Lavarleap56 Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Chris is not the only player in the league who enjoys an occasional smoke with an adult beverage.I didnt think so. And even if they had, its not the same as hearing it from a DC in the league. Whats to stop them from spouting off nonsense to make a case for their arguments, much like LavarLeap has in this very instance. Chris, when healthy, has been an extremely productive tight end in the league. Teams obviously arent going to game plan for someone if they are out due to injury, thats a no brainer. But to say DC's around the league dont respect a healthy CC is a joke. I understand LL argument concerning his age and injury history, and the likely-hood of him beating out younger competition coming off said injury. Id even agree that CC has a tough road ahead. I just cant stand when people make **** up to make their case appear stronger. spouting nonsense? Lol please bro. I appoligize if sometimes I get confused with info and if it has been put out yet on the show,twitter,es,or the site ect. Hard to keep everything organized sometimes since im talking to people all the time. Nonsense is not being able to see that cooley while a very popular player but a declining one since 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JesseNeckred Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 I think if Cooley came back and played 2nd TE, and perhaps a little bit of alternating with Freddy D, could be very deadly, but really I'd like to see more of Fred Davis as the starter edit: maybe have Paul in for 3 TE sets, and have him alternate with Paulsen for blocking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryGreenMonk Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 I think we need to be brutually honest with ourselves here... we lost the Arbitration.. Cooley is slated for 6 million this year as a BACK UP tight end coming off injury. That 6 million could reduce our penalty carried to next year from 18 to 12 with just 1 player. (EDIT turns out cutting Cooley after June 1 will get us back 3.9 million not 6. but still, that's a lot for a back up tight end) I love Cooley, but unless he's willing to take a 80% pay cut, I think he's gotta go. And that's not Cooleys fault or the Redskins fault... it's John Mara's fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 I highlighted a part of Califan007's post that may answer part of my reasoning for not wanting them to cut bait yet.And FTR authentic, I'm not wanting to hold on to Cooley for sentimental reasons as I want the best 53 on the field. I just feel Cooley right now is one of the best 53 out there for us. I never blinked an eye when Portis was cut. I won't blink and eye when Moss or Cooley is cut, but the timing has to be right. I don't think it's time to cut either one. I'd look at this year and if it looks like the WRs and TEs we have can carry the load, by all means move on. I know there is this argument out there for trading players so you can "get something" for them. But in reality, what you have already received from these two players is loyalty (both could have gone elsewhere) and 100% hard play on the football field for multiple seasons. That trumps a stupid late round draft pick in my view any day. We have already seen that Allen doesn't need to trade players to accumulate picks. Its certainly a rational thought.. And i'm not saying they should cut Cooley regardless. The decision should definitely be met with conditions.. and that condition being Paul.. If Paul is picking up on the blocking scheme and is able to threaten the defense in the pass game, then IMO its a wrap.. If Paul struggles as the summer progresses and the playbook gets more complicated, then I can make a case for keeping Cooley (if healthy).. I would also like to see if they are willing to bring in another TE for competition.. Right now i can't even assume that Paulsen's spot is guarenteed. However, the decision to move Paul to TE is very telling IMO. I don't think it gets any more blatant than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavarleap56 Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Here is one of the quotes on Chris Cooley in which i was refrencing or "making it up as some would say. NFL talent Evaluator .." For what he is as a player ,he's gotten far more pub than he deserves.When healthy he's a good player not great. You don't have to gameplan against him but he is a good player." more quotes different sources similar sounding but thats 1 so don't shoot the messanger lol ---------- Post added May-23rd-2012 at 02:42 PM ---------- I think if Cooley came back and played 2nd TE, and perhaps a little bit of alternating with Freddy D, could be very deadly, but really I'd like to see more of Fred Davis as the starteredit: maybe have Paul in for 3 TE sets, and have him alternate with Paulsen for blocking I would be game for that if cooley could turn back the clock but thats impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted May 23, 2012 Author Share Posted May 23, 2012 The defensive cordinator don't gameplan for Cooley was said but maybe not aired. I will be bringing the guest on again to verify so carry on. Who was the guest, actually?... ---------- Post added May-23rd-2012 at 07:59 AM ---------- However, the decision to move Paul to TE is very telling IMO. I don't think it gets any more blatant than that. I think the decision to move Paul to TE is multi-faceted... - They need a replacement for Cooley, regardless of when he gets replaced - They have a crapload of WRs, and apparently like Paul...having him learn the TE position allows for room to keep him on the roster - Davis might relapse and fail another drug test...Cooley, if kept, might end up injured again...honestly, we need an insurance plan for both players - Having Paul play TE may get him on the field more than if keeping him as a WR only...and perhaps Shanahan wants to try and find a way to get him more playing time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 I think the decision to move Paul to TE is multi-faceted... - They need a replacement for Cooley, regardless of when he gets replaced - They have a crapload of WRs, and apparently like Paul...having him learn the TE position allows for room to keep him on the roster - Davis might relapse and fail another drug test...Cooley, if kept, might end up injured again...honestly, we need an insurance plan