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The Art Briles Philosophy- Why he's THE man for the Redskins. THE BRILES FILES!


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.....

And, thank you for that.  What movie is that?  It was hilarious.

 

You've never seen that movie? Honestly?

 

Man, go rent it. Like NOW! Fantastic road trip/ life trip flick which is one of the best character study looks theres been. Film that broke through a living LEG-END. 

 

Rent it man. Seriously. You won't be disappointed, 

 

Hail. 

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Mom knows big brother knows best. 

 

It's a first born thang. But we'll always love you too kiddo'.  :P

 

I am all for innovation, and my reasons for not wanting Briles are purely perception related.

 

But in digging, what has worried me about Briles is his lack of making a team work.  He can make the offense work, but he can't make all three facets work in conjunction and this hasn't been something that is exclusive to his time at Baylor.

 

If it's something that is as simple as hiring a good coordinator then why hasn't he found one yet?

 

I've also noticed that when his offense isn't working, the points against are lower.  But when his offense is humming, the points against are more.  Further supporting my opinion.

 

I wouldn't mind him or his OC coming here as OC, though.  That would be absolutely fine with me.

And welcome back :)

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Topic specific, despite Briles not likely to get hired elsewhere, what we'll see in all reality are his schemes and specific formation / plays nicked by teams around the league (NFL) just for a new added wrinkle. Happens every year, especially after a season where Baylor was dropping nearly 70 points per game on average. 

 

Someone might try to get Philip Montgomery though and that's symbolically a way for Briles to "leave" and have his system shine elsewhere. Thinking of Star Trek II: "He's not really dead ... As long as we remember him."

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Ah, welcome back from sabbatical GHH. How's Monte Carlo or was it Crete this time?

 

Being as Roman's yacht is moored up for the winter on the wondrous Fontvieille waterfront in all the Principality's splendour, it would be remiss to NOT pay it a visit with you in mind Monsieur Monk. 

 

Merci bien Monsieur. 

 

Saluer.

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Mom knows big brother knows best. 

 

It's a first born thang. But we'll always love you too kiddo'.  :P

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

 

Wow, you take a weeks vacation and all sorts off crazy steam in on the back of a bad bowl outing. 

 

Pointless responding to those that STILL don't get what Briles does, despite countless posts trying to help (gimmicky air raid? Really?); but a few things have amused me catching up. (Not worth going over the state of Baylor 6 years ago to now again. That's lost on anyone that doesn't want to listen.,).

 

Age. Why is this specific to Briles? MANY have openly wanted (and still do) any of Bisaccia (53 years of age)/ Caldwell (58)/ Grimm (54)/ Danny Smith (60)/ Lovie Smith (55)/ Zimmer (57) etc etc, yet Art is deemed WAY too old at 58. 

 

Penalties: This year's shocking 120 aside, Baylor have come in 41st, 29th, 3rd, 12th, and 32nd respectively. Two poor years, 4 pretty much in line with the middle of the pack. Aside from the fact they run way more plays than most and by natural association increase the chance of being penalised more, don't be fooled by this years Nation high penalty count. 

 

If RGIII wasn't here Briles wouldn't be mentioned: Can't speak for others, but I guess anyone saying that has neither read the OP and subsequent great additions from the likes of KD, dg, Ll and others; nor has watched much of what has been evolving down in Waco. Robert being Baylor's only Heisman winner under Briles and Montgomerys tutelage is just the cherry on the top. But most if not all (excluding the lazy mediots) are blown away by his character, leadership, and innovative, game changing concepts that have adapted to what ever circumstance he's found himself in. The RGIII connection as the only reason is just weak sauce. 

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

As for the thread needing to be shut down, or Briles ruling himself out, that is neither for me to say in the first instance and one I must of missed in the second. 

 

Unless something has changed as I type this, we haven't presently got a HC in place. So EVERYBODY mentioned is still as viable candidate as the next. I may of read him wrong, but just because a guy puts out a statement as regards his current position saying he's not 'actively seeking' other opportunity's, isn't to say he wouldn't be interested in them if they came along. 

