Ted Leonsis: How to build a team

[PokerPacker]

What Ted laid out can be applied to any professional team sport. Football, Baseball, Basketball or Hockey.

It reads like how to manage a sports franchise 101. So to blow it out of the water because Hockey gets players from outside of the draft is pretty weak.

well actually, players from other countries are still a part of the draft. its not like you just go to russia and say "I want you, you, and... you". Their drafted along with everyone else in the league. only difference is that players you draft don't usually make it into the NHL that year, they play in other leagues to develop. in the case of foreign players, they often continue to play in a league in their country before they get called up to play in America (and even then they usually go into the AHL before being then called up to the NHL).

[PokerPacker]

The Caps had the worst record and was able to draft Alex the Great the following year was a lockout correct? And instead of letting the Caps draft #1 again the league tweaked it so Spittsburgh landed the much hyped Sidney Crosby which I wonder if the Caps would have taken him if they were in position to get him.

So we just need to have back to back top 3 selections in the April Draft where one in a decade can't miss players are there for us to grab and Vinny and Danny become geniuses with a fanbase understanding of the sorry seasons?

Should we start with a 1-15 season this year and dump everyone in the uncapped year if it exists?

While I don't doubt the league rigged it to give a staggering Pittsburgh team that was on the verge of moving the first pick, the way the NHL is set up, you can't get the first round draft pick two years in a row. The last 5 teams in the NHL enter a lottery to see what place they'll get their pick, the lower you are in the standings, the more likely you'll get an earlier pick. so the caps weren't gonna get the first-round pick, but I also wouldn't be surprised to see that Pittsburgh winning the lotto wasn't exactly legitimate.

[NavyDave]

While I don't doubt the league rigged it to give a staggering Pittsburgh team that was on the verge of moving the first pick, the way the NHL is set up, you can't get the first round draft pick two years in a row. The last 5 teams in the NHL enter a lottery to see what place they'll get their pick, the lower you are in the standings, the more likely you'll get an earlier pick. so the caps weren't gonna get the first-round pick, but I also wouldn't be surprised to see that Pittsburgh winning the lotto wasn't exactly legitimate.

I was wondering how they could do that when the league didn't play for that year and it would've made sense for the Caps to get the same draft position

[HailGreen28]

Have to disagree with you here. The front office has been pretty quiet the past few off-seasons, and only this off-season got 3 key players that could help the franchise. A phenomenal Defensive Lineman, an pretty good Offensive Lineman, and retained a very good young Cornerback. Heading into the draft there are two positions that could use some additional bolstering are Offensive Line and Linebacker. I can see the Front Office targetting a couple Offensive Linemen with the first pick (Oher, Monroe, Smith, Robinson, etc.). I could also see them trading down, still picking up an Offensive Lineman with the first pick, getting a good Linebacker with the second pick, and another Offensive Lineman with the third pick. I call that having an excellent plan this off-season and sticking with it.

Yes, people could say we need a new Quarterback, but they are trying to give JC one more year to develop under Zorn's coaching.

Hoo boy. Agree with you on Campbell, but for the rest.....:doh:

Here's how active we've been in free agency the past few seasons. Link

And now you're expecting Vinny to draft well. Did last year, and 1999-2000, 2002-2003 teach you nothing?

We can dream. :wish:

[DieHardSkins88]

HailGreen28- We have drafted solid players so why call them out on drafting busts all the time? Carlos Rogers, Chris Samuels, Landry, Sean Taylor, Chris Cooley, Monty, Golston, Chris Horton, Fred Smoot, Derrick Dockery, Rocky, so you can't just say 'vinny doesn't know how to draft,' that's bs. Also, the jury's still out on last years draft class. You can't simply call last year a bust, especially when judging wide receivers.

[DButz65]

You all correcting the "Jason Candle" spelling thing..

Its a joke and was a geico commercial here in the dc area

[HailGreen28]

HailGreen28- We have drafted solid players so why call them out on drafting busts all the time? Carlos Rogers, Chris Samuels, Landry, Sean Taylor, Chris Cooley, Monty, Golston, Chris Horton, Fred Smoot, Derrick Dockery, Rocky, so you can't just say 'vinny doesn't know how to draft,' that's bs. Also, the jury's still out on last years draft class. You can't simply call last year a bust, especially when judging wide receivers.

Pssst. :secret: Vinny DIDN'T draft most of those guys. Gibbs did.

