9/11 Coincidences

[Baculus]

What makes you think a thorough investigation was not performed? Because you did not see it on CNN? Why give the media the opportunity to expose all of our weaknesses? For crying out loud who was the guy on CNN that was in Baghdad while it was being bombed giving out all the intelligence Saddam needed to defend on national TV???

I will just take your answer as, "I don't know why," to my question of the reasoning behind the Bush administration's attempt to block the creation and funding of the 9-11 Commission.

[TMK9973]

I graduated with top honors from The Las Vegas Academy of International Studies and Performing Arts. I majored in Orchestra ...

Well -Clearly that makes you much more quilified then say actual experts in their field....

[vegeta613]

The entire Pentagon issue could easily be resolved with release of any footage, other then the very vague footage that was released a few years ago.

This is one of the biggest reasons I started questioning the attacks in the first place

There are more camera's around the pentagon than any other building on this known planet and yet the only video they put out is 5 frames of something we can't even see??

Not to mention that the FBI took film from the surrounding buildings cameras that caught the impact within a few minutes of the attack

When people ask to see the film they hold it back for the sake of "National Security"

If there is nothing to hide then why don't they just show us the damn video??

[Mickalino]

Why do threads like these never get merged, but all the other ones do ? :laugh:

[Predicto]

Let me guess posting links from that site is defined real research by you

I can do that too

http://911review.org blah blah

Who the heck is Jean-Pierre Desmoulins and why should I listen to him?

Will you read this short essay? It's by a 9/11 conspiracy guy who thinks that the whole "no plane at the Pentagon" thing was invented by the government to discredit the 9/11 truthers themselves (because it is such a stupid and easily refuted argument).

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/pentagontrap.html

I don't agree with him about who came up with this whacky idea or why, but I do agree that it sure is whacky.

[philal0102]

Well -Clearly that makes you much more quilified then say actual experts in their field....

See... I never said anything about being more qualified than anyone... Did you read what I wrote?

He questioned, in my eyes, my intelligence... I simply wrote how, I DO read, and some background information about me. Go back and read my post.

[Predicto]

This is one of the biggest reasons I started questioning the attacks in the first place

There are more camera's around the pentagon than any other building on this known planet and yet the only video they put out is 5 frames of something we can't even see??

Not to mention that the FBI took film from the surrounding buildings cameras that caught the impact within a few minutes of the attack

When people ask to see the film they hold it back for the sake of "National Security"

If there is nothing to hide then why don't they just show us the damn video??

Why is everyone assuming that there was a video camera just staring at the field outside this section of the Pentagon, day and night. There may be one now, but why do you assume there is any footage from 9/11?

[Predicto]

Now, Mad Mike, is that supposed to be an isult?

If you're trying to question my intelligence, please don't.

I graduated with top honors from The Las Vegas Academy of International Studies and Performing Arts. I majored in Orchestra as the top violinist in the whole school.

As for reading, I love poetry. I love Edgar Allen Poe, with a little Yeats on the side. I love novels too. I'm in the middle of "The Pillars of the Earth" by Ken Follett. It's a very good book. I do recomend you to pick it up. I also love autobiographies... I just got done reading Clapton's. He had a very interesting life. It's a good read.

I can understand your post though. Most of America today gets their information from t.v. and never attempt to pick up a newspaper, or a novel, or any form of reading. As for me.... I read.... alot. What about you Mad Mike?

Dude, are you really comparing your academic/intellectual credentials with strangers on the internet?

[Mad Mike]

Let me guess posting links from that site is defined real research by you

I can do that too

http://911review.org/Wiki/PentagonPlaneRotor.shtml

Yay!!!! real research

There is one photograph of the debris, from september 11 plane debris rotor engineFEMA 1 that may be useful. A rotor (high pressure stage) coming from an jet engine can be seen in left-hand side photo above . On the top left of the image, what seems to be the housing of this engine. On the right, the leg of somebody working on the site gives approximately the scale, of less than a meter in diameter.

Jean-Pierre Desmoulins september 11 plane debris rotor engine examines this photograph carefully, and notes that:

* this is a high pressure rotor element of a jet engine;

* the diameter of the housing is not much bigger than the diameter of this rotor,

* most of the witnesses heard a sound that they describe as the sound of a military aircraft (highly pitched and strident), not the sound of an airliner.

He concludes:

* this piece and the streamlining behind don't come from the engine of an airliner, which has low pressure fans of much larger size than the high pressure rotors, so that the streamlines are much larger than the diameters of the high pressure rotors.

* the engines of this plane had no low pressure fans: they are military engines, for which noise is not a problem.

http://www.911review.org/images/4.jpg

At the right above, we show the engine from a ######### Britannia Airways Boeing 757 that crashed 14 September 1999 at Gerona, Spain. This aircraft (G-BYAG) had the same engine model as Flight 77 ( ######### N644AA) - Rolls Royce RB211-535E4. Not only is the diameter of the Rolls Royce engine is much larger, the rotor configuration is totally different.

