Sarge Posted March 26, 2003 Author Share Posted March 26, 2003 GaSkinsfan, Thank you.......Thank you very much ( Think Elvis:D ) I liked that quote, as well. But I thought that might be piling on:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKurp Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Originally posted by Art Kurp, I grasp your point entirely. I haven't spoken on your point though, despite offering to be willing, because I want to get completely out of the way your continued play-acting at being confused as to what was said in this thread by me. Remember, you're the dexterous one and I'm the linear brute. I completely get what you want to speak about. I completely comprehend where you'd like to take this conversation. I have for several posts. I just haven't taken you upon the offer to discuss it because I am still asking you to explain your charge you were somehow uncertain of the context of the words that brought you to your counter. Damn you Art! You could have saved me a whole lot of keystrokes. Oh well, a taste of my own medicine I suppose. I guess this is where you want me to turn all my cards face up, huh? Okay. I didn't like your statements Art. On more topics than I'll ever admit, we agree. (What would be the entertainment value in that?) On this particular subject though, we differ in a way that causes me, well, to use your analogy, to feel like a kid who got socks instead of a bicycle for Christmas. I kept prodding hoping that you'd elaborate to an extent that would make your stance more palatable. You did throw my way what I thought to be an ort when you wrote the words, "careful consideration". But alas, if I understand you correctly, the highest priority for you is not what actions are employed to save American lives, but that they are saved regardless of the action. In other words, by whatever means necessary, damn the methods or consequences. So yes, I grasped your point long ago. I was hoping though that it was written with rashness. So I kept propping the door open, or playing devil's advocate if you will. You Art, and a few others on ExtremeSkins, provide an intellectual stimulation that I've found only occasionally elsewhere on the Internet. I like your writing style and witnessing you take some poor soul to task is akin to watching a train wreck. I feel for the victim but I'm morbidly fascinated. It's an affirmation when we agree, but disappointing when we don't; the degree to which depends on how strongly I feel about a particular topic. But, I still require closure. And there you have it. As for your statement about believing in a higher being, well, I'm not sure we're in total harmony there. Whether or not there is one, is superfluous to the Kurp doctrine. Tenets of Kurpism: 1. God is Love. 2. Love is God. 3. The Bible is an excellent historical reference book. 4. The Bible is a Love story. It should be viewed in that light and not taken literally, especially the Old Testament. 5. Focus on the lessons imparted by the Bible, not the stories themselves. 6. Thou shalt not refer to God in anthropomorphic terms. 7. One can only seek and be forgiven by the person they've wronged. This is the same as being forgiven by God. Remember, God is Love. Love is God. 8. Thou shalt leave this earth a better place than when they were born. 9. A man's life is judged by how he influences the actions of others. Eternity is measured by how one's actions while living, continue to impact people's lives after one's death. 10. Heaven and Hell are right here on earth. Your choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted March 27, 2003 Author Share Posted March 27, 2003 Oh, shut-up Art. I'll post what I want, when I want. You can discontinue my membership, if you want, but I can always register again as another user (If I chose to do so) and you would NEVER know. You do know about IP addresses, right? Or are you ignorant about computers, as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chunky Salsa Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Air Sarge, stick to the guns and leave us nerds to the bits . There are various easy methods to spoof your ip if your so inclined. And of course, depending on your skill, you can own someone else's machine and your ip appears as the slaves. Or, if you're not very skilled, public access can be used to have a different ip. <P> Now if he is sending from some remote area that the admins can track down, they can try to block anyone from that area from posting with that ip. However, with all the different ips around each one would have to be determined and blocked. Unfortunately, depending on the filter, other legit users could be blocked. And if he is from DC or other major metro area that has other posters with the same ip, forget about it. He can post merrily along and switch ips as he needs. If he has a static ip, he could request a change of address. If it is dynamic, his ip would vary by 4 digits each time he logs in. <P> I diligent Admin could probably keep him off if they could determine it was him each time and make it hard enough that it just wouldn't be worth it. But, that is starting to sound like a job to me and don't think anyone is being paid <P> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Chunky, We're talking about a 15-year-old child who is so insecure in his own convictions he has no answer to any question posed to him. Do you really think he's sophisticated enough to figure out IP spoofing? Hell, do you even think, given his age, that he has access to anything beyond his AOL hostname and account? Come on brother. It's true a very aware individual could do most anything he desired. Personally, I have access to several thousand IP ranges and subnets and NAT servers and the like to make impossible a true ban. But, I'm a special sort . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awgustlab Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Originally posted by Art Chunky, We're talking about a 15-year-old child who is so insecure in his own convictions he has no answer to any question posed to him. Do you really think he's sophisticated enough to figure out IP spoofing? Hell, do you even think, given his age, that he has access to anything beyond his AOL hostname and account? His Momma probably has the parental controls set on his AOL settings, too - so young Champ doesn't secretly surf porn behnind her back. Champ..........What would Jesus say?