[DieHardSkins88]

Vinny was part of the scouting department during gibbs tenure, last year wasn't his first draft with us, if im not mistaken

[SWFLSkins]

1. Ask yourself the big question: "Can this team--as constructed--ever win a championship?" If the answer is yes -- stay the course and try to find the right formula -- if the answer is no, then plan to rebuild.

If this worked in the NFL 20 teams each year would be blowing it all up. The Hockey roster might work this way and from time to time an NFL team needs to blow it all up, but to allude that the Redskins right now should blow it up and not just tweak is really short sighted. If blown up the Redskins would be further away from being competitive in the short term. This team is not far off. I think also Snyder is still judged from past mistakes, but this is Snyder post Gibbs II. I think the front office set-up now is much better. And it time to see if Vinny is actually a good football mind or not. But please show some patience, the Pittsburghs and NE's of the NFL did not just materialize the last few years. My take, Snyder is coming along.

[Smoot Point Really]

When is the last time you saw someone trade a 'prospect' in football? NFL to other leagues is like apples and oranges. There are no "minor leagues" and they usually trade expensive veterans, not prospects...

You also need 22 starters and at least 3 special teamers to field a solid NFL team (barring injury), that's about the size of a complete NHL roster. You could probably take a few years and go through the type of rebuilding you are talking about, but in the NFL you have to use the draft, free agency, and trade... You also need a LOT of luck.

[Smoot Point Really]

Vinny was part of the scouting department during gibbs tenure, last year wasn't his first draft with us, if im not mistaken

It was the first with him "calling the shots"... It's clear that the Redskins are embracing the notion that Vinny should be held accountable from last year on. Why not accept that?

[DieHardSkins88]

What you mean, i have accepted that. I was saying that he played a huge part in aquiring the talent we already have through the draft. Why can't you people accept that Vinny isn't all that bad. If that was the case then how could people be saying he can't draft after his first draft? Makes no sense

[HailGreen28]

Vinny was part of the scouting department during gibbs tenure, last year wasn't his first draft with us, if im not mistaken

Correct. Vinny was GM in all but name in 1999, 2000, 2002, and 2003. And of course with the official title in 2008.

The missing years: Schotty fired him in 2001 (Danny brought him back), and Gibbs called the shots in 2004-2007.

Go read about 1999, 2000, 2002, and 2003. I recommend keeping any breakable or sharp objects from yourself if you're a Skins fan.

Example link.

[DieHardSkins88]

Hoo boy. Agree with you on Campbell, but for the rest.....:doh:

Here's how active we've been in free agency the past few seasons. Link

And now you're expecting Vinny to draft well. Did last year, and 1999-2000, 2002-2003 teach you nothing?

We can dream. :wish:

So if vinny played no part in drafting the talent we already have, why did he go back to the 1999-2000, 2002-2003 draft to say that his drafts sucked? The logic is lacking

[DieHardSkins88]

Sorry hailgreen im not trying to call you out, rather show the other guy who tried to insult me how he misinterpreted our argument.

[HailGreen28]

Sorry hailgreen im not trying to call you out, rather show the other guy who tried to insult me how he misinterpreted our argument.

You're cool.

[HailGreen28]

So if vinny played no part in drafting the talent we already have, why did he go back to the 1999-2000, 2002-2003 draft to say that his drafts sucked? The logic is lacking

Because that's when Vinny and Danny were in charge.

Schotty and Gibbs insisted on making the final decisions themselves, when they were there.

[Reaganaut]

This shows you the difference between a world class corporation America Online vs. Snyder Communications. Someone who changed the Internet forever, vs a guy who sold magazine subscriptions. Too bad Leonsis wasn't into football... how many division trophies would we have already?

[chipwhich]

.74 + .76 = 1.5 seasons, certainly more consistency than the Redskins have ever had under Snyder.

Too tired to banter over your whole thread which is just silly.

OK, so mathematically 1.5 seasons.

Regardless.

Ted Leonsis has been owner for longer that Snyder has been owner.

His franchise has been as much if not more of a disappointment in his respective sport.

The one time they lucked into the stanley cup, they did so by beating all lower seeded teams only to be totally outclassed.

My point is, Leonsis has now shelled out "1.5" seasons of competitive hockey and you want to annoint him as the best owner in town?

I have been watching hockey since I was a little boy. I have seen better Capitals teams than we have now. I have never seen a championship.

