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What is driving the price of gas down? Election?

chomerics

By chomerics
in The Tailgate

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Ax

Ax

Posted
Posted
tax breaks + war = Federal government operates at a loss

Amount of that loss = money borrowed

extra money paid at the gas pump = windfall profits = money to invest in U.S. T-bills = money borrowed

For tax breaks and war, etc. you pay: Increased money at the pump + interest on that money

The biggest stumbling block to understanding how it works is overcoming the disbelief that our government would actually do something this stupid.

Wow! So what you're saying is, the more pumping we do, the more pumping we get?

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PokerPacker

PokerPacker

Posted
Posted
Not another "price of gas" thread.

If the price goes up, we're being screwed.

If the price goes down, we're being blinded to the fact we're getting screwed.

is that your opinion, or are you mocking us?

based on previous experience with you and gas, i'm gonna go with the latter option..

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Popeman38

Popeman38

Posted
Posted
tax breaks + war = Federal government operates at a loss

Amount of that loss = money borrowed

extra money paid at the gas pump = windfall profits = money to invest in U.S. T-bills = money borrowed

For tax breaks and war, etc. you pay: Increased money at the pump + interest on that money

The biggest stumbling block to understanding how it works is overcoming the disbelief that our government would actually do something this stupid.

So your contention on the tax cuts are that the gov operates at a loss? What about the extra $$ in Joes hand, that he takes and increases consumer confidence in the market (spends more). This increases business for the corporations (THEY pay more taxes) which requires them to open up jobs (drops the unemployment rate) and requires this new person to pay taxes. See, you don't see the immediate results on the tax break. But in the long run it stimilates the market, which increases money.

As for your surplus of the Clinton admin, let us examine how he came to that surplus. He added a tax to gas, eliminated approx 50% of the military and created 100,000+ gov jobs and claims a job hike (that would be "new" math). Then the economy starts to slow down as Bush takes office. 9/11 hits, economy drops. Half the military is missing (the Army is stretched too thin - sound familiar?) which makes the execution of the war on terror more difficult.

Now, the NYSE is forcasted to hit all time highs by the end of the year.

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ChiefBigMeat

ChiefBigMeat

Posted
Posted

Pope, you got kinda away from the thread topic, but I do want to respond.

You said more money in "Joe's" hand. This is not what is happening and why this economic policy is broken. I agree with you that the bottom 99% is what really drives the economy -- when regualr working poeple buy new cars, ipods, tv's, etc..

Problem is, these economic policies don't work and aren't working....productivity has gone waay up the past few years, yet real wages are stagnant.

ABC News report from today

I understand your reasoning, but I just don't think the results have ever shown that it works the way it's supposed to.

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PleaseBlitz

PleaseBlitz

Posted
Posted
Yes, the real tax cuts have caused us to run MASSIVE deficits ... the national debt has gone $4 trillion in the hole after a projected $5.6 trillion SURPLUS by 2010 - calculated in 2000.

Where does that money come from? T-Bills -- aka treasury bonds

Who is buying T-Bills?

Saudi's are, with the extra money we pay at the pump -- therefore, it's OUR money that the government is borrowing to run on ... only we are making interest payments to the Saudis on it.

It's like a tax, only much much worse.

So what does this have to do with short term gas prices? None of this explains why gas prices have dropped 20 to 30 cents PER GALLON over the course of the last week and a half. It just sounds like tin foil hat nonsense and doesnt relate to the thread topic.

I can tell you the reason the Sauds try to keep the price within reason ;)

IF it stays too high,other alternatives become not just feasible,but cost effective which would make oil companies and the ME unimportant.

They are playing all of us...so what you gonna do?

Thank you. What is OPEC going to do? NOT sell oil? They are sitting on top of one of the worlds most demanded commodities, but one they cant actually use themselves.

Not another "price of gas" thread.

If the price goes up, we're being screwed.

If the price goes down, we're being blinded to the fact we're getting screwed.

Not sure if you were being serious or not, but this topic always makes me laugh.

Price of gas goes UP, Bush is up to something and a horrible leader. Its a conspiracy with him and the oil companies.

Price of gas goes DOWN, Bush is up to something and a horrible leader. Its a conspiracy with him and OPEC.

Makes me :laugh:

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ChiefBigMeat

ChiefBigMeat

Posted
Posted
So what does this have to do with short term gas prices? None of this explains why gas prices have dropped 20 to 30 cents PER GALLON over the course of the last week and a half. It just sounds like tin foil hat nonsense and doesnt relate to the thread topic.

Thank you. What is OPEC going to do? NOT sell oil? They are sitting on top of one of the worlds most demanded commodities, but one they cant actually use themselves.

Not sure if you were being serious or not, but this topic always makes me laugh.

Price of gas goes UP, Bush is up to something and a horrible leader. Its a conspiracy with him and the oil companies.

