Why doesn't anyone give Gibbs credit?

[krisjan76]

i give gibbs credit for being the first top level head coach we've had since marty schottenheimer. he did the best he could with the talent he had and took them as far as he could (first round of playoffs, one time to the 2nd round). hopefully with zorn we will be able to move further.

[Skins2Win33]

I love stuff like this. Blame Saunders, not Gibbs! It's all Al's fault!

So who hired Saunders?

Hmmm, maybe it was Danny boy who pulled those strings the most. But no matter who did the hire, I agree with the fact that Gibbs brought in alot of the talent here. But the thing with Saunders I speak of was the conflict with the playcalling between Gibbs and Saunders. They could never get on the same page with who was going to make the calls. And with Saunders its a matter of all the players adapting to his highly complicated offensive scheme. Zorn is open minded and open to allow his system to adapt to the rosters strengths. But I will admit, Gibbs was off alot with his management of the game.

[gkekoa]

Gibbs brought something that was very much lacking back to Washington...HOPE. He did a good job and now it is time for the new era to begin.

[DCMONEY]

So you are saying that the reason Gibbs 2.0 wasn't successful is because Beathard wasn't making the personal moves?

If you look at our team roster right now, you can say that the only new person contributing to the team this year is Chris Horton. And if it wasn't for the unfortunate loss of ST, he wouldn't be playing at all.

But besides him, Gibbs is the one to bring in all the players having any significant playing time. So how can you say Beathard is the reason for the success of Gibbs 1.0?

Bobby Beathard was the person(GM) to put those Superbowl teams together. Beathard was the GM of the Chiefs and Chargers when they reached the Superbowl. Gibbs the coach I like. Gibbs the admin person I don't. To give Mark Brunell 9 mill up front and a 3rd round pick was I hate to say it dumb to me. The Jaguars were about to cut the guy. To give up a 4th and 5th rounder for Brandon Lloyd plus 10 mill in sigining bonus was well dumb. To give Archuleta 10mill plus was well dumb. Gibbs and his staff evaluated these guys and decided they were worth it. To give Randel El an 11 mill signing bonus was dumb. When the Skins signed him I was like what did he do with the Steelers? His #'s were average at best. He's an average WR to me. I'm not gonna even mention all the wasted draft picks. When you take into account pay and wasted draft picks this team was very average to me I'm sorry.

Also Gibbs in his evaluation decided he needed to change his offense when it was his QB all the time that needed changing. For some reason he was stuck on Brunell.

[paloosa]

I am so sick of everyone throwing Gibbs under the bus. Everyone thinks he was so terrible and held everyone back. He took us to two playoffs! Does anyone remember the years of embarrasment before Gibbs? What people dont realize is that our team wouldnt be what it is now without Gibbs. He put this franchise where it is today. I do think the west coast offense is the best thing for our team. We have little fast recievers and Jason ran the west coast well in college. Just because we are winning, does not mean Joe Gibbs hurt this football team! He brought all the character morals that our team was needing. Just my :2cents:

Not everyone is throwing Gibbs under the bus and I have always loved Gibbs as a coach and human being. He is the best type of coach to work for because he takes the blame for the failures of the team but gives the credit to everyone as a team when they win. The reason why a lot of people have made statements about Gibbs in one way shape or form is due to his conservative play-calling in certain situations.

Also, to say that the West Coast Offense won't work here because the personnel here aren't the right players based on what typical West Coast teams like San Francisco, Green Bay, Philadelphia, Denver, and many others. Yes we are winning and it is due to the agressive style of offense that the West Coast Offense brings. It is a high tempo offense designed to keep defenses off-balanced and always guessing where Joe Gibbs and his style was slow and methodical. He was predictable in his play-calling and it showed in a lot of the games. Since the West Coast Offense has been implemented here we have scorred more points in the first 4 games of the year than we have in the beginning of any Gibbs coached year. We are averaging 20 points a game right now and would be higher if we didn't play so badly in the first game against the Giants.

So don't say everyone is bashing Gibbs or questioning his coaching style for unjust cause. He did a lot to turn this franchise around but he also did a poor job in some areas during his time back. He deserves credit and equally fault in all aspects of the turn-around of this franchise. He did his job well.

[BAFGA]

guys like Czaben has a crew who hates him.

Funny thing is everyone credits Zorn which they should because he has a great offensive mind and better than Saunders. But the offensive line, defensive cordinator , special teams and whole defensive staff are all Gibbs staff members. And Gibbs brought 95 percent of these playersin. So if you say he was holding the team back. He made the team and made this coaching staff other than Zorn , Stump Mitchell and a few other coaches.

Of the players currently on the 53 man roster:

28 were acquired or drafted during the Gibbs 2.0 era.

2 were reacquired during the Gibbs 2.0 era having been here prior (Smoot, Thrash)

8 were on the team prior to Gibbs 2.0.

