Larry Gude Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 ...yesterday talking about the OT kick vs. going for it on 4th and inches. Did I miss a thread on this subject? Anyway, yesterday on the radio was a fantastic segment into the mind of coach Gibbs; the OT field goal on 4th and inches. The choice; go for it and get closer for a field goal or maybe even score a TD or kick the field goal now. Joe was asked to go through his decision making process by a caller and he did. Joe mentioned all the negatives. What if you fumble the snap? What if you get a motion penalty or false start? What if you get a 10 yard hold? What if you just don't make it? He boiled it down to one play, a chance to win the game right here and now, the odds of something going wrong vs. the odds of making a field goal. It was a wonderful piece and truly enjoyable that the coach would share his thought process in such detail and it's great he did it. The thing is, it's a fundamentally flawed thought process. A penalty can happen on the field goal. The snap can be fumbled or otherwise botched on a field goal. It can get blocked. It can be missed. If you miss it, they get the ball 7 yards close than if you're stopped short. If you get the penalty, you still have another play, so you punt and back them up. So, as the same bad things can happen on either play, it boils down to the choice; move the ball, someway, somehow, inches against a team you have put up about 300 yards on the ground or move it, accurately, 49 yards? Gibbs also made a comment to the effect that he felt more confident about things going right on the kick and it was simply a matter of Shawn making it or not. There it is. This head coach is more confident in his team kicking a 49 yard field goal than moving forward a few inches. If he gets a chance to take a chance to win it, he will take that over a chance to improve the chances. It is one thing to play conservatively and try not to make mistakes, control the clock and so forth. It is another to say my team has a better chance of a 49 yard field goal than moving the ball inches. As coach, certainly he knows his team and it worked. I thoroughly enjoyed him talking about it but at the same time it's depressing to think that is where we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 we lost the chargers game that way and other games in the past because of this.. WIth our offensive line, nothing is guaranteed.. maybe if we had jansen and thomas we might have but when suisham has been money so far then you kick it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isifhan Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Clearly putting the game in the hands of your field goal kicker who was on fire the whole day was the wrong choice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Sassy Molassy Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I think a lot of teams would go for the win in that same situation, on 4th and inches in OT. Especially if they have enough confidence in their kicker making it, and Suisham was on all day Sunday. I see where you're coming from in one sense, but in another, you end the game when you have the opportunity in Sudden Death, because otherwise you may not get the opportunity again. And if Gibbs went for it, and we got stonewalled, the Jets get the ball back and score, Gibbs gets on the radio and says that he felt like the team could get the ball closer for a closer kick for Suisham you'd probably be saying that Gibbs doesn't have confidence in the kicker. Usually the team who gets the ball first wins, but we were able to stop them, rather they were able to stop themselves. I think taking a shot at winning was the right move to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan1523 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 A field goal at Giants stadium is anything but guaranteed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I personally think that it shows a lack of confidence in the team. He did the same thing against Miami. I would have keep pushing and tried to get the touchdown. It would have given the team confidence going into the next game... But that's just my opinion. What do I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Gude Posted November 7, 2007 Author Share Posted November 7, 2007 Clearly putting the game in the hands of your field goal kicker who was on fire the whole day was the wrong choice Versus putting it in the hands of a runner who was on fire all day? One has to get a few inches, the other 49 yards with all the same variables that can go wrong. Really thoughtful there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Gude Posted November 7, 2007 Author Share Posted November 7, 2007 A field goal at Giants stadium is anything but guaranteed. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 he already made 46 before y not again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 he already showed confidence in his team by going for the onside kick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I agree, you have Mike Sellers who could literally fall forward for 3 yards or Clinton Portis who, up until that point had rushed for 196 yards... There is no reason to not believe you can make several inches on a team you had been CRUSHING all day in the run game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKM311 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Whats done is done. Both sides have an argument. Personally, I do what Gibbs does. Why? Because anytime you have a chance to WIN the game you take it. Why bypass a WIN just to gain some extra yards? Suisham was money on Sunday, so ride him to build