You mention how we were bad with Ovechkin initially. Yeah because we had a horrible coach. Just like it was a moronic move to bring in Jaromir Jagr and have Butch Cassidy as his coach. Thats like bringing in Brett Farve and making Colt Brennan his QB coach.

Leonsis appears to be on the right track. He still has won nothing. His team has done less over the last 5 years than the Skins have. His team was SUCH a doormat that we got the first pick in the draft in a year that the the basketball equivalent of Lebron James was available. Let the WIzards or Redskins be so lucky.

I am glad you are excited over the Caps, I am too. But it was a LOOOOOOOOOOOONG road to this point and Leonsis has been on that road longer than Snyder.

[elkabong82]

Because that's when Vinny and Danny were in charge.

Schotty and Gibbs insisted on making the final decisions themselves, when they were there.

Spurrier had full control also. If Vinny has really been essentially a GM all this time, why didn't he get a promotion to that affect sooner? Vinny's first offseason with full control was last offseason, and the approach then was a dramatic departure from what the team had done in the past. Yet the past draft mistakes are all credited to Vinny, and any success are credited to coaches? That's about as baised and unrealistic as you can get. Either the coaches were given full control, and therefor are the ones accountable for past moves, or Vinny has been behind them all, and gets credit for good and bad moves. Since we don't know the inner operations, all we can go off is job titles, which give you inherent responsibilities for the position. Vinny was an evalutor and provided insight, he wasn't a decision maker until his promotion this past offseason. But I know, I know, some would rather be able to criticize than watch a plan follow through. It's been 1 season, to not allow anymore time than that is unrealistic.

[HailGreen28]

Spurrier had full control also. If Vinny has really been essentially a GM all this time, why didn't he get a promotion to that affect sooner? Vinny's first offseason with full control was last offseason, and the approach then was a dramatic departure from what the team had done in the past. Yet the past draft mistakes are all credited to Vinny, and any success are credited to coaches? That's about as baised and unrealistic as you can get. Either the coaches were given full control, and therefor are the ones accountable for past moves, or Vinny has been behind them all, and gets credit for good and bad moves. Since we don't know the inner operations, all we can go off is job titles, which give you inherent responsibilities for the position. Vinny was an evalutor and provided insight, he wasn't a decision maker until his promotion this past offseason. But I know, I know, some would rather be able to criticize than watch a plan follow through. It's been 1 season, to not allow anymore time than that is unrealistic.

The reason Vinny wasn't given the actual title earlier is because he's a failure at it. And maybe Danny "deserves" the title more than Vinny.

Vinny failed in 1999 and 2000. That's why Danny gave Marty full control, Then after the free agent and drafting debacles of the Spurrier era, Danny gave Gibbs full control.

The only thing Vinny has been "proven" at is scout with the 49ers. Once he got promoted there, things went to hell drafting and personel decisions for the future.

Now apparently Danny thinks Vinny has improved, or maybe he just wants his old fantasy football guru making picks for his NFL team again.

I'm giving credit where credit is due. Other than when Schotty and Gibbs were here, it's been Vinny and Danny pulling the trigger on all the deals here. Think about it, and compare draft and FA classes. :doh:

edit: Spurrier DID NOT have full control. he basically told Vinny - "just find me some players to run the fun-n-gun". Vinny did the picking.

[elkabong82]

The reason Vinny wasn't given the actual title earlier is because he's a failure at it. And maybe Danny "deserves" the title more than Vinny.

Vinny failed in 1999 and 2000. That's why Danny gave Marty full control, Then after the free agent and drafting debacles of the Spurrier era, Danny gave Gibbs full control.

The only thing Vinny has been "proven" at is scout with the 49ers. Once he got promoted there, things went to hell drafting and personel decisions for the future.

Now apparently Danny thinks Vinny has improved, or maybe he just wants his old fantasy football guru making picks for his NFL team again.

I'm giving credit where credit is due. Other than when Schotty and Gibbs were here, it's been Vinny and Danny pulling the trigger on all the deals here. Think about it, and compare draft and FA classes. :doh:

edit: Spurrier DID NOT have full control. he basically told Vinny - "just find me some players to run the fun-n-gun". Vinny did the picking.

Nice revisionist history there.