 

So if the recent silliness has stopped, let's get back to the good discussion and see what the future brings us. 

 

Hail. 

 

Gimmicky air raid really? You may have misunderstood my posts as I'm well aware the Air Raid, and make no mistake that's what it is, is a rather straight forward, simplistic offense. While we're on the subject of ridiculousness in this thread I'd like to bring up the fact that a rigid spread offense ran by a great college coach is being talked about like the second coming of Bill Walsh introducing the west coast offense in the 80's. 

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I am all for innovation, and my reasons for not wanting Briles are purely perception related.

But in digging, what has worried me about Briles is his lack of making a team work. He can make the offense work, but he can't make all three facets work in conjunction and this hasn't been something that is exclusive to his time at Baylor.

If it's something that is as simple as hiring a good coordinator then why hasn't he found one yet?

I've also noticed that when his offense isn't working, the points against are lower. But when his offense is humming, the points against are more. Further supporting my opinion.

I wouldn't mind him or his OC coming here as OC, though. That would be absolutely fine with me.

And welcome back :)

I would venture a guess that it's easier to coach up offensive players than defensive players. Of you lack athletes with ability to read & react, & tackle consistently. ..then you will struggle on defense regardless of your scheme.

He has gotten his defenses to improve however. ..to the tune of nearly competing for a BCS title this year.

I would say the largest overlooked quality is that he gets the sloppy 4ths or 5ths in his own Conference when it comes to recruiting. ..let alone nationally. No matter what he does there I don't expect this to change. Just look at his national recruiting rankings during his tenure & tell me again why his teams have any business competing in his Conference. ..let alone nationally.

I would say he's done superfluously at Baylor with much less tools to work with. Get him to Texas, or USC, or LSU & I would be willing to wager he wins a title.

Get him in the NFL with a broader stroke & I like his chances to work with a more qualified DC to help win games.

Furthermore. ..I have a question. We have to presume 1 of 2 things is true when it comes to Baylor. 1) he is able to consistently find gems where people see coal in his recruiting searches, or 2) he consistently takes mediocre players & coaches them up into guys like...Josh Gordon, Kendall Wright, RGIII, or Terrance Williams.

So which is it? Cuz it's certainly not that he's a recruiting maven.

Honestly either of the 2 means that he possesses a significantly overlooked coaching quality. Wouldn't you want a coach that could make great OJ from not so great Oranges? I mean...either way he shows that he can make due with lesser tools....which is something we sorely need.

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I would venture a guess that it's easier to coach up offensive players than defensive players. Of you lack athletes with ability to read & react, & tackle consistently. ..then you will struggle on defense regardless of your scheme.

He has gotten his defenses to improve however. ..to the tune of nearly competing for a BCS title this year.

I would say the largest overlooked quality is that he gets the sloppy 4ths or 5ths in his own Conference when it comes to recruiting. ..let alone nationally. No matter what he does there I don't expect this to change. Just look at his national recruiting rankings during his tenure & tell me again why his teams have any business competing in his Conference. ..let alone nationally.

I would say he's done superfluously at Baylor with much less tools to work with. Get him to Texas, or USC, or LSU & I would be willing to wager he wins a title.

Get him in the NFL with a broader stroke & I like his chances to work with a more qualified DC to help win games.

Furthermore. ..I have a question. We have to presume 1 of 2 things is true when it comes to Baylor. 1) he is able to consistently find gems where people see coal in his recruiting searches, or 2) he consistently takes mediocre players & coaches them up into guys like...Josh Gordon, Kendall Wright, RGIII, or Terrance Williams.

So which is it? Cuz it's certainly not that he's a recruiting maven.

Honestly either of the 2 means that he possesses a significantly overlooked coaching quality. Wouldn't you want a coach that could make great OJ from not so great Oranges? I mean...either way he shows that he can make due with lesser tools....which is something we sorely need.

 

He's done a phenominal job at Baylor and it's shown in the last couple of years.

 

But this isn't exclusive to Baylor.  I looked at his Houston numbers too and saw the same thing.

