longball Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 A healthy Cooley is fundamentally different from Davis but I'm not so sure you can say that one is better than the other. Yea I agree with you here--- Cooley never had stellar athleticism that Davis possess'. However on the flip side Cooley's success was a result of instinct, crisp route running, knowledge of the game, and overall heart & desire. While I love Fred's athleticism I question him in all other categories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinzwiz Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 It's funny how I was talking about trading Cooley this past offseason in a draft thread and everybody was saying how stupid an idea it was. Doesn't seem so stupid now does it! SMH! Too **** late now! SMH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins Wingman Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 on a swing pass where the receiver was heading up field, rex had a solid view of both cooley and the db, he had to know that cooley was set up to get popped, yet he still led him into the play. now, rex should not have to worry about cooley taking a hit, but he should worry about the proximity of a defensive player in relation to his receiver, and not for cooley's sake, but for the play to be successful. yet he still made the throw and for all intents and purposes set him up to get crushed. Cooley was 1 on 1 with a cornerback.. Thats a mismatch in the open field advantage tight end. Asante samuel read the play and rex has no velocity on his throws and the play blew up. It happens. That is the perfect play design for mike sellars who either a. Jumps over samuels or b. Runs through him. Cooley shouldnt have even been playing, he obviously hasnt been 100% I doubt if he was even 80% healthy. Thats why he got hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 I don't get it either. Let's trade all of our players now so we can still get something for them. I say we trade Orakpo now while we can still get a 1st for him. Clearly Will Montgomery, Sav Rocca and Fred Davis are all having great years. Let's hurry up and get something for them so we can have 20 picks in next year's draft. I mean that's how the Patriots do it, why not us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slateman Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 Sad day for me as a Redskins fan. Cooley has been my favorite player for a while. I was at his break out game against the Cowboys in 2005. Twas a good day. But I understand him leaving. He wants to win a Superbowl, and the Redskins are a ways away from that. I hope he goes out, gets a one year deal with another team, wins the big one, then comes back here as the back up TE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champskins Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 I don't get it either. Let's trade all of our players now so we can still get something for them. I say we trade Orakpo now while we can still get a 1st for him. The idea is to know your team and know who you have in place. At the time (when I had said to trade him OR Fred D.) we could have received good compensation while we still had Yoder on the roster as well. TE is not a position that we need 3 of, and last year we had Paulsen. Orakpo is still young and we do not have a solid replacement in place waiting in the wings... but to make it a little more interesting, if we knew that we could outbid the Texans for free agent Mario Williams, then hell yes I retain a 1st (and possibly more) for Orakpo and sign M. Williams and have an even better defense with more picks. ---------- Post added October-27th-2011 at 12:30 PM ---------- Clearly Will Montgomery, Sav Rocca and Fred Davis are all having great years. Let's hurry up and get something for them so we can have 20 picks in next year's draft. I mean that's how the Patriots do it, why not us? The idea is knowing your team and knowing when to part ways. How many games has Fred Davis sat out due to injury? Sav Rocca was a need, we did not have a punter on the roster, and our oline depth is weak. Not only did we have Fred D, but also Paulsen and Sellers (I would have got rid of Sellers too) and Cooley was just a roster spot. ---------- Post added October-27th-2011 at 12:31 PM ---------- Sad day for me as a Redskins fan. Cooley has been my favorite player for a while. I was at his break out game against the Cowboys in 2005. Twas a good day.But I understand him leaving. He wants to win a Superbowl, and the Redskins are a ways away from that. I hope he goes out, gets a one year deal with another team, wins the big one, then comes back here as the back up TE I dont think its necessarily his choice, I think he'd be let go... and sure he can come back as a back up TE... for a one day contract to retire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted October 27, 2011 Author Share Posted October 27, 2011 So champ, you basically don't think we should have depth, just draft picks? I saw nothing wrong with have 2 good TEs. Look at the Patriots. I think Kyle should have found better ways to get both of them involved more. But just because a player gets good at a position where we already have a good player, doesn't mean we should trade them away. This team needs all the depth it can get. Let's not trade it away for a draft pick that may or may not work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 The idea is knowing your team and knowing when to part ways. How many games has Fred Davis sat out due to injury? Sav Rocca was a need, we did not have a punter on the roster, and our oline depth is weak. Not only did we have Fred D, but also Paulsen and Sellers (I would have got rid of Sellers too) and Cooley was just a roster spot It was sarcasm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Fried Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 I don't buy it. There's no reason he can't get back up to form. We should do a similar experiment that we did with Kelly last offseason, but we'll hope it works this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twenty-eight Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 granthpaulsen Grant Paulsen Chris Cooley says he'll be back: "I'm part of this team. Our general manager and our head coach believe in me and I believe in myself." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champskins Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 So champ, you basically don't think we should have depth, just draft picks? I saw nothing wrong with have 2 good TEs. Look at the Patriots. I think Kyle should have found better ways to get both of them involved more. But just because a player gets good at a position where we already have a good player, doesn't mean we should trade them away. This team needs all the depth it can get. Let's not trade it away for a draft pick that may or may not work out. We have exactly what we need and we did 2 years ago as well. Fred Davis is the pass catching/blocking TE like Jermichael Finley and Paulsen/Yoder are the bulldozers who block on goalline plays and are consistent endzone threats like Quarless.... Sorry to compare to Packers, just didnt know who else to compare to. I won't look at the Patriots, whose offense is primarily built on Tom Bradys reads to the open receiver, we are not built like that at this time. Im not stating to trade just anyone away by any means, I like Cooley as a person. But there comes a time when there are just greater needs to the team. Just look at our Oline depth, we could have had 2 capable olinemen in our depth chart instead of 4 TE's.... it just seems silly. Now if Cooley wants to come back in to some sort of coaching role, im all for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted October 27, 2011 Author Share Posted October 27, 2011 We have exactly what we need and we did 2 years ago as well. Fred Davis is the pass catching/blocking TE like Jermichael Finley and Paulsen/Yoder are the bulldozers who block on goalline plays and are consistent endzone threats like Quarless.... Sorry to compare to Packers, just didnt know who else to compare to. I won't look at the Patriots, whose offense is primarily built on Tom Bradys reads to the open receiver, we are not built like that at this time. Im not stating to trade just anyone away by any means, I like Cooley as a person. But there comes a time when there are just greater needs to the team. Just look at our Oline depth, we could have had 2 capable olinemen in our depth chart instead of 4 TE's.... it just seems silly. Now if Cooley wants to come back in to some sort of coaching role, im all for it. But who says we would've had more OL if we traded Cooley? I'd rather the sure thing over taking some flyer on a 4th or 5th rounder that might not even make the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champskins Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 It was sarcasm. I understand that... but the same people advocating us to keep everyone until there in wheelchairs is just ridiculous. Vrabel was a home team guy and fans loved him but the Pats knew they had breakout stars in the waiting and took the top offer for him, peace be with you Vrabel... it's just hard for some others to love a guy who has barely touched the field in 2 years and someone younger can come in and take that spot when we were saying he should have been gone 2 years ago for a top offer. Nothing against the guy at all, I love Cooley and what he's done, but smart organizations cut ties when the gigs on the brink of being up ---------- Post added October-27th-2011 at 12:54 PM ---------- But who says we would've had more OL if we traded Cooley? I'd rather the sure thing over taking some flyer on a 4th or 5th rounder that might not even make the team. Thats just it, he wasn't and still isnt a sure thing since what, 2009? OL was an example of a position with little to no depth that should have more focus then 4 TE's is what im getting at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GO HAMSKINS Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 Let's hope Fred Davis finds some consistency and let's hope that consistency is catching the damn ball and fighting for it so it doesn't get picked.At least Cooley(when healthy) could be counted on to move the chains. As it stands right now, we have no credible threat at WR. Fred and some other young 'uns need to step the hell up. ---------- Post added October-26th-2011 at 04:02 PM ---------- I'll take Load of Horse Hockey for $500 Alex. Did you watch the Panthers game? FD has been very consistent.He leads our team in Wr yards and is among the top TE's iin the league him and Witten are tied at the number 2 spot. Yeah,Fd did drop a crucial 3rd down play,but he still had about 80 yards and are only catching td as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted October 27, 2011 Author Share Posted October 27, 2011 Thats just it, he wasn't and still isnt a sure thing since what, 2009? OL was an example of a position with little to no depth that should have more focus then 4 TE's is what im getting at. But having Cooley had nothig to do with having 4 TEs. Sure OL depth has always been an issue, but just because we trade Cooley doesn't mean that pick would've gone to the OL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GO HAMSKINS Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 I understand that... but the same people advocating us to keep everyone until there in wheelchairs is just ridiculous. Vrabel was a home team guy and fans loved him but the Pats knew they had breakout stars in the waiting and took the top offer for him, peace be with you Vrabel... it's just hard for some others to love a guy who has barely touched the field in 2 years and someone younger can come in and take that spot when we were saying he should have been gone 2 years ago for a top offer. Nothing against the guy at all, I love Cooley and what he's done, but smart organizations cut ties when the gigs on the brink of being upWhere was all of this when I said that we should have traded him at the start of the season? I got my ass handed to me on a platter on here for mentioning about trading Cools. Cools has been everything you can expect from a player,but there are two young guys on our team that are better options than Cools at this point in his carreer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champskins Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 But having Cooley had nothig to do with having 4 TEs. Sure OL depth has always been an issue, but just because