QB in Great Standing

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Mark Brunell, #8-QB

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TD

7

INT

3

YDS

1465

RATING

90.4

Why in the hell do you people want Brunell benched??? He doesn't have a great deal of TD passes, but everything else is above average...Start bashing other player personnel and leave the man alone!!!

:logo: :logo: :logo:

:doh: How 'bout:

:mad: INCESSANT 'Dump-Offs';

:doh: ABANDONING the OTHER 'Options' on Pass Plays;

:doh: UNINSPIRING QB Play;

:doh: 'PASTA'-Arm;

:mad: POOR Decisions on CRITICAL 3rd-Down Plays (ala: 'DUMP-OFFS' FAR-SHORT of the NEEDED First-Down Yardage);

Receivers' BRILLIANT "Yards-AFTER-Catch" ("YAC") Abilities "PADDING" His Stats;

:mad: INABILITY to Utilize (or, even 'SEE") the ENTIRE Playing Field on Pass Plays;

:doh: ad infinitum!!!

:point2sky 'Loyalty' is ONE thing.

:mad: :doh: However, 'loyalty ABOVE TEAM' (something, it seems, that YOU share with Gibbs AND Brunell) is... 'something else' entirely!?!

:2cents: Hmmm!?!

[skinz4evr]

Playing well does NOT constitute trying to throw 25 dump-off passes to RB's during a game and ignoring your downfield, wide-open threats. MANY of those passes were on 3rd down and finished a drive because the team went 3 and out. That's not playing well, but it does inflate statistics so that people who don't know better have something to point at and say,"Mark set a record, Mark's numbers are good." But the numbers lie because 2 or 3 yard completions don't get your team anywhere, just your completion percentage. But if 2-5 makes you happy then yeah, Mark's playing great. I'm not saying the rest of the team is playing well, but the QB should be stepping HIS game up by sustaining long drives and scoring more points, keeping the D off the field with all the Offensive "weapons" we have. But that is not happening, and in case you missed the last couple games, defenses know that and they are flooding the O-line(making the line look worse) because they know the QB can't see the middle of the field, and has no escapability or pocket presence anymore. MB is playing scared, watch his feet hopping when he is in the pocket. Watch him curl up when a defensive player approaches. Watch him check down from Moss to a RB on almost EVERY play. Bad QB play has a bad effect on the entire team.

[christopher44]

Brunell is 15-18 as our starter and your bringing light to stats that are padded.:laugh:

[Santana89Moss]

Brunell Has those good stats cause he throws screens all the damn time

[christopher44]

The only stat that matters is the win/loss column.15-18.What else is there to talk about.HES NOT THE ANSWER AT QB.HE SUX.

[LiveStrongSkins]

Mark is one of many problems right now. When your starting QB gets most of his stats in garbage time against prevent defenses, it isnt saying much. Nor does it speak volumes about this great quarterback when he throws short of the chains on key third downs...

[KDawg]

It's simple. He doesn't complete passes down field and when he does it's because of a great catch from one of our receivers. He checks down entirely too often, he has tunnel vision locked on to Santana Moss, he has Lloyd running free on plenty of plays and he doesn't see him, but hey did you see those screens he hit!? Or how he ripped apart those prevent defenses? Yup. I can see why you think stats matter.

[Abshir]

Why in the hell do you people want Brunell benched??? He doesn't have a great deal of TD passes, but everything else is above average...Start bashing other player personnel and leave the man alone!!!

:logo: :logo: :logo:

Throwing a 5-8 yard dink/dunk and having moss inflate your stats because he just turned it into a 30-40 yard play will skew his stats all the time. He is hopeless and I wish you guy's would get off his bandwagon and go save some whales.

[Abshir]

It's best not to argue with the ignorant. No matter what you say, or how well Brunell plays, these people will crop up out of the wood work with some reason why he sucks.....

...You might as well try to tell a liberal 911 conspiracy theororist that Islamo facist al-quida members blew up the WTC and the Pentagon....

Dude keep Islam out of your mouth. It has been portrayed in the worst light imaginable. Anyway, I got your point, but Brunell is not getting the job done !!! Bottom line. We need to replace him after all, its not as if he has been a jewel on our defense for the past few years, lets just get rid of him or at the very least bench him.

