Gibbs Mistakes since he has come back.

[freeseantaylor2k6]

In comparison with the catastrophic blunders made by his predecessors, I'd say the three "mistakes" made by Gibbs are impressive. Consider the fact that he took over a team destined for salary cap trouble, with a number of players who were not living up to their potential or their contract. Since he started, he has shipped out guys like fred smoot, arrington, and pierce and brought in a number of better players. Not only that, but he has assembled a coaching staff that can utilize special teams players like lemar marshall and turn them into solid starters. Say what you want about overpaying Brunell and mistreating Ramsey, but Gibbs turned a mediocre team into a playoff contender. You can hate on anyone in the organization OTHER than Joe Gibbs. GO SKINS!

[dadirtbags]

In comparison with the catastrophic blunders made by his predecessors, I'd say the three "mistakes" made by Gibbs are impressive. Consider the fact that he took over a team destined for salary cap trouble, with a number of players who were not living up to their potential or their contract. Since he started, he has shipped out guys like fred smoot, arrington, and pierce and brought in a number of better players. Not only that, but he has assembled a coaching staff that can utilize special teams players like lemar marshall and turn them into solid starters. Say what you want about overpaying Brunell and mistreating Ramsey, but Gibbs turned a mediocre team into a playoff contender. You can hate on anyone in the organization OTHER than Joe Gibbs. GO SKINS!

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:

[skinfan2k]

whos hating? we love joe gibbs to death..

[G-Prime]

A lot of people will defend Joe Gibbs to the death and rightly so, however I choose to take a fair look at his accomplishments and mistakes.. Really only one mistake comes to mind, Patrick Ramsey. How he was handled etc. So in my book if wrongs counted against him he'd still be getting a big ol fat A =)

[PleaseGoForTheWin]

It's amazing to read how badly everyone is beating up on the thread starter and misconstruing his opinion. I believe he likes Gibbs and thinks that Gibbs is doing a great job, but that he wanted to discuss what people thought Gibbs' mistakes have been.

For the record, I agree with the thing about Pierce, because we'd be stacked with Washington, Marshall and Pierce. But concerning Brunell, don't forget that Mark 1) has restructured his deal multiple times and 2) helped the team to the playoffs last year, which no one else has done since Brad Johnson in 99 (damn, I wish we would have kept BJ!)

[bigdog77s]

IMO opinion it doesn't matter how old the QB is if he wes. He could be 82 years old, if he wins 19 games a year, pay him $50 million

[skinfan2k]

It's amazing to read how badly everyone is beating up on the thread starter and misconstruing his opinion. I believe he likes Gibbs and thinks that Gibbs is doing a great job, but that he wanted to discuss what people thought Gibbs' mistakes have been.

For the record, I agree with the thing about Pierce, because we'd be stacked with Washington, Marshall and Pierce. But concerning Brunell, don't forget that Mark 1) has restructured his deal multiple times and 2) helped the team to the playoffs last year, which no one else has done since Brad Johnson in 99 (damn, I wish we would have kept BJ!)

dude, i love gibbs, and i feel i am so fortunate to see him coach again.. since i was unabel to do it when i was young

[Gilgamesh]

Would the "glass half full" people please stand up...please stand up...please stand up...

[GibbssbbiG]

see, that won't fly around here. be civil, man. joe gibbs is not perfect. wouldn't trade him for any other coach ever, but he's not perfect. i'm sure he wouldn't claim to be. this thread is something different. it's not vehement or anything. if you don't like it, don't click on it. the title makes clear the topic, it's your choice to read it or ignore it. :2cents:

Way to go and my salutations for Major Harris, skinfan2k, AJ_skins. You are all wise Redskins fans.

I wish Joe Gibbs is the president, instead of that dimwitted and ignoramus village idiot George Bush junior who authorized the destruction of great USA.

[FightForOldDC21]

kinda bad thread idea

gibbs rocks

[Santana_Fan]

This thread is good, I like it....I like it because Gibbs is a human like any of us in which he makes mistakes too....however he is the best Coach ever, but I get tired of our homers saying "we trust in Gibbs" like every decision he makes is GREAT. Gibbs will remain the best coach, but people need to give it a rest, Gibbs makes mistakes too! I admit he's made a couple that I didn't agree with, but I guess I can also say that he's made perfect decisions.

[Bhutanibeast]

Do you actually think Mark Brunell is going to play out his contract? I mean c'mon.

whether he does or doesnt, its still awful. Theres gonna be a huge cap hit if we cut him and enormous cap hit if he stays all seven years.

