Oldfan Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Can you reconcile these two positions? You claim the Wonderlic is a fair measure of intelligence, but later it seems you are either questioning the validity of the Wonderlic itself or questioning the validity of Campbell's later scores (which begs the question why aren't the validit of both scores questioned).I still believe preparing for the Wonderlic can result in much higher scores. Employing simple strategies that are not self-evident, such as skipping any question that you can not answer at first glance, can have a tremendous impact on the raw score. As I said earlier, I can understand marginal improvement on the test with repeated tries, but something's wrong when someone scores a 14 and then a 28. If such a difference in scores happened routinely, the test would be obviously flawed. Moreover, if people can "prepare" for the test and double their scores, it would be obvious that the method used isn't reliably testing for intelligence -- rendering the test worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veretax Posted January 10, 2008 Author Share Posted January 10, 2008 Again. Why do people say Campbell has great athleticism? Average at best. Big Ben is the much better athlete, and passer. In my opinion, Ben and Campbell are about the same as far sa mobility. Ben kind of stumbles a bit while rolling out though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCMONEY Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Just because you've never heard of this problem with Jason up until now doesn't mean it hasn't existed. The fact of the matter is Jason's cognitive skills are below average. Scouts were predicting he would have trouble executing an NFL calibre offense because of his mental limitations. There's only so much Al Saunders (or any offensive coordinator in the NFL for that matter!) can do for Jason before he turns to another quarterback with adequate cognitive skills. If Jason's offensive coordinators in college have had to water down their college level offenses, imagine the challenges Al Saunders is forced to overcome in dealing with Campbell. JC has had a history of making his offensive coordinators comprimise the offense's wizardry/innovation. Defenses in the NFL become more complex. If the offense can't match or surpass that innovation because of the quarterback's mental limitations, that offensive coordinator isn't being given a fair shot to show what he can really do with the personnel capable of running the offense to its fullest. Clearly, JC isn't capable of running the offense to its fullest. Yet Al Saunders gets blamed for being unfair to JC by handcuffing the offense :doh:. Finally a QB with a brain comes in during a 4 game stretch and the washington redskins lead the league in yardage per pass play for that month. Go figure! Now that Gibbs has left, I hope Al Saunders is given a fair shot to build a successful offense by eliminating any feelings of commitment he might have had to Jason Campbell as a result of pressure exerted by Gibbs. We need an open QB competition. I think Gibbs tried to remove some of that commitment towards Campbell, which was unfair to Saunders considering he's had to work the offense around Campbell's mental limitations just like JC's offensive coordinators in the past, by advising a QB competition between Campbell and Collins. This isn't college football for Campbell anymore. Athleticism and a big frame won't win you the starting job in this league. Man I get tired of people trying to make football geometry. Don't get me wrong. Learning new terminology and keeping it in takes some level of intelligence but its football. I help coach football and know some kids that are honor roll students but their skill level on the field is what it is. On the other hand their are some kids that are dumb by society's standard and they can play period. I heard this same argument with Vince Young and Matt Leinhart. All I hear is announcers talk about Vince Young's accuracy. Hell give him some WR's. Matt Leinart has Larry Fitzgerald,Anquan Bolden & Edgerin James yet he's struggling. Young is winning and if he had the skilled players around him he'd put up the #'s. Young wasn't supposed to be able to run a pro style offense. All this being said. Stevie Wonder can see that Jason can play. Damn he's made some typical mistakes that young QB's make. Hell even veteran QB's have made some of those mistakes. What about WR's dropping passes on him. Was Brunnell dumb in this offense? Hell all he did was check down. The team won despite him. Jason has put up #'s that prove his potential. Will he be the next great QB? Who knows? But damn to put him under the bus already is ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Why does it explain that i rised my SAT score for english from a 600 to a 740 on the 2nd try and then i got a 730 on the 3rd try? If you had improved your 600 SAT to a 1200, then you would have equalled Jason's remakable achievment in going from a 14 to a 28 on the Wonderlik. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 If you had improved your 600 SAT to a 1200, then you would have equalled Jason's remakable achievment in going from a 14 to a 28 on the Wonderlik. You have to taken into consideration that even though his score might have went up by double - blind guesses are correct this time, not last time - 1/2 guesses are goign the right way - studided before this one before going into it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaded-Dragon Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 I guess we should run out and grab Alex Smith then, he seems to be 'super smart'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 You have to taken into consideration that even though his score might have went up by double- blind guesses are correct this time, not last time - 1/2 guesses are goign the right way - studided before this one before going into it That's as likely as you studying or guessing your way to a 1200 SAT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 I guess we should run out and grab Alex Smith then, he seems to be 'super smart'. Damned good idea! trade a second day draft pick, put him in Shotgun Spread like he was in college, give him some supporting talent, and we'd have the bargain of the century. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genovgr8 Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 I don't think he is completly tied to Saunders but there will be a large learning curve for him again with a new OC. He was finally looking comfortable in the offense this year but did make some critical mistakes. With a new OC he will be like a rookie again because he will have to learn a new offense. I think keeping Saunders is the key to the offseason because if we lose him the team takes a big leap backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselPwr44 Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Vermeil isn't being very realistic about Campbell's mental abilities. I think I'll take the word of a former coach and the ONLY person outside of Redskins Park that predicted Todd would win the last four games, who knows this offense, over someone who has a flat out hatred for Jason Campbell. :2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cphil006 Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 I don;t know about him being our franchise QB, but he is out starting QB in 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroundNPound Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Here are the scenerios for the current QBs in 2008 for which ever HC we have... 1) Young, physically gifted QB showing promise & veteran QB showing ability to start hot off the bench. 1 emtpy spot 2) Young, physically gifted QB showing promise. 2 empty spots You think the starters could be one of these? 1) Late 1st round draft pick for young, untested QB. 2) Expensive veteran FA with past success.(most likely has injury issues or is way past prime) 3) Inexpensive veteran FA with less success.(a.k.a. Carr, Harrington) 4) Inexpensive backup QB with some promise.(Schwabb, Aaron Rogers) One of the reasons why many coaches would want to coach our team is our QB situation. There's not much controvery (yet). The concensus around the league is that Campbell is going to be a success in this league. Why would anyone change that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 The concensus around the league is that Campbell is going to be a success in this league. Can you reveal the source of your insider information? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSkins Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 campbell is here to stay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passizle Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 however I myself don't believe JC will ever be a franchise qb, because he horribly inaccurate. Foolhardiness at its finest. How is VY these days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voicekiller Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Can you reveal the source of your insider information?Every QB i have heard talk about Campbell...ie, Ron Jaworski, Steve Young, Troy Aikman, Doug Williams, Phil Simms, etc... have all said they love Jason and think he is a franchise QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veretax Posted January 11, 2008 Author Share Posted January 11, 2008 what ever happened to Matt Schaub anyways? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Every QB i have heard talk about Campbell...ie, Ron Jaworski, Steve Young, Troy Aikman, Doug Williams, Phil Simms, etc... have all said they love Jason and think he is a franchise QB. I've heard those guys talk about Campbell. They said nice things, but I didn't hear rave reviews except from Doug Williams. I think the ESPN ranking of the young QBs reflects the popular opinion: Jason ranks with Rivers and Young -- they've done alright. The jury's still out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I've heard those guys talk about Campbell. They said nice things, but I didn't hear any rave reviews.I think the ESPN ranking of the young QBs reflects the popular opinion: Jason ranks with Rivers and Young -- they've done alright. The jury's still out. thats fine. We know the jury is still out but we feel that he has it. Next season should be enough to judge him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voicekiller Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I've heard those guys talk about Campbell. They said nice things, but I didn't hear any rave reviews.I think the ESPN ranking of the young QBs reflects the popular opinion: Jason ranks with Rivers and Young -- they've done alright. The jury's still out. Well of course the jury is still out he has only had 20 starts in this league...but they as everyone are just speculating from what he has shown has the skills to be a great QB in this league...unlike others i am not giving up on him yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 thats fine. We know the jury is still out but we feel that he has it. Next season should be enough to judge him. voicekiller -- Well of course the jury is still out he has only had 20 starts in this league...but they as everyone are just speculating from what he has shown has the skills to be a great QB in this league...unlike others i am not giving up on him yet You're confident that Jason is the future, but you don't want to see him compete for the job with a 36 year-old backup QB is that right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 You're confident that Jason is the future, but you don't want to see him compete for the job with a 36 year-old backup QB is that right? Thats correct. You either put all the marbles in and support him fully or other competition. You ride it and see what you got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voicekiller Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 You're confident that Jason is the future, but you don't want to see him compete for the job with a 36 year-old backup QB is that right?I wouldn't mind a compitition, however I feel for jason to keep on maturing as a QB he needs to start...if he backs up TC i think that may set him back because he is not getting the reps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I wouldn't mind a compitition, however I feel for jason to keep on maturing as a QB he needs to start...if he backs up TC i think that may set him back because he is not getting the reps. We're not too far apart then. My vote is for a competition, but if it's anywhere close, Jason gets the call. Will you buy that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voicekiller Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 We're not too far apart then. My vote is for a competition, but if it's anywhere close, Jason gets the call. Will you buy that?Ya i would buy that.Just noticed that i myself (my avatar) is the backup and your is the starter...kinda funny that you have Jason and I for all intensive purposes have TC (even though it is brunell in the pic) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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