Leonard Washington Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 Gay marriage is fine with me but you don't need to get married to validate your love for someone:2cents: i agree. issues involving taxes, inheritance, and health care decisions are where having a marriage or some form of legal deal makes sense. i also don't think how bp, jews, and homosexuals are treated can compare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJoe1013 Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 This is what I don't get - the people that are so against being gay are usually the religious (and usually Christian). I thought you were taught to love your fellow man - yet anti-gay people's posts are filled with underlying hate and venom. Smile on your brother, man. Interesting point raised. A small caveat, since you bring up the "religious" and the "Christian" it should be only fitting to answer with respect to them even thought thats not the direction of this good thread. But I dont not speak for them, just myself as I understand things to be. Now, if I may offer a response... Some Catholics that I know protest gay marriage and the gay lifestyle, but don't know why. They do it because they know the Catholic Church does. But the Catholic Church does not condemn BEING a homosexual. Far from it, the Catholic Church teaches to love your neighbor no matter who they are. But, through interpretation of Bible passages, the Catholic Church has formed beliefs and doctrines about the sanctity of marriage. A marriage between two people of the same sex would violate this sanctity. So, even though they care for everyone, they make the absurd request that you can be gay, just not act on it as it would violate the sanctity of marriage as defined by the Catholic Church through interpretations of Bible passages. In other words, "love your neighbor, but understand that marriage is limited to this for these reasons based on these passages from our governing sacred text that formulates the foundation of our Church which you choose to follow. But since a gay marriage violates our definition of marriage and our beliefs about marriage as we formulated it as stated above, you must not support gay marriage." But this is all off topic as religion was never a part of this discussion. I just hope to maybe answer your statement with some form of reasoning. EDIT: I will probably regret posting this as it might open up Pandora's box and engage me in a discussion I never wanted to partake in. This post definitely goes against my better judgement, especially knowing the reigious views of some of the Tailgate crowd the way that I think I do from lurking on the tailgate as well as ES for about a year and a half now I think, maybe a bit less. I just hope this can stay out of religion and on track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
project myu Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 Continuing on my thought.I've been divorced twice... I think you guys/gals have it too easy... You should enjoy a real divorce. Not this breakup thing my co-worker did with his man... that was too easy... LOL. I was actually thinking a lot about this. I was reading through my benefits to see if there was any way that I could put my mom on any of my plans. Unfortunately, I can't. However, I noticed that domestic partners that are of the same-sex can enjoy the same benefits as that of a married partner. However, a "domestic partner" of the opposite sex is not eligible. So you can get these benefits by being gay and not having to risk the consequences of a divorce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Air Force Cane Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 the fact that anti-gay marriage amendments have passed overwhelmingly in the last two elections shows that the American people simply do not want to change marriage as we have known it for 300 years here. now some of you can try and blame that on christian zealotry- but there are a LOT of democrats voting against gay marriage as well. (see Webb winning but gay marriage losing last week in Virginia) how do you explain that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insomniac Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 Well unfortunately for you and your brother that will never happen in Virginia now, because the amendment you voted in favor of bans that as well. i know this, but i stand firm in my beliefs, thats why i voted in favor of it......and virginia laws don't matter to him, he lives in texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 There will be Justice of the peace marriages within 10 years nationwide. As with everything else, the radical right will push sooooo hard they will create a backlash.. and wonder why ... Its the same as partial birth.... went too far... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rincewind Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 the fact that anti-gay marriage amendments have passed overwhelmingly in the last two elections shows that the American people simply do not want to change marriage as we have known it for 300 years here.now some of you can try and blame that on christian zealotry- but there are a LOT of democrats voting against gay marriage as well. (see Webb winning but gay marriage losing last week in Virginia) how do you explain that? There are idiots on both sides of the political fence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enter Apotheosis Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 whether gays want to admit it- this country was founded on Judeo-Christian ethics and foundations. As much as Western civilization was. Pursuant to this, marriage is a construct with both religious and societal overtones. If you want to change that so two guys can marry- then shouldn't we allow three women to marry two men? Although I don't think it would matter, the goal right now is just to make it a legally binding contract between two people. Polygamy is a completely different and unrelated issue that has nothing to do with this debate. how about a 52 year old man marrying a 12 year old girl if they "love each other"? Legally binding contracts can only be formulated between to adults (18 or over). Again, what's your point? how about a 52 year old man marrying a 12 year old boy if they "love each other"? See above. how about marrying a poodle if you "love" the poodle? Until we can definitively prove that poodle's are capable of understanding the concepts of marriage and love and can definitively give us consent, that's also TOTALLY unrelated. if you destroy the entire essence of marriage- why couldn't a man then demand equal protection under the Constitution to marry 5 different women? Again, that's a completely different law you're dealing with. basically to let gays marry means you have destroyed marriage and the fragmentation of our society will quickly ensue. hence it has had about 21 states vote AGAINST gay marriage. Americans are overwhelmingly against it- even the democrats are. Way to pose one gigantic what-if statement with a series of irrelevant questions. I'm thinking you should probably sit this one out unless you have something to say about thte actual ramifications of allowing gay marriage (or even renaming it a civil union). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enter Apotheosis Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 i voted in favor of the amendments, but the wording on it here in virginia is what made it tough for me to vote yes. i am totally in favor of gay couples being able to have a ceremony, enjoy the same rights as married couples, and all that. i am, however, against it being called marriage, because it is not marriage.you cannot change the meaning of a word to appease one group of people. call it something different, but it is not marriage. You're the kind of person I could almost respect if they didn't lack so much common sense. You essentially just voted to ban any form of a union between partners of the same sex in Virginia. Why? Because you didn't like a simple word being applied to describe it. It's almost disgusting. Why can't you just recognize the fact that marriage (the way you view it) itself will not be affected by allowing more people to partake in it? You will enjoy the same ceremony in the same church with the same sense of "this is a special day" as always. Your church doesn't have to recognize the legal definition of a marriage and most people don't even have to change their views of what marriage is. It has NO effect on you if you don't want it to. Let me make a statement that correlates to your line of thought here: "I propose we ban American-made swiss cheese because it is not from Switzerland. I'm all for Americans making swiss-style cheese but, because it is frequently mislabeled, I took part in a legal process to ban ALL swiss cheese that is not from Switzerland." As a result of your profound decision, American companies can no longer even produce cheese with holes in it and give it a different name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 No facts, no figures...no scientific data in this one. Just raw human emotion. The fact that I am a gay man and I cannot marry is really taking a toll on me personally. It saddens me deeply that I and those like me cannot marry those we love simply because we are different from the majority. I think about it constantly.Simply because we were born different. Cast into second-class citizenship via institutionalized discrimination. Why can't I marry someone I love? Why can't we partake in the happiness of marriage? How do I, or any gay people threaten marriage in any way? I have been deeply disturbed & saddened since such majorities came out in favor of the marriage amendments this past election. why suppress our desire to love and join together as you do? All we want is to love someone in the same way you do when you come home from work. What threat is there in love? sigh. no data, no statistics, no clever talking points....just the reality of the situation & the emotion it brings. The right to life, liberty and the persuit of happiness. Whether that happiness is with a same sex partner or not.. I don't agree with homosexual life styles, but that's a personal opinion based on my religion but I do not look down on homosexuals. You are still a human being and you have the God given right to be happy. My opinion, and the people who share my opinions shouldn't keep you from marrying someone. I do hope someday you can join a union with the person you love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Air Force Cane Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 "I do hope someday you can join a union with the person you love." uh, ever heard of "civil gay unions"?! in other words, they already CAN do what you are so mushily proclaiming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCsportsfan53 Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 The right to life, liberty and the persuit of happiness. Whether that happiness is with a same sex partner or not.. I don't agree with homosexual life styles, but that's a personal opinion based on my religion but I do not look down on homosexuals. You are still a human being and you have the God given right to be happy. My opinion, and the people who share my opinions shouldn't keep you from marrying someone. I do hope someday you can join a union with the person you love. Much respect for that opinion. You didn't scrifice your own beliefs but didn't force them on anyone, either. I wish there were more who could see it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCsportsfan53 Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 "I do hope someday you can join a union with the person you love."uh, ever heard of "civil gay unions"?! in other words, they already CAN do what you are so mushily proclaiming. They just banned all same sex unions in VA.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enter Apotheosis Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 The right to life, liberty and the persuit of happiness. Whether that happiness is with a same sex partner or not.. I don't agree with homosexual life styles, but that's a personal opinion based on my religion but I do not look down on homosexuals. You are still a human being and you have the God given right to be happy. My opinion, and the people who share my opinions shouldn't keep you from marrying someone. I do hope someday you can join a union with the person you love. Damn. Best post of the thread "I do hope someday you can join a union with the person you love."uh, ever heard of "civil gay unions"?! in other words, they already CAN do what you are so mushily proclaiming. You, sir, are a moron. Complete turnaround from the apparent progress made in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footballhenry Posted November 17, 2006 Author Share Posted November 17, 2006 Good posts so far. Like I said before, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Look at all sides of the issue and decide what you feel is right. I must say though, I have yet to hear one single credible argument for how gay marriage will ruin marriage itself. Wait, lets back track...50% of heterosexual marriages end in divorce in this country. Not only that but you can drive to Las Vegas and get married in a drive-thru wedding chapel with a complete stranger if you'd like, right? hmmm... And a question to those against gay marriage, just a simple question repeated. How does my getting married to another man, affect YOU in any way, shape, or form? really now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insomniac Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 You're the kind of person I could almost respect if they didn't lack so much common sense. You essentially just voted to ban any form of a union between partners of the same sex in Virginia. Why? Because you didn't like a simple word being applied to describe it. It's almost disgusting.Why can't you just recognize the fact that marriage (the way you view it) itself will not be affected by allowing more people to partake in it? You will enjoy the same ceremony in the same church with the same sense of "this is a special day" as always. Your church