footballhenry Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Tolkien was a masterpiece for his time. His writing is among the most descriptive I have ever read, and entertaining. I have read parts of the first Potter book, wrote by Rowling but it honestly I just wasn't feeling it. From a literary perspective who has the bigger masterpiece, so to speak, Rowling or Tolkien? Who is the better writer? My vote goes to Tolkien, hands down... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrockster21 Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 :doh: I'm speechless. :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancalagon the Black Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 The first Potter book is a children's piece through and through. They don't get really good until the third one. I would suspend judgement if I were you until reading at least the third, fourth, and fifth. That said, my vote DEFINITELY goes to Tolkien. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portisizzle Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 :dunce: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footballhenry Posted July 18, 2005 Author Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by jrockster77 :doh: I'm speechless. :doh: the only reason I posted this was because Rowling has been all over the TV recently, and there have been numerous Potter fans (from other messageboards) calling her greater than Tolkien and such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Anyone who thinks Rowling > Tolkien probably hasn't read much of Tolkien... Absolute genius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iheartskins Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 I think it comes down to, without Tolkein, there is no Rowling. Tolkein (albiet arguably) created the genre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrockster21 Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by footballhenry the only reason I posted this was because Rowling has been all over the TV recently, and there have been numerous Potter fans (from other messageboards) calling her greater than Tolkien and such. I wasn't trying to be a d**k or anything...its just to me, Tolkien is a whole other league than Rowling. Don't get me wrong, I love the Harry Potter books; but to even mention them in the same sentence as LOR, well, is blasphemy in my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancalagon the Black Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 I know some serious adults who would vote for Rowling's series. And it's fair enough--Tolkien wasn't the best micro-writer in the world, and his prose does plod sometimes. Even in The Hobbit there are some boring descriptive passages that make you want to rip your hair out; read something like Lost Tales and you feel like you need a translator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
englitdaudelin Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Tolien's imagination, his BACKSTORY is just genius. He frickin' invented the elvish language... and it adheres to all the rules of linguistics, has its own rules he follows, and so on. Harry Potter is a wanna-be hobbit. Well, that's unneccesarily simplified, but.... ...true? Anyway, Tolkien evokes a whole universe, a place and a time-- and has that whole nostalgia kick at the end of Return of the King-- that everything is different. Genius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mufumonk Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 If anything, Rowling is more a wannabe C.S. Lewis than Tolkien. Either way, Potter doesn't hold a candle to LOTR or Chronicles of Narnia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rebornempowered Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by Mufumonk If anything, Rowling is more a wannabe C.S. Lewis than Tolkien. Either way, Potter doesn't hold a candle to LOTR or Chronicles of Narnia. My thought exactly! Lewis is about to be unleashed on the world once again. Will it be ready to put down it's mediocre fantasy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYSkins1 Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 My thoughts: Tolkein's series has endured the test of time and has proven to be one of the great literary masterpieces of its time. While my vote does go to Tolkien, I prefer Rowling's series. His language plods on, and the things that he is lauded for--his amazing backstory, his marvelous universe--sometimes bog down the story. My hat goes off to J.K. Rowling for not interrupting the story with her universe, but instead incorporating it. I assure you, though, that my vote goes to Tolkien. Ask again in 50-100 years, and we'll see how well Harry Potter endures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosperity Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 First off let me say that I love both series. Tolkien's work has to be assumed as the better by default because of the great influence it has had on all fantasy books, but I enjoy reading the Rowling's books more. Her universe makes more sense than Tolien's universe, and it is much more human, the black and white good and evil simplicity of Tolkien is not what I like plus the already mentioned plodding style that Tolkien used. Are either really literary masterpieces though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chomerics Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by Ancalagon the Black I know some serious adults who would vote for Rowling's series. And it's fair enough--Tolkien wasn't the best micro-writer in the world, and his prose does plod sometimes. Even in The Hobbit there are some boring descriptive passages that make you want to rip your hair out; read something like Lost Tales and you feel like you need a translator. I agree totally. Re-read the first hundred pages of Felowship and you can see exactly what you are talking about. I remember being 9 or ten and actually putting down Fellowship because I thought it was boring as hell. It isn't until they leave the shire before the book actually opens up and it becomes a great novel. I know a lot of it is done as backround