Do you hate TO? Help me out!

[The Animal Trainer]

This might sound crazy, but I was over on cowboyszone.com and they're discussing an article on cowboys.com about the redskins. So I think its worth a read when all of the sudden everyone and their cousin over there is comparing Lloyd to T.O...saying his attitude is just as bad. I don't know all of Lloyd's issues with the 49ers so I laid back....then I read this.

Originally Posted by SultanOfSix

T.O. never tore a team apart. This is a myth portrayed be certain members of the media. If a team is torn apart by a single player, it isn't much of a "team."

And naturally, I have to reply with...."That is the most rediculous thing I've ever heard of. In my life. DMac said it was black on black crime, ask any iggle fan, they will tell you TO destroyed that lockerroom."

And another stinking cowboy comes out and says ND Kalu said 80% of the team was behind TO...that I'm an idiot for saying TO did anything wrong up there in Philthy.

Am I insane? TO killed that team, he berated the QB in the media and held out for more money, I even heard that towards the end he was parking in Andy Reid's spot. So now I'm going to have to list all the ways that he hurt the iggles and the 49ers, just to show these cowboy fans that TO is a cancer. Its like they've completely forgot the entire past 2 or 3 seasons of TO...I can't believe my eyes. They think TO didn't do anything wrong, like its D-Mac making stuff up. So iggle fans out there, or just regular TO haters like myself, refresh my memory on the TO saga so I can stick it to these cows, slurping TO like he's never done anything wrong...because its making me lose my mind dealing with these people who try to change the past in their own minds...its nuts.

[DWinzit]

You're not losing your mind. Think of who you are arguing with, is it worth it? Yes he ripped apart both of those teams. You forgot to mention him screwing over the ravens as well.

Think positive, next year they will be whining about TO being the cause for Parcells and Bledsoe to leave.

[The Animal Trainer]

I did forget about the ravens. He F'ed them over as well. All I did was post this excerpt from a yahoo sports artice. It summarizes what he did with the iggles, but you really need to hear it all 1st hand to get a feel for what a horribly screwed up person TO is. SportsCenter needs to do a montage of all their "TO is a dick" clips and run them back to back. I bet you could fill an hour of television with all that trash they collected over the past year. Here's what I posted.

1st reply -

You guys are serious? No one is going to back me up on the theory that T.O. was a cancer to the iggles? Or the 49ers? Tell me why he was traded or released from those teams, they just didn't think he was a good reciever? You don't remember him *****ing out coaches on the sideline in San Fran, calling Garcia gay? Or how about telling the media Donavon was tired in the superbowl, that he was a company guy, *****ing out another coach on the sideline with the iggles, it may have been their O-coordinator. Then he demanded more money. When the iggles wouldn't give it to him he held out, then he realized in order to get paid he couldn't hold out so he showed up and caused more problems. In fact the iggles had to ban him from the practice facility because he was causing so much trouble. Seriously, you guys don't remember any of that???? Suspended indefiantely for "conduct deterimental to the team". That's how you guys got him.

2nd reply -

Here's an article from YahooSports pretty much summarizing what I was just talking about

"Owens took his first verbal shot at McNabb last April, suggesting the five-time Pro Bowl quarterback was tired in the fourth quarter against the Patriots.

McNabb responded harshly and the two didn't speak for a prolonged period in training camp. They briefly reconciled their relationship and performed well together on the field -- Owens had 47 catches for 763 yards and six TDs in seven games last year.

Owens was sent home for one week from training camp last August after a heated dispute with coach Andy Reid that followed a shouting match with then-offensive coordinator Brad Childress.

Owens also annoyed the Eagles by breaking the dress code on road trips, parking in coaches' spots at the team's practice facility and sleeping through one team meeting, not bringing his playbook to another and refusing to open the playbook at another meeting.

In early November, the team had enough of Owens' antics after he again criticized McNabb, called the organization "classless" and fought with former teammate Hugh Douglas."

Really can't believe you guys don't remember all of that. It lead SportsCenter every night for about 6 months. I don't remember Lloyd doing anything near some of that garbage...parking in coaches spots, fighting Hugh Douglas, sleeping through meetings...vintage T.O. get used to it.

[#98QBKiller]

I honestly think that if TO messes up again, his NFL career is finished. If he pulls the same crap in Dallas no team will risk picking him up. Not to mention he's probably past his prime. WRs have a shorter NFL life than QBs and Bledsoe has only been in the league 3 years longer than TO and Brunell has only been in the league 2 years longer. Also, TO hasn't played in an NFL game since week 6 or so last year? We'll see what he has come September. I wouldn't count on anything big though.

