OT- Should Annika Sorenstam be allowed to play on the PGA tour?

[Tommy-the-Greek]

I just wanted to know what everyone thinks about this. I have no problems with her playing as long as she has to tee off at the same spot as the men. I think it is safe to say that we all love the competition that is sports. So why shouldn't she be allowed to compete?

Spotlight on Sorenstam

Annika Sorenstam looks forward to her upcoming challenge of being the first LPGA Tour player to play in a PGA event in over 50 years. She will be playing the Bank of America Colonial from May 19-25 at Colonial C.C. in Ft. Worth, Texas.

Annika's decision to play in this PGA Tour event has created quite a stir in the media industry. Follow the story throughout this season right here on LPGA.com.

During her April 28 interview on Fox Sports Net's "Best Damn Sports Show Period," Annika responds to Tiger Woods' statement that it will only help women's golf if she plays well at the Colonial. Watch: REAL | WINDOWS. The "Best Damn Sports Show Period" airs on FOX Sports Net weeknights at 8 p.m. ET and late night.

Annika was interviewed live via satellite on CNN Headline News on April 28. Watch: REAL | WINDOWS

Annika appeared on CBS' 60 Minutes on April 13. Watch: REAL | WINDOWS and see pictures>>

See exclusive behind-the-scenes photos from Annika's appearance on NBC's "The Tonight Show with Jay Leno.. See pictures>>

During the Kraft Nabisco Championship, LPGA & PGA players and commentators talked about Annika playing in Colonial. Watch: REAL | WINDOWS

Annika appeared on NBC's "Today." See exclusive behind-the-scenes photos.

See photos from her ESPN interview>>

Read statement from Commissioner Ty Votaw>>

What are other pros saying?

Check out Annika's cover story on USAToday.com

Read the transcript from Annika's Feb. 13 teleconference

Talk about it on the LPGA.com messageboards

[Bang]

3 schools of thought.

One, if she can cut the mustard, why not. i don't see any reason for stopping a person that has the ability to play golf competitively at the highest level just based on sex.

Two, the LPGA is losing audience, and this is a last ditch effort to drag some attention to their game. This Sorenstam person could be no different than any mook pulled out of the crowd at halftime to sink a half court shot for a million bucks.

Three, and perhaps most relevant, golf is an extremely boring elitist sport that can put even the most hyperactive kid right to sleep. Who cares who's playing.

"Well, y'know tom, golfer x has really made soemthing of himself. He came from a meager background, with his father struggling to keep the family going on a meager $250k a year. Poor guy had to play his learning years on a country club course that actually had to let women AND blacks play on the same fairways."

"Yes, Bill, there's something to be said for the kind of courage this athlete displays....."

Gimme a break.

By the way,, shame on these male golfers ****ing about it. Talk about a bunch of crybabies....

~Bang

[fansince62]

Bang....

1) go to a PGA tournament...they are very well attended.

2) golf has been one of the fastest growing sports in the country for a while

3) the principle needs to be applied in reverse: allow men to compete on the LPGA circuit......otherwise, understand this for the political sham that it is.........

[AJWatson3]

Originally posted by fansince62

3) the principle needs to be applied in reverse: allow men to compete on the LPGA circuit......otherwise, understand this for the political sham that it is.........

i don't care if she plays as long as the above is followed.

[fansince62]

concur...but we both know this will never happen....

as much as it disturbs some, we are going to have to recognize that there are legitimate areas/activities in which segregation has its merits.......the concept has to be tightly controlled, so don't go overboard fellas.....but clearly, athletic competition between the sexes appears to be one such venue....here's the problem: in any given sport, there are probably a handful of women who can compete with men. how do you allow this but not allow men to compete in corresponding women's leagues (when they exist)?

[RTerps2002]

Golf is funny about things.. They won't let the one guy play because he can't walk.... It is unfortunate that they feel above the rules it is why so many people don't care

[Art]

I'm torn on this.

