Brandon Lloyd Christmas Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Yeah, 2 weeks ago you had the Skins beating the Giants by 20 points. Two weeks later you have Zorn being fired lol. Kinda puts the "extreme" in Extremeskins... did art really have that prediction? never saw that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 did art really have that prediction? never saw that one. We've all made dumbass predictions at one time or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 The current structure is fine. You have Buges. Make him head coach. It's not like our fallback is Robiske . If it is anyone, I'd like it to be Buges. However, I'm not sure thats an improvement over Zorn at this point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maskedsuperstar Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 they went 1-3 over that stretch. i highly doubt their fans were all smiles during that stretch, especially it being so early in the season. They started 5-1, 2-3 during the no TD's. They finished 12-4 and raised the trophy at the end of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Yeah, 2 weeks ago you had the Skins beating the Giants by 20 points. Two weeks later you have Zorn being fired lol. Kinda puts the "extreme" in Extremeskins... I wouldn't say that's much of a contradiction- but rather a causal relationship. Art feels we have the personnel to beat a team like NY by 20... and when we barely squeak by the worst team in football in Week 2, calling for the HC to step down is not contradicting yourself. However, it might very well be uncalled for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maskedsuperstar Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 If it is anyone, I'd like it to be Buges. However, I'm not sure thats an improvement over Zorn at this point A coaching change? And you wonder why the Skins haven't been successful?:doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 did art really have that prediction? never saw that one. Yep, had us winning 31-10... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Lloyd Christmas Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 They started 5-1, 2-3 during the no TD's. They finished 12-4 and raised the trophy at the end of the season. with arguably the best defense ever in the history of football. and need i remind you that their offense was 14th in the league in scoring, and their defense scored i think 1 TD for them all season. so what youre looking at is a dry spell for a team that lasted about 5 weeks. do you think our "dry spell" on offense has been short lived or is some sort of hiccup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maskedsuperstar Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 The Ravens also had one of the greatest defenses to ever step on the field as well as one of the greatest LBs to ever play thte game. We dont have that luxury. If we can only beat one of the worst teams in the league by 2 points thats not very promising for when we play real teams. I am not saying Zorn needs to go now but alot of us are getting tired of never living up to our true potential week in and week out. So, because the Skins didn't beat up on the Rams, the season is not promising? OMG!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Lloyd Christmas Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Yep, had us winning 31-10... daaaaaamn gina! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 I wouldn't say that's much of a contradiction- but rather a causal relationship.Art feels we have the personnel to beat a team like NY by 20... and when we barely squeak by the worst team in football in Week 2, calling for the HC to step down is not contradicting yourself. However, it might very well be uncalled for Well, if you have enough confidence in both the players and the coach to realistically see the team beating one of the best teams in the NFL by three TDs, I would hope it would take more than two weeks to have an about-face lol :yes:... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Possibly, but, more likely the chasm is not with me and my evaluation, but more with Zorn and his refusal to evaluate... I don't know I can agree with that. I remember the DL/DB theory that was bunk.... Having said that you could very well be totally right. Fingers crossed we go to the shotgun and see where it takes us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share Posted September 25, 2009 Well, if you have enough confidence in both the players and the coach to realistically see the team beating one of the best teams in the NFL by three TDs, I would hope it would take more than two weeks to have an about-face lol :yes:... Read back over what I wrote before the Giants game. Read what I said about why and how we would win. Read what I wrote at the end. Playing like I outline is how this team wins. Consider it a guidepost. We don't beat the Giants with slam traps, power sweeps and short passes. They beat us with that. The Giants couldn't cover a receiver beyond 10 yards all game. We do that and they fall away. We don't do that enough. And that is, in great part, the disconnect between what we have and what we are. I've been very blunt that there are some things these players do not do well. But there are some things they do well. Do THOSE more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLongshot Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 You are a few days late on this. All the off the deep end stuff was earlier in the week. Fire Jim Zorn. And that would do what exactly? It certainly wouldn't improve what is on the field. Zorn's identity is part desperate, part unfocused and entirely uncertain. Thus, the team plays without focus, with desperation and without real identity. One touchdown is on a fake field goal. Another touchdown try is on a halfback pass by the end zone. He goes for it on fourth and 1 TWICE with the team up by 2 late in a game.It's Week 2 of Season 2. That's desperate. It's the mark of desperation. He doesn't think the team can score any other way. The players don't believe he can get them in the end zone any other way. It reeks of a lack of professionalism or clue. It reeks of Zorn, a man I actually like. You may have an argument with