The Villi Phanatic Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 The board's big enough, I'm sure there are plenty of both aspiring and published writers, be it books or articles or whatever. I'm nearing completion of my first novel and am just recently really starting to research the publishing process. Based on what I've come across and been told so far, it looks like getting an agent is the best route unless you're targeting smaller publishing companies. My tentative plan as of now is to submit a cover letter and a sample chapter to various agents. I think this works best for my situation as I have a particular chapter that I think is stellar and entertaining enough in its own right to get requests for the rest of the manuscript. All bets are off at that point, but I'm confident I can at least make it to that part of the process. Any advice from those with experience? Any others in a similar position as me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grhqofb5 Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 You have a literature degree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubbs Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 *raises hand* A word of advice - never pay for an agent. I've had it bashed into my head that if they ask you to pay, they're scamming you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Does erotica count? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 I'm pretty sure Extreme was a writer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrockster21 Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Burgold is a writer - not sure if his book is complete and in the publishing process, or he's nearing completion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Villi Phanatic Posted July 14, 2009 Author Share Posted July 14, 2009 You have a literature degree? Nope, engineering degree actually. Always wanted to be a writer since I was a kid though and was hoping to have my first book done by 30, which just might happen. *raises hand*A word of advice - never pay for an agent. I've had it bashed into my head that if they ask you to pay, they're scamming you. Yeah, I've seen similar advice for agents charging upfront fees. However, I've also read that some reputable agents do so nowadays and it isn't as much a red flag as it used to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissU28 Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 I think Kuretainga or whatever his name is is a writer....I think his sig shows his books edit: kuraitengai CLOSE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 The board's big enough, I'm sure there are plenty of both aspiring and published writers, be it books or articles or whatever.I'm nearing completion of my first novel and am just recently really starting to research the publishing process. Based on what I've come across and been told so far, it looks like getting an agent is the best route unless you're targeting smaller publishing companies. My tentative plan as of now is to submit a cover letter and a sample chapter to various agents. I think this works best for my situation as I have a particular chapter that I think is stellar and entertaining enough in its own right to get requests for the rest of the manuscript. All bets are off at that point, but I'm confident I can at least make it to that part of the process. Any advice from those with experience? Any others in a similar position as me? A couple pieces of advice: 1. Make sure your manuscript is properly formatted. (Courier New font, 1" margins, double-spaced etc.) An improperly formatted manuscript can result in an instant rejection. 2. Finish your novel before sending out any letters. 3. Edit and revision your first draft. An agent is definitely key, but make sure you research any potential agents to avoid scammers. And you may want to subscribe to this website: http://www.writersmarket.com/ Stephen King has a very good book, "On Writing," which discusses this process; I'd recommend it to any aspiring writer. The following page also has some good information on this subject (and other useful novel-writing advice). http://www.novel-writing-help.com/publishing-a-novel.html If you finish your novel, congratulations! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royallypwned Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Does sports writing count? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullnelson9999 Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Does sports writing count? hopefully I'm a journalism major, hopefully one day i'll be writing a column in a paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royallypwned Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 hopefully I'm a journalism major, hopefully one day i'll be writing a column in a paper. :secret: You should write for Examiner in your spare time. I get paid for people I refer. :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighOnHendrix Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Does sports writing count? I took the time to click the link in your sig. Not bad, but I'm sure you're saving your best for Sir Matthew Stafford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royallypwned Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 I took the time to click the link in your sig. Not bad, but I'm sure you're saving your best for Sir Matthew Stafford. Thanks, much appreciated! haha since I'm limited to Dallas sports I won't be able to focus much on Stafford. However, since he is from Dallas, I can probably