TSO Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Clinton Portis' situation got me thinking... Has anyone kept some sort of record with how many smoke screens Zorn's used so far? I know that's a stupid question, but this is extremeskins. I'm curious, because it seems like so many of us here have just accepted as fact that Zorn employs that strategy. I'm actually one who thinks he does also, but I'm also interested in seeing when he's done it and how many times so far this season... I know it's pretty difficult to get a handle on that, but I'm sure us "extreme" skins folk can each put in the times they remember. It'll add up eventually, right? :whoknows: Thought it'd be interesting to gauge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backpack3r Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Can someone explain exactly what a smoke screen is specifically? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSO Posted November 12, 2008 Author Share Posted November 12, 2008 Can someone explain exactly what a smoke screen is specifically? lol... I guess I should've. When a coach pretty much "fakes" everyone out by not actually stating how they really feel about injuries to the players; or simply hides the fact. Like what most of us think Zorn is doing with Portis. The whole 50/50 thing... most of us think it's just a "smoke screen". That he's either a) a lot better than that and they know he'll most likely play or a lot worse and he most likely won't play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jroc96 Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 I think he mean's letting the media know someone is injured but the injury isn't as serious as he tells them it is? Kinda to throw the other team off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins2Win33 Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 If you see today's interview with Zorn, you can see he's upbeat about Portis when first asked, then tries to play down his condition. I have a feeling the Portis talk is a smoke screen as well. That of course is my opinion, combined with some optimism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy Smith Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 The league fines teams heavily if they are dishonest about players' injuries. I'm sure it goes on, but I don't really think Portis is uninjured. Just sayin'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Acre Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Can someone explain exactly what a smoke screen is specifically? Well, as Dallas runs it, it involves a bong. (nice, green smile) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullnelson9999 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 im not sure Zorn has used a whole lot, there have been a lot of legitimate injuries on this team this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arsenic Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Well, as Dallas runs it, it involves a bong. (nice, green smile) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HigSkin Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 I think you could also call it "coach speak". Gibbs was really good at it and Zorn is using it more as the season goes on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSO Posted November 13, 2008 Author Share Posted November 13, 2008 Ok... so it seems as if we all simply accept that Zorn uses "coach speak" or "smoke screens", yet we have no examples? I'm just wondering where so many around here get the idea to not believe anything that were told when it comes to injuries. Can't tell you how many times I've read that "Portis will play, it's just a smoke screen"... I'm wondering where we can point and say "There, that was one time where Zorn likely was not telling it like it is" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walking Deadman Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 The league fines teams heavily if they are dishonest about players' injuries. I'm sure it goes on, but I don't really think Portis is uninjured. Just sayin'. Has the Patriots ever been fined? 'nuff said. They lie about their injury reports every week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cphil006 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 When I played Spy Hunter, I used smoke screens and oil slicks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gortiz Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 i don't think there has been one smoke screen, really. when has a player miraculously participated in a game after he was thought to be injured? maybe JZ-Spy Hunter is saving it for this one though. If portis plays and plays well, we just got Smoked Screened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 The league fines teams heavily if they are dishonest about players' injuries. I'm sure it goes on, but I don't really think Portis is uninjured. Just sayin'. Has the Patriots ever been fined?'nuff said. They lie about their injury reports every week. The NFL has changed the injury status reporting system to help eliminate the fudge factor. Rather than have a detailed report that appears on Wednesday and Thursday indicating whether a player is probable, questionable, doubtful, or out, teams simply report if players participated in practice. Then a standard injury report is issued Friday. Here's a link that explains it: http://www.thefantasyfootballtimes.com/fftimes/content/?CID=475 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eljeasel Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 When I played Spy Hunter, I used smoke screens and oil slicks... YES great game! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSkins2006 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 The NFL has changed the injury status reporting system to help eliminate the fudge factor. Rather than have a detailed report that appears on Wednesday and Thursday indicating whether a player is probable, questionable, doubtful, or out, teams simply report if players participated in practice. Then a standard injury report is issued Friday. Here's a link that explains it: http://www.thefantasyfootballtimes.com/fftimes/content/?CID=475 Participation in practice is easier to fake imo. You can have the player out on the field and not doing much and can still say he practiced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SittingBull Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 JZ has actually been excessively honest with players' health so far this year so I think alot of you are in denial due to the fact that the news about CP's knee came out of nowhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSO Posted November 13, 2008 Author Share Posted November 13, 2008 JZ has actually been excessively honest with players' health so far this year so I think alot of you are in denial due to the fact that the news about CP's knee came out of nowhere. This is what I'm thinking... this thread has become a joke and I think it has a lot to do with the fact that there is no evidence of such "smoke screening". I mean, does anybody have anything but Spy Hunter talk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soup Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Yeah I remember one during the preseason when everyone asked portis if he was going to play and portis told everyone during the week that he was going to start for the jets game and he didn't even suit up. Afterwards zorn said he was just pulled the media's chain. I'm not sure if that is a smoke screen but I sure believed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walking Deadman Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Portis has missed alot of practices before and plays and there is minimal conversation about missing practice in previous weeks. This injury occurs and Zorn is saying 50-50, then CP goes on Thompson's show and says Grade 2 MCL; then goes on Irvin's show and talks about how he'd miss the SB right now b/c he's injured with the knee. Granted CP is a MVP candidate, but it seems there been alot more talk about injuries than usual (normally you try to keep the conversation to a minimal b/c you give an opponent an advantage or a target) and this leads me to think that Portis was hurt and he's not 100% but one of two things will happen: 1) Portis will play and is not nearly banged up as suggested (I expect this one). 2) Portis is out and the Skins are leaving the possibility open so that Dallas will be forced to game plan him despite not practicing (practice while important, for a back like CP is overrated) Zorn hasn't been know to smokescreen folks.....matter of fact he's usually pretty candid when it comes to his players, but we haven't seen all of Zorn's tricks yet (probably not even 10%) and who knows this could be one of them. we have to wait and see......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliffBattles Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 I think Zorn is pretty genuine. But, that is a guess. Coaching against Zorn is like playing poker against a poker player you don't know. It is yet to be determined if he is really good or not. If you play poker against a bad player, it is very difficult at first because you don't know what they are going to do. If you play poker against a good player, you know what they are going to do; although they won't make really stupid moves, and will beat you if you play poorly...you know what to expect- and you can beat them if given the right circumstances and cards. If you play a REALLY good player...you need to be really good, be patient, error free, smart...and a little lucky. It is hard to say for certain what Zorn is right now. I like him...and I think he is clearly not a terrible player...but whether he is moderately good or outrageously great or average while lucky.....well, that will take time to determine. By the same logic, so will figuring out if he is using "smokescreens" or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iMeast Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 I hope it is something like this ... because I can't see this thing going too well if Clinton Portis is not in the game ... and Ladell Betts isn't there to step in. I mean I love Rock Cartwright and all, but I don't think he or the washed up Seahawk can do it half as good as those two guys. :dallasuck HTTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 I have seen Zorn use a few bubble screens and some TE screens but not many smoke screens to be honest. To be serious I actually think Zorn is pretty straight down the middle on these things. I'm sure he holds back some detail on exactly what the training staff are telling him but for the most part he tells it how it is. I think its a real longshot that Portis takes any part Sunday and it also sounds like Moss is not 100% yet either, though he still has time to get back close to full go. If Moss is in any way limited and Portis is out this is going to be a tough game to win. Campbell is going to have to take the game on his shoulders, the D is going to have to play a very good game and Cooley and ARE are going to have to have big games. Be nice if Thomas finally stepped up to the plate as well. I actually think Alexander can do a reasonable job of running the ball for us but we are going miss Portis a lot. One thing in our favour Romo sits to pee is not 100% either and must have some rust - there may be a few balls that get away from him and if we have a shot at a pick we have to catch the damn thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Nostril Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 I don't think it's necessary to have specific examples from the past to hypothesize that a first year NFL coach may be using a "smoke screen." I think it's fair to assume that a 55 year old man, who has been involved in professional and collegiate team sports for well over 30 years, is more than familiar with the concept of gamesmanship. If he fudged with injury reports too frequently then it wouldn't be effective, because his opponents would know not to take what Zorn says about injuries seriously. The theorizing about "smoke screens" is simply an acknowledgement that we have the biggest game of our season coming up, and the coach is spending alot of time talking to press about an injury to our biggest star player. It may be completely true, but it doesn't completely pass the eyeball test, and it's involving a head coach who's too new to really have a reputation about these sort of things. Questioning is justified. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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