darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Did anyone notice that on the Rams last play of their was a receiver open in the middle of the field BEHIND the defense? And why do we need Horton(fast becoming my favorite Redskin) to make a TD saving pass break-up? Why is our SS matched up man-to-man with their best receiver on a play where we knew the Rams had to throw deep? http://www.nfl.com/videos/washington-redskins/09000d5d812cce6f/Redskins-Defense-Highlight-WK-02-vs-Rams-2009 I have doubts about many aspects of the defensive and offensive game management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJD2 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Thought the same thing watching the game. Our CB let him go so it must have been some type of zone coverage. Yes Horton made the play but it even looked like he was late breaking on the ball and picking up the open man. I odn't know if it is the coaching, the schemes, or the personnel (or combination of all 3), but our secondary is quickly becoming the achilles heel of this entrie team. That includes our O-Line that many thought (myself included) would be the big problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiscoBob Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 NFL.com video's never load for me? Was the receiver outside of Bulger's throwing range (or at least close to his range limit)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenster95 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Did anyone notice that on the Rams last play of their was a receiver open in the middle of the field BEHIND the defense?And why do we need Horton(fast becoming my favorite Redskin) to make a TD saving pass break-up? Why is our SS matched up man-to-man with their best receiver on a play where we knew the Rams had to throw deep? http://www.nfl.com/videos/washington-redskins/09000d5d812cce6f/Redskins-Defense-Highlight-WK-02-vs-Rams-2009 I have doubts about many aspects of the defensive and offensive game management. I raised this question on the game thread. It's a great question. Thank God it turned out all right, and it showed that Horton could turn it on -- or was so scared s****less that his adrenaline took over and he made the play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warpath11 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 It was a cover-2 zone if you watch the play the CB stops after 15 or so yards and lets the WR go to the safeties zone. It worked as it was drawn up whether that was the right defense at the time is a better question but it worked out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Rams Receivers open on last play And???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share Posted September 21, 2009 NFL.com video's never load for me?Was the receiver outside of Bulger's throwing range (or at least close to his range limit)? you might have to go the site and play the highlight from there It was a long throw but he probably could've made it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck812 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 I saw that when it happened... If Booger had chosen the other one then it could have been bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubynj Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 we didnt even give up 150 passing yards...how is the secondary the weak link again? The other team catches a few balls and suddenly D-hall sucks? cmon now,even the best defenses dont pitch a shutout every time. Tell the offense to do thier job and we wouldnt have to play so close to the vest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tr1 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Did anyone notice that on the Rams last play of their was a receiver open in the middle of the field BEHIND the defense?And why do we need Horton(fast becoming my favorite Redskin) to make a TD saving pass break-up? Why is our SS matched up man-to-man with their best receiver on a play where we knew the Rams had to throw deep? http://www.nfl.com/videos/washington-redskins/09000d5d812cce6f/Redskins-Defense-Highlight-WK-02-vs-Rams-2009 I have doubts about many aspects of the defensive and offensive game management. Hmmm... Yes, I see....it's very important to complain when a scheme WORKED! Brilliant! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRedfishCo Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Rams Receivers open on last play And???? Well I guess you have a bad memory....Last year the rams threw a late desperation bomb to......Donnie Avery same guy they threw on the last play yesterday. Unfortunately Avery caught the ball last year and moved them into FG range for the win. Why would you chance a 4th down bomb to a guy that runs 4.3 one-on-one with horton? That was the rams only shot and it was almost there for them. And???? Next Question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popeman38 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 The coverage was right in front of me (sec 340). I fully expected Avery to make the catch and have Brown beat us on a long FG again. You can't allow a team like that to hang around. We did last year and it bit us. I fully expected it again. Fortunately for us, it was Horton defending and not Torrence! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share Posted September 21, 2009 we didnt even give up 150 passing yards...how is the secondary the weak link again? The other team catches a few balls and suddenly D-hall sucks? cmon now,even the best defenses dont pitch a shutout every time.Tell the offense to do thier job and we wouldnt have to play so close to the vest. Um what are you talking about? Because you aren't talking about what we're talking about in this thread. Do i even mention D. Hall or the secondary as a weak link? Pay attention this thread is talking about 1 play. You either noticed the play or you didn't. If you didn't don't post. And allow the ones that actually want to talk about the play to have a discussion. What do you think of a defensive play call on the Rams 4th down knowing that they have to throw it deep that leaves 1 receiver BEHIND the defenses and their BEST receiver 1-on-1 with our SS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share Posted September 21, 2009 It was a cover-2 zone if you watch the play the CB stops after 15 or so yards and lets the WR go to the safeties zone. It worked as it was drawn up whether that was the right defense at the time is a better question but it worked out. First i wanted to find out if anyone noticed that there were open receivers as a starting point for the discussion. I know the play worked as designed, but i don't think it was the right play call. Imo Cover 2 in that situation doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Cover 2 Zone has the corners defending a short zone, why would anyone defend a short zone when you know they have to throw it deep? Wouldn't it make more sense to play Cover 2 Man/Under? Where the CB play man to man with the receivers with safety help over top? Imo its an example of a suspect call on the coaches part that puts the players in bad situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arsenic Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Ninnyboo's: the majority of Extremeskins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share Posted September 21, 2009 Rams Receivers open on last play And???? You're okay with receivers running open on the Rams 4th down play?:doh: Hmmm...Yes, I see....it's very important to complain when a scheme