A good read for the Christians....A better read for the Non-Believers!

[michael_33]

Some of you are Christians and reading this will just influence what you already know...Congrats!

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Some of you are lost and confused and just need a little more proof and possibly examples of how true the Holy Bible works...You may just enjoy some of these facts that's are presented here today! :2cents:

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And some of you are possibly way past the lost department and completely in oblivion to understand or want to understand what the bible is really trying to say...Perhaps this thread is your last chance and last hope,before your 1-way trip to Hell starts bording!Good luck! :applause:

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Here you go!

Prophetic Signs that we are in the End Times

Contender Ministries Printer Friendly Version

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The Bible gives many examples of signs that should warn us of the coming end of the age. Six such signs are given by Jesus, two characteristics are given by Paul, and eleven other occurrences are given by the prophets to occur prior to or soon after the end of the age. While we are also told we will not know the time of the End, God obviously wanted us to know when that time was getting closer. As the Christian church is increasingly drawn into the interfaith movement, and as more and more churches go into isolation, preparing to sleep through the growing attacks on their faith, perhaps God knew it would take a few signs to wake us up and remind us that we have work to do.

Unfortunately, many Christians take the verses that tell us we won't know the time of His coming to mean they should ignore any and all scripture that might warn us of this time of tribulation. Others have fallen into the trap of fearing being labeled a "conspiracy theorist" should they display an interest in the Biblical prophecies about our future on Earth. My philosophy is simple. God included it in the Bible and, since God is all knowing, we should trust that it is something we should know and study along with the rest of His Word.

It is increasingly obvious that the time of our Lord's coming is drawing near. Prophecy is being fulfilled daily, and at a faster pace than ever before. Whether you believe in a pre-tribulation rapture, or believe Christians will be witness to the full tribulation, wrath, and final judgments, matters not. The beginning of birth pains and the signs of the times should have the same effect on all of us. It should motivate us to save as many souls as we can in the time that we have left. The Great Commission tells us to be disciples to all nations, bringing the message of salvation through Christ to all people. If the Church is raptured before the tribulation, it is important that we leave behind an explanation for the trials and judgments those left behind will face. How else will they recognize the deception of the anti-Christ and seek instead the truth of the Bible? If we are to endure the tribulation along side them, we will need to be prepared to not only share the message of salvation, but share with them the reasons for God's judgment and hold it up as further proof of their need to be saved.

Below is a study of the prophetic signs God gave us as a warning of the approaching end of the age. Many of them are being fulfilled now and many will be fulfilled in the near future. I would encourage you to study prophecy, know what is coming and be prepared to share it with others.

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SIX SIGNS GIVEN BY JESUS TO INDICATE HIS COMING AND THE END OF THE AGE

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In Matthew24:3 Jesus was asked, "Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming, and of the end of the age?" Jesus told his apostles to look for the following signs prior to his second coming and the end of the age.

1. FALSE PROPHETS AND CHRISTS

Matthew 24:5 "For many will come in my name, saying, I am Christ, and will mislead many."

Matthew 24:11 "And many false prophets will arise, and will mislead many."

In the last several years many have claimed to be the Messiah. Jim Jones and David Koresh are examples of these false christs as well as countless others who are not as newsworthy. These false prophets are a prelude to the ultimate false christ, the antichrist. Many New Age groups, some even NGO's working for the United Nations, are anxiously awaiting the antichrist, preparing the way for his acceptance as the head of the hierarchy of gods and the one who will usher in world peace.

2. WARS

Matthew 24:6 "And you will be hearing of wars and rumors of wars; see that you are not frightened, for those things must take place, but that is not yet the end."

Rumors of wars in all areas of the world now occur frequently thanks to instant media coverage and the availability of a multitude of 24-hour news sources.

Matthew 24:7 "For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes."

