mistertim Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Lets talk some patriots for a second. Thank you for making my point for me. Do you think they drafted Brady in the 6th round because they thought he would turn out to be a future HOFer? No. They drafted him as a backup. It was pure blind luck that he ended up being as good as he is. Take a look at the number of QBs drafted in late rounds and did nothing or are at best career backups and compare it to the number who went on to be stars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
talk show host Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 if we traded JC it should be for draft picks, not a player. jeff Garcia is a free agent and would do great in our offense here. He could start for 1-2 years while we determined if Brennan could be our QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_K Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 As much as I am not happy with JC's play, skip trading him and have an OPEN competition between he and CB ..... whomever PLAYS better should get the nod to start the season. If by week 6 we have a twice as many losses as wins, bench whomever was thought to be better for the other guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinz4Life12 Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 not to hijack the thread or anything but why is CB5 getting surgery in the off season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinz4Life12 Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 As much as I am not happy with JC's play, skip trading him and have an OPEN competition between he and CB ..... whomever PLAYS better should get the nod to start the season.If by week 6 we have a twice as many losses as wins, bench whomever was thought to be better for the other guy. lets start up the qb carousel all over again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jweisk1 Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 I was at the game when the Cards lost to the Bears on monday night followed by Dennis Green's "They are who we thought they were..." meltdown...It was AMAZING the way Leinart carved up that Bears defense!!!! Things haven't worked out for him in AZ...but I seriously believe Leinart IS a franchise QB. Based upon what? He has shown zippy since being drafted...oh yeah, he had 1 good game against the bears...:doh:...sounds like Vinny Cereto logic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RocketCitySkins Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 not to hijack the thread or anything but why is CB5 getting surgery in the off season? I think he needs his knee scoped. That's usually loose cartilage causing irritation. I would think he will be fine by training camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stew Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Why do we need to trade him for a QB? We have Collins who is a capable starter, and Brennen who Zorn has had his eye on since College. If we trade Campbell, it needs to be for a draft pick. Id like to think we can get a third rounder out of a QB that through half of the season didn't throw any INT's, and at the end of the season showed off his mobility. We need to unload some players for some draft picks, because four picks wont work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RocketCitySkins Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Why do we need to trade him for a QB? We have Collins who is a capable starter, and Brennen who Zorn has had his eye on since College. If we trade Campbell, it needs to be for a draft pick. Id like to think we can get a third rounder out of a QB that through half of the season didn't throw any INT's, and at the end of the season showed off his mobility. We need to unload some players for some draft picks, because four picks wont work. Collins looked lost most of the time in the WCO in pre-season. He was excellent in Saunders offense but might struggle under Zorn. His age is a minus, also, when developing a quarterback for the future. Zorn said Colt played reckless and pushed the pocket too far. Zorn wants someone who will stay in the pocket and be a "don't make mistakes" type of quarterback. That's doesn't seem like Colt to me. This totally worked for Colt in college and would probably work under a different coach in the NFL, but I can see Zorn trying to make Colt into an another quarterback other than the one he is. Campbell's not going to be traded. Zorn's already said he is the starting quarterback for next year. I'm not sure if he meant the start of training camp or that he expects him to be the starter at the beginning of the season, but he sounded like anything but trading JC. I could see a veteran FA quarterback with experience in the WCO being brought in depending on who is available. That would be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stew Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Collins looked lost most of the time in the WCO in pre-season. He was excellent in Saunders offense but might struggle under Zorn. His age is a minus, also, when developing a quarterback for the future. Zorn said Colt played reckless and pushed the pocket too far. Zorn wants someone who will stay in the pocket and be a "don't make mistakes" type of quarterback. That's doesn't seem like Colt to me. This totally worked for Colt in college and would probably work under a different coach in the NFL, but I can see Zorn trying to make Colt into an another quarterback other than the one he is. Campbell's not going to be traded. Zorn's already said he is the starting quarterback for next year. I'm not sure if he meant the start of training camp or that he expects him to be the starter at the beginning of the season, but he sounded like anything but trading JC. I could see a veteran FA quarterback with experience in the WCO being brought in depending on who is available. That would be interesting. Good call, i don't see Campbell being traded either, but wouldnt beat my chest in despair if he were. It reminds me of the Betts scenario last year where his marketability was at his highest and we dicided to keep him because he was