BleedinBurgNGold Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 At 3-7 there is a large part of me that feels 3-13 is the only way that we can come close to ensuring Vinny is gone. I have never hoped rfor the Redskins to lose but at this point, I'm not sure Vinny goes if we go on a run or win a few more games. Weighing the options, losingh sadly comes on top if that is what it will take for change (for the better). I hate Danny for putting us into this situation where we may have to hope for losses for draft/ FO changes. But I feel that is where we are. Am I alone? Does anyone feel different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsaneBoost Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 It's not do we have to, it's more logical that we will with the injuries and O line failure. We might be able to go 5-11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrifNick21 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Well, we'll at least beat Dallas, so we'll have at least a 4-12 record. That means 6-18 the last season and a half. That's should be reason enough for change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus T Firefly Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 We don't need to lose out, imo, but a 5-1 or 4-2 finish makes me a little nervous about the organization thinking they're close. Actually, I'll be nervous anyway. There's a good chance the D's ranking will make Danny think he's just a coach, QB and a few tweaks from having a title contender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forever21 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 At best we'll be 5-11 and considering the teams we have lost to I think change is inevitable no matter what. Especially if you go back to the middle of last season on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 The team still holds on to the belief that they were 6-2 in 2008 so they believe that the Redskins are close. No way will the Skins ever realize that they need to rebuild, even if they go 3-13, which is possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chump Bailey Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Vinny and Dan are joined at the hip from my perspective. I don't think Vinny's going anywhere anytime soon. They're too close personal and professional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Vinny and Dan are joined at the hip from my perspective. I don't think Vinny's going anywhere anytime soon. They're too close personal and professional. This seems unfortunately true:(. If we hear about Vinny selling his Six Flags stock soon then there might be hope for disconnecting the two, but for now we're stuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mordac Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 I think most of the free world realizes that Cerrato has no business running an NFL football club. But there are a couple of things that I keep coming back to that might prevent Danny from pulling the trigger. First, any of you guys ever heard of Mitch Kupchak? Nobody but Dr. Buss thought this guy was up to the job until he delivered 2 Finals appearances and a championship in 2 years, and the Lakers should be a favorite to repeat this year. Now the guy's a genius. The other thing rattling around in my brain is Joe Gibbs, and how much of the current fiasco we watch every Sunday is his responsibility? I'll still be hoping against hope every Sunday that these guys improve. btw, I can already feel this thread sliding into another discussion about a particular player that has already been debated to death on this board, so I'll stop now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubbs Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 I know how you feel. I have the same worry about winning. I'm still gonna watch every week, cheering my team on, no matter how many they lose in a row - but a little voice in the back of my mind keeps asking, "Will Vinny stay if we win this game? Wouldn't I take some medicine with nasty side effects if it got rid of a terrible disease?" This doesn't apply to Dallas. **** Dallas. I couldn't possibly "worry" about beating them. But in general, there's a little bit of a nagging feeling that going, say, 6-10 would convince Danny that Vinny's got the right idea, and all we need is a Jay Cutler/Mark Sanchez/Mike Shanahan to win the division. God, this franchise needs a kick in the ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailGreen28 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 The team still holds on to the belief that they were 6-2 in 2008 so they believe that the Redskins are close.No way will the Skins ever realize that they need to rebuild, even if they go 3-13, which is possible. Seriously. I think the last time we have even come close to "rebuilding" was 2004. And that was Gibbs's doing.Our O-Line will have to be rebuilt, because the wheels have LITERALLY fallen off (not just figuratively like last year). But I don't think Danny and Vinny understand "rebuilding" at all. edit: Oops, had quoted wrong member. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Why does anyone think losing out will lead to change? Dan Snyder is a terrible owner and there is no reason to think he's going to remove himself from the equation and hire a real GM any time soon. I think the questions skins fans need to ask themselves is this: How much are you going to put up with before YOU change? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsTillIDie Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 What people don't seem to grasp is just how badly Dan Snyder wants to win. He wants to win as a diehard Redskins fan, and he wants to win to gain respectability amongst the ranks of the NFL elite. He will do anything to get that ring: he's improbably brought back the best coach in our franchise history and paid him more than any other coach in the league; he brought in one of the most highly acclaimed offensive minds in college football; he's spent inordinate amounts of money to bring in the best free agents to DC. His decisions haven't always been the wisest - far from it at times - but they were always in the interest in putting the best possible product on the field. That's a lot more than can be said for a lot of other cheap owners around the league. At least we're using all of our possible cap space. The Jim Zorn era is tied directly to Vinny Ceratto. Snyder put his full faith in Vinny and he's ultimately been disappointed. Not just disappointed but devastated. He was convinced that we had a team that would win the division this year. The absurd failures of our offensive line, limiting any potential that our offense may have had, comes down to one man: Vinny Cerrato. It was he who neglected rebuilding our offensive line, instead spending money and picks on sexy skill position players, who still haven't produced as promised. He failed to acquire a top franchise quarterback when Snyder wanted one last offseason. He failed to bring even a decent offense to DC when a mediocre one probably would have sent this team to the playoffs (#4 defense, again!?). Instead, under Ceratto's management, our offense has never been worse in Snyder's tenure. You can't tell me that Snyder wants to keep him around any longer. No, Snyder will best repair his image and the image of the franchise with wholesale change. That will begin at the top. A new GM will hire a new top coach, with Snyder's blessing of course. And we will likely draft a new franchise quarterback with our top 7 pick - of Lausen, Looker or Bradford, one will almost certainly be available. The Redskins will have a new look and fans will once again see hope for the future. We will once again have hope. This doesn't happen unless Cerrato is fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