First, it's not really known, but, there are very few "men" only leagues, whether in high school, college or professional. If a woman can play, she can play on a team that has men. For example, if a woman basketball player was good enough, she'd be on the floor for Coach K tomorrow.

Athletics at a very high level tend to have men because they tend to be better -- either greatly so or more narrowly depending on the sport -- than women. But, women, if capable, are not precluded from participation on a team or league that has men.

I think if Sorenstam is good enough, she should absolutely play on the PGA. But, she should probably have to qualify. Even with an exemption I have no issues with her playing, especially if she proves to be good enough.

My problem is the reverse. Women are accorded secondary teams and leagues. They have every ability, if they are good enough, to play for the team typically comprised of men. But, since they rarely are good enough, they have leagues of their own that men are pretty much excluded from. I was better than any woman scholorship athlete in basketball when I was in school. But, I wasn't good enough for a scholorship on the university team, though I made the team before breaking my ankle and switching to rugby .

Anyway, I don't like the extra options available to women that are not available to men. Men should immediately be allowed to qualify to play on the LPGA tour the moment Sorenstam strikes the first ball. If that happens, then I'll have no complaints at all.

[MichaelM]

I'm with most on where I stand on this. Overall, I don't really care too much. She has dominated the LPGA just as much as Tiger has on the PGA. She should be able to compete against the best and see where she stacks up against the best, ONLY if she plays by the same rules. If she plays with the PGA, then she needs to tee off from the same tees as the rest of the field. The only negative I see from all of this is when men start trying to play on the LPGA. Martha Burke wouldn't mind would she???

[B&G]

LPGA rules clearly state that no one can compete in an LPGA event unless that person was born a woman (apparently eliminating any man who wants to win a U.S. Women's Open so badly that he'd undergo a sex change); PGA rules contain no such gender requirement.

As someone who loves the game and has played it for over 35 years, I am delighted that Sorenstam is playing. In so doing, she must abide only by the rules of golf and of the tournament in which she competes. No other restrictions should be placed upon her, nor should she receive any consideration not given to her fellow competitors.

[Bang]

Originally posted by fansince62

Bang....

1) go to a PGA tournament...they are very well attended.

2) golf has been one of the fastest growing sports in the country for a while

3) the principle needs to be applied in reverse: allow men to compete on the LPGA circuit......otherwise, understand this for the political sham that it is.........

If men should be allowed to compete at the lower level, ie: the ladies tee, what's to say Carl Lewis shouldn't enter the 100 meter dash of the special olympics and win every single year?

It doesn't matter how well attended a PGA event is,, this is about the LPGA attendance and trying to draw attention to that, if my second school of thought holds water.

I have zero problem with this lady playing with the men. As i said, the PGA is supposed to be the peak of the sport, the highest attainable level of competitive golf. I don't see golf as a sport comparable with others in terms of dividing the sexes based on physical ability. As Art pointed out, there is a marked difference in most other sports.

If she can hit it from the men's tee and play competitively, why not? It's not like she has to jump high and slam dunk, or bulk up and block or tackle. All she has to do is be able to hit it far and walk to physically keep up. In terms of the close game, I don't see how having testicles will make anyone a better putter or chip shot artist.

However, she should not be afforded any special privelege. IF she qualifies, why the heck can't she play?

~Bang

[MichaelM]

Originally posted by B&G

LPGA rules clearly state that no one can compete in an LPGA event unless that person was born a woman (apparently eliminating any man who wants to win a U.S. Women's Open so badly that he'd undergo a sex change); PGA rules contain no such gender requirement.

As someone who loves the game and has played it for over 35 years, I am delighted that Sorenstam is playing. In so doing, she must only abide only by the rules of golf and of the tournament in which she competes. No other restrictions should be placed upon her, nor should she receive any consideration not given to her fellow competitors.

I did not know this. I do have to wonder how the LPGA cnan do this, but Augusta is blasted for being an all male club. What would have been said if the PGA refused to allow Sorenstam to play because she is a women?

[Om]

WHole lotta doors open up on this one.