 

So that's two schools that he's been to in two difference Conferences and neither one played defense.

 

And I wouldn't just hire him for his offensive prowess as a head coach if he's never shown any commitment to defense.  You win games with defense in the NFL, not just lifting up one side of the barbell.  That's a hell of a gamble to be taken with someone with over 10 years of coaching and no good defense or defensive recruits.

 

And while EVERYONE in here wants to talk about how this is a passing league... let's look at the Team Defense rankings from this year and let me know what you see:

 

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=OPP&season=2013&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1

 

1. Seattle Seahawks

2. Carolina Panthers

3. Cincinatti Bengals

4. New Orleans Saints

5. San Francisco 49ers

 

 

Hmm... I see four teams playing this weekend and one that lost last weekend.

 

It's also the reason the NFC is going to win the Super Bowl again this year. 

 

Balance.  Mr. Miyagi was on to something.

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He's done a phenominal job at Baylor and it's shown in the last couple of years.

 

But this isn't exclusive to Baylor.  I looked at his Houston numbers too and saw the same thing.

 

So that's two schools that he's been to in two difference Conferences and neither one played defense.

 

And I wouldn't just hire him for his offensive prowess as a head coach if he's never shown any commitment to defense.  You win games with defense in the NFL, not just lifting up one side of the barbell.  That's a hell of a gamble to be taken with someone with over 10 years of coaching and no good defense or defensive recruits.

 

And while EVERYONE in here wants to talk about how this is a passing league... let's look at the Team Defense rankings from this year and let me know what you see:

 

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=OPP&season=2013&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1

 

1. Seattle Seahawks

2. Carolina Panthers

3. Cincinatti Bengals

4. New Orleans Saints

5. San Francisco 49ers

 

 

Hmm... I see four teams playing this weekend and one that lost last weekend.

 

It's also the reason the NFC is going to win the Super Bowl again this year. 

 

Balance.  Mr. Miyagi was on to something.

 

Not that I'm a Briles supporter but anyone involved in college football recruiting at any level will tell you when the big fat boys arrive at the recruiting table they stuff their face and pockets with front seven players. Wide receivers and running backs however are positions that are easier to come by in terms of recruiting above your program's current status.

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Not that I'm a Briles supporter but anyone involved in college football recruiting at any level will tell you when the big fat boys arrive at the recruiting table they stuff their face and pockets with front seven players. Wide receivers and running backs however are positions that are easier to come by in terms of recruiting above your program's current status.

 

Phil Taylor is the only name that comes to me of recent big named defensive players from Baylor. 

 

And I actually wanted to draft him and Brooks Ried instead of Kerrigan and Jarvis Jenkins, fwiw.

 

But I'm not sure what you are trying to say other than there are more RBs and WRs than there are linemen.

 

I'm talking about scheme adjustment and program approach.  Like we were talking about in the Gibbs hiring thread earlier today... Gibbs came to Washington and ran Air Corryel stuff from San Diego.  The defense wasn't built to support that kind of offensive attack.  He started giving the ball to Riggins more, the defense got more time to rest/coaches made adjustments and that led to a pretty successful career for Joe Gibbs here in Washington.

 

All I am saying is that Briles has had two separate programs and over a decade between them to figure out a happy medium and he's shown that he has no interest in defense at all.  I'm also saying that the NFL is not a place for on the job training to figure those inherent issues with your overall team approach... they should be figured out long before then.

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He's done a phenominal job at Baylor and it's shown in the last couple of years.

But this isn't exclusive to Baylor. I looked at his Houston numbers too and saw the same thing.

So that's two schools that he's been to in two difference Conferences and neither one played defense.

And I wouldn't just hire him for his offensive prowess as a head coach if he's never shown any commitment to defense. You win games with defense in the NFL, not just lifting up one side of the barbell. That's a hell of a gamble to be taken with someone with over 10 years of coaching and no good defense or defensive recruits.

