Disillusioned Front Office: Surprised??

[Drex]

I like ST but if hr pulls some immature crap like a hold out and wants to void his contract to go play else where at some point in time then fine.

You seem to be missing that he has guys around him that he has played with since college to help him try to keep a level head.

That is true, but one of the guys you are probably referring to, Clinton Portis, is represented by the same guy and money was the motivator behind Portis asking out of Denver. The end result of course, was a nice long term contract.

Rosenhaus has a well-documented history of getting his clients nice, new contracts.

[DRSmith]

That is true, but one of the guys you are probably referring to, Clinton Portis, is represented by the same guy and money was the motivator behind Portis asking out of Denver. The end result of course, was a nice long term contract.

Rosenhaus has a well-documented history of getting his clients nice, new contracts.

If ST pulls anything we still have PP and RD and hopefully AA has a way better year.

But if we really want to keep from worrying about guys staying we need to we a SB really soon. That way we get players that really like to have rings. For some guys if they can't win they want to be paid.

[One Shot]

I'm not the thread starter but I think that what we should have done is re-sign the good middle linebacker that we had.

Antonio Pierce was a core Redskin and he signed with another team for 26 million over 6 years. Many people justified letting him go as this was too high a price to pay.

Now we have signed a much older player to a five year contract for roughly the same amount of money.

Don't you feel like that topic has become redundant now? He's been gone for 2 years. Yes, it was a mistake to let him go, but it's just business. We've put that in the past and it wasn't really an issue until this year. We needed to do something about it so we signed Fletcher. The reason that we gave him about the same amount of money that we could've given Pierce is that now it's a bigger need. Our linebacking corps was terrible, something HAD to be done. Back when we let Pierce go, it wasn't as big of an issue.

[chiramu]

Is there an upgrade to be had within the skins roster for Dock? If so, I can understand the reluctance to lock him up earlier. Maybe they thought Pucillo or someone else could step in and do a better job.

But it looks like there isn't an UPGRADE there. If it was just about a few million here or there, the FO should face up to criticism for i) not anticipating the skyrocketing demand/desparation from other teams for a OL man; ii) not locking Dock up sooner or franchising him to keep him for another year till they know exactly what Pucillo can do.

How can people work FULL time for a whole year on making 3 or 4 trades and end up being surprised? I don't understand it and so have to assume that it was a mistake by the FO. And that includes both Vinny and Gibbs.

[robotfire]

the last time we didn't do much in free agency we made the playoffs...

We did get Santana Moss that year. There is absolutely zero chance we would have made the playoffs without him.

[DRSmith]

Is there an upgrade to be had within the skins roster for Dock? If so, I can understand the reluctance to lock him up earlier. Maybe they thought Pucillo or someone else could step in and do a better job.

But it looks like there isn't an UPGRADE there. If it was just about a few million here or there, the FO should face up to criticism for i) not anticipating the skyrocketing demand/desparation from other teams for a OL man; ii) not locking Dock up sooner or franchising him to keep him for another year till they know exactly what Pucillo can do.

How can people work FULL time for a whole year on making 3 or 4 trades and end up being surprised? I don't understand it and so have to assume that it was a mistake by the FO. And that includes both Vinny and Gibbs.

If Hutchinson had not got that contract last year would Dock have gotten that much this year?

[MisterPinstripe]

I'm not the thread starter but I think that what we should have done is re-sign the good middle linebacker that we had.

Antonio Pierce was a core Redskin and he signed with another team for 26 million over 6 years. Many people justified letting him go as this was too high a price to pay.

Now we have signed a much older player to a five year contract for roughly the same amount of money.

:laugh::laugh: Hey Buddy? News flash. That was two years ago. :doh::laugh: The fact that you are comparing something that happened two years ago with a signing we just made shows how silly what you are saying is.

[JoeKnowsBest]

I would have been with you the other day, but I do think you are being a bit harsh. It's not AA money and the key thing about him is he brings the signal calling ability on the field just before the play and the leadership we need. This is KEY because no one besides Washington (and maybe Griffen) on our defense had any kind of leadership qualities to help the other players. And Marcus can't do it all by himself.

At first before the signing all I could think of was Mike Barrow. Now for some reason I get a Wilbur Marshall vibe, and that is EXTREMELY good. The only thing is, if it works out, it will only be for 1 or 2 seasons so I really don't get the 5 year deal.

