A Look at the Roster

With the draft coming up, and free agency pretty much complete, I think it may be time to take a look at the actual, current roster and what needs to be done prior to the start of the 09 season. First, I'm going to display what I believe the current roster should look like with blank spots where I think needs truly are.

OFFENSE:

QB - Campbell, Collins, Brennan

RB - Portis, Betts, Cartwright, (RB #4)

FB - Sellers

TE - Cooley, Davis, Yoder

LT - Samuels, Heyer

LG - Dockery, Rhinehart

C - Rabach

RB - Thomas, (G/C)

RT - (RT), Jansen

WR - Moss, Thomas, Randle El, Kelly, Thrash

Ok, there's the offense. I see needs for the 09 season at RT, G/C and RB, in that order. (I do not want this to become a Jason Campbell, needs at QB debate). I think the RT can be addressed through the draft with a trade down and look at Oher, Beatty or Britton. G/C can also be looked at in the draft in the third round. As for the RB, I think this team desperatly needs a change of pace, Darren Sproles, type player. This can be a 2nd day type pick or one of the guys that were picked up in the offseason (the Denver running back for example).

Now onto the DEFENSE:

DE - Carter, Wilson, Jackson

DT - Haynesworth, Montgomery, Alexander

DT -Griffin, Golston

DE - Daniels, (DE), Wynn

OLB - McIntosh, Thomas

MLB - Fletcher, Blades

OLB - (OLB), Fincher

CB - Hall, Smoot, Tryon

CB - Rogers, (CB)

FS - Landry, Moore

SS - Horton, Doughty

I see definitive needs at DE and OLB. I think one of these picks needs to be addressed in the 2nd round with a gained pick from a trade down. The problem with not having all of our picks is that one of these needs won't be addressed. I would take which ever player at either OLB or DE is ranked higher on the board in the second round. Looking at DE Sidbury, DE English, OL Sintim or OLB Freeman would be good places to start. On the second day a CB would be a good choice.

As far as a trade down partner, the Patriots are in perfect position for a few reasons. They have numerous 2nd and 3rd round picks, they are generally active in the draft and they have too many picks this year to sign them all. Trading the #13 for the #23 and #47 matches up pretty well with the trade value sheet. My draft would then be:

1 - 23 - RT Oher, Britton, Beatty

2 - 47 - DE Sidbury, DE English, OLB Sintim, OLB Freeman

3 - 80 - C/G Wood, C/G Caldwell

4 - NO PICK

5 - Best CB or LB available

6 - BPA (with eyes on RB, CB, LB)

7 - BPA (with eyes on RB, CB, LB)

Now by looking at the roster, and plugging in Britton at starting RT, Sidbury at backup DE, Wood at backup G/C and then some depth in rounds 5-7 at LB, RB and CB, many positions would be helped out for the present and future.

Sorry this was long, but I think looking at the roster as a whole is needed to do now. I didn't add special teams, but we will have a P, K and the Red Snapper as well.

I think Sidbury would be a nice pickup at #47 if he's there...he's a beast. And if we could get Oher at #23 that would be a steal too...

Vinny has been clear in his assertion that Heyer is a RT not a LT. I keep seeing Oher and keep getting the same bad feeling about him. He makes me more nervous as a 1st round pick than A. Smith does. In your scenario we're starting the season with HB Blades or Alfred Fincher at SLB.. Doesn't that concern people more than starting Heyer at RT?

Having Blades and/or Fincher at OLB does not concern me as much as having Heyer at RT. Reason being, last year with Washington out as much as he is, the Skins pretty much had Fincher and Blades there a good amount of the season and were still a solid Defense. Every defense has holes, but with the addition of Haynesworth, Daniels, Hall (for a full season) and more experience for Horton, Moore, etc., I think the Skins could get by with Fincher or Blades. Also, when given playing time, guys we knew nothing about like Pierce, Clark, Horton, Doughty, etc have proven to be solid players. I just think RT is the #1 priority and Heyer is a backup, but a solid backup to both tackle positions. This is just my opinion and I believe that RT is just a more important position on the football field, and especially for this team than an OLB.

Vinny has been clear in his assertion that Heyer is a RT not a LT. I keep seeing Oher and keep getting the same bad feeling about him. He makes me more nervous as a 1st round pick than A. Smith does. In your scenario we're starting the season with HB Blades or Alfred Fincher at SLB.. Doesn't that concern people more than starting Heyer at RT?

Heyer starting at RT absolutely concerns me more than Blades or Fincher starting at SLB. A poor RT means Campbell will have another lackluster season. If THAT happens, our offense will struggle tremendously (again). Improvement from Thomas and Kelly will become null. Two things happen when Heyer or Jansen is starting. The RT gets injured and/or the DE gets to the QB. The latter equates to sacks, pressure, deflections, and fumbles.