More people have been killed in warfare in this century than at any other time in history. As the death toll rises in the Middle East, more and more countries work feverishly to develop devastating weapons of mass destruction. Add to that the expanding threat of terrorism and unpredictable dictators such as Saddam Hussein, and the potential for the outbreak of war exists in nations, kingdoms and places across the globe.

3. FAMINES

Matthew 24:7 "For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes."

As white, Christian farmers are driven out of Zimbabwe in increasing numbers, and foreigners move in to replace life-sustaining crops with poppies that now supply 25% of the worlds drugs, famine spreads across the African continent. The undernourished are not limited to Africa, however. A large portion of the worlds 5 billion people suffers from a shortage of food.

4. EARTHQUAKES

Matthew 24:7 "For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes."

The number and intensity of earthquakes this century is at a level higher than any other time in history. A staggering number of seismic events occur around the world daily. The earthquake seismic monitor IRIS shows all major earthquakes for the last year. Indicated by yellow and red circles, the seismic events of the last 15 days provides strong evidence of the fulfillment of Matthew 24:7 in our day. By contrast, in the years from 1890 to 1900 there was only one major earthquake in the world.

5. TRIBULATIONS

Matthew 24:8-9 "But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs. Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and will kill you, and you will be hated by all nations on account of my name."

Christians are under attack throughout the world today. In the United States Christians still enjoy freedom to worship God without suffering much more than ridicule, hatred, or discrimination at work and school. However in many other countries such as China, Sudan, Africa, Saudi Arabia, Korea, Russia, and many Muslim nations, Christian suffer much greater persecution and often times death for their faith. During the tribulation this suffering will be worldwide and will continue even to the point of martyrdom. These first 5 signs will increase in intensity and severity as the tribulation approaches, much like the birth pangs or contractions of a pregnant woman worsen as the delivery time approaches.

6. THE GOSPEL WILL BE PREACHED THROUGHOUT THE WORLD

Matthew 24:14 "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world for a witness to all the nations, and then the end shall come."

This prophecy has already been fulfilled through television, radio, missionaries, the translation of the Bible into many languages, and the internet. People all over the world now hear the message of Christ from missionaries who have the means to travel the globe, and via technology that allows us to communicate with people on the other side of the world right from our own homes, churches and offices.

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TWO CHARACTERISTICS OF THE END OF THE AGE FROM THE APOSTLE PAUL

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1. GODLESSNESS IN THE LAST DAYS

II Timothy 3:1-5,7 "But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come. For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good, treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of god; holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth."

For anyone who has watched television, read a newspaper, lost a retirement to corporate greed and corruption, or just walked outside their front door, it is obvious this prophecy has been fulfilled by our generation. Our leaders are often corrupt; our cities are filled with crime, brutality, and neon signs proclaiming our sinful, godless nature. The New Age Movement brings in increasing numbers of mystics who claim to be the enlightened ones. They are some of the most educated and influential people in our societies, and yet the most lacking in real truth.

2. APOSTASY (FALLING AWAY FROM THE FAITH)

I Timothy 4:1-3 "But the spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons. By means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron, men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth."

Churches today are becoming more and more ecumenical, embracing the New Age interfaith agenda, and denying Christ as the only way to salvation. Giving in to the politically correct media and a corrupt society, they have embrace homosexuality as an acceptable alternate lifestyle and preach tolerance and compromise in place of God's truth for the salvation of the world. The environmentalist movement within the New Age movement lures them into a worship of mother earth, belief in past lives, reincarnation, and Karma while demonizing all those who would eat the meat God gave us as nourishment for our bodies.

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ELEVEN FULFILLMENTS OF BIBLE PROPHECY REQUIRED FOR THE END OF THE AGE

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1. EXISTENCE OF A 200,000,000 MAN ARMY IN THE EAST

Revelation 9:16 "And the number of the armies of the horsemen was two hundred million; I heard the number of them."

An army of that size had never existed until China's army reached that number in the 1960's.

