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ThomasRoane

By ThomasRoane
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Redwards

Redwards

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I actually don't mind Del Rio calling Jamin out.  His issue according to some beat guys from what they heard is play recognition.  And I gather some of that can be rectified via film study.  So I don't mind Jamin getting a kick in the pants.  

 

 

 

 

Yeah this guy has said now multiple times there is tension and they don't see eye to eye on the defense.

I gotta disagree with this.

 

RR and JDR over-drafted Jamin by at least two rounds.  The kid absolutely knows what he looked like last season, which wasn't good.  His coaches have bent over backwards since Day 1 to get across to the media how mature Jamin is and how serious he takes his craft.  So, as long as that wasn't BS, we should be able to count on the fact that Jamin is studying his butt off and doing everything he can to get better.  Now all of sudden after the first game of the season in a sub-par showing (a lot of which is on JDR for terrible match-up issues) JDR feels he needs to call out Davis?

 

That doesn't add up at all.  Those things don't go together.  Were the coaches just trying to cover their butts (knowing Davis had maturity issues and isn't studying as hard as he should, etc.?) and making Davis out to be better to the public because they realized they over-drafted him...or is this guy studying / taking his craft seriously and just struggling to get it all together on the field; is it not translating? (Again, everyone kept saying all offseason how he looks like a different player at his new position.)

 

If Jamin is everything his coaches profess him to be off the field, then that type of player never needs a kick in the butt or to be called out in public - he's mature and self-motivated by that rationale.   It's one of the other.  Admittedly, I don't know which.  None of us do.

 

Personally, I don't believe Davis is going to even be a good, consistent player in the league (never did), much less a guy that was taken mid first round.  But what JDR did wasn't right, IMO.  No even a little bit.  

 

 

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Thinking Skins

Thinking Skins

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I actually don't mind Del Rio calling Jamin out.  His issue according to some beat guys from what they heard is play recognition.  And I gather some of that can be rectified via film study.  So I don't mind Jamin getting a kick in the pants.  

 

 

 

 

Yeah this guy has said now multiple times there is tension and they don't see eye to eye on the defense.

What I saw is just him being hesitant. He'd start one way then go another way then back to the original way. That's something that he needs to get better at but at the same time he needs to just be told to attack. 

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Redwards

Redwards

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, skinsfan93 said:


Sorry but boo hoo. I’m sure Jamin is crying into the millions of dollars he has. 

I'm no Jamin apologist.  I didn't like the pick. Still don't.

 

But if a coach is doing his/her job correctly behind the scenes, then calling out a player in front of the media is wholly unnecessary and nothing but bush league.  And it makes it doubly hard to earn the respect of your player, which you cannot underestimate.  But JDR is barely a respectable DC these days, so maybe he feels he needs to employ more desperate measures.  

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skinsfan93

skinsfan93

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Redwards said:

I'm no Jamin apologist.  I didn't like the pick. Still don't.

 

But if a coach is doing his/her job correctly behind the scenes, then calling out a player in front of the media is wholly unnecessary and nothing but bush league.  And it makes it doubly hard to earn the respect of your player, which you cannot underestimate.  But JDR is barely a respectable DC these days, so maybe he feels he needs to employ more desperate measures.  


I agree. The coaches have all tried to get this guy going and he hasn’t responded. I don’t believe a coach should call out players all the time but I do think it’s about time to do it now with Jamin. We desperately need him to play well if we have any shot this year. I think Jack knows it Ron knows it and the other players know it too. 
 

Coaches nowadays having to deal with prima Donna athletes is difficult but going a bit old school may be what is needed. Cuddling and building up his confidence up to this point hasn’t worked. 

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Redwards

Redwards

Posted
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15 minutes ago, skinsfan93 said:


I agree. The coaches have all tried to get this guy going and he hasn’t responded. I don’t believe a coach should call out players all the time but I do think it’s about time to do it now with Jamin. We desperately need him to play well if we have any shot this year. I think Jack knows it Ron knows it and the other players know it too. 
 