[TheSteve]

Actually, scrap this post. ESPN's splits stopped working and I was looking at NFL.com's which used slightly different terminology and mixed me up. I'll make a new thread later, but suffice it to say Brunell is truly awful at intermediate passes. :doh:

[christopher44]

Actually, scrap this post. ESPN's splits stopped working and I was looking at NFL.com's which used slightly different terminology and mixed me up. I'll make a new thread later, but suffice it to say Brunell is truly awful at intermediate passes. :doh:

Do u have stats on Boonell when he throws more than 20 yards.If so could u post them

[Arleeskin]

You all are missing the most important thing, our Defense is non-existent! If the D was anywhere near what it was last year, we wouldn't be having these bench Brunell threads! Lets put the blame for our lousy team where it should be, on the Defense! (and don't come back w/the injury thing, this is football!!)

[TheSteve]

Do u have stats on Boonell when he throws more than 20 yards.If so could u post them

It's a really interesting conundrum. Let's take passes thrown 21-30 Yards:

8/18 252 YDS 44.4% 14YPA 2TD 0INT 128 Rating

But then if you go farther

Pass thrown 31-40:

1/6 37YDS 16.6% 6.17YPA 0TD 1INT 13 Rating

Then one pass over 41

1/1 52 YDS 100% 52YPA 118 Rating

It really is distressing that in 7 games we have only ATTEMPTED, not completed, but attempted 1 pass over 30 Yards PER GAME. :laugh:

Btw, Brunell's passes 11-20 Intermediate Routes:

10/31 176YDS 32.3% 5.68YPA 1TD 2INT 36.5 Rating

Brunell seems wildly inconsistent on any pass over ten yards.

[s0crates]

Thank you to the thread starter. I've been trying to say this for a couple days now. Brunell is playing great. Unfortunately, it will fall on deaf ears. Fans just want to blame the quarterback. They don't realize that the real problem is our 26th ranked defense not our 11th ranked passer.

As the old saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

[TheSteve]

Thank you to the thread starter. I've been trying to say this for a couple days now. Brunell is playing great. Unfortunately, it will fall on deaf ears. Fans just want to blame the quarterback. They don't realize that the real problem is our 26th ranked defense not our 11th ranked passer.

As the old saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

With Brunell, the Redskins have attempted 1 pass over 30 yards per game.

With Brunell, 84.8% of the Redskins passing completions have been for 10 yards or less, 72% of his attempts are 10 yards or less.

With Brunell, the Redskins have an intermediate passer rating of 36.5(passes thrown for 11-20 yards).

With Brunell, the Redskins have a 67.6 Rating on 3rd and 8-10, a 76.8 Rating on 2nd and 8-10.

How again is our offenses lack of success posing a threat downfield a problem of our defense?

[TC]

Dude keep Islam out of your mouth. It has been portrayed in the worst light imaginable. Anyway, I got your point, but Brunell is not getting the job done !!! Bottom line. We need to replace him after all, its not as if he has been a jewel on our defense for the past few years, lets just get rid of him or at the very least bench him.

I don't usually like discussing non-Skins related topics on this message board. However, your statement is reflective of why the reputation of Islam continues to take a beating. The previous poster stated a fact (to paraphrase, that Muslim extremists were responsible for 9/11) and your response is to "keep Islam out of your mouth" ?!?! By responding in that way all you do is make the religion look resistant and intolerant of criticism, which is exactly what drives the growing problems non-Muslims have with Islam to begin with. I don't wish to get in a deep convo about this, but that's just my :2cents:

Mark Brunell is a member of al-qaeda!!

[wpenn1]

I posted this in another thread but it applies

i think some people are stats driven especially if you dont watch the game. for example on those 3rd and 8 plays when he completes a 4 yard play it still counts as a completion. so he completes a high percentage of passes and because he doesnt take any risks and if portis, moss, cooley or lloyd breaks a long one then his stats are padded more. People see the stats and they dont see that he gives us no chance to win they just say hey thats not a bad game.

Now I am watching the Giants play now and Manning has 106 yards on 4 completions in the 2nd quarter. Brunell has that in the 4th quarter with 25 completions

[s0crates]

With Brunell, the Redskins have attempted 1 pass over 30 yards per game.

With Brunell, 84.8% of the Redskins passing attempts have been for 10 yards or less, that's not even counting completions.

With Brunell, the Redskins have an intermediate passer rating of 36.5(passes thrown for 11-20 yards).