more valuable to the team. I think it applies here as well. Campbell has done enough this year to give him next year to show his worth. Betts showed that last year and remains a commodity to the passing game out of the backfield, and has proven he can take a work load. If we were to bring in a Vet QB that can run the WCO, does this make Collins the lamb for slaughter on the chopping block? Do we ship him to St. Louis to reunite with his father (Saunders) and the 700 page screen pass manual? What do you think we could get for him at this point? The one thing I will say about Colt, is that Zorn has been contacting him since College, and that means Zorn see's something he likes in Colt enough to keep in touch with him while he was at Seattle as a QB coach. Zorn has a plan for Colt, and i read during draft time last year that Brennen's stock fell because of the caliber of his opponents and some off field sexual harasssment claim. I don't know what ever came of that though, i don't think i misread the article, but maybe im not remembering it correctly though. Does anyone remember something like this? Anyways, Im good with Colt sitting and learning before coming in and putting on a show. I think in a year or two, he could be a really good QB in this league, its just not his time yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smitity Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Leinart: still a sexy name from his USC days, but if he's not good enough to start in AZ, why would he be good enough here? Grossman: Too much of a Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde stiuation here. You can't get win or build around that kind of inconsistency. Even though Cambell wasn't the most consistent QB (at least in the 2nd half of the season), at least you know what you have. Bulger: Kinda like Brunell, Good QB, but probably doesn't have very many good years left in the tank. I'd rather keep the money and draft picks Vinny would inevitably throw his way. Rebuilding the lines is far more valuable than maybe 2 good years w/ Bulger. That said, I think this is the first time a QB has started and finished all 16 games since Brad Johnson. Baby steps people, baby steps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fire3fighter4 Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Leinart: still a sexy name from his USC days, but if he's not good enough to start in AZ, why would he be good enough here? Yeah...Because Kurt Warners been terrible this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampEm Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 I would trade him for a Jason Candle stand up poster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krsone Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 I personally don't think he is a franchise quarterback, but what other options might there be if we were to trade him? Who ever we were to bring in might be in an open competition in camp with Colt.Matt Leinart? I would expect the Cardinals to sign Warner for 2 more years in which case they might want a veteran to back him up. Rex Grosman? Yeah, he's a turnover machine but he has played in big games. Plus we wouldn't need to worry about his feelings being hurt if Colt beats him out. Marc Bulger? They seem to have soured on him in St. Louis probably due to his large contract and poor record. But that team is a mess so you can't pin it all on him. These are just a few names that somewhat intrigue me due in part to their current situation that may need to change and the fact that Campbells won/loss record of 14-15 the last 2 years given his ground game and defense is lesss than stellar. Not to mention Washington is a tough place on QBs if you don't get it done in a hurry. This ofcourse is assuming we were to trade JC for another QB...which almost never happens in the NFL. A month ago I would have said that Matt Cassel would be our QB...but I doubt New England would let him get away for less than 2 first rounders once they franchise him. Plus there is the uncertainty of Tom Brady's knee. If there is a team dumb enough to give us a 1st rounder, hell yeah?> i would be happy with a 2nd or a 3rd. matter of fact, this is a thread. right now, if JC was on the market, do you think any team out there would want to give up a 1st or even a 2nd for him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunBunch7 Posted December 30, 2008 Author Share Posted December 30, 2008 Kansas City and Detroit need QBs and may not want to pay some unproven rookie 60 million so there is a chance for a trade for picks with them. Minnesota may be in the market for a QB depending on how Tavaris perfomrs in the playoffs. The Jets get to feel the pain of the Packers the last 5 years as Fav-ruh kicks around his future...they may want to solidify their QB position, "particulalry" with a QB that doesn't throw picks...?... Cleveland seems to have 1 too many QBs it can afford...Brady and Derek...?... Id Jacksonville sold on Garrard? As I mentioed in the original post...Arizona may want to unload Leinart...Chicago may finally unload Grossman...Bulger may not be the QB that the new coach will want in St Louis. Also, will Singletary be patient with Shaun Hill in SF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebster21 Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Thank you for making my point for me. Do you think they drafted Brady in the 6th round because they thought he would turn out to be a future HOFer? No. They drafted him as a backup. It was pure blind luck that he ended up being as good as he is. Take a look at the number of QBs drafted in late rounds and did nothing or are at best career backups and compare it to the number who went on to be stars. I would have quoted some one right before you but what about Matt Cassel. You think just because I said patriots I say Tom Brady. Cassel was a 7th rounder. Matt Hasselbeck 6th round. Trent Green if he ever stayed with a team would have been pretty good. I am not going to go in depth at some of the other late round players that have done good at the QB position but I came name more than a handful that have failed as first round draft picks. Not to