Art mentioned the main point I'd make, and that's that the only real problem I have with her playing on the PGA tour is that she didn't have to qualify. If it's only a one or two shot deal, then fine, I have no problem with her getting an exemption. Hell, Mark Rypien got on at the Kemper a few years ago, shot like 89-90 and limped away humbled. If she (or any other woman) ends up getting regular exemptions, though, and begin appearing as a matter of course at weekly tournaments regardless of how well they do from week to week, I'll begin to have a problem with it.

I would frankly find it interesting as hell to see a woman qualify for the tour and make some money at it. If for no other reason than to see arrogant playeres like Vijay, or marginal ones like ... well, I don't know their names because they're marginal :cool: ... have to both eat their words AND maybe hit the weight room and step it up lest they be embarrassed on a weekly basis.

As a sideshow, like the Colonial is, I'm fine with it. I'll even be rooting for her to make the cut because if she does, the fallout will be SO much fun to witness. If she gets smoked, well, so now we know. I just DON'T want to see the "exemption bunny" thing become the norm. If the ladies want to hunt with the big dogs, make them leap off the porch and earn it.

As to men therefore being allowed to complete on the women's tours, as a kind of tit for tat (ahem) ... I happen to think that's a bit silly. I am not threatened as a male by females who accept the differences in physical performance levels, and want to test themselves against the boys. If Annika or young Ms. Lu are better than some of the boys, seems to me the product being put out there is better for their having shoved the weaker male players aside in favor of a better player, regardless of the shape of their chests.

I just don't feel compelled to put them in their place by then saying, "oh yeah? Well then we're gonna take over YOUR tour, honey." Seriously, what would be the point? Seems to me the women are saying hey, we KNOW you guys are better at this ... how about letting us mix it up a bit and see if we can't hang with ya once in a while?

By the way, I don't know who it was I heard on the radio talking about this, but somebody made the point that there is no "M" in front of "PGA" ... but there IS an "L" in front of "LPGA." One could well make the case that the PGA is about the best golfers on the planet. Personally, if some of them who qualify happen to be women, so much the better. Or at least ... none's the worse.

[riggins44]

I really don't have a problem with this, because she'll being playing the same rules and same course. Advantage...zip!

I also believe with all the media and attention that she stands

very little chance of playing her best. The circus atmosphere

around her will take away from the focus she needs to do

her best. She'll only make it easier for the next one to try.

With all the whining and comments coming from the tour players,

makes me wonder if they aren't nervous about her maybe showing them up. Her chances of winning are slim, but if she makes the cut and plays respectable...hate to be the ones behind on the leaderboard.

Besides, golf is a game where it's you against the course. The conditions will be indentical for everyone. This isn't match play,

which more like head-to-head competition. In golf, you normally don't root against anyone.

I was surprised at Singh's comments. Being a minority you would

have thought his comments would have been more positive to

try and make things easier for her.

Good luck to Anna and the rest of the field.

[Tarhog]

Art and Om nailed this one. Can you imagine being a talented male golfer struggling to get your tour card for a year or more in the PGA qualifying school, and then seeing Annika or another female pro waltzing on in. I don't begrudge her the right to play, but she is getting preferential treatment, no question about that. I view it the same way I do women in the military. If she can cut it, more power to her. But they shouldn't do what they've done in the US military, lower every physical standard and call it 'equal'. Personally, I'd like to see her do well. But I suspect we'll see her miss the cut.

[scottb]

The growth of women's athletics has been a positive benefit to the American culture. I hardly think that those rare instances in which a female can compete with the guys justify trashing the women’s only teams...it's just petty retribution.

For those instances where the women do compete, no edge or advantage should be provided.

Considering the few number of female athletes that could qualify for crossing over to the male sporting arena, this issue falls into the molehill category.

[Phat Hog]

Let her compete... my thought is that after she has been thoroughly trounced, she’ll go back to the LPGA where there is more equitable competition. If she does well, then the men should be allowed to play the LPGA. BTW, she needs to play by current PGA rules!