the two gadget plays in the red zone, tho the end of the first half it was a "must score" point, with nothing particularly going right in that first half (which has been a hallmark for us for a while in Giants Stadium.) But the two 4th down calls? Not desperate at all. That was complete trust in the offense to pick up those downs and trust in the defense to stop the other guys. I had no problem with either call. The funny thing I have with all of this was that these are the calls which fans complimented Zorn on early last season and that he got away from later in the season. This team is a West Coast Offense. Kinda. Not really. We're a power running offense. Sometimes, not really. We're a spread-em-out, shotgun team. Here and there. Not really. We're unpredictible, trick play guys, once in a while and without ever setting it up well. We want to hit them deep, we just don't complete.We don't do anything offensively because we do not stand for anything offensively. We treat drives like Chinese drip torture. Long, time-consuming, unproductive and ultimately ineffective. I've never seen a team capable of so many long drives that do nothing, including never tiring out the other team. The long drives are progress over last year, when we had tons of 3-and-outs and drives that would bog down at the 40. Had we not made mistakes in the Giants game, we would have moved it well in the first half. We moved it well against the Rams. The plays were there to get it into the end zone, but the execution wasn't. We can't do it. We could MAYBE do it later in games if we ever bothered to score early. But in Zorn you have a fundamentally normal, ball-control coach, who can never break out of his mold to adopt the mold of his players. I don't know if I agree with that. The first game was mostly on last year's playbook with a lot of run Portis first. He got away from that in the Rams game and it worked well for us. Campbell has been throwing more and more from the shotgun, which is also an adjustment Zorn has made in his playcalling. The problem right now is that execution hasn't been high. It is really what killed us in the Giants game and it killed us to a lesser extent in the Rams game. Too many people making critical mistakes at critical times. That, in my eyes, it the responsibility of the players. They know what they are doing wrong and what they need to do to address those issues. They just need to translate that to the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share Posted September 25, 2009 As a refresher, the end of my Giants article: For too long we’ve pretended we’ve got the personnel to run a smash mouth game. We’ve announced that as our identity with apparent relish. And we operate in fits and starts because our line is not built to blow people up. Our runner is not built to bowl people over. Our receivers are not built (though with Malcolm Kelly in there, better) to knock people around.Our personnel is built to spread you out, make you believe it, hit the seams running and generate yards after the catch. This is impossible when 11 guys can play in a 10-yard box. There are no seams. There are no yards after the catch. There is only pain, anger and, “Uh, Bill Cowher for $20 million a year.” When this year ends and Campbell is receiving his $40 million 2010 uncapped year contract and Snyder’s very tiny statue is being put up at FedExField and John Riggins and Clinton Portis embrace the deep embrace of champions, you’ll remember, we can’t lose playing like this. We won’t lose playing like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss_Hogg Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 yeah lets fire him now, screw the rest of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLongshot Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 As a refresher, the end of my Giants article: Yet, you think Buges taking over would change that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPortJGibbs89 Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 So, because the Skins didn't beat up on the Rams, the season is not promising? OMG!!Is anything you have seen in the first two weeks in regards to scoring touchdowns been promising to you? I guess we are watching two different teams then. I have not sat here and said I give up on the Skins lets blow it all up but we are seeing the same offensive problems we ended last year with. We can move the ball between the 20s with no problem but inside the red zone the endzone seems to scare us. We have had this problem for years now and its getting really old. If we go out and play like that against the Lions we might lose and if you still sit here and say we are a good team then OMG to you man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share Posted September 25, 2009 Yet, you think Buges taking over would change that? I don't think it matters is the point. If Zorn is going to be the total nitwit who TWICE goes for it on fourth and one while being up by 2, it won't matter if he is the coach or not. I actually think he has a bit more upside as a head coach than might Bugel at this point, but, Bugel would simply keep it simple. That might actually not be a bad thing. While I'll always remain hopeful he'll find the magic and this team will become what good teams look like, to me, what we are with Zorn is all we're going to be. Spurts and stops. Inconsistent and unfocused. Hit and miss. 8-8. A TRUE GREAT QB would help him. It'd help us all. We don't have that. We do have Campbell. And Campbell, for all his flaws, does do some things very nicely. If those things were our focus you'd discover things for the rest of the roster look better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share Posted September 25, 2009 Longshot, One thing to consider on the offense, which looks fine to some degree now, it also looked fine to some degree early last year. Pretty bad first game, several good games. Then the bottom fell out. I am encouraged the offense seems to have some ability again after showing NOTHING down the stretch. It does mean Zorn can learn and adapt and overcome and can get his players to as well. If teams adjust to us, how he does later will be telling, but, the offense now is similar to the offense to start last year to start, which