another piece. Now all these poor personel decisions are coming back to haunt the skins, while they might have one solid D, it will take the O at least 3 years to be good since you will need to go find a starting LT and RG for sure, and some would argue you still need to find a C and RT, while some others even think LG could use an upgrade. By the time the O gets good again, Fletch will most likely be gone and that Defense will no longer be the same, and it will be time to rebuild parts of the D. Unless Danny hires somebody and gives them at least 5 years of complete control, this cycle will most likely continue where they address problems on one side of the ball, while ignoring problems on the other side until it is too late to actually do anything about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Your arguments center on the relative value of the two players for us in 2009. If you abandon your "what can you do for me this year" philosophy, Orakpo was a no-brainer because he graded out on almost everyone's board as a much better prospect as an NFL player than Michael Oher. No Oldfan my arguments center around the fact that team saw fit to place him at linebacker. All of the grade arguments you are throwing out there are as a defensive end. He had no grades at linebacker because he had never played the position. Oher was a highly rated tackle, that plays tackle. Orakpo was a highly rated defensive end, that now plays linebacker (poorly). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 OMG! I agree with Oldfan again! Rak and Jarmon are going to be longterm great skins for us. We haven't had two pillars on the DL in quite some time. It's amazing to see how many people think Orakpo is a defensive end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildbill1952 Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 I don't fault Vinny for the Orakpo pick over Oher. I fault him for avoiding the draft of OLine year after year. Even if he didn't get Oher in the first round, he could have gone after a center or a center/guard combo in the 3rd or 4th rounds. But every year (except 2009), he grabs some super longshot QB that he hopes becomes the next Tom Brady. Every team has a practice squad guy you can steal after the season starts for a 3rd string clipboard holder. We're spending draft picks on them. Then when training camp starts, they pick up any UDFA scrap from the Maryland "just graduated" pile and decide they're the Skins OL depth. A 5th or 6th round OL pick is usually garbage, but OL's a more valuable pick than a 3rd string QB. And if they're not going to draft them, then why not go after some OLine depth from the "just cut" pile? We should have had Jones in camp the day after Samuels went down. If the FO had any idea of what an OLine is, we would have had Jones in camp for depth, BEFORE Samuels got hurt, learning the system, ready to play. Vinny has gone cheap on OL his entire career. You get what you pay for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandman69 Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 No Oldfan my arguments center around the fact that team saw fit to place him at linebacker. All of the grade arguments you are throwing out there are as a defensive end. He had no grades at linebacker because he had never played the position. Oher was a highly rated tackle, that plays tackle. Orakpo was a highly rated defensive end, that now plays linebacker (poorly). That isn't necessarily true. He had played Linebacker at Texas some, granted in a 3-4. However, we don't always use him in a traditional 4-3 SAM and he does rush from that position quite often. Also, the Browns were looking at him at LB in their 3-4 as well prior to the draft. So he had played LB, and he had grades at it as well. And, I don't think he plays the position poorly. He has done a decent job, and continues to learn. I think it will give us a more rounded player. I am VERY happy with the pickup, and how we are using him. AND we are using him hand in dirt more over the second half of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandman69 Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 It's amazing to see how many people think Orakpo is a defensive end. Umm, perhaps because he lines up as one quite often. It is amazing that people think he doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsNumberOne Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 By the time the O gets good again, Fletch will most likely be gone and that Defense will no longer be the same, and it will be time to rebuild parts of the D. Unless Danny hires somebody and gives them at least 5 years of complete control, this cycle will most likely continue where they address problems on one side of the ball, while ignoring problems on the other side until it is too late to actually do anything about it. Hidden in some of these posts are points that some of us make in piecemeal fashion from time to time, but I think they are the most important points to make. Many of us talk about needing an FO with vision, and this is the kind of thing that has plagued the Redskins for the last decade. The bandaging of different units and the seeming complete ignorance of certain other units has led to the steady destruction of this team. To those who enjoy competitive games, yes we are competitive most of the time. That's not good enough, especially when you're only "competitive" with a bunch of winless teams. It's not my job to know where the problems are going to be from season to season. I have a job. It's not my job to think "Hey this guy is looking old, I better have a good backup in mind for him" or "You know what, I think he got injured last year and that may happen again, I better be prepared for that this year." And yet, year-in and year-out we find ourselves completely unprepared for these happenings. Some people on this board have been happy with the offensive production recently and suggested that Vinny may have helped save his job by bringing in Sherm Lewis and strengthening the OL with Levi Jones. To them, I say simply: Too little, too late. It is the GM's job to have the team's personnel ready as the years pass by. It's his job to have the vision so that as one unit ages there are good candidates ready to take their place rather than knee-jerk reactionary band-aids. He should not be able to save his job only after he has already destroyed our 2009 season and impacted our past and future as much as he has. He should be gone following this season, if Dan wants to have any remote amount of accountability in what he does. If not, then we'll continue being unprepared for regular eventualities that all other teams deal with to some degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhodus333 Posted January 5, 2010 Author Share Posted January 5, 2010 We needed a pass rusher and an offensive tackle but Orakpo essentially filled two needs: pass rusher/OLB, and he's done it very well. I don't think we would've won any more games with Oher on the line honestly. Do you think we would have won more than 4? Not sure how many games Orakpo won for us this year either. Like I said hes an amazingly talented athlete, but his abilities werent able to help the team where they most needed help. It ends up being another great individual performance that amounts to nothing when playoff time rolls around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icbmayday Posted January 5, 2010 Share Posted January 5, 2010 Oher would have been great and exactly what we needed. BUT i can't shake my head at Orakpo he will be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIBBS LIVES Posted January 5, 2010 Share Posted January 5, 2010 You're blaming Vinny for a problem created by Joe Gibbs. The O-line didn't just start to decline after Joe left and Vinny took over. When you trade away so many draft picks with little return, there's a price to pay.Drafting the BPA is the right strategy for building a winner, but it's a long term approach. Drafting for need is a win-now approach and generally ineffective. Orakpo over Oher was a no-brainer, IMO. Also, you can't blame Vinny only for not using any first round picks on the O-line. Snyder wanted "splash" selections too. Snyder is as much to blame as Vinny. But Vinny is the only one who can take the sword. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.A.C.O.L.B. Posted January 5, 2010 Share Posted January 5, 2010 Wow. This is a hell of a bump considering there's was a brand new Oher/Orakpo thread made like yesterday. I thought this was it at first, really confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebowski Posted January 5, 2010 Share Posted January 5, 2010 If you're still pissed we didn;t draft Oher or trade down then you should have been hoping we beat San Francisco last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebowski Posted January 5, 2010 Share Posted January 5, 2010 Do you think we would have won more than 4? Not sure how many games Orakpo won for us this year either. /QUOTE]Oakland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.