And while EVERYONE in here wants to talk about how this is a passing league... let's look at the Team Defense rankings from this year and let me know what you see:

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=OPP&season=2013&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1

1. Seattle Seahawks

2. Carolina Panthers

3. Cincinatti Bengals

4. New Orleans Saints

5. San Francisco 49ers

Hmm... I see four teams playing this weekend and one that lost last weekend.

It's also the reason the NFC is going to win the Super Bowl again this year.

Balance. Mr. Miyagi was on to something.

I just don't see how this applies to the proposition I supplied.

Would you agree that the Houston defense & Baylor defense were EXPONENTIALLY improved from prior to his tenure, to during it? Yes or no?

Under the context of the tools which he had at his disposal. ...and btw...I still hear NOBODY supplying a counter or even a reasoning they choose to dismiss this part of the argument. I have no other recourse than to assume that you have none & simply are trying to pick knits at what little arguments you can attempt to make.

Not a single counter supposition has been made as to how Briles is capable of squeezing such perennial quality out of a recruiting wasteland. NOT ONE! Look...If you take a crummy program & a perennial bad defense & take it from out of the 100's in defensive rank, & pull it into the 40's & 50's...playing at that pace with that offensive system, & NO RECRUITING SURPLUS WITH WHICH TO SIMPLY PLUCK THE GREATEST HS ATHLETES. .......ESPECIALLY WHEN THE FRONT 7 POT IS LOW ON THE FEEDING TUBE & ALL THE GREATER SCHOOLS GET THEIR PICK OF THE LITTER.

Address this please??? I implore someone...anyone...tell me something that can contribute to his success with these constraints other than magic fairy dust or hopes & dreams???

I mean...If it was once, with one set of recruits I wouldn't be so adamant...but he does this CONSTANTLY & EVERYWHERE HE GOES!

This should be a paramount ability for our next HC. I could almost care less what system he brings because a ) everyone has to learn it from scratch, b ) most systems will work as long as you have the athletes to compete within it & can labour all parties involved to be on the same page & execute properly.

Briles is a good candidate to me because he has proven to me that he can do these things because we have ABSOLUTELY NO REASON to believe rationally that he is simply bringing cannons to a gun fight.

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I just don't see how this applies to the proposition I supplied.

Would you agree that the Houston defense & Baylor defense were EXPONENTIALLY improved from prior to his tenure, to during it? Yes or no?

Under the context of the tools which he had at his disposal. ...and btw...I still hear NOBODY supplying a counter or even a reasoning they choose to dismiss this part of the argument. I have no other recourse than to assume that you have none & simply are trying to pick knits at what little arguments you can attempt to make.

Not a single counter supposition has been made as to how Briles is capable of squeezing such perennial quality out of a recruiting wasteland. NOT ONE! Look...If you take a crummy program & a perennial bad defense & take it from out of the 100's in defensive rank, & pull it into the 40's & 50's...playing at that pace with that offensive system, & NO RECRUITING SURPLUS WITH WHICH TO SIMPLY PLUCK THE GREATEST HS ATHLETES. .......ESPECIALLY WHEN THE FRONT 7 POT IS LOW ON THE FEEDING TUBE & ALL THE GREATER SCHOOLS GET THEIR PICK OF THE LITTER.

Address this please??? I implore someone...anyone...tell me something that can contribute to his success with these constraints other than magic fairy dust or hopes & dreams???

I mean...If it was once, with one set of recruits I wouldn't be so adamant...but he does this CONSTANTLY & EVERYWHERE HE GOES!

This should be a paramount ability for our next HC. I could almost care less what system he brings because a ) everyone has to learn it from scratch, b ) most systems will work as long as you have the athletes to compete within it & can labour all parties involved to be on the same page & execute properly.

Briles is a good candidate to me because he has proven to me that he can do these things because we have ABSOLUTELY NO REASON to believe rationally that he is simply bringing cannons to a gun fight.

 

Read my last post and you'll see where my problem is.

 

It's not with the atheletes or recruiting.  It's with scheme and commitment/resources that are dedicated to the offense vs the rest of the team.

 

There's more than one way to skin a cat and he hasn't shown that he can do that yet.

