Hindsight is 20/20 but don't we sure miss Cutler? Sanchez? Even Vick?

[ALLWORLD]

No. I'm glad we missed Cutler and Sanchez.

wow.

[ALLWORLD]

Same basic stats as Campbell yesterday except for 2 TDs.

and umm... versus the STEELERS, not the RAMS.

[Ellis Dee]

Here we go again.

The only move i wish we made was a move we never even considered.

Hiring people form the Broncos offensive coaching staff like:

You sure about this? You're happy with this team exactly the way it is?

1. Shouldn't we have gone after O-Line depth? Especially after the age of our Line (See Randy Thomas)

2. Should we have re-signed Deangelo Hall for as much as we did?

This team needs a complete overhaul starting with a new GM and owner. However, Danny Boy isn't going anywhere as is Cerrato really. Coach and QB are the next 2 pieces to go.

[DoBe]

Because Vick is more than just a wildcat QB? What makes you say that?

He is? Could have sworn he is a "watching from the comfort of home" QB right now.

[yellow41]

Snyder will regret having carelessly traded away the picks he could have used to move up and draft Sanchez. That guy will be a star.

[ntotoro]

DREW BREES.

He was a free agent. I can't believe the best QB in the league was a free agent and the spend happy Redskins front office didn't even look his way.

Brees was also coming off shoulder surgery at the time. Yeah, it smarts like hell in hindsight, but a lot of teams passed on him and you have to keep the time frame and its perspective in-mind.

[darrelgreenie]

You sure about this? You're happy with this team exactly the way it is?

1. Shouldn't we have gone after O-Line depth? Especially after the age of our Line (See Randy Thomas)

2. Should we have re-signed Deangelo Hall for as much as we did?

This team needs a complete overhaul starting with a new GM and owner. However, Danny Boy isn't going anywhere as is Cerrato really. Coach and QB are the next 2 pieces to go.

No i'm not happy with this team exactly the way it is now.

But that isn't what the OP is about.

The OP seems to think that Cutler or Sanchez would solve the teams problems or at least the passing game.

Maybe i shouldn't have said 'only' but i think that an experienced playcaller/coach would help the passing game more then Cutler or Sanchez would.

The only move i wish we made was a move we never even considered.

Hiring people form the Broncos offensive coaching staff like:

Jeremy Bates, Rick Dennison their OC or their WR Coach

About the OL i think they have improved and they are already playing better then last year.

I think that we are moving in the right direction with the infusion of youth with Rhinehart, Montgomery, Ed Williams.

http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?t=292276

I think we are good at scouting OL although we don't always keep them

Andrew Crummey is on a team somewhere and Kyle Devan is starting for the Dolphins.

But, i wish we would have drafted a stud to plug in somewhere in the starting line-up for this year and gone after Jason Brown at C instead of Dockery at G.

I don't think we should have resigned Hall for as much as we did but their was word that he had received offers from other teams and we needed a corner because the oft injured Springs was released.

I hope you aren't giving up on Hall already?

I think he's gonna bounce back.

I actually think his struggles in the past games are good for him, keep him humble and keep him working.

The dude is only 25 and was a 2 time pro-bowler 2 games doesn't make a season.

As much as dislike Synder he is the owner.

I think Cerrato is a good GM (scouting) and has only really been acting in that capacity since last year.

Imo Cerrato only problem is Synder.

Zorn deserves some lee-way because he has alot on his plate, way more then most 1st time coaches. (Creating and installing a new playbook, coaching the OC and the other offensive coaches, coaching the QB and calling plays)

^^This is why i think the biggest single gain could have been hiring a coach with some experience in the WCO as an offensive assistant, passing game coordinator, or as an 'offensive consultant' like Keith Gilbertson was to Holmgren in Seattle.

post about coaches:

http://www.extremeskins.com/showpost.php?p=6047978&postcount=60

Jason Campbell is fine, anyone that looks at the team and singles Jason out as the problem imo doesn't know football.

HTTR!

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

that TD sanchez threw to keller was sick. floated to the back of the endzone over two linebackers. for a rookie hes looking pretty good. much better than stafford at the moment.

[The Rook]

Wow, I have a feeling of deja :pooh:.

