Don't bring sexy back.

[onnie007]

I heard the Redskins are trading Clinton Portis to the Arena league for two Arena League defensive ends, is this true?

Ok, seriously,

I hoope we trade down for more picks, and do whatever it takes to prevent the Cowboys from picking Jarvis Moss or Michael Griffin. Both sound like too perfect of a match for them.

:rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: Good post! I feel some people would actually do this for their ******* DL! :laugh:

But I hope we trade down as well and take a DT (Branch) for better value and get a second 1st day pick.

[deejaydana]

I applaud the voice of reason on this board!

[Justsomeguy]

Every year between the time the season ends and round 1 of the draft we get seduced by the sexy. (credit to nachol) Sexy as a state of mind, independent from the draft, is what brought Deion and Bruce Smith here, it's what gave us two years of Spurrier instead of two years of Marty, it's what ran out Brad Johnson, and traded away a shut down corner for a two down back who, no matter how hard we wish it, is still not as good as his videogame doppelganger. Sexy also clouds our judgement, it convinces us that a raw talent can really anchor a top flight secondary on snot bubbles alone. The Redskins are not sexy, they've never been sexy, and they should never strive to be.

Calvin Johnson would be tempting if we were picking #2 or #3, but at #6?! There's no way he falls to us, so that means that if we want him we have to sacrifice which to me is insane. Even if we didn't have a WR that can turn a five yard hitch into a seventy yard TD it still wouldn't make sense. As disastrous as the offense was last year it could have been much worse considering that we went from Bruhell (washed up four years ago) to Campbell, a relative rookie. But the defense absolutely KILLED us last year. 32nd in turnovers with 12, 31st in made 3rd downs, 26th in 3rd down %, 168 passing first downs, and 19 total sacks. We need to pressure the ******* QB, We need a ******* DE!

This weekend, sexy is lurking, don't give in.

By the way I want to wish everybody a happy start to the new season this Saturday.

I am afraid one way or another that you are going to eat your words this season. You are obviously so passionate that it is blinding you. I look forward to reading your posts after the draft.

[Justsomeguy]

This has to be the 500th thread saying the exact same thing.

Again you know better than our FO and if you were coaching all would be perfect and somehow always forgeting '04 and '05 also part of Gibbs 2 with damn near the same personnel.

Get off your high horses and be a fan, not a minister in the church of the holier than thou.

[jamesbondman]

this thread is the best thread on the draft so far. The Redskins are always in love with Deion Sanders or Santana Moss type players who are fast and make great highlights.

Its about time for the trenches. Draft Okoye or trade down and get a 2nd round pick and then pick a huge run blocking guard and a huge defensive tackle. Lets win in the trenches and then our Running backs will actually not have to carry the team. Let the linemen carry the team because it ALL STARTS UP FRONT.

[deejaydana]

this thread is the best thread on the draft so far. The Redskins are always in love with Deion Sanders or Santana Moss type players who are fast and make great highlights.

Its about time for the trenches. Draft Okoye or trade down and get a 2nd round pick and then pick a huge run blocking guard and a huge defensive tackle. Lets win in the trenches and then our Running backs will actually not have to carry the team. Let the linemen carry the team because it ALL STARTS UP FRONT.

Good God, thank you for that post. I need a break from all the loons on this board that think CJ or Landry are the answer for this ailing team. You don't build a winner in one draft or with one player. This isn't rocket science folks though our Front Office makes it look impossible (at times).

[Aghar]

While I totally disagree with your assesment of Portis as a player the original post rings true about bringing "Sexy" and "highlight reel" players into DC. We have plenty of them already, and had too many that were busts in the past. Please, draft the best player on the board that will FIT this team. Not the "next Shawn Taylor" or the "next Randy Moss". How about the best guy that can contribute to our team immediately and get our defense up to par. Maybe, just once Vinny!?!:whoknows:

[NewCliche21]

It's not about stats. The fact that a guy like Terry Allen, a free agent with two bad knees can get 1353 yds in a season is evidence that high priced running backs are not worth it. I'm sorry but he simply is not a workhorse. He's good but he's not a workhorse. Riggins, Davis, Allen, Byner, those were workhorses. We didn't win 5 in a row in 2005 solely because of Portis. If Rock doesn't lose his mind in St.Louis we don't go. If Antonio ******* Brown doesn't return a punt in Arizona we don't go. Portis was huge in that run but not the only reason bro.

Nice way to combat facts with opinions and asterisks.