A poor SLB isn't the worst thing in the world. Who did we have last year? Marcus Washington? He was barely starting material himself... We have Daniels (a run stuffing DE) on that side. If necessary, Horton can play closer to the line.

This draft has me thrown off. Vinny hates drafting defensive linemen, so I don't think we go DE in the 1st. He speaks highly of Heyer everytime ("He has arms from here to the corner"), so I don't think we pick an OT in the 1st. But we haven't worked out any LBs, right? So will we go with someone like Maualuga?

I seriously just don't know what to expect.

if we draft an OT he neeeds to be able to play LT AND RT. we have NO backup for Samuels!!!!!

Huge holes at QB, WR and RB. Oddly (to some), the strength of the team now seems to be the DL. This team will finish last in its Division.

Vinny has been clear in his assertion that Heyer is a RT not a LT.

Actually, if you read the transcript, what he said was that Heyer is going to be focusing on RT. It is part of the conversation about young linemen and that they are better off focusing on one position. It sounds like they are having him make a push for the job this offseason.

Having Blades and/or Fincher at OLB does not concern me as much as having Heyer at RT. Reason being, last year with Washington out as much as he is, the Skins pretty much had Fincher and Blades there a good amount of the season and were still a solid Defense. Every defense has holes, but with the addition of Haynesworth, Daniels, Hall (for a full season) and more experience for Horton, Moore, etc., I think the Skins could get by with Fincher or Blades. Also, when given playing time, guys we knew nothing about like Pierce, Clark, Horton, Doughty, etc have proven to be solid players. I just think RT is the #1 priority and Heyer is a backup, but a solid backup to both tackle positions. This is just my opinion and I believe that RT is just a more important position on the football field, and especially for this team than an OLB.

I don't know why people believe this. Heyer has started for parts of the last two seasons and he's been pretty solid out there, especially when playing RT. I harbor no fears about him being able to protect that side of the field. The main issue has been his run blocking, which hasn't been all that great.

Meanwhile, I thought Blades' production was pretty lackluster, which goes the same for any LB who was not named Fletcher last year.

I believe that RT is soooo much more of a pressing issue than OLB. Last year the Skins were able to have a top notch defense with Washington, Blades and Fincher playing OLB. With the additions of Haynesworth, Daniels and Hall for a full year, the defense should be able to remain a top notch defense. Without a RT, the offense struggles. Heyer is decent, but in my opinion, he is best suited as a backup at both Tackle spots. RT is the teams biggest draft need in my opinion.

Heyer starting at RT absolutely concerns me more than Blades or Fincher starting at SLB. A poor RT means Campbell will have another lackluster season. If THAT happens, our offense will struggle tremendously (again). Improvement from Thomas and Kelly will become null.

Yep, got the excuses all ready to go. Sorry, RT is important but if the rest of the line is good and Heyer is even 'decent' at RT (or Jansen) it will not render improvement from the young guys "null" or means that Campbell will automatically have a lackluster season NOR was RT the reason Campbell wasn't very good this past year.

Jeebus.

If you want a player that should make the starting lineup and have an immediate impact, you draft a guy like cushing or maualuga. Either one of them will start next to london in september.

If we go RT in the 1st, looks like we will only have a choice between oher, and smith, in regards to the top tackles. Smith would push heyer at RT, and would immediately improve our run offense. I'm not sold on Oher. I think Oher would be a developmental project that would not pay dividends until 2010 at the earliest. If heyer can develope, he'll be decent enough at RT. If smith is gone by #13, I cant see us drafting a tackle. We'll get OLB/DE, or try and trade back and grab alex mack, C, or maybe even eben britton.

Heyer is not that bad. However for all the people talking about a tackle I do have a question. If we don't draft an OT there was one name I was wondering about. George Foster was a first rounder with Denver, then he was traded to the Lions with another player and a pick for a CB. Corners are rarely as valuable as tackles. So what happened with him? I ask because I saw he was still a free agent and we're reaching a point where several apparently high quality young tackles are about to enter the league. Is he a lost cause? Or could Bugel do something with him?

Washington is certainly still starting material when he's healthy.

we've had some quality UDFA RB's in the past I think it'd be nice if one of them didn't get caught up in a numbers game.

Ideally we'd trade down and get Beatty or Britton to play RT and the beast Lawrence Sidbury at DE in the 2nd round. In the 3rd round select OLB Marcus Freeman and get a center or guard in the later rounds. Successful draft.

It just pisses me off thinking that we gave this year's 2nd round pick for Jason Taylor only for him to be released after a injury-ridden season. Had we still owned that pick this year's draft would be awesome as long as the FO made the logical decisions.