[dadirtbags]

Gibbs will be the first one to take the blame and admit his flaws/makes mistakes....but the thing I have a problem with is some people within this thread throw out statements without thinking about the pros and cons or what is the reality of the situation

e.g Ramsey was treated badly - this is the pros and get over it!!!! We as fans saw some good things with what Ramsey could do..I'll admit it... but to question a HOF coach who went down winning with 3 qbs in 3 different superbowls about his decision on how he treated ramsey to me is crazy. Whatever the fact may be why he didn't like Ramsey will always be a mystery to us all....we all know he had the physical talent....maybe he wasn't able to understand the plays.... maybe Gibbs didnt like the idea he improvised rather than stick with the coaches game plan.....maybe it had something to do with Ramsey forcing passes creating turnovers...maybe Ramsey didn't have a touch with short dinky passes...maybe Ramsey had a bad attitude towards the coaching staff....maybe Gibbs didnt like Ramseys throwing technique and to relearn it was similar to teaching an old dog new tricks...whatever the case may be..... Ramsey is now a Jet and we will all witness how well Ramsey is as a QB these next few seasons...now if Ramsey kicks butt in New York makes it to the pro bowl or something...everyone can give it to me and say I told ya so dadirtbags..... and i will be the first to admit it was a mistake not to give the guy a chance...but as it stands.....Ramsey has yet to prove anything within the nfl at this time!!!! and if Joe Gibbs didn't like him I'm sure he had a good reason.

AP- Pierce filled in great within Williams system...I agree.....but was he a standout prior to Gibbs and Williams? Or did he fit well within Williams system because Williams system allows LB's to do well? Gibbs was not responsible for the Skins bad moves in the past which caused the skins to be in cap hell ....Joe Gibbs and the Skins made a very good offer for Pierce to remain as a skin......The Giants payed more...this is not monopoly money we are talking about fella's ...this is the real thing.....there is only so much money to go around.....guys like Lavar and Coles were hurting us in that aspect...so blame them not Gibbs

I have no problems viewing or talking about how Gibbs made mistakes.... and one that I agree with most....we overpaid for Brunell and his contract is way too long....also...it appeared Gibbs was rusty his during his first year...but that is a tough one too....without knowing what kind of players you have playing for you and how well they will adjust to your game plan wont be seen until the game begins.

The way I see it...Gibbs has made a few mistakes but he has done some really great great things for this organization...he has turned us around into a winner...I have the highest respect for this man because I was his biggest fan during his first time around. Tears came to my eyes the day he decided to retire. I knew from that point on those special moments were going to be missed...so when people throw out statements without thinking about the pros and cons...i get a bit upset

Baily for portis and a 2nd draft pick + reason = Baily cried he wanted out so his value dropped...is that gibbs fault?

Pierce wanted more money and the team is in cap hell with all the past signings ...once again is that Gibb's fault we were in cap hell?

[Thirtyfive2seven]

I don't mind the whole premise of this thread, I think it's ok to discuss what things you feel JG has done wrong, but there hasn't been much:

What mistakes has Gibbs made? I'm sure there are plenty: like sometimes his playcalling is questionable. Instead of run run, pass, punt he could have changed this up a little more, but hindsight is always 20/20.

I'm not upset with the way he handled Ramsey. Did he make a mistake though? Yes, and I'll tell you where. It was naming Ramsey the starter in the first place after he signed Brunell. Gibbs knew all of Ramsey's flaws and short comings after he watched him in film. Why do you think his FIRST move was to go out and get another QB? So, in hindsight I'm sure JG is kicking himself for naming PR the starter. JG have PR every opportunity to shine in Preseason and Pat played like Poo. He named Pat the starter even though ALL of us KNEW beyond a shadow of a doubt that Brunell was on fire during the Preseason. He had bounce in his step and was firing the ball all over the field. Pat started the first game and the offense sputtered and JG used Pat's injury as an excuse to bench him. Oh well, that's his choice. Welcome to the NFL

As for Pierce: Give me a break. JG has nothing to do with whether or not AP stayed here or not. AP ran for more money (and not even that much MORE money). That's on him, and he needs to shuddup about it and quit crying like a ...

[Warhead36]

I don't think there were any real "mistakes."

Pierce(and Smoot)left because we put value on other players on the team better then them at the same position-Washington and Springs.

I wouldn't call that a mistake. Thats called cap management.

Then again, when we "overpay" for a player it's a mistake, when we don't "overpay" for a player it's also a mistake.

You could say the Mark Brunell signing too. I don't like the contract he received, but then again all our contracts are set up so differently that you really don't know how it's set up(well, most of us don't anyway).

Brunell played horribly in 04, but he seemed back to his old ways in 05. Look at his numbers. 05 wasn't the fluke, 04 was.

He handled the Ramsey situation well. He knew from day 1 Ramsey wasn't going to be a winning QB here, so he brought in guys he prefered, but he still give Ramsey a fair chance.

Come on, lets be rational, I like Ramsey too, but just how good was he?No playoff apperances, losing record, not a great TD-INT ratio, mistake prone, erratic. He was ruinted by Spurrier.

[planter]

Gibbs has not made ANY big mistakes in his second term. However, after the next two NY Giants games, his biggest single mistake may be evident.

IF LA plays great, especially against us, and helps revitalize the NY Giant defense, AND the Giants win the division, then Gibbs and Williams screwed up...