15 are players that were not here last year (Brennan, D. Thomas, Kelly, Brooks, Tryon, Moore, Horton, Fincher, Taylor, Rinehart, James, Davis, Jackson, Hamilton, Geisinger).

So, saying 95% of the players were brought in by Gibbs is not accurate, since 28.3% of the roster now was acquired after Gibbs retired.

[zCommander]

I love stuff like this. Blame Saunders, not Gibbs! It's all Al's fault!

So who hired Saunders?

That was one failure on JG part. He should not have ever hired him. You don't hire and change your offense right after being 1 game away from being in the SB.

Beside that JG did do a pretty good job. I am glad he came back or else we wouldn't have never gotten Zorn (destiny is a mysterious force ).

[PortisFan123]

I completely agree Gibbs turned this program around. He kept this team together last year during one of those tragic events in the franchise history and they even made an improbable run in the playoffs...how many coaches could achieve that? Not many.

Plus I always give credit to the past coach if the following year if a team is good, makes the playoffs and then goes to the superbowl. Recent historical example is the great job Dungy did with Jacksonville, and the following year Gruden comes in, with a with a well assembled, well coached squad and they won the SB. What has Chuckie Gruden done since? Well he has brought his team to the playoffs but they miss every year. Dungy goes to an average squad in Indy and turns them into champs. So I never disregard the past coach, especially if a first year coach suddenly has a winning club.

So Gibbs remains one of my favorite coaches of all time and he has much to do with this teams current success.

[Gregpeck99]

Gibbs contribution was to go get Campbell ... but he was not an aggressive field general and his penchant for getting on his knees to pray instead of exhorting his troops set a bad example. And of course he stayed with Brunell far too long. Otherwise he was a nice guy.

[bubba9497]

Gibbs II was undermined by some incredible bad luck

but the fact is Gibbs turned the franchise around, taught Snyder a great deal, and built a solid foundation for Zorn to work with

[WSHRedskins3ATLBraves3]

Without Coach Gibbs we'd still be in that terrible cycle of hiring new coaches and big-name players with no results.

[Kindred]

I believe that Gibbs accomplished a great deal, he put all the pieces in places, but simply lacked that extra element to take this team to the next level. If he had never left the game, I think we would have been a perennial elite team. However, he always played safe, conservative football, which, although fundamentally sound and is enough to take us a long way, it was somewhat predictable and not enough to take us to the top. Zorn has the guts, the spark, the drive to take that extra step. Zorn has faith in his players and faith in his system and utilizes the players to their FULL potential.

[Fifty Gut]

I loved Gibbs II. It's just I never felt this confident about the offense under him.

[Wyvern]

My take is that Gibbs 2.0 did a great job in re-building team character and team chemistry. He was also responsible for infusing some quality coaching talent into the Redskins' organization, many of whom remain today. He also re-established some of the respect and discipline that the team needed, something that Spurrier let slide a bit. Gibbs heavily-structured training camps provided a solid basis for Zorn to build on; I doubt that would have been possible with Spurrier's leavings.

Considering Gibbs' first couple of years were involved in 'rebuilding' the team Spurrier had left him, Gibbs results were fairly decent. Many rebuilding teams take years to get back to the playoffs, and some teams (Lions, Oakland, etc.) take even longer getting back, in spite of routinely getting top 10 drafting positions. Rebuilding under Gibbs went much better, in spite of all the unfortunate injuries and tragedies.

I also think Gibbs 2.0 compares very favorably over Marty Schottenheimer. I recall stories of how Marty had some of his 'own' players spying on the attitudes of the other Skins players and informing Marty on the malcontents. That was not much of a team-chemistry builder. It seemed like Marty never did well with many of the players, nor with upper management, and both are an important requirement for the smooth running of a franchise. Also, Gibbs seems to have left the Skins FO in much better shape; they did well in the off-season of 2008, and Zorn seems to be a great hire. (Lastly, it's not clear to me whether Marty would have been as successful in the NFC-East than he was in the AFC-West; his teams tended to be somewhat one-dimensional, and NFC-East defenses are traditionally very good against the running game.)

[Flycoach]

Coach Joe is why we have a good team today. It was his idea to draft Jason Campbell.

[elkabong82]

Who on offense do we have now that was better than the players we had in 2005? And we were..13th?

Maybe you should look at how many second half leads were blown in Gibbs' second tenure. Then check the fourth quarter leads blown in Gibbs' second tenure. These things were play calling. I'm not saying Gibbs was the worse coach ever or something. He was mediocre.

