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Cheerleader Ambassador Rcvs Bad Reaction From Flu Shot - ALMOST CURED (MET; Merged)

KrnZippo

By KrnZippo
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jkypoo

jkypoo

Posted
Posted
OK - I see your point about the medical pros. But, my response did provide data: not all med pros are doctors or nurses.[/Quote]

"Here's my best guess at why:

Healthcare professionals is a group including more than just doctors and nurses (social workers, lab workers, researchers, administrative staff, etc.), so your assertion is off. I'm assuming if we looked at the subset of doctors and nurses, the rate of vaccination would be higher."

It does include data. Then you conclude that the poster's assertion is off. Then you assume, or "assert," that the rate of vaccination would be higher if social workers, lab workers, researchers, admin staff, etc.--who are all still healthcare pros--would be higher. That seems as faulty as anything else I have read in this thread.

Other than saying that and also saying that I could speculate (but won't), how are my posts irresponsible? Have I lied? Am I advocating that everyone gets a shot or else?[/Quote]

You then go on to address a poster who listed ingredients used in vaccines as being "hilarious" and implying that he is a "yahoo." The only ingredient you address is the formaldehyde, and even then you admit that trace amounts end up in the final product. The point being that he is not a "yahoo" for not wanting to be exposed to those things, but you calling him one after you have established your authority on the subject seems a lot like your bias showing through. You say that you don't care whether people get vaccinated or not, yet you slander that poster for posting the ingredients, even though he didn't advocate people not taking the shot, merely that people should be "suspicious," which I think is sound advice when anyone wants to inject anyone with anything. Not "hilarious." Definitely not "yahoo."

I'm not asking anyone to heed my word.[/Quote]

If you really meant this, then you wouldn't have posted about your involvement. There was no reason to attempt to establish your authority on an opinion based forum unless you wanted to give your words power and credibility.

Just consider it and either confirm it or refute it on your own.[/Quote]

I would have had no complaint if this was the line you stuck to throughout. I am not questioning your position, merely how you present it in some cases.

My big objection is the knee-jerk response people have when it comes to vaccines. Frankly, it's none of my business if you get one or not. I just object to people responding emotionally to something that is really about facts.

Unfortunately, this is and should be a "knee-jerk" and "emotionally" charged issue. If the young woman in question would have been shown this video before hand and told that the facts show she has a better chance of being struck by lightning or winning the lottery than ending up like that, I imagine that she might still have declined, despite the facts. She might have decided she would rather face the flu than have even the smallest inkling of a chance of ending up that way. If, if, and if, then she wouldn't have ended up where she is now. I'm just saying that "facts" are not always the answer in a personal issue. Coincidentally, and I mean no offense by this, you have painted yourself into a corner where facts are your only credible means of communication. For instance: I could ask whether you have received your immunization, but your answer would be pointless. If you say yes, then there is no way of verifying your facts without giving personal information to random internet lurkers. Therefore it could be the truth, a lie, or a company line regardless of the truth of the line. And you wouldn't, couldn't say no.

On a side note, but still related: I believe I remember reading where you said we should "trust our doctor." Well in one of the news stories attached in this thread it is stated the the woman's doctors as well as John's Hopkins doctors believe that, preliminarily, the woman's condition is linked to vaccination. Even speaking in preliminaries, that is still kind of scary, no?

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fire5man80

fire5man80

Posted
Posted
Bunch of crap. Another made up stat by drug companies to make our youth into zombies with drugs. When I think of Autism, I think of Rain Man, not some kid who just won't pay attention. It's like you have to have some kind of affliction nowadays. Back in my day, kids were giving a kick in the ass and told to do their work. They were the lazy kids put in special ed classes. I knew a couple of them. They weren't dumb, they just didn't want to do the work.

This entire thread belongs elsewhere but since it is still open in here I will entertain your pathetic point of view.

Are you that heartless and tasteless to truly label a person with special needs as "lazy"???? I believe I read previously that you are in the medical field. If this is correct I sure hope you are behind a desk and have absolutely no patient contact what so ever. My name on here will make my career obvious to you. With that, if you are a health care PROFESSIONAL then we have something in common, we both are there to help people in their worst of times. Now when you are helping somebody do you ignore some of their symptoms or pass them off as being lazy, or maybe a druggie or a drunk per say? With your previous discrimatory remark I can only see you as having that sort of attitude towards your patients. I work for a very busy fire dept. We see people of all walks of life and all sorts of problems. My one pet peeve is to see somebody mistreated or neglected because of somebodies unprofessional behavior and failure to do their job because of their own hidden thoughts and ideas.