include him in an article in the future. Gotta show him some love! edit: also, just FYI I will have another article up within a couple hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 A couple pieces of advice:1. Make sure your manuscript is properly formatted. (Courier New font, 1" margins, double-spaced etc.) An improperly formatted manuscript can result in an instant rejection. An agent is definitely key, but make sure you research any potential agents to avoid scammers. And you may want to subscribe to this website: All of them rules are important, but 1 is pretty essential. Another thing is to not spend a lot on binding. Agents, publishers, and editors can tell someone is a new writer if they use a fancy shmancy cover. The pro packs it up and ships it off, the cover isn't going to impress anyone and if you spend your money on that... esp. when just trying to recruit your agent, they're going to look down on it. Second rule of thumb is patience. The slushpiles are huge these days. Two of the biggest publishers in the U.S. decided not to even print a new line of books for next year. Between the economy and lowered reading levels and the debate about what form books will take (electronic vs. paper), the industry is just really being cautious. Almost all new writers lose a publisher money. Work very hard on your bio even if your unpublished. If anyone's payed you to write (newsletters, technical writing, etc.) let the agent/publisher know. It vets you and gives you credibility. Few people want to be the first to take a chance. Work very hard on you querry/elevator pitch. You've got to get them excited in the space of half a page. You need to motivate them to decide that this is worth their time. Remember, it's not about art to most agents or publishers. It's about making money. Get them excited and give them a reason to believe your book will have an audience. Make sure your sample chapters or manuscript is as close to perfect as you can make it. No missed commas, no misspelled homonyms. Have two friends who are good at spelling and grammar read your book or pay someone to. It's almost impossible to edit your own work because you will often see what's in your head and not what's on the page. Hope there's something helpful in there. Edit: Oh, and there are also jounals some pretty genre specific that often tell of books that have just been sold. In several of the articles and announcements they'll make a mention of the agent. That's also not a bad way for you to vet agents. It's not bad to get with a guy who's been recently successful (although if s/he's really successful it will be difficult to get on their radar/list) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royallypwned Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Well if anyone cares to read my latest article, then here ya go. Recent AL pennant winners have Rangers to thank for home field Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Villi Phanatic Posted July 14, 2009 Author Share Posted July 14, 2009 An agent is definitely key, but make sure you research any potential agents to avoid scammers. And you may want to subscribe to this website:http://www.writersmarket.com/ Stephen King has a very good book, "On Writing," which discusses this process; I'd recommend it to any aspiring writer. The following page also has some good information on this subject (and other useful novel-writing advice). http://www.novel-writing-help.com/publishing-a-novel.html Thanks for all the tips and references, Baculus. My buddy who's also writing a book recommended another book (I think Jeff Herman is the author's name) that discusses publishing and agents and whatnot. Does sports writing count? Sure. I actually am considering starting up a sports column myself on fantasy football this fall after I finish my novel. I'll try to check out your column later when I have some time. Work very hard on your bio even if your unpublished. If anyone's payed you to write (newsletters, technical writing, etc.) let the agent/publisher know. It vets you and gives you credibility. Few people want to be the first to take a chance.Work very hard on you querry/elevator pitch. You've got to get them excited in the space of half a page. You need to motivate them to decide that this is worth their time. Remember, it's not about art to most agents or publishers. It's about making money. Get them excited and give them a reason to believe your book will have an audience. Make sure your sample chapters or manuscript is as close to perfect as you can make it. No missed commas, no misspelled homonyms. Have two friends who are good at spelling and grammar read your book or pay someone to. It's almost impossible to edit your own work because you will often see what's in your head and not what's on the page. Hope there's something helpful in there. Thanks for all the advice, Burgold. Unfortunately, I have never been paid to write or had anything published so I've got an empty slate to present for my bio. As for the cover letter/query pitch, I've read similar advice and think I can put something together to draw in interest. I think the key for me is a specific sample chapter that I think will attract some interest and requests for my full manuscript, be it from agents or publishing companies if I decide to submit directly to smaller companies. Then I just have to cross my fingers that one of them is willing to take a chance on my manuscript. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuraitengai Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 I think Kuretainga or whatever his name is is a writer....I think his sig shows his booksedit: kuraitengai CLOSE! it was close. lol. and missU was right. i was a writer. two books out and somewhere around 300 articles in newspapers. basically ignore what all the books say. its a waste of time. you can go get a writers market and look through it, but its a waste of time. half the agents in there say they are looking for new writers and all that jazz. so youll submit and 99% of the time it will go straight to a slush pile that they only get to if they have extra time, which they never do. and coming from the slush pile, whether its actually read or not, youll get a form postcard back a couple months later with the 'dear author' rejection. thats just how it works. you cant get a guaranteed read from an agent unless you know another recognized author that is recommending you. so its basically a catch-22. you cant get in unless you know someone and its hard to know someone unless you are in. but as for agents in general, its a waste of time. agents USED to be like your editor. they would work with you on the book to get it write before you went to a publisher. not like that anymore. now an agent is more concerned about pumping through as many manuscripts as possible and not concerned about helping the writer out. i went to a reading a couple months ago by one of my former journalism profs in college, it was like his 3rd or 4th book released. so we talked for a while afterward about submitting. cuz when i was in his class 9 years ago, he was pushing the writers market like crazy and saying to do what it says. but now hes changed his story. i told him i had been using the writers market for my first book with no success. then i used it on my second book (but where i ended up signing wasnt from the writers market, it was something my friend found and sent me a website for). he said not to bother with going for an agent and told me the whole bit from the previous paragraph about they arent really doing what they used to. he said to go straight for an editor. find an editor at a publisher that does similar stuff to what you wrote. mail them the entire manuscript and a cover letter. no matter who the editor is, even if its some huge editor at random house or harper collins, they will at least open the package to get to the SASE to respond back. when they do that, 99% of the time they will look at the first page or two of your manuscript. and if you can reel them in with that, its your in. cuz no editor will EVER be like 'well he didnt follow the proper submission guidelines. its good stuff, but ill reject him for not doing what he was supposed to'. and even if they are intrigued but your script, but dont sign you, they possibly will recommend you to a smaller publisher. and from there you can get an agent. if you have a publisher waiting, all you have to do is tell an agent that and its an easy sign. cuz the agent doesnt really have to do anything at all for the first book. my prof said thats how he got both his agents. they knew his name from published short stories. he sent a manuscript to the editor. didnt get signed, but the editor recommended him to a smaller publisher and he signed there. and for name recognition. getting short stories published is a good idea. wont make money off it, but it can get your name out there. and thats what opens doors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Well if anyone cares to read my latest article, then here ya go. Recent AL pennant winners have Rangers to thank for home field If I watched more baseball I am sure it would be an excellent article! Quick question: I cannot recall, but are you a 'Skins or a 'Boys fan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royallypwned Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 If I watched more baseball I am sure it would be an excellent article!Quick question: I cannot recall, but are you a 'Skins or a 'Boys fan? Boys, but don't hold it against me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Boys, but don't hold it against me. Ah, OK. I was going to offer you sympathy for having to cover the 'Boys, but I guess that's a treat for you! It's all good. (I just also noticed the Tom Landry-like silhouette on your profile.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Villi Phanatic Posted July 14, 2009 Author Share Posted July 14, 2009 it was close. lol.and missU was right. i was a writer. two books out and somewhere around 300 articles in newspapers. basically ignore what all the books say. its a waste of time. you can go get a writers market and look through it, but its a waste of time. half the agents in there say they are looking for new writers and all that jazz. so youll submit and 99% of the time it will go straight to a slush pile that they only get to if they have extra time, which they never do. and coming from the slush pile, whether its actually read or not, youll get a form postcard back a couple months later with the 'dear author' rejection. thats just how it works. you cant get a guaranteed read from an agent unless you know another recognized author that is recommending you. so its basically a catch-22. you cant get in unless you know someone and its hard to know someone unless you are in. but as for agents in general, its a waste of time. agents USED to be like your editor. they would work with you on the book to get it write before you went to a publisher. not like that anymore. now an agent is more concerned about pumping through as many manuscripts as possible and not concerned about helping the writer