And maybe you should look at how many of those "leads" were by less than a TD. Seriously though, we made the playoffs twice under Gibbs. Not even a 1/3 of the NFL has made the playoffs twice in the last 3 years. I know you're not saying Gibbs was the worst ever, but you did make some silly claims, esp. the red flag privileges. The Gibbs offense actually looked real good in 2005, bringing in Saunders turned out to be a mistake. That is what I was trying to say. Gibbs was not mediocre, especially considering the team he built.

[elkabong82]

Gibbs II was undermined by some incredible bad luck

but the fact is Gibbs turned the franchise around, taught Snyder a great deal, and built a solid foundation for Zorn to work with

It's too bad there are some on here who apparently will never appreciate that, preffering instead to point out the overall W-L column as it suits what they said all along. Pretty sad some people would rather feel right than recognize the truth, or what someone brought to the team outside of wins and losses.

[Dr. Terrapin]

Read my sig. I'm with you.

Gibbs is the only reason this town has the right to EXPECT the team to do well....3 trophies, all on his original watch. People in Detroit, or Phoenix (actually, delete that....they just don't care), Atlanta, or PHILADELPHIA would kill to have just one and never really expect their teams to make it all the way. Gibbs pushed for JC, CC, CP, Gregg Williams, etc.

Zorn has done an AWESOME job, but without Gibbs 2.0 he wouldn't have had anything close to this much to work with. And however far JZ takes this team this year, I guarantee he'll get a call from Coach Gibbs offering congratulations and denying any credit.

[Smurf85]

Gibbs knows how to bring players in, just like Bill Parcells. With that being said he doesn't know how to coach like he did in the old days. Both Gibbs and Bill where great coaches in there day, but it's now a young mans game. That's why Zorn has looked so good this far. He is perfect for the job. Everyone should thank Gibbs for the players he brought in like Portis, Moss, Cooley, JC, Springs and the list goes on. He gave us the talent now we have a coach that can take them deep into the playoffs. It's just to bad we have to win every week to keep up with this division.

[HigSkin]

I really love Gibbs. However, lots of people need credit for where we are today. We're winning because we have a coach that knows what to do with QB's and calls plays for today's offense. We have young and upcoming players because of Vinny. We have a good defense because of Williams and Blache. We have an owner that is willing to pay players. etc.etc.etc.

:2cents:

[Robbynice]

I am so sick of everyone throwing Gibbs under the bus. Everyone thinks he was so terrible and held everyone back. He took us to two playoffs! Does anyone remember the years of embarrasment before Gibbs? What people dont realize is that our team wouldnt be what it is now without Gibbs. He put this franchise where it is today. I do think the west coast offense is the best thing for our team. We have little fast recievers and Jason ran the west coast well in college. Just because we are winning, does not mean Joe Gibbs hurt this football team! He brought all the character morals that our team was needing. Just my :2cents:

Nobody in his right mind will throw Gibbs under the bus not after what he did last year when we lost Sean. Last year was Joe's best year coaching with the Redskins IMHO.

[Muzzah]

I give him Credit. Credit for wearing a GM hat and bringing in most of these guys. However, Zorn is proving that he can coach this group of guys better and is more suited for the current NFL.

[truskin4life]

Funny, I remember when Zorn took over this team and it was announced that the offense would transfer over to a WCO.... that the personnel was ill-suited for that offensive scheme. That the offense lacked the larger receivers... and the offensive line personnel wasn't suited for it either. And heck, Portis was never noted for his receiving abilities --probably why our offense still doesn't feature it.

And now, you want to give credit to Gibbs for building this team and the success it has enjoyed?

Sure, right after you give Spurrier credit for the Skins making the playoffs 2 out of the last 4 years.

You can appreciate Joe for what he done for this franchise.... without having to stretch reason to do so.

Your quote made absolutely no sense!

[LoudMouth12thMan]

I don't think that people realize the impact of a guy like Parcells and what his mark meant for Bellichik and the Pat's success. I think that you'll see a similar mark made by Gibbs II and people will eventually recognize that down the road. It's just too early and people think that Zorn is some kind of savior. He's playing with Vinny's and Joe's guys, so Gibbs deserves a lot of credit. Zorn deserves a ton of credit too b/c he possesses what Gibbs never possessed. Zorn is an aggressive but smart playcaller and he knows how to get the "modern" NFL player ready to play. Zorn has a long way to go, but I do believe that Zorn will take Gibbs' players and get things out of them that Joe couldn't. That's the same thing that happened in New England, minus the Super Bowl appearance of course. But, it is pretty similar, and I actually think that Zorn will go to a Super Bowl with this team in the coming years. Call me crazy

[truskin4life]

Nobody in his right mind will throw Gibbs under the bus not after what he did last year when we lost Sean. Last year was Joe's best year coaching with the Redskins IMHO.

Really? You can honestly say you havent herd the Gibbs haters? Do you watch ESPN or listen to ESPN radio? It reallly makes me angry when our current players talk about Gibbs. That has happend as well!