2. REDEVELOPMENT OF THE ROMAN EMPIRE (EUROPEAN COMMUNITY)

Daniel 2:32-33 "The head of the statue was made of fine gold, its breast and its arms of silver, its belly and its thighs of bronze, its legs of iron, its feet partly of iron and partly of clay."

Daniel 2:40-43 "Then there will be a fourth kingdom as strong as iron; inasmuch as iron crushes and shatters all things, so like iron that breaks in pieces, it will crush and break all these in pieces. And in that you saw the feet and toes, partly of potter's clay and partly of iron, it will be a divided kingdom; but it will have the toughness of iron, and partly of pottery, so some of the kingdom will be strong and part of it will be brittle. And in that you saw the iron mixed with clay, they will combine with one another in the seed of men; but they will not adhere to one another, even as iron does not combine with pottery."

The fourth kingdom of iron is the Roman empire according to Daniel's interpretation of King Nebuchadnezzar's dream. The two legs are the division of the Roman empire into an eastern portion called the Byzantine empire which ended in the 1400's and a western portion based in Rome which ended in the 400's. The nations of Europe since the Roman empire dissolved have never adhered or formed one empire but continue as separate nations, however, the European Union now has 15 Member States and is preparing for the accession of 13 eastern and southern European countries.

3. RETURN OF THE ONE PURE LANGUAGE, HEBREW, TO ISRAEL

Zephaniah 3:9 "For then I will return to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the Lord, to serve him with one consent."

Prior to the restoration of Israel in 1948, Hebrew was a dead language. Now Hebrew is spoken throughout Israel.

4. REBUILDING OF THE TEMPLE, RESTORATION OF TEMPLE WORSHIP AND ANIMAL SACRIFICES IN JERUSALEM

For several end time prophecies to be fulfilled, the temple will have to be rebuilt.

Revelation 11:2 "Leave out the court which is outside the temple and do not measure it, for it has been given to the nations; and they will tread under foot the oly city for forty-two months."

Daniel 9:27 "And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolation, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."

Daniel 9:26 "Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary."

Some archeologists believe that the temple mount is actually 340 feet south of the Dome of the Rock site, putting the Dome of the Rock within the Court of the Gentiles. This may be the court outside the temple that is left out.

There are many groups already working on preparations for the new temple. The blueprints are already done, the temple garments have been made, and there have already been attempts to lay the cornerstone of the temple. The only thing standing in the way of the construction of the new temple is Islam's third holiest site, the Dome of the Rock and government support for such an undertaking. Some possible scenarios for the rebuilding of the temple are as follows:

1. The persuasion and performing of miracles by the Antichrist and False Prophet convinces the Islamic world to approve the rebuilding.

2. The United Nations will negotiate the rebuilding of the temple following a war with the armies from the North (Russia and Islamic forces). This assumes that the war with the armies from the North is not the battle of Armageddon as some feel and that this attack occurs before the rapture or tribulation period begins. The supernatural destruction of the Russian army and Islamic forces will cause an outpouring of Christian worship and zeal amongst the Jewish people who will reconstruct the temple.

3. It is determined that the site of the first two temples is actually south of the Dome of the Rock, and the court of the gentiles (Dome of the Rock) will be left out of the 3rd temple.

A group in Israel called the Temple Mount Faithful have obtained most of the clothing, instruments and other equipment required for temple worship and are actively preparing for the laying of the third temple's cornerstone.

5. APPEARANCE OF THE RED HEIFER AFTER 2000 YEARS

Numbers 19:2-7 "This is the statute of the law which the Lord has commanded, saying, "Speak to the sons of Israel that they bring you an unblemished red heifer in which is no defect and on which a yoke has never been placed. "You shall give it to Eleazar the priest, and it shall be brought outside the camp and be slaughtered in his presence. Next Eleazar the priest shall take some of its blood with his finger and sprinkle some of its blood toward the front of the tent of meeting seven times. "Then the heifer shall be burned in his sight; its hide and its flesh and its blood, with its refuse, shall be burned. "The priest shall then wash his clothes and bathe his body in water, and afterward come into the camp, but the priest shall be unclean until evening."