Coaches nowadays having to deal with prima Donna athletes is difficult but going a bit old school may be what is needed. Cuddling and building up his confidence up to this point hasn’t worked. 

Oh, hey, I certainly agree with most of what you're saying.  Especially prima Donna athletes.  But - and maybe this is just the former coach in me - I personally never, ever subscribed with coaches calling out a player in front of media.  

 

I think it wreaks of two possible things, and maybe both:

 

1. desperation as a coach, that you are failing to reach the player  

2. laziness as a coach; it's easier to try and motivate through subtle (and sometimes not-so-subtle) humiliation, degradation and fear.  That takes no talent as a coach; anyone can do it.  

 

It's one of the reasons I have zero respect for the Bill Parcels / Buddy Ryans / Harbaughs of the world who use / used those kinds of tactics on a routine basis.  You never saw Gibbs or Dick Vermile (sp?) / Andy Reid / Walsh types employing those tactics.  They didn't have to.  And remember, just because you don't call a player out publicly does not mean you aren't raking them over the coals and holding them highly accountable.  It's just not happening on public display.  And a player will respect and / or respond to you better in that situation because you're giving that player respect while still demanding the world from them.

 

Now, with Davis, as I posted earlier, the coaches have been telling us since he was first drafted that he's a highly motivated, hard worker who is mature beyond his years.  So, IF that is true, a player that is those things by nature does not need to be called out publicly to get the best out of them.  No one can light a fire more intense under that kind of player than the player themself.  

 

But JDR is an absolute ass of a person, IMO, and a has-been DC that can feel the foundation under his feet shifting somewhat.  I think he's growing more and more desperate as the spotlight burns brighter on his side of the ball, which is clearly now behind the offense.  And if the scuttlebutt is true about Rivera and him having tension (which seems very true considering Rivera taking mild shots in public at the defensive schemes) then, yeah, I can see desperation starting to creep in.  

 

But it's just been one game.  Let's see where things stand by mid-season.  Maybe the D turns around and Jamin does blossom.  Certainly not out of the realm of possibility.  He seems like a good dude who cares.  I wish him the best even if I'm skeptical on how much he can help the team.  

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Redwards said:

I gotta disagree with this.

 

RR and JDR over-drafted Jamin by at least two rounds.  The kid absolutely knows what he looked like last season, which wasn't good.  His coaches have bent over backwards since Day 1 to get across to the media how mature Jamin is and how serious he takes his craft.  So, as long as that wasn't BS, we should be able to count on the fact that Jamin is studying his butt off and doing everything he can to get better.  Now all of sudden after the first game of the season in a sub-par showing (a lot of which is on JDR for terrible match-up issues) JDR feels he needs to call out Davis?

 

That doesn't add up at all.  Those things don't go together.  Were the coaches just trying to cover their butts (knowing Davis had maturity issues and isn't studying as hard as he should, etc.?) and making Davis out to be better to the public because they realized they over-drafted him...or is this guy studying / taking his craft seriously and just struggling to get it all together on the field; is it not translating? (Again, everyone kept saying all offseason how he looks like a different player at his new position.)

 

If Jamin is everything his coaches profess him to be off the field, then that type of player never needs a kick in the butt or to be called out in public - he's mature and self-motivated by that rationale.   It's one of the other.  Admittedly, I don't know which.  None of us do.

 

Personally, I don't believe Davis is going to even be a good, consistent player in the league (never did), much less a guy that was taken mid first round.  But what JDR did wasn't right, IMO.  No even a little bit.  

 

 

 

I don't think the point is maturity or even lack of studying.  But for a dude with only one year college experience, he might need either an extra heavier dose of studying or to trust his instincts more and not over think.  I've talked about Jamin's background quite a lot, military family, good dude, etc. 