[hwmayfield]

London Fletcher: he's small and old. last i checked, not a good combination for ANY football player......much less, a middle linebacker.

after ALL these years, vinny and danny STILL haven't learned. this is Mark Carrier, Deion, Bruce Smith written all over again.

i guess it makes too much sense to pay the huge and young (Dockery), when you can pay the small and old.

i realize its apples to oranges before anyone says anything, and the fact that Dockery was asking too much this off-season. HOWEVER, a SMART front office would have recognized Dockery's upside before it ever got to this, and signed him to a more economical extension a year ago.

Out: Young and Big.

In: Small and Old.

This also reminds me of Chris Webber for Mitch Richmond.

glad we're keeping "the core" together.

Last I checked Fletcher is past the prove himself stage. He has played on two SB teams and has averaged 122 tackles a year. What more do you want. Height is not that important for MLB. We dont need him to cover Randy Moss. We need him to stop the run and cover the intermediate field. Which he has proven he can do. He led all linebackers in INT last year. In fact you seem like you have so much knowledge of what it takes to win a SB in the NFL you should go apply for a GM position.

[BillyKilmer]

...But becuase Fletcher looks nice in a suit and tie and says the right thing...all of a sudden he's Sam Mill and Darrell Green and Marshall Faulk all in one :laugh:

No one wrote that, to bad you dont take the time to know what your writing about.

You remind me of the phrase those who know the least know it the loudest.

Here is what mr teenage optimist is referring too,

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=191903

[hwmayfield]

I'm not the thread starter but I think that what we should have done is re-sign the good middle linebacker that we had.

Antonio Pierce was a core Redskin and he signed with another team for 26 million over 6 years. Many people justified letting him go as this was too high a price to pay.

Now we have signed a much older player to a five year contract for roughly the same amount of money.

Monday morning QB. I love those types. It is too easy to look back and suggest that you knew back then that it was the right decision. Others have already posted about this. Do you have any opinions of your own or do you just take others critical points and pawn them off as your own. We are where we are and as of now it was a good signing. Maybe we should also have gone for it on 4th and 1 a couple of times last year. That cost us a few games. Guess what? who cares yesteryear is over focus on the present and give some input.

[ciacbw]

The original poster does bring up a good point that if we are so interested in keeping our core guys, we should never have let Dockery get to free agency.

How long will they keep putting off an extension of Cooley and Taylor?

I dont think they thought of him as a core guy. They will get a deal done with talyor and cooley next year. Also they extended Sellers and Thomas did they not? Thomas is a much faster and better player than Dockery. Dockery was worth half of what he got. If not Hutchinson las year he never would have sniffed this payday.

[ciacbw]

where to start. this $$$ could be spread around in so many other useful ways. as a rule, i never like signing a guy over 30 to be a starter. as it stands now, our #1 CB is on his way out the door b/c we can't afford the contract WE drew up. so while we may be getting a very good MLB, we'll be losing a lockdown corner. this $$ could have also been planned for ahead of time by signing Dock to an extension last year, in addition to contributing towards Springs. so we bring in someone new, and lose two core guys. i guess continuity is a sham.

The bottom line is, Linebackers look bad when the Defensive line gets no pressure. MLB wasn't our greatest need.

Not true about Spings at all. Skins are under the cap right now with the way his contract his structured. Dockery was way way overpaid.

[Skins PR]

Monday morning QB. I love those types. It is too easy to look back and suggest that you knew back then that it was the right decision. Others have already posted about this. Do you have any opinions of your own or do you just take others critical points and pawn them off as your own. We are where we are and as of now it was a good signing. Maybe we should also have gone for it on 4th and 1 a couple of times last year. That cost us a few games. Guess what? who cares yesteryear is over focus on the present and give some input.

You ever heard the saying "those that ignore history are doomed to repeat it"?

Kind of like the first time we made the playoffs with Snyder as owner and then he got his little fingers into everything, overspent for a bunch of big name free agents, and then we paid for it for many seasons.

Sounds a lot like last offseason and the results were similar. That's ok, they can keep ignoring it and keep making the same mistakes because of fans like you.

[Underwater Ally]

Forget the fact that he knows the entire defense and is a very smart player who can position everyone.

Do you mean to say that he's Supersmart?