Someday they'll figure out that men and woman are indeed different.

[phanatic]

I don't have a problem with it, after all, this nation has become so politically correct what would you expect?:doh:

[Skins26]

Yeah sure, as long as they allow that Scott Contact guy to play in the womens tour like he said he was gonna do.

Im with VJ on this one, there are guys trying to make a living and just because some women wants to come try it out doesnt mean she can. She can go hit from the mens tees and compare her scores to those of Tiger Woods if she wants to, and that doesnt take some guy who struggles to make cuts spot away from him.

[panel]

If I were some how allowed to compete in a PGA event, I would (Even though I have only played golf onse, when I was 8 years old). And I think that I would go very un-noticed; unless of coarse I were a woman.

[brandies]

"What the ****" Yes, what is the problem??

[Yomar]

I'm fine with it if Charles Barkley could obtain a sponsorship exemption and play in a PGA event.

[poidog22]

I don't really see the problem. I don't think she'll do well, but if she makes the cut, I think that'll be a victory for her in itself. I'm not expecting much out of her this weekend, but it would make for an interesting tourney if she did make it to the weekend.

By the way, Yomar, sweet sig pic! Gibbs is still a god.:notworthy

[codeorama]

I totally understand the argument that the PGA is for the best golfers and the LPGA is for the best women golfers. However, I'm tired of women wanting everything. They want an exclusive tour for themselves, to guarentee that they can make a living playing golf. Yet, the also want the option of competing against men. If there were only 2 golf leagues, and the PGA was for the best and the second was the "minorleagues" of golf, there would be FAR fewer jobs for women golfers. The men who can't cut it on the tour would push the women out.

Here's where the unfairness is. There are men right now on the Nationwide tour who are better than Sorenstam, but can't pay in the event because they haven't earned their tour card and because they are not a "freak show" that will get publicity. IF I were a male professional golfer, I would be pissed.

[Art]

Scott,

Where you and I disagree is that the growth of women's athletics has had a positive impact on our culture. In my view the forced "equality" between men's and women's sports has been a detriment to our society. I believe it's a clear violation of the Constitution as cited by Brown v. Board of Education where the Supreme Court ruled that separate but equal is clearly unconstitutional. None of us would tolerate a white university basketball team and a black one.

None of us would tolerate white schools as long as black schools are available. Yet, we've all been brainwashed to believe that if a woman isn't good enough to compete equally with men, that they deserve the same opportunity for their lack of ability. That creates inequality. It presents women two bites at the apple that all men only get once, because, again, EVERY woman athlete in the nation has an opportunity to play for both the university team and if they are unable to do so, they have the women's team.

Only one of those teams is precluded from having men play on them. That should be illegal, just as it would be if we were talking about race. Women would still have the ability to play sports, just as lesser able men are. They're called club sports. It's called the YMCA. Community centers. Whatever. Just because I wasn't able to qualify for a scholorship to play basketball for a Division I team doesn't mean I had to stop playing ball.

I'm all for women competing on the same playing field with men. Those special women who are able to compete at the highest levels ought to be able to compete at them. But, we shouldn't create lesser levels for them to compete on if they fail to attain the higher levels. We certainly shouldn't pretend there's some equality in the sports.

We certainly shouldn't force equality in them. In my view this has been a very harmful time since Title IX was implemented and interpreted as a clear violation against men.

[Kilmer17]

I have no problem with it. But I would add one caveat. Every time she, or any other woman, enters a PGA event, the last guy out of the field should get her spot in the LPGA event that weekend.

That should be the real issue. The guy who is struggling to make it week to week. And loses his chance to cash a check because the sponsor wants some publicity.

Wont matter though. She wont sniff the cut line. The LPGA played this course for the Womens Open a few years ago and 1 under par won it. That was from 6400 yds. This week it will be about 7200 and the cutline will probably be below par. IF she makes it, that will be the most amazing sports feat of our lifetime. On the scale of US vs Russia in hockey.