we trade Cooley doesn't mean that pick would've gone to the OL Thats true, but its the fact that we would have ammunition in the draft, whether its for OL, moving up (we had a shortage of picks for a few years, thanks Vinny and Dan), or a Helu type RB... it serves more purpose for our teams needs. If he's to come back, he's going need to be 100% healthy with an injury clause or he's just hampering the development of younger players. Im thinking a couple of good games by Paulsen, with all of the highlights reels of Freddy D so far will change some minds. ---------- Post added October-27th-2011 at 01:05 PM ---------- Where was all of this when I said that we should have traded him at the start of the season? I got my ass handed to me on a platter on here for mentioning about trading Cools. Cools has been everything you can expect from a player,but there are two young guys on our team that are better options than Cools at this point in his carreer Dont worry, I was right there with ya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilburmarshall Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 Should have traded him when we could have gotten something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsrbeast Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 i think he'll be back just on different circumstances the dude bleeds burgundy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted October 27, 2011 Author Share Posted October 27, 2011 Thats true, but its the fact that we would have ammunition in the draft, whether its for OL, moving up (we had a shortage of picks for a few years, thanks Vinny and Dan), or a Helu type RB... it serves more purpose for our teams needs. If he's to come back, he's going need to be 100% healthy with an injury clause or he's just hampering the development of younger players. Im thinking a couple of good games by Paulsen, with all of the highlights reels of Freddy D so far will change some minds. I understand where you're coming from. But for me, not trading Cooley came down to, do you take the sure thing or the unknown. With a team that doesn't have many playmakers on offense, it seems like it made more sense to keep him than trade him. Sure Davis had some nice stretches of play when Cooley went down, but we still weren't 100% sure what he could do. Cooley was a Pro Bowler and a damn good TE. When all we had on offense was Moss, I feel like keeping Cooley was and still is the right thing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brasi Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 We will keep Chris Cooley. He will restructure. He has a great relationship with the fans and the Redskins management. Bruce Allen knows that is worth something. He may take a less prominent role, but I see a new 5 year deal in place where it is backloaded for "respect" and appearnces ($17 million, but only like $7 million guaranteed) and he plays 2-3 years of that. He wants to stay here and it isn't like we'd NEED to lean on him as a #1 option. We run a 2-TE offense so we need to carry three...he'll just be 2-3 on the chart. No way we dump Cooley. If we do that'll be a sign to start hoping for the end of the Shanny era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champskins Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 I understand where you're coming from. But for me, not trading Cooley came down to, do you take the sure thing or the unknown. With a team that doesn't have many playmakers on offense, it seems like it made more sense to keep him than trade him. Sure Davis had some nice stretches of play when Cooley went down, but we still weren't 100% sure what he could do. Cooley was a Pro Bowler and a damn good TE. When all we had on offense was Moss, I feel like keeping Cooley was and still is the right thing to do. I value your opinion as im sure you value mine... Things on offense certainly need to change though, fast, our fanbase has been hardset on hope and low points for far too long. Here's to April! ---------- Post added October-27th-2011 at 01:16 PM ---------- No way we dump Cooley. If we do that'll be a sign to start hoping for the end of the Shanny era. Weren't people saying that about Portis too? Too each their own... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RVAbrendan Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 I don't buy it at all. Cooley is 30, but still young for the TE position. He's got great hands and is a mismatch for defenses. He will force many to eat crow next year. When healthy, he certainly helps the team more than he hurts them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLongshot Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 But who says we would've had more OL if we traded Cooley? I'd rather the sure thing over taking some flyer on a 4th or 5th rounder that might not even make the team. In general, the players you know about are more valuable to you then what you generally get in trade for them. Fact is, you rarely get return value in trades, so you either wait until someone offers something you can't pass on, or if the player in question doesn't fit in your plans. It is why I was much more in favor of trading guys like Andre Carter and Big Al rather than a guy like Cooley. The former two players really didn't fit into the new scheme, so we should have got what we could for them. Cooley is still a very useful player in Shanahan's offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.A.C.O.L.B. Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 I understand where you're coming from. But for me, not trading Cooley came down to, do you take the sure thing or the unknown. With a team that doesn't have many playmakers on offense, it seems like it made more sense to keep him than trade him. Sure Davis had some nice stretches of play when Cooley went down, but we still weren't 100% sure what he could do. Cooley was a Pro Bowler and a damn good TE. When all we had on offense was Moss, I feel like keeping Cooley was and still is the right thing to do. Agree. I don't think you can blast them or even criticize them for not trading him. He was(is?) still a quality player and Davis wasn't totally proven yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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