for both players - Having Paul play TE may get him on the field more than if keeping him as a WR only...and perhaps Shanahan wants to try and find a way to get him more playing time All of the above.. along with the fact that Shanny loves himself a TE that can stretch the field which was never Cooley's strong-suit. And its obvious they need skill players who are fast and dynamic to keep up with RG3.. Sort of like how the Eagle's offense is designed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted May 23, 2012 Author Share Posted May 23, 2012 Here is one of the quotes on Chris Cooley in which i was refrencing or "making it up as some would say. NFL talent Evaluator .." For what he is as a player ,he's gotten far more pub than he deserves.When healthy he's a good player not great. You don't have to gameplan against him but he is a good player." more quotes different sources similar sounding but thats 1 so don't shoot the messanger lol. Here's that quote within its context: Cooley can still help, though one NFL evaluator said of him, “For what he is as a player, he’s gotten far more pub than he deserves. When healthy he’s a good player, not great. You don’t have to game plan against him, but he is a good player.” The Redskins still need good players, though $6.2 million for a No. 2 tight end is steep. Not really much different than what LL just said, but wanted to be more specific. At any rate, it wasn't a Defensive coordinator saying that, nonetheless saying "we don't worry about Cooley and haven't gameplanned for him in years". Plus, "one talent evaluator said" isn't much to hang an opinion on..."another talent evaluator" may have said just the opposite. The "talent evaluator" Bill Parcells told Cooley he'd never amount to anything in the NFL other than a "spot player." Another "Talent evaluator", Joe Gibbs, felt Cooley was worth trading up for. A number of "talent evaluators" have said RG3 won't succeed in the NFL. So, yeah, having one quote from an anonymous "talent evaulator" doesn't really mean much, whether the quote is positive or negative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRobi21 Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Califan007 - Defender of Cooley. TIL DEATH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted May 23, 2012 Author Share Posted May 23, 2012 All of the above.. along with the fact that Shanny loves himself a TE that can stretch the field which was never Cooley's strong-suit. And its obvious they need skill players who are fast and dynamic to keep up with RG3.. Sort of like how the Eagle's offense is designed. Very true :yes:...Cooley does have value (again, when healthy), but stretching the field isn't really part of that value lol... Right now, Cooley may be able to prove he CAN help stretch the field for all we know, though...straight-line speed alone isn't enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 I think we need to be brutually honest with ourselves here... we lost the Arbitration.. Cooley is slated for 6 million this year as a BACK UP tight end coming off injury.That 6 million could reduce our penalty carried to next year from 18 to 12 with just 1 player. (EDIT turns out cutting Cooley after June 1 will get us back 3.9 million not 6. but still, that's a lot for a back up tight end) I love Cooley, but unless he's willing to take a 80% pay cut, I think he's gotta go. And that's not Cooleys fault or the Redskins fault... it's John Mara's fault. thank you sir... this is EXACTLY my point in a nutshell... -the only thing i would add is that I believe his spot was in jeopardy before the Arbitration dismissal.. IMO, its even moreso now.. we just need to move on.. teams around the league do it ALL the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted May 23, 2012 Author Share Posted May 23, 2012 Califan007 - Defender of Cooley. TIL DEATH! Nah, just hate piss-poor arguments as to why Cooley should go lol ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONAWARPATH Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Nah, just hate piss-poor arguments as to why Cooley should go lol ... It seems like ANY argument that Cooley should go is a piss-poor argument as far as you're concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted May 23, 2012 Author Share Posted May 23, 2012 It seems like ANY argument that Cooley should go is a piss-poor argument as far as you're concerned. Nope, just the following: - Cooley was never any good at YAC - Cooley was never consistent at getting YAC - Last year showed that Cooley has lost a step - Last year Cooley couldn't stay healthy - Defensive coordinators have come out and said they don't even worry about 47 and haven't gameplanned against him for years. - Paul moving to TE makes Cooley expendable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Tater Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 I think we need to be brutually honest with ourselves here... we lost the Arbitration.. Cooley is slated for 6 million this year as a BACK UP tight end coming off injury.That 6 million could reduce our penalty carried to next year from 18 to 12 with just 1 player. (EDIT turns out cutting Cooley after June 1 will get us back 3.9 million not 6. but still, that's a lot for a back up tight end) I love Cooley, but unless he's willing to take a 80% pay cut, I think he's gotta go. And that's not Cooleys fault or the Redskins fault... it's John Mara's fault. Of course cutting Cooley after June 1 saves his salary this year but that's at a cap cost next year of about 2M. BTW, maximum pay cut Cooley can take this year? Truthfully its 0% (he will actually get a pay increase since pay is cash NOT cap), we can however decrease his cap hit this year at the expense of increasing any potential dead cap due to a Cooley restructure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavarleap56 Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Here's that quote within its context:Not really much different than what LL just said, but wanted to be more specific. At any rate, it wasn't a Defensive coordinator saying that, nonetheless saying "we don't worry about Cooley and haven't gameplanned for him in years". Plus, "one talent evaluator said" isn't much to hang an opinion on..."another talent evaluator" may have said just the opposite. The "talent evaluator" Bill Parcells told Cooley he'd never amount to anything in the NFL other than a "spot