This debris photograph of the engine rotor, if the evidence was not planted, is consistent with a small jet aircraft such as the Navy S-3B, the F-15, the F-16 or the F-18; definitely not from a Boeing 757-223. One witness that reported seeing ######### a 8-10 seat passenger plane, others reported a small rear-engined jet, which would be consistent with the Navy T-39 Sabreliner.

This isn't the only engine from 9/11 that's too small: see our page WTC Plane Engine.

The second picture that you posted is of a plane someone tried to land safely. It is still generally whole. The portion seen in the wreckage at the pentagon is the hub BEHIND and inside all of those fan blades in your picture. That's what happens when a plane full of fuel is flown into a fortress with the intend of destruction. If you cant figure out the difference between the two, you and Jean-Pierre Desmoulins are both morons.

A cutaway of the engine. Note the small diameter of the fan hubs.

[philal0102]

Dude, are you really comparing your academic/intellectual credentials with strangers on the internet?

Again, go back and read the post.... I wasn't comparing myself to anyone. I wrote things that contradicted Mad Mikes assumption. Not once did I compare myself to him... I asked him if he read, yes, but never did I say anything along the lines of comparison.

[vegeta613]

Why is everyone assuming that there was a video camera just staring at the field outside this section of the Pentagon, day and night. There may be one now, but why do you assume there is any footage from 9/11?

Why do I assume there are video camera's watching the symbol of defense for the United State of America??

I don't know why don't you tell me

[Baculus]

Mad Mike,

On this page, since I disagreed about your statements regarding the invasion of Iraq, I formulated a few pointed questions towards some of your statements. You can find them here:

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=235784&page=10&pp=15

I know you are in deep discussion about the Pentagon attack, but I'd like to hear your opinions, regarding Iraq, terrorism, and the logical basis for attacking that nation.

[TMK9973]

See... I never said anything about being more qualified than anyone... Did you read what I wrote?

He questioned, in my eyes, my intelligence... I simply wrote how, I DO read, and some background information about me. Go back and read my post.

Well - Lets review

You have posted theories that are widely discredited

A movie that is a joke

and claim that you are intelligent because you read and gradutated from a preforming arts school....

I'm questioning your intellegence.... It is clear that you are a guillible person who simply wants to reduce complex and troubling events to simple answers such as "The Big Bad Secert Rich people" are behind everything....

[Dance04]

If you cant figure out the difference between the two, you and Jean-Pierre Desmoulins are both morons.

Im tired of your name calling.

if you beleive that the very delicate tip of the plane crushed through those 3 rings, then your a moron :rolleyes:

[Baculus]

Why is everyone assuming that there was a video camera just staring at the field outside this section of the Pentagon, day and night. There may be one now, but why do you assume there is any footage from 9/11?

Because, at most facilities, there are security cameras that record events, day and night. This is in addition to the cameras at the nearby gas station and hotel that recorded the attack, but whose footage was seized and never released.

It happened in 2001 - even then, video and security cameras were quite common.

[Mad Mike]

See... I never said anything about being more qualified than anyone... Did you read what I wrote?

He questioned, in my eyes, my intelligence... I simply wrote how, I DO read, and some background information about me. Go back and read my post.

I questioned whether or not you (and on a greater scale, any conspiracy theorists) read. A fair question for people who post links to YouTube as if it were the bible.

[vegeta613]

The second picture that you posted is of a plane someone tried to land safely. It is still generally whole. The portion seen in the wreckage at the pentagon is the hub BEHIND and inside all of those fan blades in your picture. That's what happens when a plane full of fuel is flown into a fortress with the intend of destruction. If you cant figure out the difference between the two, you and Jean-Pierre Desmoulins are both morons.

Moron?? Name calling ??

You posted a link to a site and so did I

Now you are calling me a moron??

Here is another site you need to read

http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/print.asp?ID=1152

Small piece

everal readers wrote to AFP suggesting that the unidentified disc was a piece from the Auxiliary Power Unit (APU) mounted in the tail section of a Boeing 757. Honeywell makes the GTCP331-200 APU used on the 757 aircraft. No one suggested, however, that the small disc was a piece from one of the main engines of a 757-200.

AFP contacted Honeywell’s Aerospace division in Phoenix, Ariz., and sent high-resolution photos for their examination. “There’s no way that’s an APU wheel,” an expert at Honeywell told AFP. The expert, who cannot be named, added: “That turbine disc—there’s no way in the world that came out of an APU.”

American Free Press contacted Pratt & Whitney and Rolls Royce, manufacturers of the 757’s turbofan jet engines to try and identify the piece.

“If the aircraft that struck the Pentagon was a Boeing 757-200 owned by American Airlines, then it would have to be a Rolls Royce engine,” Mark Sullivan, spokesman for Pratt & Whitney, told AFP.

John W. Brown, spokesman for Rolls Royce (Indianapolis), had previously told AFP: “It is not a part from any Rolls Royce engine that I’m familiar with, and certainly not the AE 3007H made here in Indy.”