[DWinzit]

I honestly think that if TO messes up again, his NFL career is finished. If he pulls the same crap in Dallas no team will risk picking him up.

That's what many said last year. There is always some smuck who'll sign him, like denver.

[Fred Jones]

Yes, the topics of discussion during the six week lull are about the same as last year.

I have gotten to the point that TO has become a non-issue until the week we play the pukes. I just don't really care that much about players that plays for the pukes or care to talk to a puke about one of their players.

As with last year, training camp can't come any quicker.

[carvixki25]

I heard that most of eagles players did actually support TO...I actually believe that hes not gonna screw this one up, but doesnt mean he'll be that effective in that conservative system they got going there..

[whitskins]

I wouldn't even argue with these morons, I'd just laugh at the Dallas fanbase selling their souls and revising history like a pack of dim-witted sheep.

B. Lloyd's attitude problems aren't even in the same stratosphere as TO's. B. Lloyd has a bit of a big mouth and some of his team's veterans didn't like his jewelry and aspirations of a rap career. TO has... well, everyone knows what he has done.

Anyone who tries to compare the two in that regard is a complete idiot.

[Chachie]

The Dallas Cowboy fans are naturally going to get behind their man. We did it for Deion Sanders. It's totally normal. If terrell Owens had come here we'd be rationalizing by saying "Joe Gibbs will handle him." The guy is an amazing WR and I dread seeing him in a Cowboy uniform. He will certainly catch TDs against us and will undoubtedly make the Dallas offense better. I do not "hate" Terrell Owens but I don't like him either. I don't approve of his antics and I have to root against him at least twice a year.

Anyway, don't be surprised that the Cowboy faithful are getting behind TO even to the point of re-writing their collective opinion of his stay in Philadelphia. It's what fans do.

[The Animal Trainer]

The Dallas Cowboy fans are naturally going to get behind their man. We did it for Deion Sanders. It's totally normal. If terrell Owens had come here we'd be rationalizing by saying "Joe Gibbs will handle him." The guy is an amazing WR and I dread seeing him in a Cowboy uniform. He will certainly catch TDs against us and will undoubtedly make the Dallas offense better. I do not "hate" Terrell Owens but I don't like him either. I don't approve of his antics and I have to root against him at least twice a year.

Anyway, don't be surprised that the Cowboy faithful are getting behind TO even to the point of re-writing their collective opinion of his stay in Philadelphia. It's what fans do.

Very true. I expect the cows to rewrite their history of T.O. in philthy and San Fran and he should fit in well down there with the rest of the arrogant, classless, trailerpark trash down there in dallass.

However, I'd like to make one thing clear. When you say, "We did it for Deion Sanders", leave me out of that collective "we". I've hated Deion my entire life, and when he was a Redskin, I still booed him. I hated The Danny for several years for that trade, among others. It seems like he's came to his senses and learned a few things about charactar guys from coach Gibbs. I'm happy to say that our roster appears to be free from the Neon Deions and T.O.'s of the NFL. We've got some quality guys here in D.C., lets keep it that way.

[IrishOrange15]

Owens didn't kill the Eagles. They still have a lot of good, young players. Their defense will probably be revived in '06 and they should be one of the league's elite special team units.

Injuries played a big part in the Eagles demise. And it wasn't Owens that decided the team should throw the ball 72% of the time. It's a stupid idea to begin with, but utterly moronic when your star QB is playing hurt after the first half of the first game of the year.

Owens certainly didn't help matters any and there's really no excuse for the way he behaved, but he's not single handidly responsible for their 6-10 season and I'm not ready to start playing "Taps" on the Eagles for now.

It also would have helped if Reid could have developed a receiver better than the likes of Billy McMullen, Todd Pinkston, and Greg Lewis. He wouldn't have had a problem to begin with.

Rich............

[Skins4481]

What did you expect from Cowboyszone.com? Cowboys fans(for the most part) are a bunch of dumb ass homers. Yet more proof of Cowboyszone.com members(for the most part) being blind ass homers.

Everyone knows TO ripped apart that team. It was all over the news. The locker room was divided. Every day on the TV and Radio they were talking about TO and the Eagles. Now it seems that the Cowboys fans have forgotten about all that when last year, most of them were laughing their asses off at the Eagles and TO. But then again, they are Cowboys fans. Its not really surprising that they have such short memories.

[jempet]

Arguing with a cowturd fan is like arguing with a retard..it's just not fair.