out. i went to a reading a couple months ago by one of my former journalism profs in college, it was like his 3rd or 4th book released. so we talked for a while afterward about submitting. cuz when i was in his class 9 years ago, he was pushing the writers market like crazy and saying to do what it says. but now hes changed his story. i told him i had been using the writers market for my first book with no success. then i used it on my second book (but where i ended up signing wasnt from the writers market, it was something my friend found and sent me a website for). he said not to bother with going for an agent and told me the whole bit from the previous paragraph about they arent really doing what they used to. he said to go straight for an editor. find an editor at a publisher that does similar stuff to what you wrote. mail them the entire manuscript and a cover letter. no matter who the editor is, even if its some huge editor at random house or harper collins, they will at least open the package to get to the SASE to respond back. when they do that, 99% of the time they will look at the first page or two of your manuscript. and if you can reel them in with that, its your in. cuz no editor will EVER be like 'well he didnt follow the proper submission guidelines. its good stuff, but ill reject him for not doing what he was supposed to'. and even if they are intrigued but your script, but dont sign you, they possibly will recommend you to a smaller publisher. and from there you can get an agent. if you have a publisher waiting, all you have to do is tell an agent that and its an easy sign. cuz the agent doesnt really have to do anything at all for the first book. my prof said thats how he got both his agents. they knew his name from published short stories. he sent a manuscript to the editor. didnt get signed, but the editor recommended him to a smaller publisher and he signed there. and for name recognition. getting short stories published is a good idea. wont make money off it, but it can get your name out there. and thats what opens doors. I'll have to reread and fully digest this later but thanks for the insight. A couple quick comments: Catch-22s seem to be prevalent for breaking into most of these industries (I have a bit of familiarity with the video game industry). As for the submission process you recommend, you think it's better to send the entire manuscript to editors along with a cover letter as opposed to a sample chapter and cover letter? What if you think, as in my case, that a particular chapter is very attention-grabbing and entertaining and think it stands a better chance of garnering interest than reading the book starting from Chapter 1 (not that I dislike my intro and first chapter, just that I really like this one specific chapter and it doesn't need much background at all to know what's going on in it)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royallypwned Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 Ah, OK. I was going to offer you sympathy for having to cover the 'Boys, but I guess that's a treat for you!It's all good. (I just also noticed the Tom Landry-like silhouette on your profile.) haha yeah, I love what I get to do. And soon, I'm gonna start the process of requesting press credentials since I can do that. It may take awhile, if ever, but it would be awesome to actually get to attend post game conferences and such. Maybe I'll even get a press pass for Training Camp in a few weeks, one can only dream. and indeed, the Landry pic kinda gives me away doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 haha yeah, I love what I get to do. And soon, I'm gonna start the process of requesting press credentials since I can do that. It may take awhile, if ever, but it would be awesome to actually get to attend post game conferences and such. Maybe I'll even get a press pass for Training Camp in a few weeks, one can only dream. and indeed, the Landry pic kinda gives me away doesn't it? In 2007, I got to cover Redskins training camp. It was August, over 100 degrees, and I was sweating like a well... Hog, but I got a one on one interview with Joe Gibbs (only one given that day) and had a heck of a good time. It's a strange feeling because you are fan and not all at the same time. I will say that the coolest part was that Joe did not disillusion me. He was who he was supposed to be. It's still one of my favorite pieces. http://wamu.org/audio/mc/07/08/m1070810-17346.ram It's relatively long, but an excellent piece... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royallypwned Posted July 14, 2009 Share Posted July 14, 2009 In 2007, I got to cover Redskins training camp. It was August, over 100 degrees, and I was sweating like a well... Hog, but I got a one on one interview with Joe Gibbs (only one given that day) and had a heck of a good time.It's a strange feeling because you are fan and not all at the same time. I will say that the coolest part was that Joe did not disillusion me. He was who he was supposed to be. It's still one of my favorite pieces. http://wamu.org/audio/mc/07/08/m1070810-17346.ram It's relatively long, but an excellent piece... Cool, I'll listen to it now. Yeah actually getting an interview of any kind would be awesome, even if it was with a player you know doesn't have a chance at making the team and is destined for the practice squad. I may never get access, but that isn't gonna stop me from busting my ass in hopes of changing that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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