WORKED! Brilliant! You think that scheme worked? There is a receiver running open in the middle of the field BEHIND the defense. Horton was matched up with their best receiver and had to make a smart play to prevent him from making a catch because Avery had him beat. Why troll if you don't actually want to discuss the topic?:doh: There are some people that actually want to talk football, why not leave it to us? HTTR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbowman Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 It was a zone defense, Horton wasn't matched up with anyone. He was sitting in the zone, watching the QB. The CB released Avery for the saftey to pick up. That safety was Horton, who picked up the receiver the QB was looking at, and broke up the play. When you're playing a cover as a safety, you have to be aware of where teh receivers are, but you're also reading the QB to determine where he's going to throw the ball. The reason the receiver was past the safeties is because they knew the ball wasn't going his way. Good scheme, executed well. That's what happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share Posted September 21, 2009 It was a zone defense, Horton wasn't matched up with anyone. He was sitting in the zone, watching the QB. True, Horton isn't playing man-to-man at the snap. He is sitting in Zone playing deep 1/2. But, when the ball is in the air and is being thrown to a receiver the safety plays the ball and by default is playing the man the ball is going thrown to. Just like you say below: That safety was Horton, who picked up the receiver the QB was looking at, and broke up the play. My point is that relying on a safety (even a good one like Horton) To pick up the opposing teams fastest receiver on a go/fly route isn't smart. Horton could have very easily been beat by a better throw, thankfully Bulger doesn't have the arm. The CB released Avery for the saftey to pick up. Imo it makes way more sense to have Rogers(?) play Avery man-to-man and still have Horton backing him up with deep 1/2 Coverage. The reason the receiver was past the safeties is because they knew the ball wasn't going his way. We can hope the reason the receiver was past the FS is because he knew the ball wasn't going his way. But, typically no one should ever be behind the safeties with the ball in flight, especially in this situation. Good scheme, executed well. That's what happened. I respect your opinion although i don't agree. Is that the coverage you would've picked for the situation? What is the benefit of having the CBs in short zone when the Rams are 4th and 10? I think that pass was much closer to being a completion then it had to be and not many people realize it. "DB made a good play on the ball. I know better than that," Avery said. "Should have had it high and tight. It's all on me. I lost it for the team." http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/20/AR2009092002241_2.html?wprss=rss_print/sports&sid=ST2009092002988 I think it was a bad play call and Horton bailed us out. Just like Horton took points off the board earlier with his forced fumble. http://www.nfl.com/videos/washington-redskins/09000d5d812cc81a/Redskins-Defense-Highlight-WK-02-vs-Rams-2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jnhay Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Did anyone notice that on the Rams last play of their was a receiver open in the middle of the field BEHIND the defense?And why do we need Horton(fast becoming my favorite Redskin) to make a TD saving pass break-up? Why is our SS matched up man-to-man with their best receiver on a play where we knew the Rams had to throw deep? http://www.nfl.com/videos/washington-redskins/09000d5d812cce6f/Redskins-Defense-Highlight-WK-02-vs-Rams-2009 I have doubts about many aspects of the defensive and offensive game management. You assume incorrectly that they had to go long. All they needed was a first down, so if all our Dbacks go deep Steven Jackson would kill us with a long gain from a short pass. BTW, it's funny how even that short clip shows the senility of Sam (*thread worthy title?). Sam: "Look where the Redskins offense has the ball now!" Sonny: "Do they kneel down?" Sam: "Why not?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dackerman Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 The only reason he the other dude looks "open" is because our players were already closing on Avery. They already knew the ball wasn't going to be thrown in their direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThisSplitLip Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 If they were truly running a cover 2 zone then I would say yes that's a bad play call. Typically one of the only weak spots on a cover 2 is the area between the corner and the deep safety which also happens to be the sideline which is exactly where you'd want to go. Realistically a 15-20 yard out or post toward the sideline should be open with an accurate pass for a clock stopping first down. Now, that doesn't bring into consideration the Ram's pathetic offensive line not really giving Bulger a great chance imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTotalPackage Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 to me, it looks as if the "open" ram might have been covered, the pass was already in the air by the time the camera showed them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share Posted September 21, 2009 You assume incorrectly that they had to go long. All they needed was a first down, so if all our Dbacks go deep Steven Jackson would kill us with a long gain from a short pass. I would rather force them to throw underneath short of the 1st down marker and live with having to come up and make a tackle short of the 1st down. Then giving their fastest receiver a free run at our SS on 4th down. *BTW-They went long Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laurent Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 First i wanted to find out if anyone noticed that there were open receivers as a starting point for the discussion.I know the play worked as designed, but i don't think it was the right play call. Imo Cover 2 in that situation doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Cover 2 Zone has the corners defending a short zone, why would anyone defend a short zone when you know they have to throw it deep? Wouldn't it make more sense to play Cover 2 Man/Under? Where the CB play man to man with the receivers with safety help over top? Imo its an example of a suspect call on the coaches part that puts the players in bad situations. Why exactly did the Rams have to go deep again in that situation? There was a minute forty seconds left on the clock, that's plenty of time to get in field goal range. If you ask me Washington called the right coverage but execution almost let them down. Not so much Horton, who did a great job covering his man, but the two corners that let the receiver get behind them in the middle of the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share Posted September 21, 2009 The only reason he the other dude looks "open" is because our players were already closing on Avery. They already knew the ball wasn't going to be thrown in their direction. If they were closing on Avery shouldn't they be in front of the receiver there supposed to be covering and not trailing behind? The receiver is running in the middle of the field and the FS and the CB are behind him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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