With the picks that we currently have its highly unlikely that we'll be able to address all of our teams needs. Hopefully we draft a RT and the best DE/OLB available in the third round. Although we won't be able to go into this season without any holes (not a lot of teams do), we'll be taking steps in the right direction and that's all that really matters. Getting better.

if we draft an OT he neeeds to be able to play LT AND RT. we have NO backup for Samuels!!!!!

so you don't even think Heyer is "a useful backup"?

Yep, got the excuses all ready to go. Sorry, RT is important but if the rest of the line is good and Heyer is even 'decent' at RT (or Jansen) it will not render improvement from the young guys "null" or means that Campbell will automatically have a lackluster season NOR was RT the reason Campbell wasn't very good this past year.

Jeebus.

Oh, trust me. I'm not a Campbell apologist. However, Campbell had a good start to the season last year going 6-2. What went wrong, I'm not sure. I wasn't too invested in the why as I was the :cuss:. The year before, Collins came in and gave us life. But was it him or improved play from the offense? In the first round of the playoffs (against the Seahawks), that answered my question. Kerney came in and just demolished Heyer (to the point in which Heyer got injured). Kerney disrupted our hot (at the time) offense. Collins (who was playing great before the Wild Card game in 07) had an abysmal game. Completion percentage of 58, 2 TDs to 2 INT, sacked 3 times, a fumble, and a passer rating of 69.

But to build off of this example, Tom Freaking Brady and the Patriots. Last year, they came in to the Super Bowl owning EVERYONE (except their last regular season game against the Giants). Low and behold, the Patriots are mortals. Their high powered offense becomes pudding. Why? They had a good OLine, Tom Brady, Wes Welker, Randy Moss, some running back they never used... How could they lose? The defensive line they played against had none of it. Brady was sacked 5 times in that one game. Compare that to him being sacked 21 times all season.

I do not think Campbell is a great QB. I think he's too cautious as a QB. Is it because of Gibbs? Saunders? Zorn? Or has he always been so cautious? Who knows... But when he's got time, he's fine. If he... no, if anyone (insert the Tom Brady example here) doesn't have time, the offense will not succeed.

IMO Heyer is a GREAT for depth. But is a sub par in both his pass pro and run blocking. As for the effects of a weakness at RT think Patrick Kearny, Seattle. We need a legit T get his feet wet on the right side and move left when Samuels retires, so when that day comes we are not relying on a rookie.

When looking at the roster, and my original post, I have the needs as such:

RT

DE

OLB

G/C

CB

Of these needs I feel that RT is the most important, and the most difficult to fill. This year there is some tremendous depth at the OT position and I believe the Skins need to take advantage. At 13, either A.Smith or Oher or both will be available. If the Skins trade down to the mid-20's or so then Oher, Britton, Beatty could possibly be available. There is always quality G/C and LB in the 2nd and 3rd round, however OT usually does not last that long, just look at last year. Taking a RT with the first pick would not only bring in a starter, but allow the offensive line to take shape for the present and the future.

IMO Heyer is a GREAT for depth. But is a sub par in both his pass pro and run blocking. As for the effects of a weakness at RT think Patrick Kearny, Seattle. We need a legit T get his feet wet on the right side and move left when Samuels retires, so when that day comes we are not relying on a rookie.

Agree. We need a stud OT. At #13 the talent should be good enough to start at RT and project to LT once Samuels is gone. LT is a spot you don't want to have a question mark at. I think we are fortunate to have a lot of talent at OT this draft. And should be in a position to take advantage of it.

OFFENSE:

QB - Campbell, Collins, Brennan

RB - Portis*, Betts*, Cartwright*, (RB #4)

FB - Sellers*

TE - Cooley*, Davis, Yoder*

LT - Samuels*, Heyer

LG - Dockery*, Rhinehart

C - Rabach*

RB - Thomas*, (G/C)

RT - (RT), Jansen*

WR - Moss*, Thomas, Randle El, Kelly, Thrash

The players with *'s represent starters/major role players on the team in 2005. 4 years ago. When the offense had it's best statistical year, and the best record. You'll notice it's EVERY starter except for the QB. There is something to be said for stability and consistency, but this is a bit odd.

I would agree that the positions of need on offense are RT and C, and depth for everything. You really can't address the WR position with new players, you HAVE to wait to see what Kelly/Thomas/Davis do in year 2.

I also think that we need to dump Betts and/or Rock, and get a true complimentary back to Portis, somebody who can scare defenses with the ability to break a big run.

Defensively, DE is a need, Carter is ok, the other side isn't great. OLB is a need. the secondary should be fine.

