PokerPacker Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I don't think anybody said that in this thread.But, that is an entirely different thing than whether or not God cares what a nation does. :2cents: That was not a response to anyone in particular, but just he idea of a flag in a church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Like that "one nation, indivisible" part, do ya? I like how you quoted it in its true, original form Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I don't think anybody said that in this thread.But, that is an entirely different thing than whether or not God cares what a nation does. :2cents: collective sin? That's a topic most people run away from as fast as they can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnLockesGhost Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I like how you quoted it in its true, original form I was just trying to get MSF, who claims he doesn't like Lincoln, to admit that he loves him deep down. They both worship the federal government. If you stray from your duty to worship the federal government, you're an apostate worthy of stoning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zguy28 Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 collective sin? That's a topic most people run away from as fast as they can.The Old Testament is replete with stories of God's judgment on entire nations because of sin. Including his own people Israel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 The Old Testament is replete with stories of God's judgment on entire nations because of sin. Including his own people Israel. I thought that cranky old testament God mellowed out in the New Testament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 The Old Testament is replete with stories of God's judgment on entire nations because of sin. Including his own people Israel. We both know that but it's a topic that people tend to stay away from. The implications are dire because they would indicate that guilt by political association are possible. Say for example you voted republican/democrat and that party supported an unjust war and you continued to support them. Would your soul be on the hook for that war? (this is NOT a reference to anything happening at the moment, please don't go there) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I thought that cranky old testament God mellowed out in the New Testament. You know more about the bible then you let on. Time to give it another chance homie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I'm of two minds: 1) The church should be above all things secular. Devotion to God and a place of God is beyond the idea of nationality. Besides, though shou worship no graven idols, not even a flag. 2) Why the heck not, if they want to have a flag and bless America with their prayers then they should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Should be Canadian flags and they should be in Buddhist temples. We're doing it all wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zguy28 Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 We both know that but it's a topic that people tend to stay away from. The implications are dire because they would indicate that guilt by political association are possible. Say for example you voted republican/democrat and that party supported an unjust war and you continued to support them. Would your soul be on the hook for that war?(this is NOT a reference to anything happening at the moment, please don't go there) I believe so. You are accountable for your actions before God. I am getting ready to teach a series at my church on the Minor Prophets of the Old Testament (Hosea, Joel, Amos, etc.). A lot of people, especially Christians could learn some valuable lessons from the prophets and from what happened historically to Israel and Judah and their neighbors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zguy28 Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I'm of two minds:1) The church should be above all things secular. Devotion to God and a place of God is beyond the idea of nationality. Besides, though shou worship no graven idols, not even a flag. "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind."2) Why the heck not, if they want to have a flag and bless America with their prayers then they should.Then again, a church is just a building like any other. Its made of brick and mortar.God does not dwell in man-made structures, but the Spirit lives in the heart and mind. Its why the flag isn't as much of a sticking point with me as the Pledge is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 You know more about the bible then you let on. Time to give it another chance homie. Several years of Catholic school and 10 years of CCD FTW! Actually, I did try to get back into it a few years back... unfortunately I couldn't get over the hump of my own scepticism. I think if I ever am going to be able to turn to religion again, it's going to have to be as a Quaker or a universalist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass_SkinsFan Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Like that "one nation, indivisible" part, do ya? Yes I do; and I have no problem with it in its original form. For me morals and values have a higher point of reference than religion ever will. Of course we might have to change the last couple words to ..."Morality and Justice for Citizens." but that's semantics and not for this particular discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass_SkinsFan Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I thought that cranky old testament God mellowed out in the New Testament. Funny, some of us prefered the cranky old God to the mellowed out one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnLockesGhost Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Yes I do; and I have no problem with it in its original form. For me morals and values have a higher point of reference than religion ever will. Of course we might have to change the last couple words to ..."Morality and Justice for Citizens." but that's semantics and not for this particular discussion. So Lincoln did the right thing preventing Southern independence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass_SkinsFan Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 So Lincoln did the right thing preventing Southern independence? No. The South did the wrong thing by failing to win the war and conquer the entire North, thereby returning the country to its appropriate system of government. So far as I'm concerned it's the NORTH that broke away from the south, not the other way around. Again, that's a topic for another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnLockesGhost Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 No. The South did the wrong thing by failing to win the war and conquer the entire North, thereby returning the country to its appropriate system of government. So far as I'm concerned it's the NORTH that broke away from the south, not the other way around. Again, that's a topic for another thread.Well, that's not what the South wanted. They just wanted to separate, which is a reason the term "Civil War" is actually a misnomer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass_SkinsFan Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Well, that's not what the South wanted. They just wanted to separate, which is a reason the term "Civil War" is actually a misnomer. Correct. I truly believe that Lee should have done in PA what Sherman would eventually do in Georgia. TOTAL WAR. I would rather have seen this country cease to exist in 1865 than what ended up happening. The American People LOST the Second American Revolution and our society has paid dearly for it in the last 140 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnLockesGhost Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Correct. I truly believe that Lee should have done in PA what Sherman would eventually do in Georgia. TOTAL WAR. I would rather have seen this country cease to exist in 1865 than what ended up happening. The American People LOST the Second American Revolution and our society has paid dearly for it in the last 140 years. So Lincoln acted correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mass_SkinsFan Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 So Lincoln acted correctly. Let's take this up another time in a thread where it's actually somewhat on-topic. Or send me a PM if you wish to discuss it at this time. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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