[GOSKN5]

I was happy with this signing... one of our smarter signing in recent past...we filled a need and we didnt break the bank doing it.....

i dont think you will hear much bashing from the media for this move.. he is a proven leader who works his tale off and gives his all on every play and practice... doesnt sound bad to me...

[Craig]

London Fletcher: he's small and old. last i checked, not a good combination for ANY football player......much less, a middle linebacker.

after ALL these years, vinny and danny STILL haven't learned. this is Mark Carrier, Deion, Bruce Smith written all over again.

i guess it makes too much sense to pay the huge and young (Dockery), when you can pay the small and old.

i realize its apples to oranges before anyone says anything, and the fact that Dockery was asking too much this off-season. HOWEVER, a SMART front office would have recognized Dockery's upside before it ever got to this, and signed him to a more economical extension a year ago.

Out: Young and Big.

In: Small and Old.

This also reminds me of Chris Webber for Mitch Richmond.

glad we're keeping "the core" together.

I agree. It's funny watching the Redskins do the same thing year after year and the fans fall for it year after year. Kind of like Ground Hog Day. OF course, while I don't see the Skins as having improved much SO FAR, without the continued improvement of Campbell, it won't matter who we sign.

[The Sisko]

i think you need to stop telling people to STHU. this is a message board to share one's thoughts and opinions is it not? if so, "STHU" is not only wrong, but a terrible argument at that.

to all the people disagreeing with me, let me ask you how many productive years you expect out of a 32 year-old linebacker? are you maive enough to think that London Fletcher has found the fountain of youth and will continue playing at this level until he's 37?

better yet, how many prductive years will 26 year-old Derrick Dockery provide? my humble opinion suggests many more than Fletcher.

You realize your argument of how long each player has left implicitly assumes that they're both making the same $$$. Of course, Fletcher obviouslywill be making a boatload less $$$ than Dockery. However, he's a better player at his position than Dockery is so it can certainly be argued that he provides more bang for the buck for the time he'll be here than Dockery will for the Bills. Of course all that assumes that Fletcher will be able to play at least two or three seasons for us.

Finally, I agree that the poster had no business telling you to STHU. Actually it's :stfu:

[hiswadeness]

Lets see we lost the 4th best O lineman we had. Who wanted $ equal to being the best at his position, and got a MLB who is arguably the best LB on the team. At least the most durable. And thats a bad move?

I wanted to see Dock stay, but NO WAY was he worth the money he got. At least not yet.

[deejaydana]

uh, maybe the Front Office is simply forced to make a transaction like this because we HAVE NO CAP ROOM TO MOVE! get used to this people.

[LoudMouth12thMan]

Listen, Process, and then allow it to sink in...

The dude has better stats than ANY other LB in the game. He's led the NFL and played 100+ games nine years in a row. He IS the best LB in the game on paper, and listening to him in his press conference only makes me secure that he is a smart player as well.

To the age and height issue:

The guy is iron man, so lets hope that trend continues. He led the league amongst LB's with 4 INT's last year (according to Gibbs). So where does heighth come in to play?

Lastly, the difference between what the FO has done in the past and this year so far is we let an expendable player (arguably) go and acquiring almost a sure thing in Fletcher. We DO have the core guys and we've added a sound, pro bowl LB/leader for our defense. Barring health, how can this be a mistake? There are some positives here, so give it time. No one person can be a savior, but you got a coach that has a grandkid with cancer and he's still out there doin' his phuckin' best for you, I, and the rest of the fans. Put things in perspective man and don't be such a whiner. After all, we got nothing to lose at this point. :2cents:

HTTR

[Boss Hogg]

If I would have told you 3 months ago our D would add Smoot,Fletcher & Jamaal Anderson you would have cried no cap room.Major upgrade on D we are on point.

[Macd36]

so let me get this straight. we should have resigned a slow guard who: cant pull, was the weakest link on our offensive line, got overpaid by a team desperatly trying to get an Oline together.

but we should not have signed a MLB who: has never missed a game in his 9 year NFL career, is a proven tackling machine, fills a position of need where we sucked, will be a field general, already knows williams system.

yeahhhh, good call threadstarter.

well said! :notworthy :applause:

[BigRay]

I don't know maybe it's me but, this thread has the smell of a troll written all over it.

[phishisthegreatstuff]

So far the were signing the right guys... I hope after we sign one more cb, a blocking TE, and then go draft crazy. Also i think we should try and trade/cut patten.