WizSkinsO's Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 The Skins and the media are telling us that Zorn and Gibbs are a lot alike: for their religious conviction, for their hard-work, for their integrity, etc. And while few matched Gibbs in his first stint here and that's what makes the comparisons largely unimportant, the one thing I keep reading about Zorn and love how different it is from Gibbs II is Zorn's honesty. By all accounts, he's brutally honest. He tells it like it is. If you sucked, he'll tell you you sucked. Gibbs, as great of a player's coach he was and as strong as a motivator, lacked one major factor this time around: toughness. He wasn't tough on players at all, and always praised their efforts, no matter what the situation. While positive reinforcement is good, did we ever hear Gibbs rip into his team after an embarassing loss or a game we should have put away easily? Absolutely not. Discipline was lax under Gibbs II. Zorn changes that immensely. If we're struggling in his first year and blow a half-time lead, I fully expect him to rip into the guys and scold them for not doing things right. While I appreciate everything Joe did, he was too soft on a group of immensely talented players and thus didn't produce as strong of a record as players of this caliber should have. I look forward to Zorn's honesty and telling it like it is, no more suger-coating guys for being "super smart" or "fighting their guts off" or anything like that--if we stink, he'll tell us so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 By all accounts, Gregg Williams was honest as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddub52 Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 I wouldnt say that Gibbs was not honest. He just didnt volunteer information that he didnt need to. Im sure when the time comes, he will do the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 Gibbs was always honest, but classy enough not to rip into the team and players in front of the media. That stuff belongs in the lockerroom. What are you basing your belief of Zorn's brutal honesty off of by the way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalSkins Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 Yes. A 50 year old plus coach who has never been given any responsibility greater than QB coach will perform better than a hall of fame coach with 2 top coordinators running the offense and defense. By the way, the first words out of Chris Samuels mouth when asked about Zorn was that he is a lenient head coach. Lenient = Spurrier and Norv. That worked so well for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WizSkinsO's Posted February 10, 2008 Author Share Posted February 10, 2008 By all accounts, Gregg Williams was honest as well. True. But I think it's most important for the head coach. He's the face of the franchise. If we have a collective choke-job, the head coach is the one who keeps the player's esteems high but tells them that they need to do a much better job. Gibbs, quite frankly, was too tolerant of failure this time around. I think Zorn, as a head coach, will have a very positive effect due to his sometimes brutal honesty with the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One Shot Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 You don't need to rip the team after a loss to the media. He doesn't need to be honest for the reporters. Just needs to be honest to the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttr77 Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 What you call a lack of 'honesty', I call 'keeping it in house'. And just because Gibbs didn't call out a player in public, that doesn't mean he didn't tear them a new one in private. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WizSkinsO's Posted February 10, 2008 Author Share Posted February 10, 2008 Gibbs was always honest, but classy enough not to rip into the team and players in front of the media. That stuff belongs in the lockerroom. What are you basing your belief of Zorn's brutal honesty off of by the way? http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/09/AR2008020902681_2.html?sid=ST2008020902280 Those who know Zorn say he is honest, almost to a fault. From Hawaii, where he was sitting poolside before his third Pro Bowl, Hasselbeck laughed when asked about Zorn's legendary forthrightness, calling him "the worst liar I've ever seen in my life," adding that it wasn't always the best thing for his confidence as a still-struggling quarterback that first year in Seattle, often making the mistake of asking, "Hey, Jim, how do you think I played?" "Well, uh, well, you weren't very good," Hasselbeck recalls Zorn often saying. "The guy just doesn't know how to lie, but as a player you respect that. You want to know your coach is there with you," Hasselbeck added. Dilfer remembers Zorn being the only man on the Seahawks' coaching staff who would challenge the iron rule of Holmgren, who often stood as an intimidating presence to other coaches and players, frequently volcanic in his displeasure. Around 2001, as defenses became more extravagant and teams employed new blitz schemes, it was Zorn, along with Hasselbeck and Dilfer, who designed the Seahawks' responses to those changes, Dilfer said. Then Zorn would take the new plays to Holmgren, mining the dangerous waters of a coach who did not like his system to be questioned. "He pretty much deserves more credit for Seattle's evolution as an offense than anyone on that staff," Dilfer said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