 

Chip Kelly made it to a National Championship and Chris Pedersen has been undefeated several times.

 

Art Briles is far down on the list of "did more with less" coaches... and as I have illustrated, he didn't even do it all with less.  Just 33%.

 

And I'm not sure the defenses have improved.  He wins games by outscoring you.  They arent winning games 17-13 down there in Waco.

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Phil Taylor is the only name that comes to me of recent big named defensive players from Baylor. 

 

And I actually wanted to draft him and Brooks Ried instead of Kerrigan and Jarvis Jenkins, fwiw.

 

But I'm not sure what you are trying to say other than there are more RBs and WRs than there are linemen.

 

I'm talking about scheme adjustment and program approach.  Like we were talking about in the Gibbs hiring thread earlier today... Gibbs came to Washington and ran Air Corryel stuff from San Diego.  The defense wasn't built to support that kind of offensive attack.  He started giving the ball to Riggins more, the defense got more time to rest/coaches made adjustments and that led to a pretty successful career for Joe Gibbs here in Washington.

 

All I am saying is that Briles has had two separate programs and over a decade between them to figure out a happy medium and he's shown that he has no interest in defense at all.  I'm also saying that the NFL is not a place for on the job training to figure those inherent issues with your overall team approach... they should be figured out long before then.

 

I'm saying defensive linemen and linebackers of quality are harder to find the lower you are on the recruiting totem pole, and before Briles Baylor were pretty low on it relative to other BCS conference teams. Considering Briles' background I think it's safe to assume that once they started moving up the pecking order the skill positions were the first to benefit. A few years ago they wouldn't have come close to kids like Shawne Oakman and Javonte Magee so I think judgment on his ability to put together a defense should be reserved.

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I'm saying defensive linemen and linebackers of quality are harder to find the lower you are on the recruiting totem pole, and before Briles Baylor were pretty low on it relative to other BCS conference teams. Considering Briles' background I think it's safe to assume that once they started moving up the pecking order the skill positions were the first to benefit. A few years ago they wouldn't have come close to kids like Shawne Oakman and Javonte Magee so I think judgment on his ability to put together a defense should be reserved.

 

So he's forced to outscore teams with his offense instead of adjusting his scheme and approach to let his defense have more success?

 

I got it... having better X's than the opponents O's helps, but guys like Chris Pedersen do okay.  It's hard to find a more balanced team than Chris Pedersen's Boise State clubs.  Same with David Shaw.  Outside of Andrew Luck they haven't had many super star recruits.  Stanford go after solid players and their coaches constantly outwork and outcoach the opponents who have more talent.

 

Why Briles?  Why not a whole team approach?

 

I mean we're looking for the best guys right?

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.....

Why Briles?  Why not a whole team approach?

 

I mean we're looking for the best guys right?

 

So why not Briles, Montgomery and their staff taking care of offense. 

 

Phillips/ Spanos or the like with a total defensive remit. 

 

With Bruce and his staff acquiring players. 

 

That's the whole team approach right?

 

Forget any preconceptions on his defensive attitude to date. Why wouldn't that be the perfect pro-scenario?

 

Hail. 

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So why not Briles, Montgomery and their staff taking care of offense. 

 

Phillips/ Spanos or the like with a total defensive remit. 

 

With Bruce and his staff acquiring players. 

 

That's the whole team approach right?

 

Forget any preconceptions on his defensive attitude to date. Why wouldn't that be the perfect pro-scenario?

 

Hail. 

 

I'm okay with one of them (Briles or Monty) being OC (if not for perception).

 

But if either were HC, they've shown in their approach to the game that they don't care about defense.  They know one thing... score score score.

 

That's the beef.

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So he's forced to outscore teams with his offense instead of adjusting his scheme and approach to let his defense have more success?

 

I got it... having better X's than the opponents O's helps, but guys like Chris Pedersen do okay.  It's hard to find a more balanced team than Chris Pedersen's Boise State clubs.  Same with David Shaw.  Outside of Andrew Luck they haven't had many super star recruits.  Stanford go after solid players and their coaches constantly outwork and outcoach the opponents who have more talent.