:helmet: The Rook

[skinsdude]

I have no reason to believe Zorn would call passes on those plays with a different QB

Why do you think that Zorn is so reluctant to call passing plays now? Do you think that maybe it's because he has no confidence in his quarterback? If Sanchez were here, and playing like he is today, do you think that Zorn would be more likely to call more passing plays. I know that I would.

[Vicious]

Ironically for a team that is known to be interested in EVERYONE, it was more the moves we did NOT make which may hurt this team in the future?

I'm hearing things like 'JC played respectable' and 'JC didn't make mistakes' but with either Cutler or Sanchez as our QB we would have a lot better future don't you think?

We haven't had a franchise QB in almost 20 years (B. Johnson doesn't count). IMO looking back on things Cutler was probably the answer along with getting Shanahan next year. After all we love to deal with the Broncos anyways!

Discuss yet again!

You're off base. May I suggest watching the Redskin game before you post. That might help you out a bit. If it doesn't, go watch Soccer, it's much simpler. You will be able to get a better grasp of it than Football, which is too complex for you.

[NewCliche21]

Why do you think that Zorn is so reluctant to call passing plays now? Do you think that maybe it's because he has no confidence in his quarterback? If Sanchez were here, and playing like he is today, do you think that Zorn would be more likely to call more passing plays. I know that I would.

No? Campbell only showed that he could do it against the Giants in a two-minute drill, he led the team up and down the field against the Rams, and he hit two receivers in the hands in the end zone.

So, no, I don't think that Zorn has any confidence in HIMSELF, which he shouldn't.

Just bow out, Zorn.

[Busch1724]

Can't be serious about Vick...he'll be a gadget play quarterback until he can regain some semblence of accuracy as a thrower.

[[[ghost]]]

The only benefit of having had Cutler or Sanchez at the helm is that they would have been allowed to pass the ball inside the 20.

Although with our receivers, they would have dropped the ball anyways. Or fumbled it.

Let Campbell throw.

Why do you think that Zorn is so reluctant to call passing plays now? Do you think that maybe it's because he has no confidence in his quarterback? If Sanchez were here, and playing like he is today, do you think that Zorn would be more likely to call more passing plays. I know that I would.

You couldn't be more right. Zorn simply refuses to let Campbell throw.

The problem is... when he has let Campbell throw, he's done it fairly well. He had a good day against the Giants and the Rams. It just seems that once we get inside the Red Zone, Portis is our QB, as well as Hunter Smith, although he's more of a scrambling QB than anything.

Campbell is the reason we were in position to score those 3 field goals. If we would allow him to play, we may score a TD or two, considering he's the only offensive player responsible for a touchdown.

[Chicken Fried]

There's no doubt we regret it. Cutler and sanchez are stars. Campbell is a good game manager.

[REDSKINZ-RIDEORDIE]

In hindsight we should have hired Rex Ryan.

MAJOR COSIGN........

I said it once and I'll say it again, I hate the fact that we signed a coach with such limit coaching experience. I know no one wanted to coach here and I havent completely given up on Zorn, but I wish we wouldve gotten a coach with experience as a HC or coordinator.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

the worst part is you know dan is watching sanchez with a rookie HC just shaking his head. hes gotta be livid every time he sees that mark sanchez pretty boy smile after the jets score or win.

[thedevilhimself]

No i'm not happy with this team exactly the way it is now.

But that isn't what the OP is about.

The OP seems to think that Cutler or Sanchez would solve the teams problems or at least the passing game.

Maybe i shouldn't have said 'only' but i think that an experienced playcaller/coach would help the passing game more then Cutler or Sanchez would.

About the OL i think they have improved and they are already playing better then last year.

I think that we are moving in the right direction with the infusion of youth with Rhinehart, Montgomery, Ed Williams.

http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?t=292276

I think we are good at scouting OL although we don't always keep them

Andrew Crummey is on a team somewhere and Kyle Devan is starting for the Dolphins.

But, i wish we would have drafted a stud to plug in somewhere in the starting line-up for this year and gone after Jason Brown at C instead of Dockery at G.

I don't think we should have resigned Hall for as much as we did but their was word that he had received offers from other teams and we needed a corner because the oft injured Springs was released.

I hope you aren't giving up on Hall already?

I think he's gonna bounce back.