With Brunell, the Redskins have a 67.6 Rating on 3rd and 8-10, a 76.8 Rating on 2nd and 8-10.

How again is our offenses lack of success posing a threat downfield a problem of our defense?

Of course. I see your point. Brunell is no gunslinger. Brunell does not have a strong arm. But, Brunell is a good quarterback nonetheless. He is smart with the football, accurate, and a good leader.

Contrary to what you seem to believe, a ball control offense is not a bad thing. This offense is effective doing what it does, which is controlling the clock and commiting few mistakes. If the defense was any good at all, this team would be a winner with this style of offense.

Brunell is playing smart and efficient football. Improve the defense and that will be good enough to win.

(And for the record, Brunell is averaging 7.11 yards per attempt which puts him near the top of the league in that category).

[TheSteve]

Of course. I see your point. Brunell is no gunslinger. Brunell does not have a strong arm. But, Brunell is a good quarterback nonetheless. He is smart with the football, accurate, and a good leader.

Contrary to what you seem to believe, a ball control offense is not a bad thing. This offense is effective doing what it does, which is controlling the clock and commiting few mistakes. If the defense was any good at all, this team would be a winner with this style of offense.

Brunell is playing smart and efficient football. Improve the defense and that will be good enough to win.

(And for the record, Brunell is averaging 7.11 yards per attempt which puts him near the top of the league in that category).

There is nothing wrong with a ball control offense, but Al Saunders Offense and his Offensive reputation is not a dink and dunk one. For that matter, neither is Joe Gibbs.

In the Washington Glory Days we had a ball control, pound it out style, but we also countered that with a bomb it over the top and over the middle to keep defenses honest. The constant? Gibbs always had a QB who could make those throws.

Now for some reason he's married to a QB in Brunell who couldn't execute HIS offense properly and the last two years he's been dinking and dunking Brunell's faults away.

Al Saunders comes from KC and St. Louis, two high powered offenses that were never known for their dink and dunk approach. Martz had control in St. Louis so after Vermiel left the Rams became less and less ball control, but the Chiefs were always a team that could chew out the clock AND gain big chunks of yards because Saunders offense was predicated on being able to attack all parts of the field.

Yet now, running Saunders offense, 84.8% of the completions are under ten yards? And this is okay to you? This is a warning sign to me. Yet, you seem to think it's not one of the reasons we are 2-5. All teams are going to do is either blitz and bump to take away the short pass and force Brunell to beat them over the middle, or play zone and leave the intermediate parts of the field as the vulnerable part because they know Brunell can't throw there.

[No_Pressure]

Mark Brunell, #8-QB

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TD

7

INT

3

YDS

1465

RATING

90.4

Why in the hell do you people want Brunell benched??? He doesn't have a great deal of TD passes, but everything else is above average...Start bashing other player personnel and leave the man alone!!!

:logo: :logo: :logo:

Somebody can look good statistically and not really be that good of a player or help to his team. Mark Brunell doesnt get a bad stat for completing a 3 yard pass on 3rd and 8, but checking down and throwing too short is one of the things he does that ruins our drives and forces us to punt. Brunell isnt getting statistics for the turnovers when we have to punt it when if you think about all the 3 and outs we have had this season its often.

On top of this there isnt a stat for how often he gets sacked, now obviously most of his sacks are blocking mistakes by the O-Line, but sometimes Brunell is dumb enough to run into a sack, or not get out of the way of one when most QB's even immobile ones like Bledsoe would have moved. Whenever he gets sacked we get a loss of yards and a loss of downs, and sometimes a turnover results like getting sacked on 3rd and long.

The point is there are so many factors that go into being a good QB / player in general and stats never tell the whole story. Sometimes you have a player that is really great but people underrate him because of his stats. Take a power runningback like Riggins or Bettis for example. They never really had absolutly amazing stats in terms of rushing yards. If you looked at Warrick Dunn's stats compared to John Riggins you may be misled to think that Riggins was a sub par back, not even as good as the amazing Warrick Dunn.

There is one problem though. John Riggins always got the short yardage. He kept drives moving. He didnt pile up the 60 yard touchdown runs, but when we needed him to come up big on 3rd and short, 4th and short, he did every time. That is what made him great. He could always get you at least 3 yards and while 3 yards per carry isnt much for a whole season, if you have 3 yards almost gauranteed out of a back you will rethink that 4th and 1 on the goal line. Brunell is the opposite of this. He has decent stats and numbers but his bad decisions are killing our drives and thats a statistic you cant look at in just his passer ratings.