 

Why Briles?  Why not a whole team approach?

 

I mean we're looking for the best guys right?

 

The staff Harbaugh put together at Stanford is streaming into the NFL for good reason. Boise State don't go up against the quality of athlete Baylor does but I am a big fan of that program. They also tap into to the California JuCo pool which contains a lot more talent than most people realize.

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I'm okay with one of them (Briles or Monty) being OC (if not for perception).

 

But if either were HC, they've shown in their approach to the game that they don't care about defense.  They know one thing... score score score.

 

That's the beef.

 

Yeah, I get that (although I don't wholly agree at the collegiate level given individual schools circumstance and how you prioritise your funds to adapt to the field your given); but forget what's gone before. Look upon it as a complete clean slate allround here, with, in that hypothetical, the best guys brought in for one side of the ball (and yes, by association the QB. Even if the move wouldn't be solely for him but the benefit of the group as a whole); and a proven 34 guy given a complete remit for that side of the ball. 

 

This isn't a Shanahan meddling scenario. I'm just presuming as any of us are not knowing the man but by all accounts Art let's his coaches coach and sticks to his side of things that he does best. 

 

So why would you still have reservations if it was set up and readily agreed upon like that? Chances are he'd tweak his O to the pro game regardless. He has right through his career to the circumstance hes found himself in and constraints there in. So that by association should help out a D he wouldn't be interfering in. 

 

Just spitballing here lil' bro' as this Coaching search is driving everyone nuts, lol. but that seems the perfect harmony of the two to me.

 

Throw in an experienced ST coach, and we're onto something. 

 

Hail. 

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The staff Harbaugh put together at Stanford is streaming into the NFL for good reason. Boise State don't go up against the quality of athlete Baylor does but I am a big fan of that program. They also tap into to the California JuCo pool which contains a lot more talent than most people realize.

 

That is the point.  If Boise State can do it, Baylor can do it.  We're talking Big 12 vs Mountain West (most of the time) right?

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Yeah, I get that (although I don't wholly agree at the collegiate level given individual schools circumstance and how you prioritise your funds to adapt to the field your given); but forget what's gone before. Look upon it as a complete clean slate allround here, with, in that hypothetical, the best guys brought in for one side of the ball (and yes, by association the QB. Even if the move wouldn't be solely for him but the benefit of the group as a whole); and a proven 34 guy given a complete remit for that side of the ball. 

 

This isn't a Shanahan meddling scenario. I'm just presuming as any of us are not knowing the man but by all accounts Art let's his coaches coach and sticks to his side of things that he does best. 

 

So why would you still have reservations if it was set up and readily agreed upon like that? Chances are he'd tweak his O to the pro game regardless. He has right through his career to the circumstance hes found himself in and constraints there in. So that by association should help out a D he wouldn't be interfering in. 

 

Just spitballing here lil' bro' as this Coaching search is driving everyone nuts, lol. but that seems the perfect harmony of the two to me.

 

Throw in an experienced ST coach, and we're onto something. 

 

Hail. 

 

Yeah I get it from that aspect and it makes sense unless you look at his approach.

 

As I've said, teams with weak secondaries run the ball to shorten the game (so that their secondaries aren't exposed). 

Weak run teams score a lot of points and build up their pass rush and secondary so that they can play with a lead.

Etc.

 

Briles has had over a decade to have a defensive identity and they don't.  He just outscores people to win and if his offense scores they win and if they don't they lose.  It's just difficult to comprehend the appeal of a guy like that coming into the NFL.  And it's not as simple as "get him Wade Phillips" because Phillips is going to tell him "if you want this defense to be successful I'm going to need you to not do X, Y, and Z on offense".  Briles is going to look at Phillips like he has a.... well, a patrusion on his forehead :lol:

because he's probably honestly never had to think of that.  And he really hasn't had to when his offense has been good.  He'll be a BCS at large in college and that's great for Baylor.  But that's not great for the NFL and that's certainly not the place for him to learn how to have a complete football team.  He needs to have demonstrated that at some point.

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