Mass. Special election.

[Kilmer17]

They have an easy solution. Just scrap it as a whole and start over with small pieces one at a time and dare the GOP to oppose them. Start with an easy one- No preexisting conditions reform.

It's really not that hard unless their actual goal was what Rush et al says it is- to expand govt for the sake of expanding govt.

[twa]

Congressional democrats are in a lose/lose situation.

That's a direct result of trying to be all things to all people.

Ain't no voting present when you lead and people actually expect ya to do what ya promised.

:saber:

[gunslinger5]

It's really not that hard unless their actual goal was what Rush et al says it is- to expand govt for the sake of expanding govt.

How can it not be if their stated goal is to provide healthcare for everyone and to lower healthcare costs but their bill does neither? But what the bill does do is vastly expand the role of the federal government in our personal lives because they know better.

[Ignatius J.]

They have an easy solution. Just scrap it as a whole and start over with small pieces one at a time and dare the GOP to oppose them. Start with an easy one- No preexisting conditions reform.

It's really not that hard unless their actual goal was what Rush et al says it is- to expand govt for the sake of expanding govt.

I don't understand how that could work kilmer. Why would anyone buy health insurance in that system?

[hkHog]

I think one election for an open seat is hard to read one way or another. Maybe the people of Mass just approved of this specific person more. Why is that so impossible to think? People seem to think it was this huge vote where all the people of Mass were thinking Nationally. Where is the proof of that?

Sorry, its not one election in a vacuum. This is happening after the elections for governor in VA and NJ as well. Also, Brown ran primarily on stopping health care reform and drew lots of national attention. This is hardly "one election for an open seat" this is a tidal change across the country (particularly in blue states).

[twa]

I don't understand how that could work kilmer. Why would anyone buy health insurance in that system?

How about a sliding scale on paying claims?

Preexisting starts at 25% payout on claims and goes up as time goes by?

They already do half of that formula

[Seabee1973]

I think the question is what happens when you hate everyone. Most reasonable people should distrust the Republicans after what they intentionally and maliciously did to the country. Now, if you decide the Dems are just as bad (and they are proving to be) do you go back to the Repubs or give the Dems a little more rope? Or is there a third alternative that people can rally towards.

I still hold to my thesis that people are unhappy and just want to throw the bums out. The bums being whoever is currently in power.

It's like us when we want to change head coaches every year hoping that somehow that will change something and give us an instant championship.

What did the republicans malicously do?

[Seabee1973]

http://hotlineoncall.nationaljournal.com/archives/2010/01/after_obama_ral.php

As audience members streamed out of Pres. Obama's rally on behalf of AG Martha Coakley (D) here tonight, the consensus was that the fault for Coakley's now-floundering MA SEN bid lies with one person -- George W. Bush.

"People are upset because there's so many problems," Rosemary Kverek, 70, a retired Charleston schoolteacher said as tonight's rally wrapped up. "But the problems came from the previous administration. So we're blaming poor Obama, who's working 36 hours a day ... to solve these problems that he inherited."

click above to read more.

I probably should have strted this own thread but this is outright funny

No wonder our school children are lacking

It is Bush Fault Coackley lost now

[btfoom]

Sorry, its not one election in a vacuum. This is happening after the elections for governor in VA and NJ as well. Also, Brown ran primarily on stopping health care reform and drew lots of national attention. This is hardly "one election for an open seat" this is a tidal change across the country (particularly in blue states).

I agree 100% with this assessment. People in this country are angry with some of the junk they see going on with their government and voting out the incumbents is a way to express their anger.

In this country, while many people label themselves as either Dem or Rep, in the end, most are pretty middle of the road folks. Steer the country too far off to one side or the other and they will rise up and vote you out. It's happened before and will happen again.

[88Comrade2000]

The M.A. voter really had nothing to lose. It's was an election to fill out the remaining 3 years of Kennedy's term. So, they can do a protest vote this around and in 2012 if they don't like him; vote in the next liberal dem.

[Burgold]

What did the republicans malicously do?

Increased the deficit.

Gave favored status to Big Oil.

Turned a blind eye to the Housing Crisis hoping it would just go away.

Ignored health care.

Ignored our ports and borders.

Failed to reform medicare or social security.

Allowed and fostered a condition where many of our largest financial institutions failed.

Underfunded and undermanned many Government agencies, then castigated them for failing to do their jobs.

(I don't even need to get into Iraq)

[mardi gras skin]

Increased the deficit.

Gave favored status to Big Oil.

Turned a blind eye to the Housing Crisis hoping it would just go away.

Ignored health care.

Ignored our ports and borders.

Failed to reform medicare or social security.

Allowed and fostered a condition where many of our largest financial institutions failed.

Underfunded and undermanned many Government agencies, then castigated them for failing to do their jobs.

(I don't even need to get into Iraq)

You think the republicans were being deliberately harmful and now you believe the democrats are being deliberately harmful. I thought you liberals were supposed to trust big government. Burg, you're getting old:

“If you're young and conservative you have no heart, if you're old and you're a liberal you have no brain”

[Ax]

Increased the deficit.

Obama, and the la Congra Nostra crime families, Reid, and Pelosi, liked the idea so much, they added even more. With more on the way.

Gave favored status to Big Oil.

The Pelosi and Reid crime families must like the setup, they haven't changed anything, have they?

Turned a blind eye to the Housing Crisis hoping it would just go away.

Apparently, the Pelosi & Reid crime families feel it's not a crisis at all. It's on the back burner, isn't it?

Ignored health care.

Better than ****ing it up even more, like the current crap being pushed by la Congra Nostra.

Ignored our ports and borders.

Too busy keeping out underwear bombers?

Failed to reform medicare or social security.