I'm NOT predicting the above nasty scenario, but if it happens, Gibbs will have blundered. He should have stepped in and told Williams to find a way to fit LA into his schemes.

Was it "freelancing" or "instinct" ?

I thought that the Pats' free agent, David Givens , would have made a better #2 wide receiver, but that's pretty small stuff.

[kramdizzle]

ramsey. i think if given half a chance he could have been a solid starter

[JohnLockesGhost]

Gibbs has not made ANY big mistakes in his second term. However, after the next two NY Giants games, his biggest single mistake may be evident.

IF LA plays great, especially against us, and helps revitalize the NY Giant defense, AND the Giants win the division, then Gibbs and Williams screwed up...

I'm NOT predicting the above nasty scenario, but if it happens, Gibbs will have blundered. He should have stepped in and told Williams to find a way to fit LA into his schemes.

Was it "freelancing" or "instinct" ?

I thought that the Pats' free agent, David Givens , would have made a better #2 wide receiver, but that's pretty small stuff.

Here's a man with some courage. If this happens or that happens, then this or that would have been a mistake. Are you or are you not saying that letting Arrington go was a mistake?

I for one believe letting him go was the only option. He hasn't really played that much in the last two seasons and he was willing to pay the organization to let him go. His departure opened up alot of avenues for the FO to take with the extra cap space.

[freeseantaylor2k6]

Okay, I didnt mean to pounce on the guy who started the thread, so sorry about that. As a redskins fan, I have watched coaches over the past decade make so pretty ridiculous moves. With each of those coaches, they made a lot more mistakes than they did brilliant moves. Gibbs has let a few players go, but he has also brought in guys like Marcus Washington, Shawn Springs, Sean Taylor, Clinton Portis, Santana Moss, and Chris Cooley. He might have let a few guys walk who were considered "core redskins" a few years ago, but since then he has built a younger, more team oriented group of players who will do the burgundy and gold right for years to come.

[bulldog]

by and large the players the Redskins have let go have been replaced by cheaper talent that has performed as well if not better than the original starters.

Smoot wasn't worth $11 million in bonus money. Pierce is a nice player but not a 'must have' performer at middle linebacker. Cost wise, do you want to pay Pierce the same bonus that Marcus Washington is earning? That wouldn't have gone down too well. We would have had to sweeten MW's deal.

Coles and Gardner have done nothing. Both were dead weight here. Gibbs knew it from the middle of the 2004 but could do nothing about it until the end of the season.

Ramsey is another unproven commodity whose short term as a starter in 2003 under Spurrier probably set him back as he now views himself as a starter in the NFL, when his on the field knowledge is a half step or so short of that mark.

Bailey and Arrington played themselves off the team. Bailey due to his stance that he wanted to leave if the Redskins were not going to give him a $20-22 million bonus. For a corner? That wasn't going to happen.

Arrington was a crybaby that refused to do the work and prep necessary to gain the trust of the coaches and their respect for his professionalism. Arrington created himself into a media star when the club was in losing mode from 2000-2003 and there was no way that Gibbs was going to allow one inconsistent player to throw public tirades in the press and call out his position coach as if he were untouchable.

I bet he tones down his act in NY :laugh:

See, LaVar WILL learn from his experience here in DC. Then if he is successful in NY will point a finger in our face and tell us how we were so wrong about him.

Meanwhile, it will be LAVAR that changes to become more successful

[dfos81]

As long as we have a chance at a superbowl and we improve upon what we did before Gibbs, I'd say he has done nothing but make us a contender overall. Players can be replaced, H.O.F. coaching cannot.

[CPstretch]

its easy to sit here and bad mouth players who are no longer on the team. if they were redskins, we would be praising them and defending them for sure.

there is no way that people on here would not want antonio pierce on the team, or champ bailey. they brought amazing things to the table for the defense and helped tremendously.

with that said, maybe they arent the kind of players gibbs wants around, then so be it. but you cannot deny what good things they could do for a defense.

[Santana_Fan]

its easy to sit here and bad mouth players who are no longer on the team. if they were redskins, we would be praising them and defending them for sure.

there is no way that people on here would not want antonio pierce on the team, or champ bailey. they brought amazing things to the table for the defense and helped tremendously.

with that said, maybe they arent the kind of players gibbs wants around, then so be it. but you cannot deny what good things they could do for a defense.

I agree with that

[onedrop]

its easy to sit here and bad mouth players who are no longer on the team. if they were redskins, we would be praising them and defending them for sure.

there is no way that people on here would not want antonio pierce on the team, or champ bailey. they brought amazing things to the table for the defense and helped tremendously.

with that said, maybe they arent the kind of players gibbs wants around, then so be it. but you cannot deny what good things they could do for a defense.

sure, maybe just not OUR defense.

[CPstretch]

sure, maybe just not OUR defense.

youre trying to say pierce and bailey were not good when they played for the redskins? youre lying to yourself if you believe they were not good when they were in DC