Passizle Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Hey all, I know this is a hard day and we all feel a sense of loss in one way or another. We all have questions that needs answers. My questions is about his medical treatment. Why not hook him up to life support and have machines do his breathing/heartbeat for him. I will be the first to admit that I know nothing about medicine and I am positive that the peopple who were taking care of Sean did everything they could to help him. But why not let machines live for him while he heals? We do it for coma patients and sometimes have people on them for months... waiting for a sign. Is there something I am missing? I just cant beleive he is gone. I cant beleive the sense of loss I feel today. I never even met the man and I feel like I lost family. I hate this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenaa Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Rest assured if that was an option it would have been done. I heard on the radio that Snyder said they had to open his chest during surgery. Since he was shot in the leg, this indicates to me he was having heart failure. Sometimes there's just nothing they can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlinginSammy HOF '63 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 almost always, when you have to have a machine pump your heart and blood you're already gone. People are usually kept on life support until the family can gather and be there for "official" time of death Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paige3girl Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 I ride the train with an FBI doctor and we were talking about it -- he told me that with a severed femoral artery you could lose your entire blood supply in minutes. Even with the fast arrival of paramedics the early blood loss was so severe it would have been a miracle for him to recover. I took it with a grain of salt yesterday and when I heard the news that he was reacting to the nurse I was hopeful and optimistic -- unfortunately the good FBI doctor was correct in his assessment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currahee Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 You can't keep a person alive for any long period of time if the heart stops beating. There is no such a machine that pumps the heart or could do so for such a long period of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulane Skins Fan Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 I work with a nurse who said that even on life support, a person's brain has to tell a person's heart to keep pumping. So, I'm not sure that that would have worked. To someone who has more medical knowledge than me though: would it not be an option to amputate above where he was shot, and then somehow close off the artery - as i assume they have to do in every amputation. I wouldnt want to see him become an amputee, but if it could have saved his life it should have been done, right? Is that not an option in these cases? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RocketCitySkins Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 My mom was on life support for 3 three weeks. The day she died the doctor told us that the blip we were seeing as her heartbeat wasn't her heart beating. It was just the action of the machine and her heart had actually stopped. As soon as the machine was turned off, the heart signal flatlined. Sadly, there is only so much the machines can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slaga Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 To someone who has more medical knowledge than me though: would it not be an option to amputate above where he was shot, and then somehow close off the artery - as i assume they have to do in every amputation. I wouldnt want to see him become an amputee, but if it could have saved his life it should have been done, right? Is that not an option in these cases? He lost too much blood before he ever made it to a hospital. It was already too late. He probably lost too much before the paramedics arrived. The problem wasn't his organs quittting on him. It was his organs suffering from irrepairable damage from not having the blood bring the oxygen they needed. Kind of like an engine, if you lose oil pressure (blood) and keep the engine running (he tried his best to survive), at some point the engine will sieze (die). Unlike an engine, you cannot replace the internal organs in the human body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiplohmillers#1 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 The problem is once the blood is gone your brain is no longer recieving oxygen. Sure its possible to keep his heart going but he would be brain dead. Unfortunatley he was shot in a totally improbable but very critical place. But he didnt feel any pain and the other bullet missed his fiance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 I've talked to a few nurses at work about this. If the artery was severed like they are reporting, they had - at the very most - ten minutes to stop the bleeding to even give him a chance to survive. Even if they had stopped the bleeding, his brain was probably going to be so deprived as oxygen as to leave him at the very best slightly brain damaged. It sounds to me that the brain was damaged to the point where it stopped pumping his heart. At that point, life support would have done little. Life support machines can be useful when the body simply needs time to heal. You can't heal a brain injury alas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbodiesel#44 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 I think he was likely finished before the chopper landed at the hospital. He had bled out and probably suffered severe brain damage from having no blood carrying oxygen to his brain when the ambulance arrived. Most of the other organs are rather resiliant and can go longer without O2. But the brain cannot be restarted. Even if he was given a transfusion by paramedics, the femoral artery is such a large conduit it would have done little to