Wow! Those ****s did what every other group did. Shocking!

Allowed and fostered a condition where many of our largest financial institutions failed.

Led by captians from the Pelosi and Reid crime families, Frank & Dodd.

Underfunded and undermanned many Government agencies, then castigated them for failing to do their jobs.

You're right, they should have just gotten rid of half of them.

(I don't even need to get into Iraq)

I know, but we did.

[Burgold]

In other words, you can't dispute a single one.

Edit: Eh, Mardi Gras I can't hear you. Wait a minute while I... oh my back! Where's that damn walker... Wait a minute while I come closer. Now, what's that about who getting older?

I am disappointed in both parties. They have been mirroring each other big time. The instincts of dealing with healthcare and the environment are great. If the execution was merely clumsy then I would understand. These things are hard, but they've been worse than cluumsy. They've been downright Republican.

[Midnight Judges]

Increased the deficit.

Gave favored status to Big Oil.

Turned a blind eye to the Housing Crisis hoping it would just go away.

Ignored health care.

Ignored our ports and borders.

Failed to reform medicare or social security.

Allowed and fostered a condition where many of our largest financial institutions failed.

Underfunded and undermanned many Government agencies, then castigated them for failing to do their jobs.

(I don't even need to get into Iraq)

I think you are understating pretty much everthing here. For example, Republicans didn't merey "Increase the deficit." They went from a quarter trilliion surplus to a $1.3 trillion deficit and they doubled the national debt. And they created zero net jobs, got thousands of Americans killed unnecessarily, and caused an awful recession in the process.

[RedskinsTime]

In other words, you can't dispute a single one.

Burgold- correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't one of the biggest issues on the Bush agenda (second term) to reform social security through privatization? Didn't the Dems block it from going through?

Ultimately, the blame lies with Bush for not working out a compromise. But, this is like pointing the fingers at Democrats for not socializing healthcare when they've been pushing it for years now.

[TheGoodBits]

Burgold- correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't one of the biggest issues on the Bush agenda (second term) to reform social security through privatization? Didn't the Dems block it from going through?

Ultimately, the blame lies with Bush for not working out a compromise. But, this is like pointing the fingers at Democrats for not socializing healthcare when they've been pushing it for years now.

Sorry but that's not reforming social security, that's getting rid of it.

[cjcdaman]

Increased the deficit.

And the Dems are lowering it?

Gave favored status to unions and anyone who is on their side.

Turned a blind eye to the terrorism in our country and prosecuting terrorists like simple criminals hoping it would just go away.

Are trying to shove healthcare down our throats when the American public is clearly saying they don't want it.

Ignored our ports and borders. Are the Dems doing a better job of this?

Failed to reform medicare or social security. See healthcare above.

[Burgold]

Burgold- correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't one of the biggest issues on the Bush agenda (second term) to reform social security through privatization? Didn't the Dems block it from going through?

Ultimately, the blame lies with Bush for not working out a compromise. But, this is like pointing the fingers at Democrats for not socializing healthcare when they've been pushing it for years now.

Two thoughts on this...

First: Bush had majorities in the House and Senate and for six years he never had to issue a veto. If he wanted it, he got it. The Dems were a bunch of spineless jellyfish who rarely put up a fight, even when they got majority control in Bush's last two years. Still, if Bush really wanted it and thought it was important, within those six years it would have been done. (This is sort of like blaming the Repubs today for all the flaws in Healthcare by the way)

Second: It wasn't one of his biggest issues. It was an idea and he backed off it really quickly. Turns out it was a really good idea he did too.

Edit: and CJ.... same comment to you as Ax. You seem to be agreeing with everything I wrote just adding a their side does it too. Hardly a rebuttal esp. since in the graph that was originally quoted I said the dems were doing their best job to copy the Repubs.

[Ax]

In other words, you can't dispute a single one.

Neither can you, really.

I am disappointed in both parties. They have been mirroring each other big time.

Which was my only point. At times, you seem more level headed than most of the hysterical elements of the Democrat faction of la Conga Nostra. But then there are times, like the post in question, when you seem like one of their most ardent, blindly supportive, cheerleaders.

But, we still love you.

Now, go start a thread somewhere. You'll feel better

[Ax]

The Dems were a bunch of spineless jellyfish who rarely put up a fight, even when they got majority control in Bush's last two years. Still, if Bush really wanted it and thought it was important, within those six years it would have been done.

It's called leadership. Which, so far, President Obama lacks, severely.

[Burgold]

Which was my only point. At times, you seem more level headed than most of the hysterical elements of the Democrat faction of la Conga Nostra. But then there are times, like the post in question, when you seem like one of their most ardent, blindly supportive, cheerleaders.

But, we still love you.

Now, go start a thread somewhere. You'll feel better

Ah, I think you missed the post that started this silly tangent. (Although, I suppose some took offense to intentionally maliscious... not sure why? )

Here's the bit that started it all:

I think the question is what happens when you hate everyone. Most reasonable people should distrust the Republicans after what they intentionally and maliciously did to the country. Now, if you decide the Dems are just as bad (and they are proving to be) do you go back to the Repubs or give the Dems a little more rope? Or is there a third alternative that people can rally towards.

I still hold to my thesis that people are unhappy and just want to throw the bums out. The bums being whoever is currently in power.

It's like us when we want to change head coaches every year hoping that somehow that will change something and give us an instant championship.

[GibbsFactor]

You can't just toss the "bums" out because the ones to replace them would be like fresh meat for the lobbyists.

[alexey]

You can't just toss the "bums" out because the ones to replace them would be like fresh meat for the lobbyists.

It takes some time to establish connections and relationships and such.

[mardi gras skin]

They've been downright Republican.

Obama did promise to make some changes.