mention that is just a few of the QBs that have been good that are still in the league. So you are very welcome for proving your point WRONG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus87 Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Kansas City and Detroit need QBs and may not want to pay some unproven rookie 60 million so there is a chance for a trade for picks with them.Minnesota may be in the market for a QB depending on how Tavaris perfomrs in the playoffs. The Jets get to feel the pain of the Packers the last 5 years as Fav-ruh kicks around his future...they may want to solidify their QB position, "particulalry" with a QB that doesn't throw picks...?... Cleveland seems to have 1 too many QBs it can afford...Brady and Derek...?... Id Jacksonville sold on Garrard? As I mentioed in the original post...Arizona may want to unload Leinart...Chicago may finally unload Grossman...Bulger may not be the QB that the new coach will want in St Louis. Also, will Singletary be patient with Shaun Hill in SF? You're reaching pretty far with almost all of these.Kansas City likes what they see so far out of Thigpen, he's sticking around for next year, they've already said as much. Minnesota isn't expecting the world out of Jackson against the Eagles because of his inexperience, but they'd like to keep developing him and see what he can turn into. He's played some decent football for them the last few games, and he was a 2nd round I'm pretty sure. Cleveland right now is stuck with both Quinn and Anderson due to their contracts, but I wouldn't want either guy anyway, as both aren't that good (especially Anderson who just sucks). Jacksonville just gave Garrard a big extension last year and while he's a pretty average QB (definitely not better than Campbell in any way), the whole team sucked from offense to defense to special teams, so they're not looking to dump him right now. Leinart has already been addressed by several people in this thread, as has Grossman. Bulger is a Coryell QB to the core, so that's not an option. And the 49ers aren't entirely sold on Hill but that's largely because of Martz being shaky on him, but Martz likely won't be there next year, and Hill was their QB when they went 5-3 or whatever to end the season, including beating us with his arm to set up their field goal. The only possibles on that list are Detroit and the Jets. Problem is, teams aren't likely to trade a 2nd for a QB that's on his last contract year, especially when they know we're not entirely sold yet on him ourselves. Other GMs aren't as dumb as Vinny. If a team is interested in Campbell, there's no rush to make moves to get him now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AirMayo21 Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 We all know JC isn't going anywhere. Zorn has a major crush on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catatonic Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Can him for Brunnell. At least he can hit the short stuff consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morpheusmeyers Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Can him for Brunnell. At least he can hit the short stuff consistently. You mean Scott Brunell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catatonic Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 You mean Scott Brunell? Negative, everybody's favorite Mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 I would have quoted some one right before you but what about Matt Cassel. You think just because I said patriots I say Tom Brady. Cassel was a 7th rounder. Matt Hasselbeck 6th round. Trent Green if he ever stayed with a team would have been pretty good. I am not going to go in depth at some of the other late round players that have done good at the QB position but I came name more than a handful that have failed as first round draft picks. Not to mention that is just a few of the QBs that have been good that are still in the league.So you are very welcome for proving your point WRONG. You want to go back to the draft boards for the last 10 years and count the number of late round QBs that did NOTHING? Like I said, some teams get lucky. Cassel played well after stepping in but there is no way to know if he would be consistently good for them or would be a flash in the pan like Anderson was last year for Cleveland. So you have named a few late round QBs who have gone on to be productive for many years (Brady, Hasselbeck, Green perhaps, Warner). Again, compare that to the number of guys drafted in late rounds that did nothing. If a team is looking for a starter at QB they are going to pick one up early. If they really liked a guy that much they would pick him up before the 6th. The Skins saw value in Colt in the 6th and grabbed him to groom for what would likely be a backup role. Remember that Colt isn't much younger than JC. I think about a year and a half younger. So it isn't like we have some young 21 year old. They must have taken that into account during the draft. Why would you draft a guy who is raw and will probably take a decent amount of work to be an an NFL level as your future starter if he is not much younger than your current starter? As an educated guess I'd say "if you want him to eventually be a solid backup for a while". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yeen80 Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Well, as long as Zorn remains our coach, the idea of bringing in Matt Hasselbeck makes sense. But I still think JC needs another full year in this offense. We need to surround him with some better targets that fit this scheme. I don't think we should trade him....at least not yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsbosoxheels Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Cassell...Anderson...or possibly Alex Smith whom I think with the right system could be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommishDC Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 QB's for next year is really simple: Campbell-Brennan-Hasselbeck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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