"The reason Vinny wasn't given the actual title earlier is because he's a failure at it?" Umm, what? Vinny hadn't held the title before, so how could he be a failure at it? Why would somebody hire someone to a position if they are a know failure at it? The whole "Snyder and Cerrato Out to Rule the World" conspiracy stuff is getting old. They are not Monty Burns and Smithers. That's a cartoon, this is the real world. We know Snyder interferes and carries a lot of influence, but we don;t know how directly involved he gets, so why keep pretending otherwise? We don't know the inner operations of the FO, all we have is titles and the responsibilities which come with them to go on. So, using facts instead of gossip, Cerrato wasn't making decisions until last year.

I double checked on the Spurrier thing, and you are correct that Spurrier was in charge as a coach only. However, it appears in those times Dan was in charge. Gibbs came in and had full control. Snyder said Gibbs had a large effect on him, and for the most part stayed out of the way unless it was time to go get a player Gibbs wanted. Whose to say Snyder didn't learn to become less involved? Vinny was promoted after Gibbs left, taking on the responisbilities of a GM. That's just speculation though, because as I said, we don;t know the inner operations, the only concrete thing we have are job titles. Vinny has direct accountability now, so let's see what happens. Allow things to develop and then we can examine. To write everything off after just 1 season is, again, unrealistic.

[chipwhich]

Nice revisionist history there.

I double checked on the Spurrier thing, and you are correct that Spurrier was in charge as a coach only. However, it appears in those times Dan was in charge.

I agree with your post. You can't convince me Vinny an NFL GM would pick all those gator QB's and receivers and trung as a running back. There was more to that story than Vinnie making all of those decisions. You can dislike Vinnie all you want, but to say he was a gator lover is a little naive.

[BayouBrave86]

the caps would be where they are right now even without Ovi. Its the players around him, the intensity that the coach has brought with him and the scheme as well.

Wrong. Without Ovechkin the Caps are probably a 6 or 7 seed right now. I'm sorry but if you took the best player in the game off the team it is going to have an impact. The Patriots are a good example. They lost arguably the best player in the game and they went from elite to above-average. No way in hell the Caps are sitting 2nd in the east right now without Ovechkin. The defense still is very average and they need to do something to improve it by the trade deadline this week. What impresses me the most about the Caps is all of the youth and assets they have to trade. It is truly awesome to cheer for them. And yes, the party has just begun for the Caps.:dj:

[HailGreen28]

Nice revisionist history there.

"The reason Vinny wasn't given the actual title earlier is because he's a failure at it?" Umm, what? Vinny hadn't held the title before, so how could he be a failure at it? Why would somebody hire someone to a position if they are a know failure at it? The whole "Snyder and Cerrato Out to Rule the World" conspiracy stuff is getting old. They are not Monty Burns and Smithers. That's a cartoon, this is the real world. We know Snyder interferes and carries a lot of influence, but we don;t know how directly involved he gets, so why keep pretending otherwise? We don't know the inner operations of the FO, all we have is titles and the responsibilities which come with them to go on. So, using facts instead of gossip, Cerrato wasn't making decisions until last year.

I double checked on the Spurrier thing, and you are correct that Spurrier was in charge as a coach only. However, it appears in those times Dan was in charge. Gibbs came in and had full control. Snyder said Gibbs had a large effect on him, and for the most part stayed out of the way unless it was time to go get a player Gibbs wanted. Whose to say Snyder didn't learn to become less involved? Vinny was promoted after Gibbs left, taking on the responisbilities of a GM. That's just speculation though, because as I said, we don;t know the inner operations, the only concrete thing we have are job titles. Vinny has direct accountability now, so let's see what happens. Allow things to develop and then we can examine. To write everything off after just 1 season is, again, unrealistic.

I'm confused. What are you saying that I "revised" history-wise? :whoknows:

Who else was picking players for the Skins in 1999-2000? Nobody had the title of GM then, it was just Vinny and Danny up in the booth, though.

I don't know WHY Danny kept Vinny after the failures of 1999 and 2000. Only that Danny hired Vinny right back after canning Marty.

Snyder cut Danny Woefull (sp?) link - middle of page, Vinny cut a player possibly without Spurrier even knowing it! link

My point is that Vinny's had the job WITHOUT the responsibility. Maybe because Danny deserves more blame. But all Danny had for "expert" advice, was old bug-eyes.

1999-2000, 2002-2003, and now 2008.. We have PLENTY of years to evaluate Vinny. Can you look at this year and tell me with a straight face that Vinny's learned a thing since 1999?