[elkabong82]

TO is viewed as an elite receiver, one of the top 5 in the NFL, some view him as the best. When your team picks up a top player, you will usually be glad. TO has baggage w/ him, so in his case some are glad, some were not all. However, now that TO being a buttboy has fully sunk in w/ the Dallas fans they are doing all they can to defend him, some might love it, but I know some don't but are "stuck" with him, so they feel they must support him. All teams have idiot fans, but seeing as our two teams are one of, if not the, biggest rivalries, the idiots come out of the woodwork when the Skins and Boys are mentioned in the same sentence. They are only saying Lloyd is problematic b/c they don't have a valid argument to support TO not destroying yet another team. They drudge up Lloyd to distract from the main issue. When you're stuck on a crappy team whose coach doesn't care about the players coming or going, I can understand being upset. When you're getting millions of dollars and are on a championship team crying you "need to feed your family" you won't receive sympathy from too many people. TO felt he got screwed in his contract, he should have taken it up w/ his agent, whose primary goal is to ensure his client has the best contract possible. TO instead redirected his anger towards the team. Some feel since he is making good money, he won't put up any problems. Not true, as he was making good money in san fran. Once you cause problems, you are labeled and will be treated differently. TO has done so twice, and the media is foaming at the mouth for him to say anything they can take out of context. There will be problems again, bet on it.

This nonsense about Lloyd being a problem should have been quelched by an logical person the second he signed a long term contract with the skins. Lloyd is going from being a number one receiever to having to battle between two other talented players (patten and El) for a number 2 spot. TO could never swallow that kind of pride. Lloyd is showing he was upset due to lack of production, and now he is happy. TO is a baby.

[jrocrb96]

TO is a moron. Did he rip apart the Eagles and 49ers, I don't think so. The 49ers were about to go into a rebuilding stage and quite frankly what Eagles team has ever kept things together over 3 years. It was there time to fall. TO made bad decisions in Philly but there's no way he alone could rip that team apart.

[Chachie]

Very true. I expect the cows to rewrite their history of T.O. in philthy and San Fran and he should fit in well down there with the rest of the arrogant, classless, trailerpark trash down there in dallass.

However, I'd like to make one thing clear. When you say, "We did it for Deion Sanders", leave me out of that collective "we". I've hated Deion my entire life, and when he was a Redskin, I still booed him. I hated The Danny for several years for that trade, among others. It seems like he's came to his senses and learned a few things about charactar guys from coach Gibbs. I'm happy to say that our roster appears to be free from the Neon Deions and T.O.'s of the NFL. We've got some quality guys here in D.C., lets keep it that way.

I hated Deion too, even after his arrival. I suppose I couldn't say that while saying what I said about the collective and still keep some integrity in my post. But yes- you and I were together on the "I still hate Deion" thing.

[onedrop]

even if kalu is right and 80% of the team was behind TO, that means that 20% werent. so it was still a team divided. and a team so divided cant compete with one that is 100% rock solid and together.

[The Animal Trainer]

Ya, I agree onedrop. Even if 80% of the guys were on TO's side he still destroyed the lockerroom because he made his teammates choose between him and Donavon, and this was all during the regular season. You can't have a team where your 2 best players aren't speaking to one another and a line is drawn between them in the lockerroom. That is the very definition of cancer, TO's subversive immature behavior that placed his own agenda above the team's agenda. It spread to the other players who were caught up in TO vs. Donavon and it undermined Donavon, the coaching staff, even Andy Reid because it was "The Company and the Company Guy" (Iggles coaches, management, and D-Mac) vs. TO and his homies. Can't have that. Thats how you get to 6-10.

[THEHEREAFTER]

What did you expect from Cowboyszone.com? Cowboys fans(for the most part) are a bunch of dumb ass homers. Yet more proof of Cowboyszone.com members(for the most part) being blind ass homers.

Everyone knows TO ripped apart that team. It was all over the news. The locker room was divided. Every day on the TV and Radio they were talking about TO and the Eagles. Now it seems that the Cowboys fans have forgotten about all that when last year, most of them were laughing their asses off at the Eagles and TO. But then again, they are Cowboys fans. Its not really surprising that they have such short memories.

I think what's being said is that one person cannot be responsible for tearing apart an entire team. I actually agree with you somewhat and yes, I laughed at philthy mercilessly when they're soap opera transpired. Many people feel that Reid & Co. didn't really handle the situation well and you must agree that several factors contributed to philly's sub-par season other than T.O.. Pinkston was gone before pre-season and they lost McNabb, Westbrook and several key defensive starters for the majority of the season. T.O. was definitely a divisive force last year but injuries and their supposed "leaders" should share some of the blame.

[THEHEREAFTER]

Lloyd is going from being a number one receiever to having to battle between two other talented players (patten and El) for a number 2 spot. TO could never swallow that kind of pride.QUOTE]

With all due respect T.O. is better than Lloyd and should be considered a #1 receiver in their respective situations.