Price of gas goes DOWN, Bush is up to something and a horrible leader. Its a conspiracy with him and OPEC.

Makes me :laugh:

Sounds like typical "I keep my head buried in the sand and never read the news and blindly believe that politicians do whatever is in my best interest so I will never question them" reasoning

You won't look into any of this because you are so partisan-oriented you just don't want to know.

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JohnLockesGhost

JohnLockesGhost

Posted
Posted
Not sure if you were being serious or not, but this topic always makes me laugh.

Price of gas goes UP, Bush is up to something and a horrible leader. Its a conspiracy with him and the oil companies.

Price of gas goes DOWN, Bush is up to something and a horrible leader. Its a conspiracy with him and OPEC.

Makes me :laugh:

I guess I should have been more clear. Yes, I was being facetious.

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twa

twa

Posted
Posted
Will it work to help defuse a huge campaign issue?

You bet it will

From where I sit the dems gain by it going down,after all who's been blocking opening up areas for exploration?

Both sides will forget it is all about supply and demand.

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PleaseBlitz

PleaseBlitz

Posted
Posted
Sounds like typical "I keep my head buried in the sand and never read the news and blindly believe that politicians do whatever is in my best interest so I will never question them" reasoning

You won't look into any of this because you are so partisan-oriented you just don't want to know.

:laugh:

Wrong on both counts. I keep a very close eye on energy pricing because it has a large impact on my job, and im about as non-partison as you can get seeing as I am an independant who rarely votes.

Go ahead and look up my post history. Thanks.

Also, you have STILL failed to explain how any of your wacky theories impact the short term pricing of gasoline in the US. So please, step right up.

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ChiefBigMeat

ChiefBigMeat

Posted
Posted
The game isn't getting more oil out of the ground -- it's finding it and taking control of it to make sure it stays in the ground.

It's all a game. The only goal of oil companies is to make as much profit as possible, which = doing what it takes to make the price per barrel as high as possible for as long as possible.

Seriously, if you can give me a good reason why an oil company would want to dump a wad of product on the market, let me know--I've tried and I can't think of one.

--edit

Well, there are reasons to do it short-term, like say ... to influence American elections (which got this thread going in the first place)

Sorry to everyone else who already read this

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ChiefBigMeat

ChiefBigMeat

Posted
Posted
The crude prices began its decline Friday after the United Nations failed to impose sanctions on Iran for refusing to stop its nuclear enrichment program, ending speculation of a squeeze that was already factoring into pricing. Also easing energy prices were strong inventory data, a promising forecast for this year's hurricane season (meaning, less storms) and a mixed U.S. jobs report --> suggesting fuel demand probably won't surge sharply during the long weekend we just had.

/answering work questions on a holiday. :)

Edit: The political angle probably didnt hurt either, but its hard to quanitfy. :2cents:

Oops, sorry Pleaze, I got you confused with someone else. I apologize.

I actually totally agree with this post. You're right on with the specifics. "Hard to quantify" is exactly right.

I do believe that political influence is playing a factor here -- my posts have mostly been intended to demonstrate a relationship between Oil$ and economic policy. For the record, I never called Bush evil or mentioned the word "Democrats" I do wholeheartedly disagree with the administration's economic policies and don't doubt that the price of gasoline would be used to play politics, however, as you said, it's often hard to quantify.

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jbooma

jbooma

Posted
Posted

Chom there can be a bunch of reasons, and yes reasons you will not agree with. The first is the refineries have been able to get their production line with the new regulations, which was a huge issue in the beginnig of the year. The second is more places have reopened since the Katrina last year, remember we lost a ton of places in the area that very important for our gas.

The Mideast crisis has simmered down some, and Iraq is taking control more every day. The price of crude is dropping in the world which the oil companies have no ability to change due to OPEC.

Last but not least, look at the calendar is the end of the Summer, we did not see the drop last year due to Katrina, so this is normal.

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chomerics

chomerics

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Posted

I think we should make a periodic visit to this thread, and see if politics is the motivation behind the latest gas prices. Here is my prediction.

The price of gas will continue to decrease until the elections, while the price of crude oil futures will not fall at a similar percentage (for example, if gas falls 33% from $3.00 to $2.00, crude oil will not fall from $72.00 to $48) it will stay around the $65 dollar mark.

If this is the case, then we can safely say that the futures price was not setting the price of gas, as it has been argued in the past, because there would be a correlation in %'s between gas prices and crude oil futures. As was argued here

If the democrats gain control of the house, the prices will stay well below $2.50 because the oil companies will be afraid of investegations and having to testify under oath (something the republicans blocked in the latest hearings).

If the republicans controll the House and win the elections, the price of oil will go back up to over $3.00 prices until the next election. The oil companies will continue to make billions of dollars in profit per quarter, Wash, rinse, repeat. . .

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