material, but IMHO, it dragged and plodded very slowly at first. With that said, why in the world are we even debating this. The Potter books are good, in much the same way I think Judy Blume wrote good books. . . for fouthr graders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chomerics Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by Mufumonk If anything, Rowling is more a wannabe C.S. Lewis than Tolkien. Either way, Potter doesn't hold a candle to LOTR or Chronicles of Narnia. Great point about C.S. Lewis, I enjoyed the Narnia series more then Potter, but then again I was 8 when I read them so this may have something to do with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Harris Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 i see people touting cs lewis...... i just read "the lion, the witch and the wardrobe," and, while i enjoyed it, i really felt that it moved so fast that there wasn't a whole lot of story behind it. i haven't read the other chronicles, so maybe they're better in that category.?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosperity Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by chomerics I agree totally. Re-read the first hundred pages of Felowship and you can see exactly what you are talking about. I remember being 9 or ten and actually putting down Fellowship because I thought it was boring as hell. It isn't until they leave the shire before the book actually opens up and it becomes a great novel. I know a lot of it is done as backround material, but IMHO, it dragged and plodded very slowly at first. With that said, why in the world are we even debating this. The Potter books are good, in much the same way I think Judy Blume wrote good books. . . for fouthr graders. or the last hundred pages of retrun of the king for that matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chomerics Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by Liberty or the last hundred pages of retrun of the king for that matter Yes, the beginning and end were really drawn out, but the middle was probably one of the best fantasy novels ever written. As for book endings, nothing dissapointed me more then It by Steven King. The first 1000 or so pages were great, but it was almost like he said to himself "this thing is too damn long and I have to end it soon" and the last 50 pages were crap. It ruined a great book in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeorama Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by chomerics I agree totally. Re-read the first hundred pages of Felowship and you can see exactly what you are talking about. I remember being 9 or ten and actually putting down Fellowship because I thought it was boring as hell. That happened to me twice. Man, the beginning was so slow.... Great books otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smsmith40 Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Well I love fantasy fiction but I have never enjoyed Tolkien, perhaps its the language, perhaps its the over-descriptiveness of the prose. I don't know. However, at its worst LOTR is streets ahead of Harry Potter for anybody aver the age of 14. Thw writing is poor and the chracter one-dimensional. Before anybody asks I've read 1 through 3 HP books but couldn't get more than 100 pages through 4 before hurling it across the room. I think maybe its the length, as the books have gotten longer I am just less inclined to waste time on such poor writing. p.s. If HP has got even 100 more children reading a book than would otherwise have done then I'm all for it. Just don't make ME read it. If anybody wants to read GOOD fantasy fiction then I recommend George RR Martin or Robin Hobb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancalagon the Black Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 Originally posted by smsmith40 However, at its worst LOTR is streets ahead of Harry Potter for anybody aver the age of 14. Thw writing is poor and the chracter one-dimensional. Interesting, smsmith. What exactly about the writing do you dislike? I'd agree that Rowling doesn't have the tight control of a Fitzgerald or brilliance of a Joyce, but I think she's amazing for a fantasy writer (most of whom couldn't write their way out of a paper bag). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 This is one area of life where there needs to be totalitarian control over people's thoughts. You simply shouldn't be allowed to mention Rowling and Tolkien in the same sentence unless you are beginning a sentence like "Rowling owes much to....." Seriously though, isn't there a Ministry of Truth for something like this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smsmith40 Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 This is one area of life where there needs to be totalitarian control over people's thoughts. Ghost I would have though you would have a number areas is mind for this.:jk: AtB I enjoyed the first two HP books and struggled through the third but I have tried the 4th twice now and had to give up after 100 pages. I gave it a second chance becasue after the entire universe said it was inspired and brilliant I figured it must be me that was wrong. Its only my opinion but I just find the whole thing quite derivative, not especially original and the prose to be plodding and uninspired. Its quite possible that the characterisation has improved as the books have got longer and the target audience a bit older. I am not a literary critic by any means but I am an avid reader of modern fantasy and the writing does not stand up to comparisons with George Martin, Robin Hobb or Steven Eriksson. I know these are adult writers but one of the best fantasy series I have read over the last couple of years has been Phillip Pullman's Northern Lights, which is also for kids and young adults. Read that back to back with HP and you will see what I am trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NASMTrainer Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 I didn't read either but my 12 y/o says Rowling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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