If you say that Portis was not reasons 1-5 that we went to the playoffs in 2005, then you haven't been paying attention.

[Mooka]

I agree with you about trading up, but Gaines Adams would be a sexy pick as well. Pure edge rusher, doesn't fit our system, "we need the pressure the QB so lets get a sack machine." Now there's a "sexy" pick for ya.

Not that I would mind having Adams, I think he'd give Gregg felixibility to have a real rotation on the D-Line that would suit us well.

[Rodriggo]

Nice way to combat facts with opinions and asterisks.

If you say that Portis was not reasons 1-5 that we went to the playoffs in 2005, then you haven't been paying attention.

What?!?! 1 THRU 5?!?! You talk about Portis like we won two Super Bowls with him. If Antonio "I'm now driving a delivery truck" Brown had not returned a punt against the Arizona Cardinals we would not have won that game and not have been in the playoffs. If we didn't play Ryan Fitzgerald we probably don't win in St.Louis. If we played Philly with McNobb instead of McMahon we don't win that game. Dude, we barely got into the playoffs that year, Portis was certainly on that roster and certainly one of the top five reason but the SOLE reason?!?! No ******* way.

[NewCliche21]

What?!?! 1 THRU 5?!?! You talk about Portis like we won two Super Bowls with him. If Antonio "I'm now driving a delivery truck" Brown had not returned a punt against the Arizona Cardinals we would not have won that game and not have been in the playoffs. If we didn't play Ryan Fitzgerald we probably don't win in St.Louis. If we played Philly with McNobb instead of McMahon we don't win that game. Dude, we barely got into the playoffs that year, Portis was certainly on that roster and certainly one of the top five reason but the SOLE reason?!?! No ******* way.

If Joe Gibbs hadn't washed his hands, then he would have gotten sick and not been able to coach. If Sean Taylor hadn't made the hit on Crayton Week 2, then we wouldn't have made it. If Ramsey hadn't made that 72-yard touchdown to Moss, then we wouldn't have made it. If the fan wasn't cheering in section 134, row 12, seat 5, then we wouldn't have made it. Do you see how stupid that sounds? If, if, if for these stupid one time, random things is absolutely the dumbest argument that I've ever heard.

Portis carried the team, plain and simple. I doubt that you can find me one person with a positive GPA in high school who could agree with you. Everyone's entitled to his or her opinion, but when you say something on par with "The sky is polka-dotted and made of soy sauce!" then your opinion is wrong.

[PA Skin Fan]

traded away a shut down corner .

I am so tired of people saying this.

Champ Bailey was NOT a shut down corner with the Redskins!

He was a good, solid corner, but he got beat too many times by Amani Toomer and others to be called a shutdown corner. Even now he is better but he is no where near on the same level as true shutdown corners like Darrell Green and Deion Sanders were.

You revisionists who constantly bemoan this trade always seem to forget that Champ Bailey wanted out of here and if we didn't trade him, we would have lost him in FA and received absolutely nothing. Instead we got a top-5 running back who is the heart and soul of our team.

All those years, #24 was on the Skins, how good was the defense? I'll answer this one: pathetic! Even with old #56 and #24, we couldn't stop anybody. Then when he was traded away, guess what, we were the #2 defense in football! We didn't miss him then. We didn't miss him the next year either, when we still had a great defense and we rode CP's back to make the playoffs. Now our D has the first bad year in the three years that Bailey has been gone, and everyone is crying and whining for Champ Bailey. Get over it already. The guy is insanely overrated, he was leaving the Skins anyway, and we were incredibly lucky to get a guy of Portis' talents and abilities in exchange for him.

[Skinsfor4]

The FO around here should be referred to as"Draft Dodgers".

[skins4eva]

Hey Rodrigo (primo) we gotta watch some games together this season bro! I haven't seen Natch in forever. You doing ok?

Anyway, great thread. We don't need to trade up--we certainly don't need to trade up for Calvin Johnson. I was actually trying to think of the last top-3 receiver of even top-10 receiver that made an incredible impact. I'm having trouble coming up with one. We need to pick at 6 and take a DE or DT or trade down and take a DE or DT. Either way, we've got to get stronger on the D-line...it's been hounding us for years and years.