 

Having said that, I don't live and die with one game.  I'd let the movie play out.  Plenty Lbs take time to develop.

 

As for the Del-Rio-Rivera alleged tension and Jamin was the dude that Del Rio really pushed in that draft.  That was discussed today also on 980. 

 

 

10 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

It's really funny to me at how much people have called out Jamin Davis on this board but when the coach does it, it's an issue.  LOL

 

Yeah.  And I've defended Jamin plenty.  Still I don't mind Del Rio putting him on the spot and I am not much of a Del Rio guy of late. 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted
51 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

What I saw is just him being hesitant. He'd start one way then go another way then back to the original way. That's something that he needs to get better at but at the same time he needs to just be told to attack. 

 

He was like that in college too, that was his weakness.  He needs to likely trust his instincts and fly. 

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skinsfan93

skinsfan93

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Redwards said:

Oh, hey, I certainly agree with most of what you're saying.  Especially prima Donna athletes.  But - and maybe this is just the former coach in me - I personally never, ever subscribed with coaches calling out a player in front of media.  

 

I think it wreaks of two possible things, and maybe both:

 

1. desperation as a coach, that you are failing to reach the player  

2. laziness as a coach; it's easier to try and motivate through subtle (and sometimes not-so-subtle) humiliation, degradation and fear.  That takes no talent as a coach; anyone can do it.  

 

It's one of the reasons I have zero respect for the Bill Parcels / Buddy Ryans / Harbaughs of the world who use / used those kinds of tactics on a routine basis.  You never saw Gibbs or Dick Vermile (sp?) / Andy Reid / Walsh types employing those tactics.  They didn't have to.  And remember, just because you don't call a player out publicly does not mean you aren't raking them over the coals and holding them highly accountable.  It's just not happening on public display.  And a player will respect and / or respond to you better in that situation because you're giving that player respect while still demanding the world from them.

 

Now, with Davis, as I posted earlier, the coaches have been telling us since he was first drafted that he's a highly motivated, hard worker who is mature beyond his years.  So, IF that is true, a player that is those things by nature does not need to be called out publicly to get the best out of them.  No one can light a fire more intense under that kind of player than the player themself.  

 

But JDR is an absolute ass of a person, IMO, and a has-been DC that can feel the foundation under his feet shifting somewhat.  I think he's growing more and more desperate as the spotlight burns brighter on his side of the ball, which is clearly now behind the offense.  And if the scuttlebutt is true about Rivera and him having tension (which seems very true considering Rivera taking mild shots in public at the defensive schemes) then, yeah, I can see desperation starting to creep in.  

 

But it's just been one game.  Let's see where things stand by mid-season.  Maybe the D turns around and Jamin does blossom.  Certainly not out of the realm of possibility.  He seems like a good dude who cares.  I wish him the best even if I'm skeptical on how much he can help the team.  


 

VERY WELL SAID! I agree the days of the Parcells calling Keyshawn a girl or berating a player on national tv should be long gone. It’s not professional. 
 

If you watch the presser, JDR didn’t beat him up. He wasn’t ranting and raving about how awful Jamin is. He simply said he played okay and they expected more. 
 

The one thing I would disagree with you is that I actually like JDR  and think he’s been one of our better defensive coordinators. I much rather have him than Joe Barry. I don’t think he feels any more pressure than anyone else. He’s been a player and coach for a long time. He knows how it goes. 
 

Finally yes only one game but pretty soon you look up and the season is over and Jamin is still awful. I worry about that. 

Edited by skinsfan93
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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

Pretty sure the entire offense will be with us next year. I'm going to assume we sign a new DC and go offseason heavy on defense.

 

It's great to hear that there is tension between Ron and Jack.

 

Yeah I've soured on Del Rio.  The kicker for me was Jay on a podcast talking about how Del Rio's defenses were among the easiest for him to pick apart -- nothing complex, he doesn't try to fool you, etc. 