means pretty good at yardage, good at making some plays and frustrating as hell. Last year teams got up on us. They may not this year, and in that hope you have the thought the offense will become less frustrating. It'll start scoring. I just can't help but watch teams that do score and HOW they do it. They take shots in the end zone from distance. They stretch you out and if they don't score, they impact you. Brees just kills you in the 25-yard-range and all they are doing is running four go routes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Diggler Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 It's not just offense; this team hasn't had an organizational identity since Snyder bought the team. You know what the Eagles, Patriots, Colts, Giants, Steelers, Ravens, and Titans are about. Certain adjectives are used to describe these teams. And these teams are defined by their physicality or their passing games or their resiliency or their intelligence. You see the Steelers helmet and it stands for something. We are defined by our dysfunction and lack of identity. Not good. We need a legitimate GM to come in and bring a vision of how a team should be. If it means he can work with the players we have, great. If we have to clean house, fine. I just can't buy what they're putting out there right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maskedsuperstar Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 The long drives are progress over last year, when we had tons of 3-and-outs and drives that would bog down at the 40. Had we not made mistakes in the Giants game, we would have moved it well in the first half. We moved it well against the Rams. The plays were there to get it into the end zone, but the execution wasn't. I agree. The Skins are moving the football. They many long drives Sunday, but failed in the Redzone. 2 dropped passes, thats 14 points. The offense way better than last. The problem right now is that execution hasn't been high. It is really what killed us in the Giants game and it killed us to a lesser extent in the Rams game. Too many people making critical mistakes at critical times. That, in my eyes, it the responsibility of the players. They know what they are doing wrong and what they need to do to address those issues. They just need to translate that to the field. Exactly. I mean, this fire Zorn is totally going overboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLongshot Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 If Zorn is going to be the total nitwit who TWICE goes for it on fourth and one while being up by 2, it won't matter if he is the coach or not. I actually think he has a bit more upside as a head coach than might Bugel at this point, but, Bugel would simply keep it simple. That might actually not be a bad thing. I don't understand how it WASN'T smart to go for it both times, particuarly since the Rams were out of time outs. Working all the time off the clock while trying to put away the game seemed like a good plan to me. The only unfortunate thing is that the OL couldn't execute it on the last play of the drive. While I'll always remain hopeful he'll find the magic and this team will become what good teams look like, to me, what we are with Zorn is all we're going to be. Spurts and stops. Inconsistent and unfocused. Hit and miss. 8-8. A TRUE GREAT QB would help him. It'd help us all. We don't have that. We do have Campbell. And Campbell, for all his flaws, does do some things very nicely. If those things were our focus you'd discover things for the rest of the roster look better. Again, I think Zorn IS focusing on what Campbell does well, and when given an opportunity, he has shown that he can move the ball up and down the field on teams. The problem is, Campbell can't do it all by himself and he needs some of his teammates to step up. Moss has been MIA for the first two games and I've been questioning his effort out there. The young receivers need to step up and make plays themselves. What ARE and Cooley have done so far is what all the other receivers need to strive for. Both have stepped up their game, but one WR and one TE has never been enough for this team to be what it should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share Posted September 25, 2009 It's not just offense; this team hasn't had an organizational identity since Snyder bought the team. You know what the Eagles, Patriots, Colts, Giants, Steelers, Ravens, and Titans are about. Certain adjectives are used to describe these teams. And these teams are defined by their physicality or their passing games or their resiliency or their intelligence. You see the Steelers helmet and it stands for something. We are defined by our dysfunction and lack of identity. Not good. We need a legitimate GM to come in and bring a vision of how a team should be. If it means he can work with the players we have, great. If we have to clean house, fine. I just can't buy what they're putting out there right now. There was certainly a vision during the Gibbs years. It was Gibbs' vision. The team didn't have any real football identity and was as scattershot and uncertain as Zorn, but it did have "character" to a large degree. The only two times it ever looked good was when everything looked the worst. That is what's frustrating. In the last few years we've had three good runs of football which show the players can compete at a very high level. Two under Gibbs and last year early with Zorn before he got figured out. That we never find the full formula which carries over form year to year is something that ought not be quite so elusive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Diggler Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 We do have Campbell. And Campbell, for all his flaws, does do some things very nicely. If those things were our focus you'd discover things for the rest of the roster look better. But what Campbell doesn't have is balls. It's a hell of a lot easier to ask a gunslinger to rein it in then it is to ask a QB afraid to make a mistake to take chances. That's why I'd take Tony Romo sits to pee 8 days a week over someone like Campbell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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