help with his circulation until it was surgically repaired. Depending on the exact site of the wound, you may not even be able to tourniquet it. I think the "response" reported was just people who loved him grasping at hope. I also heard that he was found by paramedics with his eyes rolled back and his chest heaving in an involuntary desparate reaction to get oxygen to his body and brain. The reports I have read say he never awoke in any fashion. I think he never regained conciousness and had no pain after he bled out on his bedroom floor. Bleeding to death, like drowning, is supposedly a rather painless way to go. RIP Sean, I'll be checking every day on the hunt for the **** that shot you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsNut73 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 I have absolutely no medical expertise at all, but as a volunteer firefighter I am around paramedics quite often. I was hanging out at the firehouse last night with some while we watched Monday Night Football. They had heard about the shooting, but not too many details... When I told them the femoral artery was hit all three of the men 'winced' simultaneously. Even though at the time the reports were surfacing that Taylor was responding to his doctors, all 3 of the paramedics were convinced he would not survive. That was when I first started to lose hope. They explained to me that in all likelihood (although stressing they were not there - obviously - so they cannot say for sure) he lost so much blood so quickly that his chances for survival were extremely slim. The looks on their faces is something I will never forget...like I said, that's when I started to lose hope. So it sounds like the medical staff did an outstanding job keeping him alive as long as they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan4life Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 If any of you saw "BLACK HAWK DOWN" The scene in the middle when they try to clamp the soldier's leg wound. He was shot near the groin in the movie. It was nasty and seem very similiar where Sean was shot. Sad and just unbelievable to see such a STRONG MAN go down like that.! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'KanSkinFan Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 I'll try and help you here - (these are "estimated numbers to assist you) 6000 cc's of blood in the body 20-30 cc's with each heartbeat flow by an artery so you can "feel a heart beat" 80 heart beats in a minute / heartbeats are taken on an ARTERY Average cc's with each heart beat 25 cc's Take the average cc's of 25 X 80 beats a minute = 2000 cc within a MINUTE pass by an artery (or flow of blood pass an artery) 6000 divided by 2000 cc/min = 3 minutes before a person bleeds out and starves cells and organs of the body of blood - which contains oxygen that keeps them alive Remember, these are estimated numbers....................but pretty close to reality. The PARAMEDICS - arrived quickly - they would have given him alot of fluid - but it still isn't blood with oxygen................... Paramedics and Hospital ER, Operating Room and ICU DID everything they could to save Sean - but he was "on the TEAM bus to heaven, long before he reached the hospital" - The lesson to be learned from this - if ever an artery is cut/shot/severed - PLEASE place something on the artery and place your hand on the object and put alot of pressure on the artery to slow the blood flow OUT......... This may save someones life.............. Signed, A 30 year Paramedic/FF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dexter's manley Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Here's an interesting story on ST's death, from a medical perspective; http://www.revolutionhealth.com/news/?id=article.2007-11-27.0360060856 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD0506 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 When a major (femoral/carotid) artery is severed in the way that Sean's was a body will "bleed out" very quickly, within a scant few minutes. It is not only a matter of oxygen loss as occurs with a heart attack when the blood just stops circulating. The loss of most of the blood in a body causes vascular collapse. The pressure of the heart beating and pumping blood "pressurizes" the system in a way. In a case like this, there would be a massive amount of capillary damage due to the blood not being there to hold them open. Even if paramedics arrive quickly, clamp the artery off and administer an IV it won't just reinflate everything. Generally this causes damage faster and more severe than oxygen deprivation. You can survive on an average 6 minutes or so without O2 to the brain, often more depending on temperature, physical condition, etc., but it is the vascular collapse that is so often irreversible. Some things are just too much for a body to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFan48 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 good info thanks I'll try and help you here - (these are "estimated numbers to assist you)6000 cc's of blood in the body 20-30 cc's with each heartbeat flow by an artery so you can "feel a heart beat" 80 heart beats in a minute / heartbeats are taken on an ARTERY Average cc's with each heart beat 25 cc's Take the average cc's of 25 X 80 beats a minute = 2000 cc within a MINUTE pass by an artery (or flow of blood pass an artery) 6000 divided by 2000 cc/min = 3 minutes before a person bleeds out and starves cells and organs of the body of blood - which contains oxygen that keeps them alive Remember' date=' these are estimated numbers....................but pretty close to reality. The PARAMEDICS - arrived quickly - they would have given him alot of fluid - but it still isn't blood with oxygen................... Paramedics and Hospital ER, Operating Room and ICU DID everything they could to save Sean - but he was "on the TEAM bus to heaven, long before he reached the hospital" - The lesson to be learned from this - if ever an artery is cut/shot/severed - PLEASE place something on the artery and place your hand on the object and put alot of pressure on