doesn't have to recognize the legal definition of a marriage and most people don't even have to change their views of what marriage is. It has NO effect on you if you don't want it to. no offense to you, or football henry, or anyone else here, but let me say as i have said in an earlier post.......if a simple word means nothing to you, do you mind if i just start referring to you as homo every time i quote you? would that bother you? how about if i start throwing out racial slurs at everyone, would that bother you? i mean, afterall, it's only a word. i didn't ask for respect, i was just stating my stance and my opinion on it, just as you have. for you to call my view disgusting, is an opinion of yours, and i respect that. how about you at least return the favor and respect other peoples opinions? it isn't that hard to do. i forgive you for your ignorance sir. just try a little harder not to call someone names just because they don't agree with the same things you do, that's why the world is so screwed up in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twenty-eight Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 Wait, lets back track...50% of heterosexual marriages end in divorce in this country. Not only that but you can drive to Las Vegas and get married in a drive-thru wedding chapel with a complete stranger if you'd like, right? hmmm... And a question to those against gay marriage, just a simple question repeated. How does my getting married to another man, affect YOU in any way, shape, or form? really now. It doesnt affect me.... Maybe allowing gay marraige will lower the rate of divorice....:whoknows: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insomniac Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 And a question to those against gay marriage, just a simple question repeated. How does my getting married to another man, affect YOU in any way, shape, or form? really now. it's like this......people that go around killing people because they are gay, black, female, etc, doesn't directly affect me either, but it doesn't mean i agree with it. i believe you should have the same rights, i really do. i just don't agree with the wording, that's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Air Force Cane Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 "How does my getting married to another man, affect YOU in any way, shape, or form?" how does ANY action by the government affect YOU in any way? does bombing Iran affect you? does building a highway in Arkansas affect you? Does declaring war affect you? how about drilling for oil in Alaska? does out of wedlock pregnancy affect you? how about low income housing? does illegal immigration affect you? here is a hint: changing our society and country in a negative fashion affects ALL of us... that is why millions of Americans are voting against you in every state it has come up for a vote.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DjTj Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 here is a hint: changing our society and country in a negative fashion affects ALL of us...Spoken like a true liberal AFC. There is nothing that should be off-limits for the government because everything affects us all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfitzo53 Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 it's like this......people that go around killing people because they are gay, black, female, etc, doesn't directly affect me either, but it doesn't mean i agree with it. Equating murder with homosexual marriage? Come on now. The hate crimes you mentioned do have adverse effects on individuals (who died) and their families (who are now bereft). Footballhenry wants to know how that's the case with gay marriage, and your scenario doesn't answer that at all. "How does my getting married to another man, affect YOU in any way, shape, or form?"how does ANY action by the government affect YOU in any way? does bombing Iran affect you? does building a highway in Arkansas affect you? Does declaring war affect you? how about drilling for oil in Alaska? does out of wedlock pregnancy affect you? how about low income housing? does illegal immigration affect you? here is a hint: changing our society and country in a negative fashion affects ALL of us... Once again, there's a series of wild and unfounded equivocations with no actual support for the contention that allowing homosexual marriage (or whatever you choose to call it) will harm American society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SackMachine Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 When you get married, its essentialy to spend your lives together and start a family. Since men cannot get pregnant, im guessing they cant start a family. Getting married is essentialy and was always known as when a woman and man get married. The whole "im born gay" thing im completely against and baffled that scientists say it might be genetic without any factual evidence. Sure, lets use that as an excuse, Mister x "was born a pedofile" and Joe Blow was born "A psychopatic murderer". Its not because of certain events and the environment in which they were raised, they were probably born that way. Sorry for going off topic, nothing against homosexuals, just homosexuality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosperity Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 "I do hope someday you can join a union with the person you love."uh, ever heard of "civil gay unions"?! in other words, they already CAN do what you are so mushily proclaiming. Not in Virginia The gay marriage amendment will ban "another union, partnership, or other legal status to which is assigned the rights, benefits, obligations, qualities, or effects of marriage." ie civil unions But I am sure you already knew that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCsportsfan53 Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 When you get married, its essentialy to spend your lives together and start a family. Since men cannot get pregnant, im guessing they cant start a family. Getting married is essentialy and was always known as when a woman and man get married.The whole "im born gay" thing im completely against and baffled that scientists say it might be genetic without any factual evidence. Sure, lets use that as an excuse, Mister x "was born a pedofile" and Joe Blow was born "A psychopatic murderer". Its not because of certain events and the environment in which they were raised, they were probably born that way. Sorry for going off topic, nothing against homosexuals, just homosexuality. God that's so idiotic. Homosexuality isn't an act that harms others, pedophilia and psychopathic murder are. That's like saying we should ban all sex because if sex is acceptable than so is rape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SackMachine Posted November 17, 2006 Share Posted November 17, 2006 Sorry for the poor comparison, just put whatever else in there that pleases you. I never said it harms others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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