I actually think his struggles in the past games are good for him, keep him humble and keep him working.

The dude is only 25 and was a 2 time pro-bowler 2 games doesn't make a season.

As much as dislike Synder he is the owner.

I think Cerrato is a good GM (scouting) and has only really been acting in that capacity since last year.

Imo Cerrato only problem is Synder.

Zorn deserves some lee-way because he has alot on his plate, way more then most 1st time coaches. (Creating and installing a new playbook, coaching the OC and the other offensive coaches, coaching the QB and calling plays)

^^This is why i think the biggest single gain could have been hiring a coach with some experience in the WCO as an offensive assistant, passing game coordinator, or as an 'offensive consultant' like Keith Gilbertson was to Holmgren in Seattle.

post about coaches:

http://www.extremeskins.com/showpost.php?p=6047978&postcount=60

Jason Campbell is fine, anyone that looks at the team and singles Jason out as the problem imo doesn't know football.

HTTR!

I tend to agree with you DG, I think there are some problems with the team . I am not sure Snyder is one . I think Snyder gets a lot o bad press which unfortunately nothing short of a superbowl run will undo ... Brian Bidwell anyone ?

IMO the problem is Zorn, not in his coaching or development but in the fact he is trying to do so much . I think he should step away and tell Stump Mitchell or Joe Bugel that he wants them to call the plays . Just even for portions of the game, because it would then let him take a step back and see the whole game .

One thing that really concerns me is his argument for the four running plays at the end of the game . I can understand his logic in that he wanted to run the clock out but equally you could have run almost the same amount of time off the clock and tried at least 1 toss into the End Zone . You can still play 4 downs they just don't all have to be the same play .

Zorn needs to stop reading paper and go back to enjoying what he enjoys. There may be internal pressure but I say F that .. what is the worst thing that will happen . Snyder is going to can your ass . Big Woop not exactly a career stain . He has to stop worrying about failure and go out and enjoy the games .

Going back to the OP point though . I am glad we don't have Cutler, the price was WAY too high for him and he has looked good and terrible in the first two games . A win over PIT or NE may not be that uncommon this year .

[REDSKINZ-RIDEORDIE]

Hasselback put up 28 points on this Rams team. ALL the blame can't go to Zorn's playcalling for only scoring 9 points. I really think its a combination of 2.

I think it's a combination of Zorn, JC and the fact that we have absolutely NO running game at all.

[Vicious]

Really, what did JC do in the red zone other than throw touchdown passes that were dropped and get a bogus call by the refs?

[Going Commando]

Jay Cutler hasn't been all that great this season. It's more of the same with him, one good game, one awful. That sounds like 8-8 football to me. I thought trading for him at the time would be a disaster and I still think it would have been.

On the other hand I really like Mark Sanchez as a prospect and I would have been happy drafting him because I thought he was a better total package even than Matt Ryan coming out of college. And I think he was a better prospect overall than any of the three big QBs (Snead, Bradford, Clausen) from this upcoming class. BUT did I think he was worth the price we would have had to pay to get him?

Let's speculate on what we might have had to give up for him. First off, it's a given that Campbell would have been a casualty of drafting him. Second, you can take away Orakpo for sure. On that alone I would not make the trade because I think Campbell has been playing pretty well and losing Orakpo would have been a tremendous longterm blow to our team.

Third, we weren't going to get any backroom deals like the Jets got giving up that pupu platter to move up 12 spots in the first round. I still can't believe the Browns took that deal... but they did it because of the Mangini connection between the teams, something we lack. We would probably have had to give up our 2010 first whose value has yet to be determined. If not our first then at least our second and 2009 third. I don't know about you all, but I am super excited for the 2010 class because, from top to bottom, it's going to be the best of the decade and it is packed with potential QB, OL, and DL prospects. That 2010 pick could have huge amounts of value, and Dan and Vinny were absolutely correct in not giving it up.

Is Sanchez worth Campbell, Orakpo and a potential 10 year franchise LT like Bryan Bulaga or Charles Brown? Or perhaps we don't get a LT and get a blue chip defensive prospect, then is Sanchez worth Campbell, Orakpo, and Corey Wootton/Gerald McCoy/Derrick Morgan/Trevard Lindley/Sean Weatherspoon, etc. ?