I dont support the idea that immunization is the reason for many of the neurological disorders out there, and only because I have never tried to research it. My brother was born brain dead. He lived for just under 13 years in a vegetative state. I dont blame doctors, shots or chemicals in the environment. I accepted him as a gift from god, as I believe all living beings are. Some are less fortunate than others though and do not enjoy the same abilities as most of us do. For those of us who are fortunate enough to enjoy life as it should be enjoyed, we should be their to support those who cant and make their lives easier. Not because theyre LAZY but because they have special needs. Learn the different levels of each disability and they symptoms accompanied by them before you make such a tasteless remark. Not a sermon just a thought. Sorry for the rant.

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MassSkinsFan

MassSkinsFan

Posted
Posted

Who is doing quality control on the billions of doses being produced? Assume no one. Checked out the drug recalls lately?

Here are the basic US regulations on QC:

Responsibilities of Quality Control Unit

General Biologic Products Standards

Additionally there are guidances and related parts of the Code of Federal Regulations (CFRs) which apply to QCU as well - most of the regs in 21 CFR 211 are primarily the responsibility of manufacturing or QC, but the QC Unit has responsibility for seeing they're followed. The international regs are almost exactly the same with some small variances.

These must be met to get a product licensed and to maintain the license.

Here's the vaccine recall list.

I didnt think healthy middle aged adults needed seasonal flu shots.

You're probably right. It depends on risk factors. I didn't get them for years but found out this year that I have allergic asthma which puts me at greater risk, so I got one this year. Otherwise I wouldn't have bothered.

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bcl05

bcl05

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Posted

Something I posted in the other current vaccine thread:

A bunch of folks in this thread are saying some variant of "I'm a healthy young adult, no need for me to get vaccinated."

What is missing from this logic is that getting vaccinated doesn't just help the recipient, but helps everyone. Once a certain threshhold of people get a vaccine, it becomes much more difficult for a virus to circulate within a population. This provides protection for the most vulnerable people, who might not be eligible for a vaccine themselves (i.e., babies under 6m) or who just might not get it. I have gotten a flu shot every year for the past decade or so, not because I'm scared of the flu, but because I think its one way of doing my part to protect others.

The population benefits of the vaccine are so underreported that it drives me crazy. All the media stuff re: the vaccine is about "protect yourself" - which is kind of silly, because, as its been pointed out a million times in this thread - flu is generally not that big a deal. If all of us healthy people got the vaccine though, many of the deaths (in the vulnerable and chronically ill) from flu could be avoided. I think that message has not been told nearly enough.

I firmly believe that if every healthy adult got the flu vaccine, there would be a couple of hundred with serious side effects, and a handful that would actually die directly because of the vaccine. And TENS OF THOUSANDS of lives would be saved. Its a no-brainer for me.

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MassSkinsFan

MassSkinsFan

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Posted
It does include data. Then you conclude that the poster's assertion is off. Then you assume, or "assert," that the rate of vaccination would be higher if social workers, lab workers, researchers, admin staff, etc.--who are all still healthcare pros--would be higher. That seems as faulty as anything else I have read in this thread.

Assert v. conclude. I said I was speculating there, and then asserted something, meaning I'm not saying it's definite. I expect that people can make that distinction but I'll refrain from any more speculation.

You then go on to address a poster who listed ingredients used in vaccines as being "hilarious" and implying that he is a "yahoo." ...Definitely not "yahoo."

You're right about my tone. I am sorry I wasn't more dispassionate. I still think that, when you go through the components listed, they are not harmful in the amounts in which they exist in vaccines. There's a body of data to support that. My response was my knee-jerk reaction.

If you really meant this, then you wouldn't have posted about your involvement. There was no reason to attempt to establish your authority on an opinion based forum unless you wanted to give your words power and credibility.

And if I didn't say I was involved right away, and it surfaced later, I'd be in even deeper. I think it's important to state where you're coming from and I did it to get that out in the open.