A red heifer will be required to be used in the process of purification described in the book of Numbers. In May 1997 the first Red Heifer was born in 2000 years. Another red Heifer was born in Israel in March of 2002.

6. INCREASE IN KNOWLEDGE AND TRAVEL

Daniel 12:4 "But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the book until the end of time; many will go back and forth, and knowledge will increase."

Billy Graham was quoted as saying, "ninety percent of all the engineers and scientists who have ever lived are alive today." Air travel, space travel, DNA research and human cloning are all examples of the rapid increase in knowledge in our generation.

7. RETURN OF THE ETHIOPIAN JEWS TO ISRAEL

Zephaniah 3:10-11 "From beyond the rivers of Ethiopia My worshipers, My dispersed ones, will bring My offerings. In that day you will feel no shame because of all your deeds by which you have rebelled against Me; For then I will remove from your midst your proud, exulting ones, and you will never again be haughty on My holy mountain."

In 1984, Operation Moses saw the airlift of 15,000 Jews who had already fled to refugee camps in Sudan to escape starvation. In 1991, Operation Solomon flew 20,000 Jews to Israel from Ethiopia itself. A further airlift began in June of 1999, aimed at transporting the last 3,000 members of the Quara Jewish community from northeastern Ethiopia to Israel.

8. THE RISE OF RUSSIA

Ezekiel 38:2,4,8 "Son of man, set your face toward Gog of the land of Magog, the prince of Rosh, Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him. I will turn you about and put hooks into your jaws, and I will bring you out, and all your army, horses and horsemen, all of them splendidly attired, a great company with buckler and shield, all of them wielding swords. After many days you will be summoned; in the latter years you will come into the land that is restored from the sword, whose inhabitants have been gathered from many nations to the mountains of Israel which had been a continual waste; but its people were brought out from the nations, and they are living securely, all of them."

In order for some end time events to occur Russia will have to be a strong nation with a strong military.

9. RETURN OF RUSSIAN JEWS TO ISRAEL

Jeremiah 23:7-8 "Therefore behold, the days are coming declares the Lord, when they will no longer say, as the Lord lives, who brought up the sons of Israel from the land of Egypt, but as the Lord lives, who brought up and led back the descendants of the household of Israel from the north land and from all the countries where I have driven them. Then they will live on their own soil."

In the 1970's and 1980's there was a mass exodus of Russian Jews out of Communist Russia. In 1999 the Associated Press reported a dramatic increase in the number of Jewish immigrants from Russia, bringing the largest number of Russian Jews to Israel since the early 1990's.

10. TECHNOLOGY FOR THE MARK OF THE BEAST

Revelation 13:16-17 "And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves to be given a mark on their right hand or on their forehead, and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name."

On May 10, three members of a family in Florida became the first people to receive the biochip implant. Each device, made of silicon and called a VeriChip, is a small radio transmitter about the size of a piece of rice that is injected under a person's skin. It transmits a unique personal ID number whenever it is within a few feet of a special receiver unit. VeriChip's maker describes it as "a miniaturized, implantable, radio frequency identification device (RFID) that can be used in a variety of security, emergency and healthcare applications."

Is the biochip the mark of the beast to be used by the antichrist? We can't really know. What is significant is that people are being softened to the idea of a mark or an implant as a means of maintaining security, providing medical information, and regulating a more interdependent world. As attitudes change, fears subside, and people are convinced of the need for such a mark, the true mark of the beast will be easily introduced to the world by the antichrist.

11. PLANS FOR THE ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT

The United Nations, World Trade Organization, International Criminal Court, UN peacekeeping/police force, numerous UN NGO's, and other agencies are preliminary steps to the formation of a one world government. We now have the communications technology, transportation, and the pro-globalization media necessary to usher in the one world government headed by the antichrist. The increasing terrorist threat and the middle east conflict will only speed up the formation of this governing body as fear and promises of better security make more people willing to give up their national sovereignty for global governance.