The AE 3007 engines are used in small commuter jets such as the Cessna Citation; the AE 3007H is also used in the military’s unmanned aircraft, the Global Hawk. The Global Hawk is manufactured by Northrop Grumman’s subsidiary Ryan Aeronautical, which it acquired from Teledyne, Inc. in July 1999.

A detailed photo of the front fan of a Global Hawk is online at:

http://www.rolls-royce.com/media/gallery/defence/lrg_ae3007_6.htm

Basicly it could have been anything that uses that type of engine

[philal0102]

Well - Lets review

You have posted theories that are widely discredited

A movie that is a joke

and claim that you are intelligent because you read and gradutated from a preforming arts school....

I'm questioning your intellegence.... It is clear that you are a guillible person who simply wants to reduce complex and troubling events to simple answers such as "The Big Bad Secert Rich people" are behind everything....

Would I like to reduse the troubling events? No.

Would I like real answers? Yes.

Am I gullible because I have an open mind, and I don't just shut the door on opinions, or "conspiracies". If that's your definition of gullible... Then yes.

Do I think that the extremely wealthy people in this nation have a hand in most things that deal with the government? Yes. Does this mean I'm dumb, or gullible? I don't think so.

[philal0102]

Well - Lets review

You have posted theories that are widely discredited

A movie that is a joke

and claim that you are intelligent because you read and gradutated from a preforming arts school....

I'm questioning your intellegence.... It is clear that you are a guillible person who simply wants to reduce complex and troubling events to simple answers such as "The Big Bad Secert Rich people" are behind everything....

Would I like to reduse the troubling events? No.

Would I like real answers? Yes.

Am I gullible because I have an open mind, and I don't just shut the door on opinions, or "conspiracies". If that's your definition of gullible... Then yes.

Do I think that the extremely wealthy people in this nation have a hand in most things that deal with the government, and the media that you or I watch? Yes. Does this mean I'm dumb, or gullible? I don't think so.

[Mad Mike]

Im tired of your name calling.

if you beleive that the very delicate tip of the plane crushed through those 3 rings, then your a moron :rolleyes:

Then its a good thing I don't believe that. In fact, the only person claiming that the "very delicate tip of the plane" made that unidentified burn mark... is you. :laugh:

[Baculus]

For some folks on this thread, name calling and insultive posting it is really starting to become your posting method, and to be frank, it makes you look like an ass.

Having a bit of decorum is a positive thing.

[Predicto]

Because, at most facilities, there are security cameras that record events, day and night.

No, there aren't. There are cameras at doors, for example, that show who is going in and out, and in elevators, but there are no cameras just recording the entire outside wall of most facilities. I work in the California Supreme Court. We have high security. Metal detectors and cameras at the doorways, electronic pass cards, etc. But there are no cameras just trained on the front wall of the building waiting for a plane to crash into the building, at least not as far as I can tell. Same thing for San Francisco City Hall, across the street.

The Pentagon may well have installed such broad cameras now, for all I know, but I do not think we can assume they had them pre 9/11.

This is in addition to the cameras at the nearby gas station and hotel that recorded the attack, but whose footage was seized and never released.

Those were released. You can see them on the wiki page. Are there others that anyone is aware of (rather than just speculating that they MUST exist)?

[Mad Mike]

Mad Mike,

On this page, since I disagreed about your statements regarding the invasion of Iraq, I formulated a few pointed questions towards some of your statements. You can find them here:

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=235784&page=10&pp=15

I know you are in deep discussion about the Pentagon attack, but I'd like to hear your opinions, regarding Iraq, terrorism, and the logical basis for attacking that nation.

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78073&highlight=Iraq

[Predicto]

For some folks on this thread, name calling and insultive posting it is really starting to become your posting method, and to be frank, it makes you look like an ass.

Having a bit of decorum is a positive thing.

It is just frustration, Baculus.

If you were trying to explain to someone that the world is round, and they just didn't want to believe you or think logically about it at all, you would get frustrated.

If you then had the 23rd new thread claiming the world is flat, repeating the same old stuff, you would get VERY frustrated.

That is where I am now.

[Mad Mike]

No, there aren't. There are cameras at doors, for example, that show who is going in and out, and in elevators, but there are no cameras just recording the entire outside wall of most facilities. I work in the California Supreme Court. We have high security. Metal detectors and cameras at the doorways, electronic pass cards, etc. But there are no cameras just trained on the front wall of the building waiting for a plane to crash into the building, at least not as far as I can tell. Same thing for San Francisco City Hall, across the street.

The Pentagon may well have installed such broad cameras now, for all I know, but I do not think we can assume they had them pre 9/11.

Those were released. You can see them on the wiki page. Are there others that anyone is aware of (rather than just speculating that they MUST exist)?

I just want to add that security cameras like ones that did capture bits of the attack on the pentagon operate at a frame rate of about 1 frame per second so that one tape can record and entire day. In order to capture normal motion 30 frames per second are needed. in order to capture his speed motion, up to thousands of frames per second are used in special cameras. the idea that one of the cameras around the pentagon should have captured an image of the plane is, well.... crazy.