2022 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[sebestian]

After hearing Bucky Brooks and DJ talk about Hamilton, that sealed it for me.  Hamilton at 11, and you do not think twice.  That's it.

[Warhead36]

38 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I am on board with this thought.   I do think Hamilton or Lloyd for different reasons would take this defense up a peg.   And I do prefer a WR at 11.  But if it ends up Hamilton i'll be plenty jazzed. 

At the very beginning of all this I wanted Lloyd. I still love him as a player, just don't love the positional value. Then again, a Safety isn't that much better in that regards. But something about Hamilton in this defense just screams special to me. I'm getting Troy Polamalu vibes.

6 minutes ago, sebestian said:

After hearing Bucky Brooks and DJ talk about Hamilton, that sealed it for me.  Hamilton at 11, and you do not think twice.  That's it.

Yeah he's been my no brainer pick from the start. I only wavered a bit after we got Wentz because I really wanna load him up with weapons, but man this D would be awesome and fun to watch with Hamilton and Curl at Safety, a developed Davis, the DL at full strength etc.

[redskinsrmylyfe]

Dream scenario in my opinion

[mhd24]

Why won't Atlanta take Hamilton?  They need help EVERYWHERE.  If they aren't going QB, why not take Hamilton at 8 and go with QB/skill/DL with their multiple 2nd rounders and early 3rd?

[Warhead36]

12 minutes ago, mhd24 said:

Why won't Atlanta take Hamilton?  They need help EVERYWHERE.  If they aren't going QB, why not take Hamilton at 8 and go with QB/skill/DL with their multiple 2nd rounders and early 3rd?

They're the Wild Card of the top 10. They could literally draft any position and it would make sense(except TE I guess but there are none worth it that high this year anyway). I think who they draft will be based on how teams 1-7 pick. So like if Thibodeaux somehow drops they'd snatch him up. Or Neal. I have them going Wilson personally.

[Zim489]

20 hours ago, mhd24 said:

 

 

Why would they take Gardner at 5 when they know Carolina won't take him at 6 (considering Carolina took Horn last year and traded a relatively high pick for Henderson)?  Everyone knows they need OL (and so does Carolina).  So, taking the OL of your choice at 5 makes much more sense.  If they take Gardner, it will be at 7.

Maybe they want to trade down from 7 knowing that will likely be a good spot to take a QB if Carolina doesnt take one?

[KDawg]

Hamilton is an absolute stud and I’m not sure why anyone would think otherwise. It becomes more of a BPA with weighted formula math problem to determine his value. Which all of us can say who our preference is but ultimately the team will choose based on their rankings.

[Zim489]

3 hours ago, Going Commando said:

Hamilton is a transcendent player and the concerns about his speed are crazy.  His speed is breathtaking.

Watch him in pure coverage especially in man. You can easily see the concerns. If hes able to sit and read whats going on in front of him hes pretty good but if hes got to flip his hips and run hes in a world of trouble.

[sebestian]

2 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

Watch him in pure coverage especially in man. You can easily see the concerns. If hes able to sit and read whats going on in front of him hes pretty good but if hes got to flip his hips and run hes in a world of trouble.

 

Fair point.  Do you think he can improve on that with coaching?  Serious question.

[Zim489]

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

But I do think his charm in the NFL will be mostly underneath -- 1st-2nd level.

And this is why I am not high on him. Curl can already do these things. The buffalo nickel was just to not have a 12 million buck hole burning a hole in our pocket with Landon. It was alright in strict run sets where Landon can come down and just make plays but was heavily sheltered in obvious pass sets. Maybe the liked it because it was better than having 3 dreadful LBs on the field. Im personally a numbers and analytics driven guy and the numbers over the last 20 some years shows Run Defense has absolutely no correlation to Playoff success. It matters Zero. And really if you want to improve your run defense the best way to do that is to score more points on your own. The more points your offense scores the less teams instinctively run against you because of the feeling they have to keep pace with you.