12. INSTANT COMMUNICATION AROUND THE WORLD

Revelation 11:3, 7-10 "And I will grant authority to my two witnesses, and they will prophecy for twelve hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth. When they have finished their testimony, the beast that comes up out of the abyss will make war with them, and overcome them and kill them. And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which mystically is called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified. Those from the peoples and tribes and tongues and nations will look at their dead bodies for three and a half days, and will not permit their dead bodies to be laid in a tomb. And those who dwell on the earth will rejoice over them and celebrate; and they will send gifts to one another, because these two prophets tormented those who dwell on the earth."

Television and the 24-hour news networks make it possible for people around the world to see the dead prophets and rejoice at their deaths.

Luke 21:28 "But when these things begin to take place, straighten up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near."

Luke 21:32 "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place."

[dreamingwolf]

after reading that Im so gonna run all my credit up

[No_Pressure]

I am not lost, and if I am on my way to hell I will see you there.

If there is one thing I have found to be true about all people that think its a good idea to push their religious views on others its this: The more arrogant, smug, and condescending the person, the louder they speak, and the more they pity you when you question what they say.

[Ancalagon the Black]

Of all the things that made me angry about that post, this was the worst:

As white, Christian farmers are driven out of Zimbabwe in increasing numbers, and foreigners move in to replace life-sustaining crops with poppies that now supply 25% of the worlds drugs, famine spreads across the African continent.

So white Christian farmers (less than 1% of Zimbabwe's population) are the chosen ones, but the ones replacing them--ie BLACK Christian farmers--are devils incarnate? This is a preposterously racist statement; it values lives of white people specifically because they are white. And no, famine is not sweeping through Africa. "We Are the World" was in the 1980s; most of Africa is doing much better now. The statement just panders to deep-seated prejudices and stereotypes.

[Bad Man Burgendy & Gold]

If someone doesn't believe, yall just believe they go to hell, fine then let me go to hell, I mean I respect your religion and all but do you really think your gonna convert any non-believers on a message board

[Ford]

How pathetic are you that you feel the need to impose your views on others. Your close minded extremist antics are more a betrayal to the nature of your religion and those who actually understand the message behind the book you're citing than anything else. I hope you feel ignorant because it radiates off you.

[No_Pressure]

How pathetic are you that you feel the need to impose your views on others. Your close minded extremist antics are more a betrayal to the nature of your religion and those who actually understand the message behind the book you're citing than anything else. I hope you feel ignorant because it radiates off you.

Damn man you put that perfectly, I was trying to but I couldnt find the right words. Damn. Post of the year right here. :applause:

[Ancalagon the Black]

I just wanted to note--I think a lot of the animosity in the thread is not coming from the fact that it is espousing Christianity, but rather that it's a bunch of lunatic, fringe observations on current events that somehow fit with selected passages (with proper interpretation). I bet that most Christians wouldn't agree with everything in the original post at all.

[ChiefBigMeat]

Yikes...

The scariest thing about apocalyptic cult weirdos is they want to take everyone out with them.

Beware the next exciting post, when we are all encouraged to bring grape Kool-aid and firearms to a Texas compound so we can prepare for the comet that will bring the alien spaceship that will take our souls to Gary Coleman's magical petting Zoo.

[PleaseBlitz]

Bring grape Kool-aid and firearms to my Texas compound so we can prepare for the comet that will bring the alien spaceship that will take our souls to Gary Colemans magical petting zoo.

[#98QBKiller]

Yikes...

The scariest thing about apocalyptic cult weirdos is they want to take everyone out with them.

Beware the next exciting post, when we are all encouraged to bring grape Kool-aid and firearms to a Texas compound so we can prepare for the comet that will bring the alien spaceship that will take our souls to Gary Coleman's magical petting Zoo.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

We're supposed to bring cherry Kool-aid.