his confidence. Thats how you build a kickers confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 he already showed confidence in his team by going for the onside kick Eva is beautiful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 the jets were stopped on a 4th down and inches earlier in the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Whats done is done. Both sides have an argument.Personally, I do what Gibbs does. Why? Because anytime you have a chance to WIN the game you take it. Why bypass a WIN just to gain some extra yards? Suisham was money on Sunday, so ride him to build his confidence. Thats how you build a kickers confidence. Which is more important, building the kickers confidence or this struggling offense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onnie007 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 we lost the chargers game that way and other games in the past because of this.. WIth our offensive line, nothing is guaranteed.. maybe if we had jansen and thomas we might have but when suisham has been money so far then you kick it Thats exactly what I was thinking. If Thomas and Jansen were still in the picture then I'm sure he would have considered getting the ball closer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Gude Posted November 7, 2007 Author Share Posted November 7, 2007 you'd probably be saying that Gibbs doesn't have confidence in the kicker. ...I'm saying right here and now for the record for all time, a team that just ran for 300 yards sounds like a safer bet to get one more than a 49 yard field goal. I don't know the stats, but, to me, anything outside of 40 yards feels less of a sure thing than anything inside 40 for NFL kickers. It was a GREAT pressure kick, not a gimmee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinzOwnU Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I don't disagree with the decision to kick in this case, but Gibbs has some of the most flawed reasoning processes behind his decision making. He coaches scared, and he lets 1 bad thing that happened 2 years ago continue to haunt him and taint his decisions. He needs to let go, and he needs to make the best decision for a particular situation regardless of what happens in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Gude Posted November 7, 2007 Author Share Posted November 7, 2007 Whats done is done. Both sides have an argument.Personally, I do what Gibbs does. Why? Because anytime you have a chance to WIN the game you take it. Why bypass a WIN just to gain some extra yards? Suisham was money on Sunday, so ride him to build his confidence. Thats how you build a kickers confidence. Yes, but 49 is not a gimmee. It just seems like a better choice to at least get a little closer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 U have a chance to win the game in OT, or you dont have a chance of winning the game. First downs are not guaranteed, neither are FGs but the FGs ends the game immediately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 BTW the field goal was 46 from the left hash mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 You always take the win on 4th down If it was 3rd and inches, or like the Dolphins game 2nd down, I agree with your point But it is 4TH DOWN in OT Gibbs hates making the same mistake twice. Anyone know why he never tries to make something happen at the end of the half with the ball on our side of the field? The rocket screen The shotgun? Took him years to get over We have hardly used any hurry up in Gibbs 2.0, even though he was using it a lot at the end of Gibbs 1.0 because of the debacle in Dallas in 1992 When something goes wrong, Gibbs puts it in the "NO" column. That play against SD 2 years ago cost us homefield in the first round of the playoffs, and quite honestly could have cost us a Superbowl apperance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polo3 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Incredible, I can't even believe this discussion is taking place. Gibbs broke it down on the radio as to why he did not chance it. He made the right call and we won the game, I doubt very seriously that if you asked any of the offensive players if they felt duped that the coach did not go for it on 4th and inches they would not say they didn't think the old man had confidence in them. We got the win I'm sure they were happy and we should all be happy. Game over we won, its time to concentrate on the Beagles... :eaglesuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
da#1skinsfan Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Your kicker is 4-4. Hes on fire. Its a manageable kick. The game is in your hands, your offense has been inept all year and your defense is getting worn down from shouldering the load every week. Seems simple to me...it was to Gibbs too, and we won the game. /discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tastes Like Chicken Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Some of you wishing for us to go for it on 4th down in overtime, did you forget about the Giants game? The right side of our line is as stout as a croissant. So what happens when the runner is stuffed for no gain because the left side is overloaded, and the Jets march down the field for the winning FG? What's your answer then? Gibbs is an idiot for not trusting his kicker, who was on fire all day, had already made 4 FG's. We should have done x y z blah blah. Gibbs made the right call. We won the game. I swear, some of you people are never happy. You act like we're 3-5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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