 

Just get LB that can cover and this need for a buffalo nickel goes away. If you want more coverage ability in pass sets just put another CB out. And if youre concerned for the Run game against your nickel again your fix is a LB that can cover and you can play more base. The more you can be in base with better LBs the better off youre going to be. 

 

Its not a hard concept but feels like were trying to file down a Circle Peg to fit inside the square hole when theres squares available there in the second round with no issues at all in Troy Anderson, Chad Muma, and Quay Walker. Why over complicate it? I just want us to take some players that we can throw out there and not worry about how were going to scheme them to work. Fitting 3 safeties out there is difficult and your still stuck with 2 LBs out there in Jamin and Cole who cant cover. It just doesnt make sense 

Edited April 23, 2022 by Zim489

[KDawg]

7 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

Watch him in pure coverage especially in man. You can easily see the concerns. If hes able to sit and read whats going on in front of him hes pretty good but if hes got to flip his hips and run hes in a world of trouble.

This is an accurate assessment, too. I don’t think it’s a deal breaker for him, though. But as much as I think he’s excel in the hybrid role is really want him to be our free. Let Curl play the Buffalo Nickel. But then we have a SS issue unless Forrest can do it. 
 

we’ll see. Landon Collins putting ego aside and coming back would solve a lot of issues and we could still get a hybrid later in the draft. But I’m not sure if he can or will put his ego aside.

[Zim489]

7 minutes ago, KDawg said:

This is an accurate assessment, too. I don’t think it’s a deal breaker for him, though. But as much as I think he’s excel in the hybrid role is really want him to be our free. Let Curl play the Buffalo Nickel. But then we have a SS issue unless Forrest can do it. 
 

we’ll see. Landon Collins putting ego aside and coming back would solve a lot of issues and we could still get a hybrid later in the draft. But I’m not sure if he can or will put his ego aside.

Problem is free tends to be the deeper man and has to flip his hips and run to help in coverage down the sidelines far more often. Unless hes playing 30 yards off as a True Centerfielder then youre kinda wasting his ability to play well by the LOS. 

 

It all comes down to Value. The way he's good just isnt as valuable as it once was. If were looking for Frees theres plenty of decent options in the middle of this draft like Nick Cross Marquese Bell JT Woods and Kerby Joesph

 

As for Landon. I see no use in him. He cant cover. If youre in the back 7 and cant cover you have minimal value in todays NFL

Edited April 23, 2022 by Zim489

[Redskins 2021]

Hamilton is the way to go if there. He will fit what we need.

Edited April 23, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[KDawg]

I will say the scenario id love in the draft is:

 

Round 1: London/Wilson/Olave (if we can get them in a very small trade back which I have my doubts on)

Round 2: Walker or Hall

Round 3: Brian Asamoah for OLB if we play true 4-3 and hybrid in the 4-2 alignment

 

Obviously that would require a trade back but if we can’t only drop 2-3 spots Im out on the trade back. 
 

I have softened my stance on Walker/Hall. I like both just about equally for us at this point. Hall reminds me a little bit of Clinton Portis. Not completely. But I watch him and get Portis in my head.

 

Walker is Barry Sanders (not from a dominant perspective. I would never say that Walker IS Barry) but from his vision and athleticism he reminds me of Barry’s style. Again, though, I want to make it clear: I don’t think Walker is Sanders or Hall is Portis. They are just who I think of when I watch them. 
 

I want one of them. Badly.

3 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

Problem is free tends to be the deeper man and has to flip his hips and run to help in coverage down the sidelines far more often. Unless hes playing 30 yards off as a True Centerfielder then youre kinda wasting his ability to play well by the LOS. 