[No_Pressure]

Some random cult in 1990: REPENT NOW! THE SIGNS ARE ALL RIGHT! JESUS IS COMING AND HE WONT SAVE YOU UNLESS YOU BELEIVE EVERYTHING I TELL YOU!!!! NOW DRINK THIS ARSENI....ERR......KOOL ADE....YES!!!

Some random cult in 2000: THE TIME TO REPENT IS UPON US! IT IS THE YEAR 2000, AND UNLIKE THE YEAR 1,000 I THINK THIS WILL BE THE MILLENIUM THAT JESUS DECIDES TO COME BACK! MOST OF US WILL BE GOING TO HELL, SO GIVE AWAY YOUR WORLDLY BELONGINGS! YOU WONT NEED THEM! I WILL TAKE YOUR ITEMS AND THROW THEM AWAY FOR YOU! I AM ALSO SELLING SACRED JESUS STONES FOR YOU TO BUY AND CARRY AROUND WITH YOU, AND GIVE TO FRIENDS YOU WANT TO REPENT!!!

This guy now: REPENT! YOU NON BELIEVERS HAD BETTER LISTEN UP. ALL THE SIGNS ARE CLEAR NOW JESUS IS COMING AND YOU WILL BE JUDGED! FOLLOW WHAT I SAY NOW OR BURN IN HELL!

Sad thing is, in 2000 that cult actually exsisted. One of my grandfather's friends was suckered in and lost everything he owned. The guy bought sacred rocks that looked like someone had just polished a little bit...thats all he carried. He lost his house and im not sure what happened to him I think he went to live with relatives, or a nursing home.

[Pskins]

Livin easy Livin free

Season ticket on a one way ride

Asking nothing, leave me be

taking everything in my stride

Don't need reason Don't need rhyme

Ain't nothing I'd rather do

Going down, Party time

My friends are gonna be there too

:nana:

[aszumilo]

The end of the world will occur sometime after you read this.

[Jumbo]

Well, nice work, Michael. I think you'd best serve attracting souls to Christianity by becoming a Buddhist.

BTW, the "red heifer" is among us now, but not in the form you think. The Beast has disguised it as a bull. And its energy is fierce and draining. And mixed with alcohol, it leads many to sin. Three or four times some nights.

[RLeVan]

I never thought I would have found a more appropriate post for this quote.

Billy Madison:

Mr. Micheal, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Names have been changed to reflect those responsible for such a post.

[thelarkascend1ng]

listen.

i'm going to be as brutally honest as i can.

my father used to be a pastor in the northern virginia area. as i grew up, until about 16 (when he quit due to controversy within the church body over the direction of the church itself), i pretty much found that our church was filled with one of two people. those who were sincere, honest, and open about their faith in a constructive and undeniably amicable way, and those who were proselytizing beyond belief and came across as straight up jerks when it came down to it.

no matter what, from a believer to another believer, please listen to me and ask yourself how constructive you really think you will be posting this on a late night OT thread on a Redskins message board? this basically makes me further understand and see where those who hate religion are coming from. can you imagine how unbelievably frustrating this would be for anyone other than you?

i'm not saying you are a jerk, and i'm not saying your intent isn't just - but this isn't the time or place to open up such a delicate subject, and the manner in which you chose to do so is, for lack of a better word, detestable.

by the way - those who were writing the new testament thought that Jesus was coming any day as well. let's not forget...

I Thessalonians 5:4,9-10 "For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night. For God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, who died for us, that whether we are awake or asleep, we may live together with him.

[No_Pressure]

Well, nice work, Michael. I think you'd best serve attracting souls to Christianity by becoming a Buddhist.

BTW, the "red heifer" is among us now, but not in the form you think. The Beast has disguised it as a bull. And its energy is fierce and draining. And mixed with alcohol, it leads many to sin. Three or four times some nights.