I would have had no complaint if this was the line you stuck to throughout. I am not questioning your position, merely how you present it in some cases.

Point taken. Thanks.

I'm just saying that "facts" are not always the answer in a personal issue.

Fair enough.

I could ask whether you have received your immunization, but your answer would be pointless. If you say yes, then there is no way of verifying your facts without giving personal information to random internet lurkers. Therefore it could be the truth, a lie, or a company line regardless of the truth of the line. And you wouldn't, couldn't say no.

I could say no. :) For years I haven't had one, until this year when I learned of a risk factor I didn't know about previously. I take things like ibuprofen without a second thought mainly because I know that there are very effective systems in place to ensure that product is not harmful to me. Those are systems based on CFR requirements and inspected by FDA just like vaccines. And no offense taken.

On a side note, but still related: I believe I remember reading where you said we should "trust our doctor." Well in one of the news stories attached in this thread it is stated the the woman's doctors as well as John's Hopkins doctors believe that, preliminarily, the woman's condition is linked to vaccination. Even speaking in preliminaries, that is still kind of scary, no?

It's a good question. When a serious adverse event occurs, there's an investigation. In a case like this, a report must be filed with FDA within 15 days. There is a determination of as many facts as can be gathered, and assessment from the physician at the clinic. If a direct causal link is established, there must be immediate action. That would likely be a recall.

If that is the case, it is scary.

If pre-existing conditions were the major cause, then the investigation would likely find the vaccination is related, but not the cause. Then I wouldn't be scared about the vaccine.

It is also possible the investigation will find no link at all.

We need to see the outcome.

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tex

tex

Posted
Posted
Something I posted in the other current vaccine thread:

A bunch of folks in this thread are saying some variant of "I'm a healthy young adult, no need for me to get vaccinated."

What is missing from this logic is that getting vaccinated doesn't just help the recipient, but helps everyone. Once a certain threshhold of people get a vaccine, it becomes much more difficult for a virus to circulate within a population. This provides protection for the most vulnerable people, who might not be eligible for a vaccine themselves (i.e., babies under 6m) or who just might not get it. I have gotten a flu shot every year for the past decade or so, not because I'm scared of the flu, but because I think its one way of doing my part to protect others.

The population benefits of the vaccine are so underreported that it drives me crazy. All the media stuff re: the vaccine is about "protect yourself" - which is kind of silly, because, as its been pointed out a million times in this thread - flu is generally not that big a deal. If all of us healthy people got the vaccine though, many of the deaths (in the vulnerable and chronically ill) from flu could be avoided. I think that message has not been told nearly enough.

I firmly believe that if every healthy adult got the flu vaccine, there would be a couple of hundred with serious side effects, and a handful that would actually die directly because of the vaccine. And TENS OF THOUSANDS of lives would be saved. Its a no-brainer for me.

just a couple of points here. 9 out of 10 flu deaths occur among the 65 and older group. most times they already have health problems that the flu makes worse. so basically you are asking the strong healthy group to put themselves in harms way for the greater good to protect a group near end of live that already have health problems. by my way of thinking the "greater good" should likewise be there for those getting the shot when things go wrong. that just doesn't square with the fact that those peddling the vaccine have received blanket immunity leaving those that suffer side effects from the shots no recourse.

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PorkSkins

PorkSkins

Posted
Posted

I wouldn't say that 65 or older is near end of life. There are people in their 20's, 30's, and 40's with health problems. Whether or not you take any vaccine is your choice. Personally I wouldn't go to the local grocery store to get it. I would consult with my physician and see if I have any lingering problems that might would cause a side effect. A thorough blood test prior might not be a bad idea. I just pray they find some way of treating this woman and help her live as normal of a life as she will be able to.

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tex

tex

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Posted
I just pray they find some way of treating this woman and help her live as normal of a life as she will be able to.

Well said.

Just to be clear on the other points: average life expectancy in the US is 77.5-80 years. Therefore the 65 and older group have lived out over 80% of their lives. It's true that the 65 and older group are not the only ones with health problems yet that group accounts for 9 out of 10 flu deaths according to the CDC.