player." Another "Talent evaluator", Joe Gibbs, felt Cooley was worth trading up for. A number of "talent evaluators" have said RG3 won't succeed in the NFL. So, yeah, having one quote from an anonymous "talent evaulator" doesn't really mean much, whether the quote is positive or negative. Not sure what your talking about with the context stuff i only have the raw quote. Anyway like i said that was 1 of many different quotes from different sources saying similar things.Yes in 2004 Gibbs thought Cooley was worth trading up for... But 2012 is not 04,05,06,07,08 Really Cali that was a reach lol ---------- Post added May-23rd-2012 at 03:49 PM ---------- Very true :yes:...Cooley does have value (again, when healthy), but stretching the field isn't really part of that value lol...Right now, Cooley may be able to prove he CAN help stretch the field for all we know, though...straight-line speed alone isn't enough. Cooleyis not and has not been a stretch the field TE. You can't all the sudden become something you are unable to do. ---------- Post added May-23rd-2012 at 03:55 PM ---------- It seems like ANY argument that Cooley should go is a piss-poor argument as far as you're concerned. 100% truth.. Respect cali but cooley lovefest is unreal.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted May 23, 2012 Author Share Posted May 23, 2012 Not sure what your talking about with the context stuff i only have the raw quote. Anyway like i said that was 1 of many different quotes from different sources saying similar things.Yes in 2004 Gibbs thought Cooley was worth trading up for... But 2012 is not 04,05,06,07,08 Really Cali that was a reach lol You know what?...You have ZERO reading comprehension skills lol ... I doubt anyone but you thought my point was that, since Parcells was wrong about Cooley in 2004 the anonymous "talent evaluator" in 2012 must be wrong, too. Everyone else got that it was about how a quote from "a talent evaluator" means little, considering how often individual evaluators tend to be wrong...notice how I said that stands true whether the evaluation is "good or bad". Hell, Vinny Cerrato is a "talent evaluator" lol...would you trust his thoughts about--well, anyone:? Cooleyis not and has not been a stretch the field TE. You can't all the sudden become something you are unable to do. I said what I said as a way of saying we don't know WHAT Shanahan is seeing of Cooley right now, outside of his knee so far is holding up well. There was a report about Cooley looking healthy, running well and making sharp cuts, but that's it. You know what's interesting, though...Fred Davis has never caught a TD outside of the red zone. Almost all of his TDs have come within 10 yards of the end zone...hell, almost half have been 1 yard TDs. He's only run two TDs into the end zone, all the rest have been caught while in the end zone (or standing at the one foot line). And both Shanahans felt the Skins inability to score TDs outside the end zone was something that definitely reflected poorly on the offense... 100% truth.. Respect cali but cooley lovefest is unreal.. You have a knack for dismissing anyone's positive views on Cooley as being based on nothing but emotion. Bravo. :applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTC228 Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 I see a lot of comments on here about what Cooley can't do, but 1 thing he did do was make 2 pro-bowls. I think you have to be pretty good to do that. Cooley should be on this team, even if he is not the starter he will get plenty of reps. Given he may not be be as athletic as Davis, but he gets it done, just look at career stats. Cooley is a football player and a productive one at that, may not be flashy but when he is on the field he produces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinz4Life12 Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 pro bowl = popularity contest, nothing more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTC228 Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 pro bowl = popularity contest, nothing more 2007 - 66 rec, 786 yds, 8 TD's 2008 - 83 rec, 849 yds, 1 TD Yea those numbers are not deserving of the pro bowl at all. And in 2005 he led all TE's in the fan voting for the pro bowl, but did not make it because of player and coach voting. So obviously the 2 years he did make it, either the players or coaches felt he deserved the selection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uno Mas Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 pro bowl = popularity contest, nothing more Not when you play for the Washington Redskins in the Snyder era. You have to produce to make it to Hawaii. And Yes LL, It's nonsense to assume that defenses don't gameplan for one of two receiving threats this team has had the past 10 years. Still waiting for quotes from someone, other than some fans speculations... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinz4Life12 Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 explain why it took fletcher forever to go to a pro bowl if its all about how you produce on the field? i'm sick of the pro bowl and hope they get rid of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinz#28Rules Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Is it possible to do a three TE set?? Just wondering...... Niles Paul, Fred Davis, and a healthy Chris Cooley could be almost impossible to defend if they were on the field at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Is it possible to do a three TE set?? Just wondering...... Niles Paul, Fred Davis, and a healthy Chris Cooley could be almost impossible to defend if they were on the field at the same time. Let's see Joe Gibbs started the 2 TE formation and Shanny has in Denver's first game of 2008, for the first few plays, flirted with the three tight end sets. So yes. The 3 TE formation is also known as the "magic three" formation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWFLSkins Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Nah, just hate piss-poor arguments as to why Cooley should go lol ... What is piss-poor about this.... Cooley makes too much as a backup He is often hurt and someone else has to step up He plays behind a rising star He appears to have lost a step, unless otherwise demonstrated and right quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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