 

It all comes down to Value. The way he's good just isnt as valuable as it once was. If were looking for Frees theres plenty of decent options in the middle of this draft like Nick Cross Marquese Bell JT Woods and Kerby Joesph

 

As for Landon. I see no use in him. He cant cover. If youre in the back 7 and cant cover you have minimal value in todays NFL

Problem is man coverage on a slot requires a faster hip turn and trail than playing free. I think the issue is opposite this post. I’d prefer him in a deep zone versus running with a slot down the field. A tight end? Fully comfortable.

 

So maybe the solution is that he is the SS, McCain (ugh) stays Free and Curl plays that hybrid spot in the case we get Hamilton. Can put Ham in man on TEs and virtually erase them and let Curl, a former corner, play the slot.

 

Now that I’m thinking about that I like it a lot.

[shemp nixon]

4 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

@Skinsinparadiseis there one of those for Wilson?

  I saw a draft video with Wilson in it... He really, really sucks at golf. If you ever see him at the driving range or on the course, heads up for flying clubs.

[Going Commando]

22 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

Watch him in pure coverage especially in man. You can easily see the concerns. If hes able to sit and read whats going on in front of him hes pretty good but if hes got to flip his hips and run hes in a world of trouble.

 

I don't agree at all.  His coverage versatility is elite and he is absolutely capable of playing man on backs and tight ends.  If you're lining him up to play straight man on outside receivers and jitterbug slot receivers, then that would just be a stupid way to play a safety, not a real limitation for a player of his position.  He is a true safety and can play any role or alignment of the position, including centerfielding.  His instincts and play speed are elite and he makes more plays demonstrating crazy range than any safety who has come out in years.

[50yrSKINSfan]

1 hour ago, mhd24 said:

Why won't Atlanta take Hamilton?  They need help EVERYWHERE.  If they aren't going QB, why not take Hamilton at 8 and go with QB/skill/DL with their multiple 2nd rounders and early 3rd?

My worries too.

[Ball Security]

1 hour ago, mhd24 said:

Why won't Atlanta take Hamilton?  They need help EVERYWHERE.  If they aren't going QB, why not take Hamilton at 8 and go with QB/skill/DL with their multiple 2nd rounders and early 3rd?

I’d take Williams if I was Atlanta.  They are going to be bad.  Let him heal, then go get a QB in 23 with Pitts and Williams.

[Zim489]

Hamilton would be an elite SS. Problem is we have a good SS in Curl. The buffalo nickel isnt a standard position across the league for a reason. If youre worried about coverage you just put another CB on the field. If youre worried about the pass game with your LBs on the field just get better LBs. Feels so simple to me. 

[50yrSKINSfan]

2 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

 

I don't agree at all.  His coverage versatility is elite and he is absolutely capable of playing man on backs and tight ends.  If you're lining him up to play straight man on outside receivers and jitterbug slot receivers, then that would just be a stupid way to play a safety, not a real limitation for a player of his position.  He is a true safety and can play any role or alignment of the position, including centerfielding.  His instincts and play speed are elite and he makes more plays demonstrating crazy range than any safety who has come out in years.

This is right on. I want him and I do not want to hear any BS from Ron if we have the chance to take him and we pass to take another outside LB that Ron thinks will be the next Ray Lewis. No more reaches with your first pick Ron. PS any safety that can be compared to S Taylor cannot be passed on.

[KDawg]

Some guys who I think are underrated here (not saying they aren't liked, but guys *I* think are better than the general convo here):

 

Christian Harris, LB, Alabama. Watching him he is a tackling machine that can cover, move laterally, play down hill and tackles pretty well. I have him at LB2 and I genuinely think he has "star" written across his forehead.

 

Brian Asamoah, LB, Oklahoma. More of an OLB than an ILB, but with some development could probably play the inside role. Would initially fit our hybrid role really well. Aggressive, attacking, athletic, big (clean) hitter. His biggest issue is navigating traffic when playing inside that I can see. That can be developed and he can fit as a traditional OLB, a 4-2 ILB or a flex guy down the line. 