Did you say bull or balls?

http://www.dumpalink.com/media/1149505294/Dave_Chappelle_Red_Balls

[RLeVan]

Thanks for the insight Lark. My previous post wasn't a diss on all religion, so don't get me wrong. It must have been difficult for your father to distance himself from the church he belonged to. It's nice to hear that about those that are faithful can still retain some objectivity.

[SEF]

Now I'm all scared and stuff. I hope Ghozer spares me.

[Thiebear]

Which part am i confused on?

The, we've been describing the end of times even though Jesus said not to for 2000 years and have been wrong every time? (Probably why Jesus said not to)....

[rebornempowered]

I fully intentioned on ignoring this post but I cannot let it go without addressing.....well.....almost the entire post.

First off, dispensationalism is a dangerous idea that has very little root in scripture.

Before I start my critique of the "article" I want to ask a question: In Matthew 24 to whom is Jesus speaking? Read verse 34 "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place."

Every time Jesus refers to "this generation" in the New Testament it refers to the generation to whom Jesus is speaking. Yet, you want it to mean something else here? That is not good scholarship.

1. FALSE PROPHETS AND CHRISTS

This was fulfilled in the first century. Jesus said that the generation would not pass until all these things take place. It didn't. There were plenty of false prophets in the first century. Nothing indicates there will be a fulfillment almost 2000 years later. Every generation could claim this was fulfilled in their day.

2. WARS

Once again easily fulfilled in the first century. Also, every generation could claim that this was being fulfilled in their day.

3. FAMINES

Fulfilled in the first century.

During this time some prophets came down from Jerusalem to Antioch. One of them, named Agabus, stood up and through the Spirit predicted that a severe famine would spread over the entire Roman world. (This happened during the reign of Claudius.) The disciples, each according to his ability, decided to provide help for the brothers living in Judea. ACTS 11:27-29

4. EARTHQUAKES

First century fulfillment. There are several earthquakes recorded in the Bible and others in history. Once again, to whom is Jesus speaking? A first century audience, if it was fulfilled why are we placing this nearly 2000 years in the future.

5. TRIBULATIONS

Tribulation.....tribulation......you don't know no stinking tribulation.

During the Roman siege on Jerusalem in 70 AD Josephus records that nearly a million Jews were killed. Things were so bad that he records a woman cooking and eating her own child. :puke:

6. THE GOSPEL WILL BE PREACHED THROUGHOUT THE WORLD

This is just flat out BAD Bible scholarship. The Greek word translated as "World" here mean "known world" and other places in scripture is translated as "Roman world" and the like. It is the same Greek word that we find in this verse:

In those days Caesar Augustus issued a decree that a census should be taken of the entire Roman world. Luke 2:1

Once again a first century fulfillment is in play because even the Bible says that the gospel has gone out to the world.

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TWO CHARACTERISTICS OF THE END OF THE AGE FROM THE APOSTLE PAUL

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1. GODLESSNESS IN THE LAST DAYS

Of course there was godlessness in the first century. The apostle John says that many anti-christs were at work.

2. APOSTASY (FALLING AWAY FROM THE FAITH)

There was definetly apostacy in the first century. The problem is that this "article" is saying the "last times" is the end of the world. It is better understood as the end of the old covenant system of sacrifice that was put to an end when the temple was destroyed in 70 AD.

You will notice in Matthew 24 that the disciples ask Jesus about the end of the AGE not the end of the WORLD.

Perhaps the best point to make is that there is a specific prophecy on Christs return that goes contrary to all of this.

The LORD says to my Lord:

"Sit at my right hand

until I make your enemies

a footstool for your feet."

Psalm 110:1

How is everything being bad and terrible and apostacy the world being Christs footstool for Him to be able to leave the Fathers right hand? In other words this dispensational theory has made people let the world go to hell because it believes that is required for Christs return when it is actually doing the exact opposite. It is high time Christians abandoned this theory and get back to work at changing the world.