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CampbellIsAwesome

CampbellIsAwesome

Posted
Posted
Good lord. I think I received a flu shot once, many years ago. I think that will be my last one after watching that.

I hope that she somehow gets better. God bless her.

A dystonic reaction is not specific to the flu vaccine (or any vaccine for that matter). Some prescription drugs such as compazine (a common drug used for treating nausea) can cause dystonic reactions in some people. Also traumatic injuries can cause dystonia.

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jkypoo

jkypoo

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Posted
If pre-existing conditions were the major cause, then the investigation would likely find the vaccination is related, but not the cause. Then I wouldn't be scared about the vaccine.

It is also possible the investigation will find no link at all.

We need to see the outcome.

It would be a shame even if the vaccine was merely a trigger or contributing factor to a previously dormant or suppressed preexisting condition. I know that there is really no way that such extremely rare circumstances can be accounted for before hand, but, like I said, even the most remote and unlikely of possibilities is enough to turn some people off, and I think they should have the right to make that decision, as you have stated many times, as well.

Of course, and I really hate saying this, this whole thing is probably a little bit easier to bear for her and anyone reading this story when there is some external contributing factor. If the timing of events turns out to be 100% pure coincidence, it is probably going to be that much more devastating. Without blame there is only sadness without anger. Typically, no one likes not knowing why something happened. It is always the more difficult path.

Of course, it is all speculation until the final reports come back.

We definitely need more information to be sure.

Thanks for chatting with me.

Regardless of my objections, I have enjoyed your unique take on things.

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MassSkinsFan

MassSkinsFan

Posted
Posted
If the timing of events turns out to be 100% pure coincidence, it is probably going to be that much more devastating. Without blame there is only sadness without anger. Typically, no one likes not knowing why something happened. It is always the more difficult path.

Thanks for chatting with me.

Regardless of my objections, I have enjoyed your unique take on things.

I agree with point 1 100%. Not knowing is usually much harder.

I also agree with point 2 - it's been good, and I learned a few things. Thanks!

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  • 3 weeks later...
PhiAlpha

PhiAlpha

Posted
Posted

Hope she gets better!

http://www.aolhealth.com/health/fall-health/flu-shot-desiree-jennings?icid=main|hp-desktop|dl2|link2|http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aolhealth.com%2Fhealth%2Ffall-health%2Fflu-shot-desiree-jennings

Desiree Jennings: A Flu Shot Gone Wrong

Courtesy of Desiree Jennings

By Mary Kearl

You may have heard news reports about 25-year-old Desiree Jennings, the girl with the severe reaction to the seasonal flu shot. Her symptoms -- the inability to walk forward, but the ability to run forward and walk backwards -- even appeared as Google Trends, with searches related to her condition. Some believed it was all just a hoax. Her story is garnering celebrity attention, too -- Generation Rescue, the organization founded by Jim Carrey and Jenny McCarthy to raise awareness about health and safety issues related to vaccines -- has reached out to support Jennings.

The Centers for Disease Control (CDC) advises against getting a flu shot if you've ever had a severe allergic reaction to eggs or to a previous flu shot. Additionally, if you have a history of Guillain-Barré Syndrome -- a condition which includes symptoms of fever, nerve damage and muscle weakness -- that occurred after receiving influenza vaccine, you shouldn't get the seasonal flu shot. The risk of "serious harm" or death from a flu shot, the CDC's Web site explains, "is extremely small. However, a vaccine, like any medicine, may rarely cause serious problems, such as severe allergic reactions. Almost all people who get influenza vaccine have no serious problems from it."

Jennings, a Northern Virginian and AOL Employee (Full disclosure: This reporter and Desiree Jennings have never worked together before this interview.), who was healthy, training for a half marathon and a Washington Redskins Ambassador preparing to become a cheerleader, never suspected the health complications she is living with now. She is suffering from acute, viral post immunization encephalopathy and mercury toxicity with secondary respiratory and neurological deficits, which she believes is the direct result of the seasonal vaccination she received from her local grocery store chain in August 2009.

Initial reports and diagnoses indicated Jennings had dystonia, a neurological disorder characterized by involuntary muscle contractions that are sometimes painful. But, as of the most recent interview, Jennings's treating physician believes she has acute, viral post immmunization encephalopathy, or a disease of the brain that alters brain function or structure and can include memory loss and personality changes.