[Rodriggo]

If Joe Gibbs hadn't washed his hands, then he would have gotten sick and not been able to coach. If Sean Taylor hadn't made the hit on Crayton Week 2, then we wouldn't have made it. If Ramsey hadn't made that 72-yard touchdown to Moss, then we wouldn't have made it. If the fan wasn't cheering in section 134, row 12, seat 5, then we wouldn't have made it. Do you see how stupid that sounds? If, if, if for these stupid one time, random things is absolutely the dumbest argument that I've ever heard.

Portis carried the team, plain and simple. I doubt that you can find me one person with a positive GPA in high school who could agree with you. Everyone's entitled to his or her opinion, but when you say something on par with "The sky is polka-dotted and made of soy sauce!" then your opinion is wrong.

Carried this team?!?! How can you compare things that had no impact on that run with actual plays and events that happened and affected our performance independent of what Portis did? I'll give you the spin move in the backfield TD against Philly as Portis's shining moment, but other than that he was what he we thought he was.

Suffice to say I underestimate Portis's impact on this team while you vastly overrate it. Lets agree to disagree. Let me also say that there is nothing wrong with a negative GPA and that my favorite kind of weather is partly polka-dotted with a slight drizzling of soy sauce.

[ejay183]

Carried this team?!?! How can you compare things that had no impact on that run with actual plays and events that happened and affected our performance independent of what Portis did? I'll give you the spin move in the backfield TD against Philly as Portis's shining moment, but other than that he was what he we thought he was.

Suffice to say I underestimate Portis's impact on this team while you vastly overrate it. Lets agree to disagree. Let me also say that there is nothing wrong with a negative GPA and that my favorite kind of weather is partly polka-dotted with a slight drizzling of soy sauce.

*Sigh* I had to do this during last season cause of all the "Betts is better than CP" rants. Lets go back down memory lane.

Game One of the 5 in a Row, the Rams. Portis begins the first first drive by running the ball well, which finished with a 56 yard TD. Our passing game had troubles because no. 8 was acting like his old self. Every time we had trouble moving the ball, Portis got us moving. Yes Rock had some great runs, due to the defense being tired of tackling Portis. Even at the half the score was 10-7. Skins came out in the second half and ran the ball down the Rams throat and Portis got another TD. We run the ball at will, with Rock's big runs mixed in, for the rest of the game and Cooley's TD sealed the deal. (which was the result of a play action)

Game Two, the Cards. This game was a mess on both sides of the offense. Brunell kept throwing INTs to the grand total of 3 in the redzone mainly and our defense kept causing fumbles and ST got a pick. This game was 10-3 cards leading at the half thanks to Brunell's picks. We come out in the second half and run the ball down the Cards throat, which ends with CP's 15 yard grabbing Seller's jersey TD. Our defense holds them to a field goal and Brown runs back a kick. On 3rd and 6, we needed to get a first to run out the clock. Portis gets it and we win.

Game Three, Dallas. This game the defense was just tearing apart the Cowboys. Cooley was unstopable and Portis kept moving the chains(and Roy) to fight out another 100 yard game. This game was over by halftime, Portis and Betts helped close it out in the second half.

Game Four, Giants. The lost of Randy Thomas was thought to be the end of Portis' great strench of games, but he turned out another great game. He threw a TD and ran one in on his way to 100 yards. Moss torn the secondary apart with 3 TDs, but that long bomb that he had to readjust was possible thanks to the defense biting so hard on that playaction.

Game Five, Eagles. I was scared that we were going to lose at halftime. The defense was struggling and our offense was never made to play catch up. Portis ran hard and threw his boby around, moving the chains, mainly in the second half. That spin two yards in the backfield into a TD gave us the lead and the defense finished out the game.

Yes the defense was a huge reason we made it to the playoffs, but Portis made the offense work. Fact. Period.

[ouvan59]

It's not about stats. The fact that a guy like Terry Allen, a free agent with two bad knees can get 1353 yds in a season is evidence that high priced running backs are not worth it. I'm sorry but he simply is not a workhorse. He's good but he's not a workhorse. Riggins, Davis, Allen, Byner, those were workhorses. We didn't win 5 in a row in 2005 solely because of Portis. If Rock doesn't lose his mind in St.Louis we don't go. If Antonio ******* Brown doesn't return a punt in Arizona we don't go. Portis was huge in that run but not the only reason bro.

LOL, this is the funniest delusional argument I've ever seen. Prior to last year Clinton Portis had carried the ball 270+ times every single year of his four year career. Terry Allen did it twice. Davis did it three times. Byner did it twice. Riggins did it twice. His first two years with the Skins he averaged 348 carries per year.