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ELEVEN FULFILLMENTS OF BIBLE PROPHECY REQUIRED FOR THE END OF THE AGE

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1. EXISTENCE OF A 200,000,000 MAN ARMY IN THE EAST

That's great and all that China has that army but where are they going to get all those horses. It's going to be a while before there are that many horses. Get to work on breeding them.

For the sake of time I am going to skip ahead to the easier points. I may come back and comment on the ones I skipped if I have time later.

4. REBUILDING OF THE TEMPLE, RESTORATION OF TEMPLE WORSHIP AND ANIMAL SACRIFICES IN JERUSALEM

Is there one verse in the NT that says the temple will be rebuilt?

Don't you think it's just slightly blasphemous for there to be a temple rebuilt when Christ is the temple and the ultimate sacrifice?

5. APPEARANCE OF THE RED HEIFER AFTER 2000 YEARS

They have to have that red heifer. :doh: YAY, HOORAH for genetic variety. Do we really know that no red heifer was born for 2000 years? That is probably the dumbest statement in the whole "article".

6. INCREASE IN KNOWLEDGE AND TRAVEL

Daniel 12:4 "But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the book until the end of time; many will go back and forth, and knowledge will increase."

Yes, this has to be true because it talks about airplanes and engineers and the internet and cell phones and skype and IM and MySpace and ........... :doh:

This easily was fulfilled by the first century. People had been going back and forth and I am sure their knowledge increased.

8. THE RISE OF RUSSIA

Rosh is not Russia. Deal with it.

9. RETURN OF RUSSIAN JEWS TO ISRAEL

This brings up a very scary point. Christians are paying for Jews to return to Israel so the end times can be fulfilled. Yet those same Christians believe that 2/3 of the Jews will be killed in their fulfillment of the end times.

Do you think they are telling these Russian Jews that when they sign them up to go to Israel?

10. TECHNOLOGY FOR THE MARK OF THE BEAST

How come the "Mark" is a technological mark in one chapter of Revelation but the Mark of the Lamb is not a technological mark but symbolic just a few chapters later?

In addition you don't need technology for this to be fulfilled anyway.

Luke 21:32 "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place."

Finally, something I agree with. It didn't. The things prophecied in Matthew 24 and Luke 21 took place leading up to the destruction of the temple in 70 AD.

A side note:

I obviously do not believe that Christ physically returned to earth as prophecied here:

For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. 1 Thes. 4:16 and 17

That is a consumating coming at the end of history not the U-turn coming of the rapture as dispensationalist authors would have you believe.

I strongly recommend that any Christian interested in this topic read two books:

Are We Living in the End Times by Tim LaHaye and Jerry B. Jenkins

Last Days Madness by Gary DeMar

Read and compare the two and determine for yourself which one is the best piece of scholarship and study of scripture.

[Thiebear]

rebornempowerd:

or you could just post this:

"Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only."

You would think that any person that believed in Jesus.. AND.. tell others they are basically Stupid, would actually listen to the person they profess to believe in....

[rebornempowered]

rebornempowerd:

or you could just post this:

"Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only."

You would think that any person that believed in Jesus.. AND.. tell others they are basically Stupid, would actually listen to the person they profess to believe in....

I have a book entitled "The Day and the Hour" by Francis X. Gumerlock that chronicles every prediction of the end from the time of Christ until now. It started out as an article and instead ended up being a 329 page book. :doh:

You are right that I could have said that but it was so poorly written and is such terrible scholarship that I couldn't let it go without an attempt at a proper refutation.

[rebornempowered]

A CHALLENGE

I need someone to explain something to me.

Read this verse:

And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the SON OF MAN COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF THE SKY with power and great glory. Matthew 24:30

Jesus is obviously quoting Daniel 7:13

I kept looking in the night visions,

And behold, with the clouds of heaven

One like a Son of Man was coming,

And He came up to the Ancient of Days

And was presented before Him.

So, here is my question:

Which direction is the verse in Daniel? Obviously it is up.

Why do we read Matthew 24:30 as being in a downward direction then?