Agree. We need a stud OT. At #13 the talent should be good enough to start at RT and project to LT once Samuels is gone. LT is a spot you don't want to have a question mark at. I think we are fortunate to have a lot of talent at OT this draft. And should be in a position to take advantage of it.

he was a rookie against a Pro Bowler

OFFENSE:

QB - Campbell, Collins, Brennan

RB - Portis*, Betts*, Cartwright*, (RB #4)

FB - Sellers*

TE - Cooley*, Davis, Yoder*

LT - Samuels*, Heyer

LG - Dockery*, Rhinehart

C - Rabach*

RB - Thomas*, (G/C)

RT - (RT), Jansen*

WR - Moss*, Thomas, Randle El, Kelly, Thrash

The players with *'s represent starters/major role players on the team in 2005. 4 years ago. When the offense had it's best statistical year, and the best record. You'll notice it's EVERY starter except for the QB. There is something to be said for stability and consistency, but this is a bit odd.

I would agree that the positions of need on offense are RT and C, and depth for everything. You really can't address the WR position with new players, you HAVE to wait to see what Kelly/Thomas/Davis do in year 2.

So it's Campbell fault that the Skins didn't lead the Skins to the playoffs this past year, and you want to use Brunell's final 5 game stretch as a comparison? Really? Did you even look at Brunell's stats the last 5 games in '05?

Week 13 vs. St. Louis: 14/21 for 156 yds and 1 TD

Week 14 vs. Arizona: 18/28 for 122 yds and 3 INT's

Week 15 vs. Dallas: 12/20 for 163 yds and 4 TD's

Week 16 vs. NYG: 7/11 for 112 yds and 2 TD's, 1 INT

Week 17 vs. Philly: 9/25 for 141 yds and 1 TD, 1 INT

Not to mention Portis happened to run for 573 yards and 7 TD's during those last 5 games and the o-line allowed 3 sacks to both Brunell and Ramsey during those last 5 games.

Campbell's last 5 games this past season:

Week 13 vs. NYG: 23/28 for 232 yds and 1 INT

Week 14 vs. Balt: 21/37 for 218 yds and 1 TD, 2 INT's

Week 15 vs. Cincy: 17/28 for 167 yds and 1 TD

Week 16 vs. Philly: 18/33 for 144 yds

Week 17 vs. San Fran: 18/30 for 156 yds and 1 TD

However, during this 5 game span Portis only ran for 281 yards and 2 TD's; also the o-line gave up 10 sacks to Campbell in those 5 games.

Yes the offense was great in '05, but that was not because of the QB, that was because of Portis and the play of the o-line; however, that was 3 years ago. 3 years ago, Jansen could be considered a solid, reliable RT, now 3 years later he wouldn't be on the Skins if his cap hit wasn't astronomical. Also, Portis has had a few injuries since '05 and he doesn't have the breakaway speed he used to possess back when he first joined the Skins.

Yes, Campbell has to improve this year or he'll hit the road to find a new home. However, to say that Campbell is the main reason to say why the Skins offense is struggling compared to the '05 season is a complete joke.

If you look at the '05 season stats for Brunell overall: 3,050 passing yards, 23 TD's, 10 INT's, 57.7 completion %, sacked 27 times, 111 rushing yards, and 6 fumbles.

If you compare that to Campbell's '08 season: 3,245 passing yards, 13 TD's, 6 INT's, 62.3 completion %, sacked 38 times, 258 rushing yards, 1 TD, and 1 fumble.

Campbell's TD to turnover rate was 2:1, while Brunell's was 1.4:1. I would say Campbell is not the only reason the offense is struggling like you suggested. If the FO can get the o-line some help, and if Thomas or Kelly can become that outside #2 WR that this offense needs, then I think this offense will have a chance to be better than the '05 offense with Campbell under center.

I'm not sure why people think OLB is good when twice the team has wanted to convert DEs to play the Sam position.

I can't wait til 2 weeks from now when there will be a whole new class of topics we're talking about - the draft, the UDFAs, minicamps, who's likely to be cut, who's a steal, etc. THose topics are gonna be so interesting.

im more concerned about our LDE and LB situation. heyer can make do as the weak link on our oline at RT, hes done ok in spot duty, and a platoon of him and jansen would be ok. if we draft a RT, good deal, thatll be fine. but then what do we do with our LDE situation? i guess they figure daniels/wynn on run downs, wilson on passing downs?

LB is scary too, i guess blades could get his shot, although his coverage really scares me, he doesnt have top end speed for a LB. his run tackling is fine though.

i dont think we fill all these holes in the draft, one of these 3 is gonna have a weak link. id rather us just go with a RT in the draft unless the best LB or DE is there and have fallen way far. we draft a LB/RT/DE, ill be perfectly fine with any of those 3. although its vinny, so DE is out the window lol.