ABSTRACT Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/1981-82-vs-2008-09-redskins-a.html 1981-82 vs. 2008-09 Redskins, A Comparison During my usual morning reading today, I came across a USA Today article that opened by sorta-kinda comparing the possibility of the 2009 Redskins making a Super Bowl run with the 1982 Redskins that did so in a strike-shortened season. The article points out the 1981 Redskins, like the 2008 version, finished 8-8. And that just as the 1982 Redskins entered the year with a second-year coach (Joe Gibbs) and a quarterback yet to inspire confidence in a fan base as being capable of leading a team to playoff success (Joe Theismann), so too will this year's Redskins with Jim Zorn and Jason Campbell. The article wasn't saying it's likely this year's Redskins will make a run; it was merely drawing those two simple lines of comparison. (Though for the most optimistic of Redskins fans that is probably the best way to think about things going into the season.) But I decided to take a second look at the comparison to see just how much these two teams stack up, at least statistically on the surface. This is as unscientific a comparison as you'll get, and by no means am I coming to any conclusions out of it. Just trying to see if/how they do compare. A little check on pro-football-reference.com, and this is what I came up with: 1981 Points Scored: 347 points (21.7/g) -- 10th of 28 in NFL 2008 Points Scored: 265 points (16.6/g) -- 28th of 32 in NFL 1981 Points Allowed: 349 points (21.8/g) -- 16th of 28 in NFL 2008 Points Allowed: 296 points (18.5/g) -- 6th of 32 in NFL 1981 Takeaway/Giveaway: -2, 16th in NFL 2008 Takeaway/Giveaway: 0, 17th in NFL Looking further into the comparison, you can see there is one difference that shows these two teams are going into Year 2 under much different circumstances. Unlike the 2008 Redskins that started the season 6-2 before crashing to a 2-6 finish and .500 record, the 1981 version did it almost exactly opposite, opening the year losing six of their first seven and then winning seven of their final nine to finish the year 8-8. The 1981 trajectory is much more comparable to Marty Schottenheimer's one year in Washington than it is Jim Zorn's first one, and indicates that this year's team doesn't have the momentum going into Year 2 that the 1982 team did. The Theismann-Campbell comparisons are tougher to look at than just the offensive and defensive efficiency of the 1981 and 2008 teams. Theismann was in his eighth season in 1981 and had started games in the previous five, while Campbell had started just 20 games entering last season. And the development of the passing game since Theismann's era obviously factors in. I did two comparisons -- first, Theisman's numbers in 1977-78 when he started six and then 14 games, respectively, because I thought it could compare to Campbell's seven and 13 starts in 06-07. And then of course, a comparison between 1981 and 2008: Theismann 77-78: Games Started 20; Passes Cmp/Attempted 271/572; Percentage 47.4; Yards 3690; Yds/G 184.5; Yds/Cmp 13.6; TDs 20; INTs 27 Campbell 06-07: Games Started 20; Passes Cmp/Attempted 360/624; Percentage 57.7; Yards 3997; Yds/G 199.9; Yds/Cmp 11.1; TDs 22; INTs 17 Theismann 1981 (4th year with 14 or more starts) Games Started 16; Cmp/Att 293/496; Percentage 59.1; Yards 3568; Yds/Cmp 12.2; Yds/G 223.0; TDs 19; INTs 20; Rating 77.3 Campbell 2008 (2nd year with 13 or more starts) Games Started 16; Cmp/Att 315/506; Percentage 62.3; Yards 3245; Yds/Cmp 10.3; Yds/G 202.8; TDs 13; INTs 6; Rating 84.3 Thoughts? --------------------------------------------------------------------- Despite the NEGATIVE talks I hear about this beat writer coming from Baltimore....I love his articles, his positive and unbias view, and we are blessed to have him. Despite all of the NEGATIVE talks about our team...I love this article on our team compares so much to the glory days. Well despite our 1991 campaign...decades 90-00 and 00-10 were MEDIOCRE but I think that we can make some new glory days and we might turn it around for the good in this new decade upon us. We might be the patriots of the 10-20 decade...you never know..We turned it around in the early 80s and we can in the early 10s...(10s??? I guess that's how you would write that) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 I am pretty sure this was already posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 If we could put up points like the '81 team, allied to this defense, we'd have a great shot at having similar success as they did in '82. Sadly, we can't, with little sign last year that, that will change any time soon; and as pointed out, the '81 team carried confidence and momentum over into '82, were as the current team has the reverse. Sorry, but I don't see much of a comparison to get excited about in the two. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 Every time the Giants won the Super Bowl, we won the following one. So naturally I thought we would win last year, didn't help that we started off hot too :doh: What I am basically trying to say is that I am not buying into anymore comparisons between two different eras. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABSTRACT Posted June 19, 2009 Author Share Posted June 19, 2009 If we could put up points like the '81 team, allied to this defense, we'd have a great shot at having similar success as they did in '82.Sadly, we can't, with little sign last year that, that will change any time soon; and as pointed out, the '81 team carried confidence and momentum over into '82, were as the current team has the reverse. Sorry, but I don't see much of a comparison to get excited about in the two. Hail. Unless you are in Redskins park and see them everyday in practice....you do not know what type of swagger they have going on. It sucks that you do not see anything positive in our offense going into next season though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 It sucks that you do not see anything positive in our offense going into next season though. Please, help me out here, and I've no intention of pulling your answer apart. I'm just curious as to what I'm missing on the offensive side of the ball. I see a HC that steadfastly refuses to look at his own scheme as being at fault at all, dictating an offensive unit that's pretty much the same as last years that couldn't score for ****, and even when it was winning games early it struggled to put teams away through that. I see a QB who's not going to be challenged despite the fact he's shown himself to be little better than average right through his career, and is coming off a woeful season in terms of production; playing behind an O-line that look's little better than it did last year, bar it's younger if less experienced in depth. Outside of the run game, I see little to get enthused about. And being as teams wised up and shut that down, knowing it was all we had, that's looking less and less of a weapon. What exactly do you see that's gona' bring about this Lazaruss like turnabout in our offensive fortunes? Hail. *I was positive and highly enthused btw back around the beginning of April, not just for the offense next season but going forward long after that. But then Denver went and valued Kyle freaking Orten over Jason Campbell, and that optimism was crushed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 What exactly do you see that's gona' bring about this Lazaruss like turnabout in our offensive fortunes? Hail. For one it is year two. Another reason is because I think that Zorn will change things around. I know he might seem a little ****y and reluctant to do so, but I think (hope) he has something up his sleeve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 For one it is year two. Another reason is because I think that Zorn will change things around. I know he might seem a little ****y and reluctant to do so, but I think (hope) he has something up his sleeve. That would be a more than welcome change, Zorn switching things around. I'll believe it when I see it based on what we've seen to date, but here's hoping your right and I'm wrong on that score. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsCrushCowboys Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 I get sucked in every year with the memories of that team and what they did. And yes, last year I bought into it again after the first 5 games. I hope to see a big turn around this year, but we ended on a down as opposed to the 82 team who came off a solid end in 81. Take a look at the roster in 82.....http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/was/1982.htm, I wish we had some of these type character guys with a chip on their shoulder in the locker room today. I hope for a great season, but not the same type of team or players in my opinion. HTTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABSTRACT Posted June 19, 2009 Author Share Posted June 19, 2009 What exactly do you see that's gona' bring about this Lazaruss like turnabout in our offensive fortunes? It is Jason Campbell's ONLY second year in the same consecutive offensive scheme. One or two changes in an O-line can deeply impact the success of an offense. We already rid of our worst players in the offensive line and replaced them with intriguiging prospects that can be some real positive suprises. Our WR position in looking good. Thrash is gone. Thomas and Kelly will be #3 and #4. I believe #5 and hopefully #6 can be filled with players such as ROYDELL WILLIAMS(Check his resume w/ Titans) and Marko Mitchell(Another Randy Moss imo). Doube TE Sets with Cooley and Davis. Keep an eye open for our RB spot as well. D. Dorsey, A. Aldridge, and Mason can break the roster with older players like Rocks and hopefully Betts getting knocked out of a spot. JIMMY ZIMMY!!! I think that he is a wonderful coach and everyone will see that next year. Look at our schedule!!!!!!!! lls Seriously...Look at it and compare it to last year....I honestly do not see us losing a lot of games if any with this stout hungry defense and developing WCO. I see alot of positive changes in our offense that can affect our success. The 1981 Redskin's defense was looking like our offense looked statistically so I do not see a big difference. With the defense that we have (which was vastly IMPROVED in the off-season)...an improved offense has us looking like this year's cinderalla story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MustangSteve Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 There's one major difference between these 2 teams, the 1981 redskins started off 0-5 and finished the year very strong, going into the next season with a lot of momentum. The 08 redskins started off hot but ended the season pathetic and looking even as bad as the lions in some games. Nothing has been shown or proven to us that this offense of last year has even fixed the 2nd half season downfall. If our offense could kick it in high gear, this team could win a titile with the defense we have, but this offense needs to score much more points then it averaged last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 Maybe it's an age thing, maybe it's just the fact we've been totally worn down by nigh on two decades of almost total mediocrity, but I wish I could say I shared your optimism man. I said I wouldn't go around pulling your thoughts to bits, and I won't, save to say the only part we agree fully on is the first part of the last sentence about the D. But they can't be expected to pull us through game on game as I fear they'll be asked to do yet again. Again, I wish I shared your enthusiasm. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 Oh, God, I hope there is a strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yeen80 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 I was barely alive in 81-82 so I don't remember anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Acre Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 The '82 team had what would become the best run blocking line of all time. (Passing-wise, it was mediocre. Theismann got sacked a lot. Then again, it took time for the young-uns to learn pass blocking; Starke being the only real vet starting.) The '91 OL was one of the best pass blocking lines of all time and a very good run blocking line, but '82 was better at the run, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 The '82 team had what would become the best run blocking line of all time. (Passing-wise, it was mediocre. Theismann got sacked a lot. Then again, it took time for the young-uns to learn pass blocking; Starke being the only real vet starting.) The '91 OL was one of the best pass blocking lines of all time and a very good run blocking line, but '82 was better at the run, IMO. Bingo The biggest difference is the 81 team had a young up and coming offensive line that came into it's own during the 82 season and really blossomed into the elite unit that we all came to know during the 82 playoffs. This team has an old line. If Orakpo can generate a pass rush, then I do think our defensive line compares favorable to the one we had in 1982. Also as others have pointed out, the 81 team began to gel and played better as the season went on whereas this team faded. I really don't see any similiarities between 1981-82 and 2008-09 other than it's Jim Zorn's second season. But then again Steve Spurrier had a pretty decent finish to his first season and how did his second season turn out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 When I saw this article first posted by Bubba at the Breaking News section I went to the comments to see if anyone else was thinking what I was thinking, and there was....... Seems like a more apt comparison, just for a statistical point of view, would be with the 1978-79 Skins. 1978 featured a rookie head coach and a QB (Joe Theismann) who was just coming into the starting role (he had split time in '77 with Billy Kilmer). The team started 6-0, then 7-2, then 8-3 before dropping the last five games to 8-8, and struggled offensively down the stretch. The '79 team finished 10-6 and a perfect storm on the last week (one team winning by like 35 points and then our heartbreaking loss to the Cowboys) knocked us out of the playoffs. Here are the statistics and a link: 1978: Offense: 273 points PF (17th of 28); Defense 283 points PA (10th of 28); turnover ratio minus 5 1979: Offense: 348 points PF (10th of 28); Defesne 295 points PA (10th of 28); turnover ratio plus 22 http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/was/1978.htm Perhaps one of the old-timers can talk about this team more. I was a Skins fan by then but only 11-12 years old and had moved to enemy territory (Philly) by that time. Point is that even though the Super Bowl is the ultimate goal, sometimes we have to be satisfied with baby steps first, so to speak. As I recall, the '79 team was pretty good and would've been a force to be reckoned with in the playoffs. As it turned out, the Rams, with a 9-7 record and divisional winners, were the team who wound up playing the Steelers in the Super Bowl. Of course, the postscript is that John Riggins held out the next year, the team stumbled to 6-10 in 1980, Pardee got fired, and Jack Kent Cooke and Bobby Beathard decided to roll the dice with this no-name coach Joe Gibbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Acre Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 I'm about your age, and yeah, for anyone who was a Skins fan in 1979, that last game is the worst game ever. Forget Longley on T-giving; that didn't knock a very strong team out of the playoffs. Riggins was arguably better in '79 then he would become with the Hogs (although he didn't have the Hogs, laying 34 points on Dallas in the 70's did require a pretty good line. Who knows - watching Riggins v. the Steel Curtain would've been fun, but it would've been an alternate universe since Joe Gibbs would never have become our coach. The '79 team finished 10-6 and a perfect storm on the last week (one team winning by like 35 points and then our heartbreaking loss to the Cowboys) knocked us out of the playoffs. Perhaps one of the old-timers can talk about this team more. I was a Skins fan by then but only 11-12 years old and had moved to enemy territory (Philly) by that time. Point is that even though the Super Bowl is the ultimate goal, sometimes we have to be satisfied with baby steps first, so to speak. As I recall, the '79 team was pretty good and would've been a force to be reckoned with in the playoffs. As it turned out, the Rams, with a 9-7 record and divisional winners, were the team who wound up playing the Steelers in the Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMK9973 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 *I was positive and highly enthused btw back around the beginning of April, not just for the offense next season but going forward long after that. But then Denver went and valued Kyle freaking Orten over Jason Campbell, and that optimism was crushed. Of course, Denver also Valued Kyle orten over Jay Cuttler.... so I'm not sure they are the way to Judge talent.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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