[Da_Truth]

Well another thing is that Gibbs has decided to stick with Brunell, yet for some reason no one on extreme skins ever calls for his head...These fans love to bash MB, but they don't seem to realize that Gibbs knows football and if he said MB is the man there really shouldn't be much question or doubt geared towards MB...

Gibbs know football? Can anyone please answer these questions

Why did he give up the only thing he was known for which was coaching an offense and calling offensive plays if he KNOWS football?

Why are we sitting at 2-5?

Why did he bench his starting QB in the first quarter of the first regular season game?

Why did he make the decision to give away a 3rd round pick for a rb we dont even use?

Why did he give away a 1st round pick for a QB 2 years ago, yet the QB hasnt even took "ONE" snap in a NFL game, But Vince and Lienart just came into the freakin league and already got more game starts then Campbell?

I have not found anyone to answer these questions yet. If anyone do please let me know.

[318 SKIN]

I :applause: you for that sir.

They have as much validity as those people who try to say that Joe Montana was over rated because all he threw was three yard slants to Jerry Rice and he'd run 70 yards.....in other words none what so ever.

Thing is, it's Gibbs assessment too. That is what makes you iggy. It just so happens that Gibbs and I are on the same page. No that you can't challenge the coach...but you are just wrong here....sorry.

That is true....I never said that. Mine was a judgement of quality based on experience not an all out indictment against those who haven't played football before.

:paranoid:

you started the whole stats thing. Read below bro...read.

Here's some more stats for ya:

(14:15) M.Brunell sacked at IND 37 for -13 yards (D.Freeney).

(4:16) M.Brunell sacked at IND 15 for -6 yards. FUMBLES, and recovers at IND 16.

(1:17) PENALTY on WAS-J.Jansen, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at WAS 38 - No Play.

(:15) M.Brunell sacked at WAS 41 for -8 yards (J.Thomas).

(3:04) (Shotgun) M.Brunell pass short left to B.Lloyd to IND 29 for 17 yards (A.Bethea) [R.Mathis].

PENALTY on WAS-C.Samuels, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at IND 46 - No Play.

(2:07) M.Brunell pass short right to L.Betts to IND 20 for 13 yards (C.June).

PENALTY on WAS-C.Rabach, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at IND 33 - No Play.

That's 82 yards of penalties not on MB on offense or...36% of your given number. But we are the one's padding stats...? :doh:

Gosh...he would have had 338 totaly passing yards without those penalties...Burn him anyway...he's a witch!!!!!

I remember A player by the name of Patrick Ramsey who was burned at the steak after one 1qtr of play - had this been MB he would have been praised for his toughness & courage! With PR offsides, fumbles, and sacks are his fault - with MB they are someone else's fault. Go figure, i'm just sick of Gibbs undying loyalty to MB. He gave away the farm to get JC - if it turns out that he can't be the guy then Gibbs will have set this franchise back 5yrs.

[drowland]

Thank you to the thread starter. I've been trying to say this for a couple days now. Brunell is playing great. Unfortunately, it will fall on deaf ears. Fans just want to blame the quarterback. They don't realize that the real problem is our 26th ranked defense not our 11th ranked passer.

Brunell is playing great? Wow, you can see the effect that 15 years of futility is having on fans. There's nothing great about a QB who plays NOT to lose. Yeah the defense stinks, but why can't the offense pick it up? How many times did the defense carry the offense the last 2 season? I see a QB who seems to be afraid to risk an INT because he thinks it will get him pulled. Some call it smart. But with the situation this team is in, I call it p****.

[illone]

Most of these critics couldn't even throw and catch the ball 22 time's in a row from 15 feet away in their back yard, and they are going to criticize MB...

Nice one. :laugh:

It's true, too.

[Winning Season Please!]

Mark Brunell, #8-QB

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TD

7

INT

3

YDS

1465

RATING

90.4

Why in the hell do you people want Brunell benched??? He doesn't have a great deal of TD passes, but everything else is above average...Start bashing other player personnel and leave the man alone!!!

:logo: :logo: :logo:

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3126649&posted=1#post3126649