In an interview with AOL Health, Jennings, she explains her diagnosis and how her life is forever changed. Watch the video below to hear Jennings talk about her condition.

AOL Health: How were you feeling before you got your seasonal flu shot this year? What motivated you to get it?

Desiree Jennings: I was feeling great, very strong and healthy. I had just started training for a half marathon and was up to about seven miles by the time I went to get a flu shot.

I was motivated by a health program at work that rewards employees for doing health-smart things like working out, getting your cholesterol checked and receiving the flu shot each year.

AOL Health: How did you feel in the initial hours and days after receiving it?

Jennings: After [getting] the shot on August 23, with the exception of a sore arm, I felt fine over the next nine days. On day 10, and on my two-year wedding anniversary, I became very ill with a fever, painful body aches and nausea. From that day forward, everything quickly went down hill.

AOL Health: Can you describe your symptoms and some of the "workarounds" you've found helpful in overcoming/minimizing them?

Jennings: The symptoms started with the inability to talk and walk normally. At first, the walking and talking were manageable. Most of the time I could use sensory tricks [such as] touching my chin to talk or touching my left leg to walk, or walking backwards/sideways. But, as each day passed the sensory tricks slowly began to stop working as did the backwards/sideways walking.

That is when I began to notice that stimuli, such as a loud noise, bright lights, reading, or even eating, would worsen the symptoms and throw me into violent convulsions. The symptoms continued to worsen and my health deteriorated even further to the point where I could not move my tongue to eat without going into a convulsion or seizure.

AOL Health: You've been very public about your symptoms and what happened to you since taking a flu shot. Why has that been important to you?

Jennings: I am a very open person to begin with and I believe that having that openness towards my symptoms and experiences not only helped me get answers to my questions and a diagnosis, but will hopefully help educate and provide hope for other people in similar situations.

AOL Health: There have been some rumors online about people wondering if your symptoms and one of your initial diagnoses, dystonia, have all been a fraud. How have you reacted?

Jennings: I have been appalled to say the least. I have even received threatening e-mails from another well-known person suffering from dystonia. I have never heard of the disabled harassing the disabled.

I was a couple months away from a promotion at work, had just made the Redskins Cheerleader Ambassador team, was celebrating my two year wedding anniversary and had recently paid off all credit card debt and car loans. My perfect life has now been completely turned upside down. I am now on short-term disability, my paychecks have been cut, and will be cut again in a few weeks, and we are paying thousands in out of pocket medical costs. What incentive would a person have to completely change their life for the worse? I always told myself that if I ever were to become well-known it would be for something I accomplished, being the fastest runner or best editor and writer, not for being the most injured or a one-in-a-million victim. That is not an accomplishment, in my opinion, it's a failure.

AOL Health: How has your work and home life changed since getting the flu shot?

Jennings: It has been turned upside down. I worry that I may never be able to return back to my career that I have cultivated, grown and cherished since I was 18 years old. And my home life is a frenzy of activity and stress -- dealing with appointments, treatment options and media, all while simply trying to find normalcy in my new day-to-day activities.

AOL Health: Has your idea of your future changed?

Jennings: My idea of the future had definitely changed. All the things I worked so hard to accomplish and obtain now seem mundane and meaningless in the whole scheme of things. This injury has opened my eyes to so many things I was too busy to stop and pay attention to before. I have received so many letters and e-mails from people I have never met that speak of similar injuries and neurological issues and my heart goes out to each one of them. I wish I could just get better so I can help them.

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tex

tex

Posted
Posted

if a bunch of people are getting sick with the flu then obviously the vaccines aren't working so there is no need to take the shot and accept the risk.

if it's a new strain of flu as some reports suggest the existing vaccines will be ineffective against it so again there is no need to take the shot and accept the risk.

baxter sent a vaccine containing a deadly mix virus to 18 countries. the ramifications of this fact should be strongly considered.

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HawaiianTime

HawaiianTime

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Posted

Here's my input to the H1N1 vaccine. Per my sons cardiologist (my son is 6), their thoughts were that the vaccine was new and they advised waiting a couple of yrs to vet the vaccine out. They also would not give it to their children. But, the choice is ours to make. Mercury also has been linked to autism.

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