Rdskn4Lyf21 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 (3) If you do not think African Americans suffer from high poverty and incarceration rates because of some genetic defect, but rather the way society has treated them, do you believe society has an obligation to try to make amends? If so, you are an affirmative action supporter like me. I wish I could blame my actions on how society treats me. People need to take responsibility for their own actions, regardless of race/gender/etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IbleedBnG83 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 That's true -- but it goes both ways. There seems to be a prevailing notion that it is perfectly ok to discriminate against a majority. I added that to my edited post...lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IbleedBnG83 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 The problem with impoverished unedcuated communities is the ongoig trend of the lack of education wich leads these individuals having and raising more children who are impoverished and uneducated. Its a vicious cycle. Thats where it all begins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 The problem with impoverished unedcuated communities is the ongoig trend of the lack of education wich leads these individuals having and raising more children who are impoverished and uneducated. Its a vicious cycle. Thats where it all begins. Like LaxBuddy said, the way to fix it all is to go to the inner cities and spend money on education. Then there will be no more excuses for anyone because everyone will have access to a good education. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 technically, there is no Affirmative Action, as the ERA has been soundly defeated everytime it comes for a vote. It lacks ratification by at least 3 more states to even have a prayer. This is as it should be. Hire based on merit and merit alone and we will be the most productive society ever known. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endzone_dave Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Like LaxBuddy said, the way to fix it all is to go to the inner cities and spend money on education. Then there will be no more excuses for anyone because everyone will have access to a good education. The dropout rates in the inner cities make be believe that it's not the quality of education that's the problem but the desire of the kids to be educated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 The dropout rates in the inner cities make be believe that it's not the quality of education that's the problem but the desire of the kids to be educated. That could be a part of it as well. But I think we need to devote some time and money to the inner cities and get them cleaned up and give them a better education. I just think most of them don't know any better so they drop out of school and just don't care. I think with a little time it can be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweedr01 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 technically, there is no Affirmative Action, as the ERA has been soundly defeated everytime it comes for a vote. It lacks ratification by at least 3 more states to even have a prayer.This is as it should be. Hire based on merit and merit alone and we will be the most productive society ever known. Hey Dr. Seuss, did you purposefully make this rhyme at the end or are you just that good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparkleMotion Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 The dropout rates in the inner cities make be believe that it's not the quality of education that's the problem but the desire of the kids to be educated. I agree. Hasn't there already been gobs of money spent on education and programs for inner-city kids? Money alone isn't going to solve the problem. It's going to take a serious attitude adjustment if you want to see a real change. I liked when Obama said that dropping out of school was no longer an option. This is a problem that needs more tough love, and less coddling and victim mentalities. As to the SCOTUS decision, this one seemed to me like a no-brainer. Being scared of pissing off black guys is no justification for trampling the rights of white guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Hey Dr. Seuss, did you purposefully make this rhyme at the end or are you just that good? LMAO!! Total accident with the rhyme! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaxBuddy21 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 The dropout rates in the inner cities make be believe that it's not the quality of education that's the problem but the desire of the kids to be educated. I agree there is no desire because there are not many good role models in those areas showing them what they could become with a good education. The education quality is not that good either because of that lack of motivation. Good teachers do not want to go teach kids who do not listen, do not show up and are sometimes violent. Drugs are rampant in the school and the parents really dont care in most cases. That type of environment is bad for the kids and the teachers. Somehow the cycle needs to be broken. I say we ship the inner city kids out to other schools to get them out of the negative environment to educate them. Expensive? Of course it is and right now its a little hard to do but I think if these kids could be isolated away from the drugs and violence from an early age (even though they would go back to it when school is out) it would force them to focus on school because there would be little else to distract them. Does anyone think that the majority of parents in the inner city who dont care about their kids anyway would object to having their kids stay elsewhere on the government dime during the school year? Try it out in a few cities and see what happens. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaxBuddy21 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 I agree. Hasn't there already been gobs of money spent on education and programs for inner-city kids?Money alone isn't going to solve the problem. It's going to take a serious attitude adjustment if you want to see a real change. I liked when Obama said that dropping out of school was no longer an option. This is a problem that needs more tough love, and less coddling and victim mentalities. As to the SCOTUS decision, this one seemed to me like a no-brainer. Being scared of pissing off black guys is no justification for trampling the rights of white guys. It would be great it we could force kids to stay in school until they were competent enough to graduate. If we made it the law that people had to complete high school, that would be amazing. I dont care if you have turned 18, you should be forced to stay in school until you can complete it. Dont lower the standards to help those people either. Make them work hard enough to finish themselves. Think we wouldnt be a better stronger country if that was the law? Another thing that will never happen but still wishful thinking is good sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweedr01 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 I agree there is no desire because there are not many good role models in those areas showing them what they could become with a good education. The education quality is not that good either because of that lack of motivation. Good teachers do not want to go teach kids who do not listen, do not show up and are sometimes violent. Drugs are rampant in the school and the parents really dont care in most cases. That type of environment is bad for the kids and the teachers. Somehow the cycle needs to be broken. I say we ship the inner city kids out to other schools to get them out of the negative environment to educate them. Expensive? Of course it is and right now its a little hard to do but I think if these kids could be isolated away from the drugs and violence from an early age (even though they would go back to it when school is out) it would force them to focus on school because there would be little else to distract them. Does anyone think that the majority of parents in the inner city who dont care about their kids anyway would object to having their kids stay elsewhere on the government dime during the school year? Try it out in a few cities and see what happens. Just a thought. That doesn't sound like a bad idea necessarily, but you always have to consider the extreme as well when coming up with ideas. If people knew the gov't would pretty much raise the kids for them on gov't money, there