booballen Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Dan Snyder has publicly spoken out twice this season, something he never does. The man's pride is hurt, and thats more important to him than anything else. There will be change, the question is is it Vinny being gone? Maybe Vinny has convinced him that its all Zorn's fault and that will be enough change for him....I hope not though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Why does anyone think losing out will lead to change? Dan Snyder is a terrible owner and there is no reason to think he's going to remove himself from the equation and hire a real GM any time soon. I think the questions skins fans need to ask themselves is this:How much are you going to put up with before YOU change? Losing out a few years in a row might lead to some change, but not this year. I won't be holding my breath. Doesn't appear you will be, either:hysterical: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedinBurgNGold Posted November 27, 2009 Author Share Posted November 27, 2009 What people don't seem to grasp is just how badly Dan Snyder wants to win. He wants to win as a diehard Redskins fan, and he wants to win to gain respectability amongst the ranks of the NFL elite. He will do anything to get that ring: he's improbably brought back the best coach in our franchise history and paid him more than any other coach in the league; he brought in one of the most highly acclaimed offensive minds in college football; he's spent inordinate amounts of money to bring in the best free agents to DC. His decisions haven't always been the wisest - far from it at times - but they were always in the interest in putting the best possible product on the field. That's a lot more than can be said for a lot of other cheap owners around the league. At least we're using all of our possible cap space. The Jim Zorn era is tied directly to Vinny Ceratto. Snyder put his full faith in Vinny and he's ultimately been disappointed. Not just disappointed but devastated. He was convinced that we had a team that would win the division this year. The absurd failures of our offensive line, limiting any potential that our offense may have had, comes down to one man: Vinny Cerrato. It was he who neglected rebuilding our offensive line, instead spending money and picks on sexy skill position players, who still haven't produced as promised. He failed to acquire a top franchise quarterback when Snyder wanted one last offseason. He failed to bring even a decent offense to DC when a mediocre one probably would have sent this team to the playoffs (#4 defense, again!?). Instead, under Ceratto's management, our offense has never been worse in Snyder's tenure. You can't tell me that Snyder wants to keep him around any longer. No, Snyder will best repair his image and the image of the franchise with wholesale change. That will begin at the top. A new GM will hire a new top coach, with Snyder's blessing of course. And we will likely draft a new franchise quarterback with our top 7 pick - of Lausen, Looker or Bradford, one will almost certainly be available. The Redskins will have a new look and fans will once again see hope for the future. We will once again have hope. This doesn't happen unless Cerrato is fired. What in the hell is the difference between an Owner who doesn't care about winning and is a dozen games under 500 under his tenure with a couple playoff appearances in Ten years and an Owner who wants to win so badly but is... 12 games under 500 under his tenure and has only a few playoff appearances in 10 years? Not one thing! The results are still the same! Obviously he doesnt want to win bad enough IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 What people don't seem to grasp is just how badly Dan Snyder wants to win. And what exactly do the fans get for this desire to win? Do we get bragging rights, and if so where is this desire to win monitered so we can compare it to other owners desire to win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Dan Snyder has publicly spoken out twice this season, something he never does. The man's pride is hurt, and thats more important to him than anything else. And now he has to try and keep it all together, so we can finally have some continuity in our organization, while fans boo and sneak signs about hating him. I really hope he can, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 What in the hell is the difference between an Owner who doesn't care about winning and is a dozen games under 500 under his tenure with a couple playoff appearances in Ten years and an Owner who wants to win so badly but is... 12 games under 500 under his tenure and has only a few playoff appearances in 10 years?Not one thing! The results are still the same! Obviously he doesnt want to win bad enough IMO. Right, because the 5 or 6 consistently winning teams in the league are the only owners who really want it.:doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedinBurgNGold Posted November 27, 2009 Author Share Posted November 27, 2009 Right, because the 5 or 6 consistently winning teams in the league are the only owners who really want it.:doh: I dont care how bad Snyder 'wants it'. There is one constant under his tenure. We have not been a solid contender. Only one year did we reach double digit wins under his Ownership. How many Head Coaches? How many aging star players did we sign? How many draft picks have we given away? You can try and excuse Snyder all you want, the results are the results. And yes, obviously doesnt wsnt it bad enough or he would step back and hire people who have a CLUE! Anything else you want to chime in on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriginalWhizzinator Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Bring back Pepper Johnson!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkfan63 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Vinny and Dan are joined at the hip from my perspective. I don't think Vinny's going anywhere anytime soon. They're too close personal and professional. Yep. I see a coaching change. But I don't foresee a change in how senior management. And because of incompetent management, I think this team will be bad for years to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkfan63 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 What in the hell is the difference between an Owner who doesn't care about winning and is a dozen games under 500 under his tenure with a couple playoff appearances in Ten years and an Owner who wants to win so badly but is... 12 games under 500 under his tenure and has only a few playoff appearances in 10 years?Not one thing! The results are still the same! Obviously he doesnt want to win bad enough IMO. The Midget doesn't want to win badly enough to step back and let a professional run this organization. This franchise is his toy to play with as he sees fit. Who cares if the fans suffer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck812 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Am I the only one who would rather win out? I just dont like losing for any reason and I had rather the light all of sudden come on with the people we have than to change every few years.... Yeah I know its a long shot but stranger things have happened. If and probably when that doesnt happen then worry about change... I just wanna win! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKINSFAN87 Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 At 3-7 there is a large part of me that feels 3-13 is the only way that we can come close to ensuring Vinny is gone. I have never hoped rfor the Redskins to lose but at this point, I'm not sure Vinny goes if we go on a run or win a few more games. Weighing the options, losingh sadly comes on top if that is what it will take for change (for the better). I hate Danny for putting us into this situation where we may have to hope for losses for draft/ FO changes. But I feel that is where we are. Am I alone? Does anyone feel different? I would say your alone pal, sorry. Just Kidding! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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