the artery to slow the blood flow OUT......... This may save someones life.............. Signed, A 30 year Paramedic/FF[/quote'] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'KanSkinFan Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 When a major (femoral/carotid) artery is severed in the way that Sean's was a body will "bleed out" very quickly, within a scant few minutes. It is not only a matter of oxygen loss as occurs with a heart attack when the blood just stops circulating. The loss of most of the blood in a body causes vascular collapse. The pressure of the heart beating and pumping blood "pressurizes" the system in a way. In a case like this, there would be a massive amount of capillary damage due to the blood not being there to hold them open. Even if paramedics arrive quickly, clamp the artery off and administer an IV it won't just reinflate everything. Generally this causes damage faster and more severe than oxygen deprivation. You can survive on an average 6 minutes or so without O2 to the brain, often more depending on temperature, physical condition, etc., but it is the vascular collapse that is so often irreversible. Some things are just too much for a body to deal with. Very good - medical info deeper than I went - but very good! Vascular collapse to the cells is sometimes beyond the comprehension of a "lay person" - So I take it you have advanced medical knowledge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Last night, a friend of a friend of a friend emailed me. He has a cousin that is a nurse in the hospital where Sean was taken. She said with the amount of blood he had lost by the time he got there, it was a wonder he was alive when they brought him in It doesn't matter how much blood they put back, your systems shut down from lack of O2 in a very short time I was hoping that email was full of ****, and for that reason I didn't post it, it being rumor and all. And last night it looked like a miracle was going to happen. ANd then this morning came................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chants Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 So if the news sources were using the term "severed artery" accurately, it seems to me that it is highly likely that Sean was beyond the point of no return before the EMTs arrived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goflyhelo Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Major artery wound suffered by Redskins' Sean Taylor tough to treat Doctors cite blood loss By Lindsey Tanner ASSOCIATED PRESS 12:21 p.m. November 27, 2007 The type of wound suffered by Washington Redskins player Sean Taylor is among the most difficult to fix, trauma experts said Tuesday after the 24-year-old gunshot victim died in a Miami hospital. Even in a healthy young athlete with access to top trauma care, gunfire tearing through the main artery of the upper leg and abdomen can cause quick, massive blood loss. Doctors who treated Taylor have not given details of his injury or his emergency surgery, but several experts speculate that blood loss is likely what killed him. Taylor was shot at his Miami home early Monday by an apparent intruder and airlifted to Jackson Memorial Hospital. The body has two femoral arteries that branch off from about mid-abdomen into each thigh. They are among the body's biggest vessels, and in the groin area and upper thigh, are about as big around as an index finger. Stopping blood loss gushing from a bullet hole in that region can be extremely challenging if the wound is close to the groin. It would be hard to put a tourniquet around it, said Dr. Gannon Dudlar, an emergency medicine specialist at the University of Illinois Medical Center in Chicago. An injury of this type “essentially means you can lose all the blood in your whole body within five minutes,” said Dr. Mary Pat McKay, director of George Washington University's Center for Injury Prevention and Control. Rapid blood loss can prevent oxygen from reaching the brain and vital organs, leading to death. “Everybody last night was breathing a sigh of relief that he survived the surgery, but his body went through” too long a period of blood loss, McKay guessed. “Even a young healthy athlete, his body organs may be so compromised that they just can't continue,” she said. Dr. Fahim Habib, a trauma surgeon at Jackson Memorial where Taylor died, said massive blood loss sets into a motion a series of devastating events. Blood pressure falls dangerously low, the body tries mightily to get blood to vital organs, and then the body's temperature drops below normal, said Habib, speaking generally and with no knowledge of Taylor's specific injuries. “When you get these three together, it's called the triad of death. Once that happens, it suggests that the physiologic injury is so severe that the body does not have the ability to overcome” it, Habib said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'KanSkinFan Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 So if the news sources were using the term "severed artery" accurately, it seems to me that it is highly likely that Sean was beyond the point of no return before the EMTs arrived. Severed/nicked/cut - in Seans case, high probability - but Sean was in good health and the body does try and compensate.....really deep anatomy discussion, but for lay person - yes, without pressure on the spurting artery from the gun shot - unfortunate outcome. Please remember - If its red and spurting - put pressure on it.......perhaps a lot of pressure to "slow" the blood loss down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'KanSkinFan Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Needs merged - A question for anyone with medical knowledge... Good information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinzFoLife Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 From everything I read, a normal man would've died much sooner, but ST fought like a true warrior to the very end. Damn, I'm just on mental hangover today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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