Or even assume that Campbell walks at the end of the season and we go QB in the first round. Sanchez as a whole is a more well-rounded and consistent prospect than either Clausen, Bradford, or Snead--his only weakness was inexperience. But he is only a hair better prospect than any of those three guys I mentioned. In a heartbeat I would take Clausen and Orakpo over just Sanchez. If we didn't have to give up our 2010 first but our 2nd and last year's third that means no more Barnes (a promising young corner we somehow managed to steal in the 3rd) and another elite 2010 prospect because it's estimated that something like 45-50 prospects in 2010 will have a first round grade. We'll be able to get better players than were taken in the top 20 picks in 2009 picking at the top of the second round in 2010.

The value just wasn't there for us picking 13th and Mark Sanchez eventually going 5th to trade to get him. Right now, we were better off sitting tight with Campbell and taking Orakpo and seeing who we will get in 2010. I have confidence in our FO to use that pick wisely. They've done really well with the first rounders lately, and gotten good value when they've traded down.

[Iced Coffee]

i wish we got sanchez or cutler.

vick not so much

[Ellis Dee]

You're off base. May I suggest watching the Redskin game before you post. That might help you out a bit. If it doesn't, go watch Soccer, it's much simpler. You will be able to get a better grasp of it than Football, which is too complex for you.

Haha way to insult me but have no basis for your bashing? I've been watching Redskins football longer than you have and feel as though I have a pretty good grasp on this team (My opinion of course).

I see major flaws in the entire way this team is run stemming from upper management (Let's face it, we need a true GM or at least give Cerrato the GM title and hold him accountable. Antonio Pierce comes to mind who if we had paid him the $$$, we have changed future drafts to fill that need), coaching and the players.

As a short-term fix I think Zorn and Campbell will be the ones replaced. In the end you can do all the analysis you want of why this team isn't scoring points but the blame is going to go on Zorn and Campbell.

My point in this post is can you honestly say this team will be better off in the future with Cutler/Sanchez or Campbell? I just don't see the latter.

[darrelgreenie]

I tend to agree with you DG, I think there are some problems with the team . I am not sure Snyder is one . I think Snyder gets a lot o bad press which unfortunately nothing short of a superbowl run will undo

I read in a Mike Lombardi article that Synder told Cerrato to get Cutler.

I guess we'll disagree on the Synder thing.

I just think that his ideas were the driving force behind some of the teams past blunders.

IMO the problem is Zorn, not in his coaching or development but in the fact he is trying to do so much . I think he should step away and tell Stump Mitchell or Joe Bugel that he wants them to call the plays . Just even for portions of the game, because it would then let him take a step back and see the whole game.

I think Zorn has to do to much because he doesn't have enough help from the rest of the offensive brain trust because they're all as new to their jobs. (Sherman Smith/Chris Meidt)

I think that play calling is the one thing he enjoys most about being a coach and i don't think he'll give that up.

But, if he had other coaches that say the game through 'WCO' eyes like he they could offer him more perspective when it comes to gameplanning before the games and tendencies during the game.

One thing that really concerns me is his argument for the four running plays at the end of the game . I can understand his logic in that he wanted to run the clock out but equally you could have run almost the same amount of time off the clock and tried at least 1 toss into the End Zone . You can still play 4 downs they just don't all have to be the same play .

+1 My main problem with Zorn's playcalling at this juncture is lack of creativity.

And i think the lack of creativity comes from fear.

I think he's afraid to fail.

So afraid that he plays it safe.

I lived in the Atlants for awhile and as they say in the south:

"If you're scared..get a dog"

+=Confidence

J/K lol

Going back to the OP point though . I am glad we don't have Cutler, the price was WAY too high for him

+1

I actually really like Cutler's game, but i'm glad he's not here.

He had a gifted receiver corps, great offensive line great playcalling in a weak division.

And the price was too high.

Can you imagined how Zorn would've reacted during Cutler's Green Bay game?

[REDALERT]

No, what we missed out on is good coachs IMO like Rex Ryan and guys like Lovi Smith. You have guys like Lovi and Rex that can take a defense and do wonders with them.

Also, they understand that defenses wins Championships and how to pick a qualified OC to manage the offense. We are lacking in both areas when it comes to coaches.