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HigSkin

HigSkin

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

He was like that in college too, that was his weakness.  He needs to likely trust his instincts and fly. 

 

BMitch and Finlay are discussing this exact point on the radio.  He was put in to games because of injuries at Kentucky.  People kept pointing to his coverage on Kyle Pitts but Pitts actually torched him at least according to BMitch.  I suppose you could look at it this way - not all guys are going to turn out like Jahan Dotson.  LOL

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

Just blitz him

 

That was part of my mantra on him before that draft.  I thought he was an underrated pass rusher in college albiet he didnt rush much.  I think he looked good rushing the passer on Sunday.  His college coach said they almost made him an edge rusher.

 

They likely got to play him the way Dallas plays Parsons.  He's not as good as Parsons as a rusher but IMO he's potentially a good one. 

3 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

 

BMitch and Finlay are discussing this exact point on the radio.  He was put in to games because of injuries at Kentucky.  People kept pointing to his coverage on Kyle Pitts but Pitts actually torched him at least according to BMitch.  I suppose you could look at it this way - not all guys are going to turn out like Jahan Dotson.  LOL

 

 I dont think he was bad in coverage in college but IMO his play recognition was slow.  

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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Thinking Skins

Thinking Skins

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Posted

My whole thing about this defense and really the team is the versatility. We have a lot of speed. Speed kills. We need to utilize it. He has the skills to cover but make him comfortable more and just let him rush more. 

 

And not just on pass rushes, but blitz him to go after Swift. Let him just run even if it's the wrong way. Just run. 

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Thinking Skins said:

My whole thing about this defense and really the team is the versatility. We have a lot of speed. Speed kills. We need to utilize it. He has the skills to cover but make him comfortable more and just let him rush more. 

 

And not just on pass rushes, but blitz him to go after Swift. Let him just run even if it's the wrong way. Just run. 

 

am sure you recall he had a sack but it was taken away by a Fuller penalty, and almost got to the qb two other times

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RandyHolt

RandyHolt

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Redwards said:

I'm no Jamin apologist.  I didn't like the pick. Still don't.

 

But if a coach is doing his/her job correctly behind the scenes, then calling out a player in front of the media is wholly unnecessary and nothing but bush league.  And it makes it doubly hard to earn the respect of your player, which you cannot underestimate.  But JDR is barely a respectable DC these days, so maybe he feels he needs to employ more desperate measures.  

 

I agree his comments reek of desperation. And with JDRs comments in the past think guys on D will respect him even less calling out Jamin an obvious late bloomer that needs time.  I think calling him out (after a win no less) is frustration from HIS OWN FAILURES in wanting him drafted and failing to develop him yet is too arrogant to admit it. Coaches have egos and you rarely hear them say yeah I ****ed up I was an idiot to open up in man or let our DL get abused for the first 10 games last year and never adjusted.

 

It doesn't surprise me to hear some say there is tension before RR & JDR. One comes off as respected the other is no where close to that.

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Daniel.redskins

Daniel.redskins

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Posted

A lot of people are overreacting. It's 2022, offenses will score points. Trevor Lawrence had a good game. Yes he made some bad misses but he did a great job reading the defense and shifting receivers around.  He's one of the better qbs we will face this year.  I liked the Jamin pick because this team badly needed a linebacker with physical abilities.  Remember the Will Compton and Mason Foster days?  We are a much better defense now.  

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Warhead36

Warhead36

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, Daniel.redskins said:

A lot of people are overreacting. It's 2022, offenses will score points. Trevor Lawrence had a good game. Yes he made some bad misses but he did a great job reading the defense and shifting receivers around.  He's one of the better qbs we will face this year.  I liked the Jamin pick because this team badly needed a linebacker with physical abilities.  Remember the Will Compton and Mason Foster days?  We are a much better defense now.  

lolol Trevor Lawrence is really bad right now. He might end up being good but right now he's a bottom 5 starting QB in the league.

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