 

Kerby Joseph, S, Illinois. Has range, moves well, athletic and has high end ball skills. Biggest concern with him is he is fairly raw as a safety and needs to get more reps so he gets familiar with situational football. But I think he is a day 1 starter for a lot of teams and right now he is my S3.

 

Kyler Gordon, CB, Washington. Everyone talks about Stingley and Gardner. Most understand how good McCreary is, although he may be underrated as well. And people know Gordon's teammate McDuffie. But Kyler Gordon is just as good as McDuffie all things considered and I think he has better ball skills. Others corners I like that aren't talked about: Tariq Woolen (UTSA), to some extent Kaiir Elam (Florida), though there's some buzz around Elam. 

 

Brian Robinson, Jr, RB, Alabama. I'm on record saying I want Walker or Hall pretty badly. But man... I think Robinson is the guy in this class that can make a ton of noise. Can pass protect, is a literal hammer and has seen high end competition at Alabama. While Spiller is more of an all-around threat and more of a general fit for teams I think Brian Robinson could wind up being the steal of the draft at RB. 

 

Brandon Smith, LB, Penn State. I just like the way he plays. Not much else to say. 

 

George Karlaftis, Edge, Purdue. He gets some love, but I genuinely think his consistency and ability is similar to another Boilermaker who I think all of us may be familiar with. Ryan Kerrigan was 6-4, 265 coming out and was known as a motor guy. Karlaftis 6-4, 275, motor guy. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if they have similar careers. The Greek Football Freak is going to make some team really happy. It's a semi lazy comparison and it's not dead nuts... But it's an easy one to put together.

 

Ty Fryfogle, WR, Indiana. There's a few receivers that can be put here but most of them are talked about more often. I'm the only one that I've seen talking about Fryfogle. I think he is a solid possession guy. Not going to wow you or separate deep for too many big plays but he has a very good catch radius and can act as a large target who times his jumps well and runs good routes. He breaks tackles, too, so he is a YAC threat. But he's not a burner so he's not likely to leave defenders in their wake. 

[Zim489]

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Started the draft season saying I am not even going to watch Kyle Hamilton because the buzz is he's slam dunk top 5.

 

Then I decided what the heck?  After watching, I said the generational stuff is over the top from these mock drafters IMHO but I still liked him a lot and explained why.  However, I was accused of being too negative on Hamilton.

 

Now with less than a week i've turned into one of the top 5 people here hyped on Hamilton and I am constantly defending him.  He's still not my top want at 11.  But I'd be jazzed to get him.

 

Seems like this full circle journey for me on Hamilton makes it feel even more like he will be our pick. 

 

As for all the Buffalo nickel stuff and hybrid safety.  My best argument is all these guys aren't cut the same way.  The hybrid safety position isn't all the same.   More on point, Hamilton isn't a pure Buffalo nickel.  He also likely becomes our best safety IMO.

 

For example, I love Cine.  But I admit he's a bit undersized as far as chasing big WRs and TEs down the field from the slot.   I think he makes up for it in other ways as for how he sets the edge.  And I think he can cover some of the speedier slot WRs that lets say a Landon Collins could not.  

 

Daxton Hill is basically a FS-slot CB.  You can interchange him that way.  He's not bad at setting the edge but I prefer Cine on that front.  But I'd take Hill over Cine as a pure cover guy. 

 

As far as Hamilton goes, he has the size and skills to match up with big slot WRs and TEs.  Landon Collins for example had the size too but he wasn't so much hot at that IMO -- but he was really good at setting the edge and playing zone underneath in coverage.  Hamilton takes that to another level, he can run hip to hip with name that big WR and TE. 

 

He is a terror on the first and 2nd level.  He's IMO good in coverage. 

 

I think people are running a bit wild with his bad deep coverage grade from PFF.  My bad since I posted it.  And PFF by the way sees him as one of the top 5 players in this draft.  Also he's slammed that he's not a pure cover 1, cover 3 single high safety like Earl Thomas.  And because of that he's labeled by some here as a one dimensional safety.  But IMO that narrative is off.