would be people so irresponsible as to just keep on having kids knowing full well the gov't would take care of them. Then obviously the gov't would have to cancel the program because they wouldn't be able to afford it and now there are even more kids in the same situation as it was before. I know its a little extreme to think of all that, but its not like stuff like this hasn't happened before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunny Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 I agree. Hasn't there already been gobs of money spent on education and programs for inner-city kids?Money alone isn't going to solve the problem. It's going to take a serious attitude adjustment if you want to see a real change. I liked when Obama said that dropping out of school was no longer an option. This is a problem that needs more tough love, and less coddling and victim mentalities. Bingo. Let's face it, children of the impoverished and uneducated usually don't have suitable or motivating parents. Their behavior is learned, and they just become accustomed to either giving up or resorting to criminal activity instead. They just settle, instead of being motivated to succeed. Hard work and focus is basically discouraged, and the 'easy' way out (usually crime) is the only path these children feel they have. It's a vicious cycle, and I personally don't blame it all on lack of funding, I mostly blame it on parenting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IbleedBnG83 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Like LaxBuddy said, the way to fix it all is to go to the inner cities and spend money on education. Then there will be no more excuses for anyone because everyone will have access to a good education. Education is one thing. Its the upbringing at home and the emphasis or lack thereof on education at home plus over core values and beliefs what makes a person who they are. How do you fix parents? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endzone_dave Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Bingo. Let's face it, children of the impoverished and uneducated usually don't have suitable or motivating parents. Their behavior is learned, and they just become accustomed to either giving up or resorting to criminal activity instead. They just settle, instead of being motivated to succeed. Hard work and focus is basically discouraged, and the 'easy' way out (usually crime) is the only path these children feel they have. It's a vicious cycle, and I personally don't blame it all on lack of funding, I mostly blame it on parenting. I'm fortunate that my son goes to a good school district. The teachers all say the main difference is the parents. Having parents who care about their childrens' education is the most important factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Education is one thing. Its the upbringing at home and the emphasis or lack thereof on education at home plus over core values and beliefs what makes a person who they are.How do you fix parents? I don't know if you can fix parents. And that's a valid point that it all starts at home, which I believe to be true. But I also believe that a child's social setting plays a role in it too. If they go to school and the teachers and other students don't care and then they go home and thier parents don't care, what motivation do they have? So if you try to motivate them in school, maybe it would turn things around at home? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rdskn4Lyf21 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 How do you fix parents? You stop enabling them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaxBuddy21 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 That doesn't sound like a bad idea necessarily, but you always have to consider the extreme as well when coming up with ideas. If people knew the gov't would pretty much raise the kids for them on gov't money, there would be people so irresponsible as to just keep on having kids knowing full well the gov't would take care of them. Then obviously the gov't would have to cancel the program because they wouldn't be able to afford it and now there are even more kids in the same situation as it was before. I know its a little extreme to think of all that, but its not like stuff like this hasn't happened before. I would rather the government raise them than some of the scumbags raising (if thats what you want to call it) the kids now. I know it would be an extremely expensive undertaking and we could never afford it but think of the benefits that it could have after the first generation made it through school like that. Kids would actually learn responsibility and it should actually have the reverse effect and lower the inner city population as this new generation works hard for a living rather than pop kids out for a welfare check. Of course this is all in an ideal world and the reality of a program like this could be vastly different as you stated. We just need to remove these kids from these environments where crime and drugs are the way of life. Ignorance is cheered. This is my biggest problem with hip hop culture. It glorifies ignorance and inner city drug dealers and such. Stop making kids think its cool to be dumb and that maybe they can eventually get a record deal for it! Its such a joke! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunny Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Education is one thing. Its the upbringing at home and the emphasis or lack thereof on education at home plus over core values and beliefs what makes a person who they are.How do you fix parents? Mandatory vasectomies and tube-tying for those on welfare, those with an extensive criminal background, or those deemed to simply be unsuitable parents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaxBuddy21 Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 How do you fix parents? Stop letting ignorant people breed! Tell people if they do not have jobs and are living on welfare, they are not allowed to have kids PERIOD! If they have them while they cannot afford to raise them then put them automatically up for adoption. Stop giving them bigger checks for popping out more kids. Stop with social welfare programs that reward laziness. Prop parents up with education and incentives to work. Tie the parents money to their childs performance in school. I have always thought making a parents tax status (or welfare status) based on their child's attendance and grades in school would motivate parents to care what their children do. If your gets between a 3.0 and 4.0 and has 95% attendance, you pay the least amount of taxes or get the best government check and it goes down on a sliding scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 I don't understand how you throw out the tests. It's about fire-fighting. There is no racial bias in fire fighting. Either you know it or you don't. I'm assuming it's about procedures and safety, so......I don't get it? Tired of them throwing out tests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madison Redskin Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 I wish I could blame my actions on how society treats me. Do you think blacks are far more likely than whites to be poor or commit crimes because they are somehow inherently different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madison Redskin Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 Stop letting ignorant people breed! Tell people if they do not have jobs and are living on welfare, they are not allowed to have kids PERIOD! If they have them while they cannot afford to raise them then put them automatically up for adoption. You should sign up to be a member of the Chinese Communist Party. It's amazing how members of the right who talk so much about "freedom" are often the ones who have no problem with freedoms being taken away from other people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljs Posted June 29, 2009 Share Posted June 29, 2009 I'm confused at how a firefighting test could be unfair to black people? I mean how does your race factor into how you fight fire, safety and such. I don't know what is on the test, but that one baffles me. I know cops that used to get mad that women/ minorities got hired before the white guy cause of the different lists per group. My only comeback was that I was #5 outta 450 overall- and just happened to be the #1 female. I did get hired before the #4 overall(white guy) though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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