CLINTON PORTIS IS A FRIGGIN WORKHORSE!!!!

[chipman5544]

CP carried the team and will so again this season. Now all of you guys talk about the sexy pick and stuff like that, well it think all of you have forgotten one thing, we don't have a starting left guard. Now we went out and signed a bunch of old offensive tackles who have never played guard in their careers. So if Washington does anything they trade down and draft a guard. The key to the success of our offense is the offensive line. How can everyone forget that. Does anyone remember the Seattle playoff game we should have won. Think about it, if Ray Brown, and Corey Raymer don't play guard and do horrible in that game, we might just win it. Dispite the fact we only had one real good wide reciever so thats my rant, i'm sure you will all disagree

[ALLWORLD]

Portis got hurt, give him a break. Was 2005 really that long ago?

no but that schedule is

[ALLWORLD]

CP carried the team and will so again this season. Now all of you guys talk about the sexy pick and stuff like that, well it think all of you have forgotten one thing, we don't have a starting left guard. Now we went out and signed a bunch of old offensive tackles who have never played guard in their careers. So if Washington does anything they trade down and draft a guard. The key to the success of our offense is the offensive line. How can everyone forget that. Does anyone remember the Seattle playoff game we should have won. Think about it, if Ray Brown, and Corey Raymer don't play guard and do horrible in that game, we might just win it. Dispite the fact we only had one real good wide reciever so thats my rant, i'm sure you will all disagree

Dockery missed more then enough blocks, especially downfield which could have resulted in TD's.

Your guard theory is out the window.

We will not draft a 1st round guard. unless we get Thomas if available)

Our key to success in not entirely on the O-Line.

Moss is not our only good receiver.

The Seattle game is another "woulda coulda shoulda" ranging from Springs being 100%, Rogers holding onto the INT or our maind D plan of attack (alexander until Arrington put him out).

Come over my house dude and I will pour you a drink, you obviously need it.

And BTW, Portis didnt "carry" this team, he was a part but Brunell to Moss meant just as much if not more as well as our D "carried" us.

[Bangee7]

The Portis arguments are a lot weaker now than ever.

Did anyone see what Betts did last year?

Not much different from what Portis did the year before.

So was it really Portis or the O-line?

Portis will most likely be a 2-down back this year, cause Gibbs & Co. want Betts on the field more.

I'm not sorry we got Portis, but I still feel like we gave up way too much.

(and just because the rest of the informed football world feels that way, please feel free to tell us again how all knowledgeable football analysts are just 'skins haters)

p.s. great post rr

[onnie007]

Betts benefitted from the favorable play calling toward the end of they year and the OL was playing its best in a while. I am excited because I think Todd Wade may play better than Dock and CP will have a great year like in '05. Plus in pass protection, it will be nice to have pretty much two tackles playing on the left side of the ball.

[ALLWORLD]

If, and its a big IF... Betts fixes his fumble issue and blocks better and I take him over Portis. Now, I do think that Betts took advantage of defenses backing up once JC started, he did tend to chuck it downfield more.

Okay, I had to edit, lets all just agree to the fact we got the best tandem in the NFL. Cool?

[McD5]

He's a two down back because he's a two down back. There are moments in games when he's not on the field for two consecutive series, injured or not. To me that's ridiculous. I like Portis but I don't feel as though he's lived up to the value we let go for him. Granted Champ probably wouldn't have stayed but what would you rather have a more stout secondary and a Betts at HB or the situation we find ourselves in now with Carlos Rogers as our No. 1 CB? Portis has had his great moments but to me he hasn't even attained Terry Allen status.

Agree with you on the Betts and Carlos "toast" Rogers comments. I swear Betts doesn't get one tenth of the respect he deserves.

I think I am one of few that recognizes that Betts was the MVP of the entire team last season.

I also am the only one that would at least say on the forum, that the perfect draft for us would be to:

1. Trade Portis and Brandon Lloyd...or Portis and a 2nd round pick next season outright, to move up and take CJ at the number 2 spot.

2. Keep our 6th pick in the first round and draft Dline.

3. Start Betts in the backfield.....the guy played his heart out, while people expected him to just go through the motions once it was clear we couldn't make the playoffs. He averaged 4.8 ypc last season--more than Portis ever has as a Skin.

4. Keep the great majority of 2008 picks. Don't trade away the future.

[argentina_redskins]

They want to give in.

They need to give in.

They WILL give in...

:(