 

Hamilton IMO is the perfect safety for today's NFL.  Coverage now is about split level.  And Hamilton excels at that.   Teams like to play the quick game and get the ball out quick to Rbs in the flat -- Hamilton sets the edge really well.  Offenses likes to use big receivers or TEs as mismatches in the slot versus small corners and or take advange of the defensive formation by running on teams playing nickel.  Hamilton can deal with the run.  Hamilton can also go hip to hip with big receivers and TE out of the slot. 

 

I wish I liked him more as a pass rusher.  But he makes up for it and more some as a ball hawk 8 with career picks.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 23, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

9 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

Hamilton would be an elite SS. Problem is we have a good SS in Curl. The buffalo nickel isnt a standard position across the league for a reason. If youre worried about coverage you just put another CB on the field. If youre worried about the pass game with your LBs on the field just get better LBs. Feels so simple to me. 

 

Curl is very good in coverage. He can also play the run from that hybrid spot.  It seems even simpler to me to let him play there.

[Ball Security]

15 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Some guys who I think are underrated here (not saying they aren't liked, but guys *I* think are better than the general convo here):

 

Christian Harris, LB, Alabama. Watching him he is a tackling machine that can cover, move laterally, play down hill and tackles pretty well. I have him at LB2 and I genuinely think he has "star" written across his forehead.

 

Brian Asamoah, LB, Oklahoma. More of an OLB than an ILB, but with some development could probably play the inside role. Would initially fit our hybrid role really well. Aggressive, attacking, athletic, big (clean) hitter. His biggest issue is navigating traffic when playing inside that I can see. That can be developed and he can fit as a traditional OLB, a 4-2 ILB or a flex guy down the line. 

 

Kerby Joseph, S, Illinois. Has range, moves well, athletic and has high end ball skills. Biggest concern with him is he is fairly raw as a safety and needs to get more reps so he gets familiar with situational football. But I think he is a day 1 starter for a lot of teams and right now he is my S3.

 

Kyler Gordon, CB, Washington. Everyone talks about Stingley and Gardner. Most understand how good McCreary is, although he may be underrated as well. And people know Gordon's teammate McDuffie. But Kyler Gordon is just as good as McDuffie all things considered and I think he has better ball skills. Others corners I like that aren't talked about: Tariq Woolen (UTSA), to some extent Kaiir Elam (Florida), though there's some buzz around Elam. 

 

Brian Robinson, Jr, RB, Alabama. I'm on record saying I want Walker or Hall pretty badly. But man... I think Robinson is the guy in this class that can make a ton of noise. Can pass protect, is a literal hammer and has seen high end competition at Alabama. While Spiller is more of an all-around threat and more of a general fit for teams I think Brian Robinson could wind up being the steal of the draft at RB. 

 

Brandon Smith, LB, Penn State. I just like the way he plays. Not much else to say. 

 

George Karlaftis, Edge, Purdue. He gets some love, but I genuinely think his consistency and ability is similar to another Boilermaker who I think all of us may be familiar with. Ryan Kerrigan was 6-4, 265 coming out and was known as a motor guy. Karlaftis 6-4, 275, motor guy. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if they have similar careers. The Greek Football Freak is going to make some team really happy. It's a semi lazy comparison and it's not dead nuts... But it's an easy one to put together.

 

Ty Fryfogle, WR, Indiana. There's a few receivers that can be put here but most of them are talked about more often. I'm the only one that I've seen talking about Fryfogle. I think he is a solid possession guy. Not going to wow you or separate deep for too many big plays but he has a very good catch radius and can act as a large target who times his jumps well and runs good routes. He breaks tackles, too, so he is a YAC threat. But he's not a burner so he's not likely to leave defenders in their wake. 

I like Harris as a second round target if we go WR in the first.  How much separation do you have between Harris and Dean?