909997 Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 one word "balls" gibbs super conservative zorn open and creative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttr77 Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 one word "balls"gibbs super conservative zorn open and creative Right. Zorn is already 1000 times better than Gibbs. Sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 O.P. may want to substantiate that initial claim that Joe was soft. We have reports,(somewhere here in the archives), that Joe was anything but after at least one game last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gart Monk Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 Snyder just crippled the Seahawks by stealing their best asset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttr77 Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 O.P. may want to substantiate that initial claim that Joe was soft. We have reports,(somewhere here in the archives), that Joe was anything but after at least one game last season. I read somewhere that during or after the Tampa game this year, Gibbs tore his team up in a way many of them had never seen in their entire lives. But he sure was nice to the press afterwards. Man, he must be dishonest! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PosseLover Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 one word "balls"gibbs super conservative zorn open and creative that one word is true... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 A Sudden influx of Jimmy Z fans?? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggins77 Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 By the way, the first words out of Chris Samuels mouth when asked about Zorn was that he is a lenient head coach. Lenient = Spurrier and Norv. That worked so well for us. What in the hell would Chris Samuels know about Zorn as a head coach? This is his first head coaching job and to even compair him to Steve ****ing Spurrier is just ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalSkins Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 one word "balls"gibbs super conservative zorn open and creative Based on what? He has never coached a team before or even been a coordinator in the NFL. He is somehow better than a hall of fame coach, without having coached a single game. Maybe you can take over Swanson's job as the Skins PR guy if you improve your smearing abilities. After seeing how nervous he was today, "balls" would not be the first word to come to mind. "In over his head" sound more appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalSkins Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 What in the hell would Chris Samuels know about Zorn as a head coach? This is his first head coaching job and to even compair him to Steve ****ing Spurrier is just ridiculous. Spurrier won a national championship and was considered an innovator and genius. Zorn has been relegated to low level NFL jobs until his mid 50's. But you are absolutely correct, comparing Spurrier to Zorn is a huge insult to Steve. ..Edit.. Samuels got that from talking to the Seahawks guys at the Pro Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChief Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 Believe me, Gibbs is honest, and he tells it like it is, but doesn't call someone out publicly. As for the in your face/toughness factor, that's why he sorrounded himself with guys like Saunders and Williams. It's all about balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[[ghost]] Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 By all accounts, Gregg Williams was honest as well. Doesn't get much more honest than GW. **** You Dan Snyder for ruining this for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 ]']Doesn't get much more honest than GW.**** You Dan Snyder for ruining this for us. I have to back Zorn and hope for the best for him and the Redskins. But there was a tone at the presser that just seemed a bit contrived, as if Zorn realized that more deserving candidates for the position had gotten screwed over. Oh well.......we'll see what happems in September. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mania Posted February 11, 2008 Share Posted February 11, 2008 By all accounts' date=' he's brutally honest. He tells it like it is. If you sucked, he'll tell you you sucked. Gibbs, as great of a player's coach he was and as strong as a motivator, lacked one major factor this time around: toughness. He wasn't tough on players at all, and always praised their efforts, no matter what the situation. While positive reinforcement is good, did we ever hear Gibbs rip into his team after an embarassing loss or a game we should have put away easily? Absolutely not. Discipline was lax under Gibbs II. [/quote'] With all due respect, Gibbs ripped into the players, but behind the scenes. His ammo is it is disrespectful to rip into players in front of other players. Would you want to be ripped into by your boss in front of your peers. Keenan McCardell said two weeks after he was picked up that Gibbs hasn't changed one bit from his first go around in 1991. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted February 11, 2008 Share Posted February 11, 2008 If you think Gibbs is soft, you need to learn some Redskins history. After the "Body Bag" game in 1990, Gibbs called the entire team a "bunch of lazy, fat @sses" and had full contact practices the rest of the year. He waived Brian Davis, a starting cornerback because he was sucking, but Davis said that he was a returning starter and didn't have to earn his job in camp. Gibbs just kept it internal, not in the press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilsu Posted February 11, 2008 Share Posted February 11, 2008 I just hope Zorn is more honest in his press conferences. I know Gibbs meant well, but "core Redskins" or "Ramsey is the starter" or "I will honor my contract"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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