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Kurp, Closure has been witnessed and accepted. I will spend some time tomorrow in an effort to answer the expanded conversation you wish to have. Though, if you'll recall, among the very first conversations you ever had on this board was, in part, with me about the what war means. I haven't altered my stance from Sept. 12, 2001 when you really entered into this forum as one of us. War, as defined, is a thing most terrible and destructive and deadly and when waging it, it is the lives of OUR people that matter even if that means the lives of many others must be sacrificed. You and I have a fundamentally different view on what war is. Even what we're doing right now in Iraq bothers me because we seem too politically correct and that means we're not at war here, which is probably ok since we haven't actually declared war. I don't think either of us desires what I view war to be. I just think that you know my origins on what war is, and the terrible nature of it so that the words here really can't be of a huge surprise to you. But, again, I'll go over this more in depth a little later in thanks for closure on the other issue . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackC Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Originally posted by Art Jack, I find it to be laughably puppet like to be overly concerned with any acts of terrorism that may rise out of the liberation of Iraq. Certainly if we deliberately target and kill civilians that could change, but, Saddam is not a popular leader in the Arab world. The "Arab Street" won't rise. And if we are seen to be willfully killing civilians it may cause that to change. If, however, we stop avoiding legitimate military targets hidden in civilian areas, and that causes the death of civilians, it seems unlikely in the extreme that acts of terrorism will ensue. Though, that does have the fine point of perception on it. I actually agree with you about not avoiding legitimate targets no matter where they're hidden. This war after all. I just think it would be a long term mistake to carpet bomb Baghdad. PS Stop picking on the liberal kid! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackC Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 "The left does have a church and its called liberalism. It has shifted from a political movement and the sad thing is it has become a de facto religion." You could be right, but some on the right think part of being christian is to also be conservative politically. Some even stated that the liberals brought the attacks of 9-11 on us. Let me answer Art's question: If you don't accept Jesus as your savior you will go to hell. See some of you there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 One of the Baptist preachers/ Human shields will be publishing his story about the horros of Iraq this week when he broke away from the Iraqis to interview the locals. He apparently freaked when he was told of how disent and those with the potential to disent was quelled by taking a family member to a chipper machine designed for plastic byproducts, and thrown in feet first so the screams are prolonged and louder. And to be honest I will take care of American before anyone else. I value life but lets get real for a minute. We are considered weak because we value lives why do you think the bast@rds forced women to stand in front of my Marines while firing at them two days ago? And as I said before, the opinions of those about what soldiers shouldnt do to ensure to our safety that havent served are worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince62 Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 chunky...in the more general case......it's not as simple as you suggest. sure...one can write his own socket routines in vis basic, perl, etc...spoofing an IP AND effecting TCP or higher level communications also requires other network "presence" whether it be through a sniffer, dns cache poisoning, whatever....... so...yea it can be done.......but your normal 15 year old script kiddy doesn't have the skills...... granted....web stuff is not not session oriented....although it can be configured to be connection oriented.......and other mechanisms....as you well know......can be used to authenticate...thus raising the bar.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince62 Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 I don't get it....why hasn't anyone taken Champ up on his offer?:laugh: :laugh: I would die for every citizen in Iraq. Truthfully. go for it....oh brave one....or is this more idiot bravura with no back-up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 What they mean is that the hedonism (Act UP parties) that the Muslim world sees here is part of the reason that those people consider us godless and want to ensure that we dont infect them. Liberalism is contagious and is resistant tomost forms of common sense and morality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackC Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 NavyDave, You are part of the problem. You have just expressed your belief that to be liberal you have to lack morals! Yet another arrogant right winger. God help you my friend! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Of all the threads on all the message boards, I had to miss this one. I havent read it all, but I'll respond anyway. Jack- You're wrong. Kurp- You're misguided Code-YOu're crazy Sarge- Absolutely Art- Well said Uninformed Youth- YOu're uninformed Everybody who doesnt agree with me is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarhog Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Originally posted by Kilmer17 Of all the threads on all the message boards, I had to miss this one. I havent read it all, but I'll respond anyway. Jack- You're wrong. Kurp- You're misguided Code-YOu're crazy Sarge- Absolutely Art- Well said Uninformed Youth- YOu're uninformed Everybody who doesnt agree with me is wrong. Awww....nothing pithy for me K.? Damn...even when I try to stir the pot, I can't get any love? Jack....I'm interested in this idea of yours that we should plant WOMD if we don't find them? I'll say up front that I don't support it (primarily because in my mind, theres no doubt they have mass stores of them and that we'll find them), but I'm intrigued by your suggestion and would like to hear you expand on why you think this is justifiable. It intrigues me because it sounds so much like something you'd accuse right wingers of contemplating in these circumstances, so I was surprised you'd put it forth as something we should consider.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackC Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Tarhog, The reason I say we should plant WOMD if we don't find them is simple. When the security of my nation is at stake, there isn't any GOP or democratic positions. Only American positions. If we don't come up with WOMD it would be a major blow to our country which could haunt us for decades. I will tell you I think mistakes made by our current President are most of the reason, that we are in this position. At this point it's water under the bridge. We are where we are and we must topple the regime and we must show WOMD period. It's in the best interest of our country. Besides if we plant them we can make the unquestionable WOMD. We won't be trying to say some hair spray is actually a WOMD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yomar Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 thank goodness, I was afraid this thread was dead... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Even if we find them, those opposed to this war will claim we planted then anyway, so might as well fake it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Originally posted by Kilmer17 Of all the threads on all the message boards, I had to miss this one. I havent read it all, but I'll respond anyway. Jack- You're wrong. Kurp- You're misguided Code-YOu're crazy Sarge- Absolutely Art- Well said Uninformed Youth- YOu're uninformed Everybody who doesnt agree with me is wrong. Kilmer, I think you've found your new sig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Originally posted by Yomar thank goodness, I was afraid this thread was dead... :laugh: You and me both Yomar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted March 27, 2003 Author Share Posted March 27, 2003 By the way Art, you're going to hell when you die:D It gives me no satisfaction to bedazzle a young 'in, but I think between the two of us he'll be dazed and confused for awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Brown #43 Posted March 28, 2003 Share Posted March 28, 2003 I am extremely sorry for being so late to this party. Now that I am here, there are two things in particular that jumped out at me as I browsed through the pages of this thread. First, for JackC... Despite being a left-wing nut, you are clearly not a complete moron. Having said that, I am shocked and appalled that you would pat Champ24Bailey on the back after he stated that "America has never been great." I realize that someone else pointed out your lack of judgment on this issue, and you responded to him. But I am not satisfied with your response. If you had an ounce of Americanism in you, you would have distanced yourself from Champ right then and there. Instead, you responded to Champ by letting him know how proud you were of him. I have a theory about the left. Despite their vehement denials, most liberals truly ARE anti-American. JackC, as you stated yourself in reference to Champ's comment, "when things get heated these kind of things get said." True, but the way I see it, when things get heated people's true feelings come out. So I guess we learned a bit about where Champ stands. And the fact that you immediately embraced him after that post tells me a bit about you. Personally, my jaw dropped when I read his comment. Now for gbear. gbear, you made a very curious comment way back on page 2 of this thread... Originally posted by gbearFor me, human life begins at birth or slightly before. Human life for me is not determined by a heart beat or breath, but rather by the ability to think, reason, build and communicate. It's value is determined by the decisions made in that lifetime and the comfort given. My question is, how many infants do you know that can think, reason and build? If, say, a 6-month old child is unable to complete these tasks that you've prescribed, then I suppose it would be ok to kill this child since, by your measure, it is not yet a human life? :?: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckydevil Posted March 28, 2003 Share Posted March 28, 2003 In fact Gbear has backed the position of Peter Singer. The man has justified infanticide with that same reasoning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKurp Posted March 28, 2003 Share Posted March 28, 2003 Originally posted by Larry Brown #43 I have a theory about the left. Despite their vehement denials, most liberals truly ARE anti-American. JackC, as you stated yourself in reference to Champ's comment, "when things get heated these kind of things get said." True, but the way I see it, when things get heated people's true feelings come out. So I guess we learned a bit about where Champ stands. And the fact that you immediately embraced him after that post tells me a bit about you. Personally, my jaw dropped when I read his comment. As far as I can tell, it's every American's right to express his feelings regardless of how unpopular they come across. I believe America is about guaranteed rights. Whatever Champ and JackC said, how did they infringe on anyone's rights? I have a theory about people like you LarryBrown who are so quick to call someone anti-American, you have NO IDEA what it is to be an American. Chew on that for awhile. Then get back to me, okay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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