[The Animal Trainer]

I think what's being said is that one person cannot be responsible for tearing apart an entire team. I actually agree with you somewhat and yes, I laughed at philthy mercilessly when they're soap opera transpired. Many people feel that Reid & Co. didn't really handle the situation well and you must agree that several factors contributed to philly's sub-par season other than T.O.. Pinkston was gone before pre-season and they lost McNabb, Westbrook and several key defensive starters for the majority of the season. T.O. was definitely a divisive force last year but injuries and their supposed "leaders" should share some of the blame.

It wasn't just T.O. Donavon going down led to McMahon and his comedy of errors followed by their other QB who's name escapes me at the moment, but it doesn't matter cause he just flat out couldn't play. Then you had injuries in the 2ndary and Andy Reid's lunatic system of passing it 75% of the time even when your #1 reciever and pro-bowl QB are both out of commission for one reason or another. It wasn't simply T.O. that made them a 6-10 ball club, but he did divide the lockerroom which started the avalanche. He also made it impossible for him and Donny to coexist, probably the same was true for him and Reid. Bottom line is TO has proven to be a terrible teammate and a selfish individual who appears to care more about his own agenda then that of his team. Not a player I want on the Redskins no matter how talented he is. Not to mention his physical skills have to start diminishing at some point. It was brought up in another post that he has been in the league only 3 years less than Bledsoe and I believe 2 years less than Brunell. He can't last forever, no matter how much of an athletic freak he is.

[kingfish50]

The Dallas Cowboy fans are naturally going to get behind their man. We did it for Deion Sanders. It's totally normal. If terrell Owens had come here we'd be rationalizing by saying "Joe Gibbs will handle him." The guy is an amazing WR and I dread seeing him in a Cowboy uniform. He will certainly catch TDs against us and will undoubtedly make the Dallas offense better. I do not "hate" Terrell Owens but I don't like him either. I don't approve of his antics and I have to root against him at least twice a year.

Anyway, don't be surprised that the Cowboy faithful are getting behind TO even to the point of re-writing their collective opinion of his stay in Philadelphia. It's what fans do.

Excuse me! The majority of Redskin fans were dead set against signing Deon Sanders. If TO were to have signed here, believe me, the vast majority on this board would be against it.

If you know Joe Gibbs, you knew that was never an option to sign TO and if he was here in Dan Snyders early years, none of those signings would have ever occured (Deon Sanders, Bruce Smith, etc..).

Not to make assumptions, but sounds to me like a TO fan. Not liking him but only having to root against him twice a year?

[JoeSkins]

That's what many said last year. There is always some smuck who'll sign him, like denver.

His talent makes him seem well worth the risk to some people. Don't forget, we were close to trading for him during his last season in SF too. We offered Gardner and a 2nd, they wanted a 1st, so we didn't get it done.

Edit: I can't spell

[elkabong82]

With all due respect T.O. is better than Lloyd and should be considered a #1 receiver in their respective situations.

I'm sorry, but I don't undertand what you are saying here. TO is a number one guy, and is, right now, way more talented than Lloyd. What I was saying was that everyone who says Lloyd has attitude problems is ignoring the fact he was a number 1 receiver (albeit in san fran) and has since signed for six years to play alongside santana for probably all six years. Lloyd signed knowing the odds are heavily in favor of him being the number two guy for at least a couple years. This was stated, more or less, to show that the people who stated Lloyd is a bigger problem than TO are absolutely retarded. While TO won't be in that situation ever again (due to talent and attitude), it shows that there is no problem w/ Lloyd, and also demonstrates selfless sacrifice, something TO knows nothing about.

TO is an elite receiver, but like I said, for anyone to suggest Lloyd is a problem and TO is not, well..., let's just say what ever they're smoking..., they probably bought it from Irvin.

[Chachie]

Excuse me! The majority of Redskin fans were dead set against signing Deon Sanders. If TO were to have signed here, believe me, the vast majority on this board would be against it.

If you know Joe Gibbs, you knew that was never an option to sign TO and if he was here in Dan Snyders early years, none of those signings would have ever occured (Deon Sanders, Bruce Smith, etc..).

Not to make assumptions, but sounds to me like a TO fan. Not liking him but only having to root against him twice a year?

Fine, so we disagree. I know most people hated Deion the day BEFORE we signed him. However- if you recall, this town was lit up with pride the day after.

Now in regards to Terrell Owens- any fan would get excited about his production and begin finding reasons why he won't screw things up for their team. Once you have him, you HAVE to start thinking positively whether you wanted him in the first place or not. This is all the Cowboy fans are doing. It's what should be done. He's a Cowboy now. What are they going to do? Just LET opposing fans pick away at them? I wouldn't and I just don't think you would either, Kingfish.