gchwood Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 http://www.inmotionmagazine.com/penalty.htmlThe religious right, who claim to follow and love Jesus, reject his example with its adamant belief in capital punishment while fiercely opposing abortions. Of course, this belief is selective and far from color blind. Consequently, white humans have rarely received the death penalty for killing humans who happen to be black. At least Catholicism is consistent in its condemnation of abortion and capital punishment. Where is the consistency in our nation's administering the death penalty? The grossly disproportionate race statistics of the victims of capital punishment strongly foretell that this nation can never fairly decide who will live and who will die. The elimination of death by the state offers the only just solution. Capital punishment relates to someone who chose to kill someone else. Abortion relates to an unborn baby who has obliviously committed no crime, that is where the protestants get there "inconsistancies." They beleive that life is sacred, but if you deprive someone of theirs you should be deprived of yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 True I made the statement based on my own research, but just because I didn't name a source doesn't make my statement untrue. And whether you choose to accept 'NEVER' or "RARELY" doesn't matter to me, I just made the statement to show some of the disparities in the death penalty regarding how we as Americans value human lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 If you like, I can keep naming sources that have come up with similar numbers such as myself. I think I have named enough to at least begin discussion about my statements themselves as opposed to their validity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herrmag Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Wow. A gang leader and murderer is sentenced to death and is executed, and this turns into a race debate. How pathetically predictable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamingwolf Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Malvo was black but when the shootings started everyone was looking for a loner white guy-- why is this? I think most people thought it was either a deranged white dude or a islamic terrorist, most people were kinda half right. I would like to see the crime statistics on crimes comitted by race. I wonder if that plays into racial % in death penalty cases. I still think its wealth that makes the difference in being sentanced to death. Hell if you got enough cash you might not even ever goto trial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 so none of the white serial killers have never killed any blacks :doh: i highly doubt that Certainly serial killers kill Blacks too, but when they go to trial its not just the life of a Black man they have to account for; its the life of a White man and a Black man. That changes the story so I didn't count them in my research because I was interested in the Blacks who killed ONLY Whites and the Whites who killed ONLY Blacks. As an independent person doing research, I'm allowed to do that if thats what I'm curious about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 I think most people thought it was either a deranged white dude or a islamic terrorist, most people were kinda half right.I would like to see the crime statistics on crimes comitted by race. I wonder if that plays into racial % in death penalty cases. I still think its wealth that makes the difference in being sentanced to death. Hell if you got enough cash you might not even ever goto trial. I agree that the poor are judged differently. Poverty is quickly becoming the 20th centry's major problem. People are so quick to judge a poor man as having different morals than a rich man? Maybe so, but does that mean that the poor man is more likely to commit a crime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Capital punishment relates to someone who chose to kill someone else. Abortion relates to an unborn baby who has obliviously committed no crime, that is where the protestants get there "inconsistancies." They beleive that life is sacred, but if you deprive someone of theirs you should be deprived of yours. I shouldn't have posted the entire article. All that I supported from the article was the research and facts stated. I have not taken the time to ponder over her opinions on Capital Punishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rincewind Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 three words - O J Simpson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gchwood Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 If you like, I can keep naming sources that have come up with similar numbers such as myself. I think I have named enough to at least begin discussion about my statements themselves as opposed to their validity. dude you still have not aknowledge that vast desparity of population of whites and blacks. or that fact that most violent crimes happen in that city. or that fact that most cities are populated with blacks as the vast majority. or the number of whites that are serving life sentances (many of you have said that life in prison is worse than the death penalty anyway) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Wow. A gang leader and murderer is sentenced to death and is executed, and this turns into a race debate. How pathetically predictable. As long as things don't get out of hand, a discussion is always informative and should be approached positively. If it gets to name calling, then I'll have to apologize for starting things to go this way. But one of our jobs as humans is to seek wisdom. I'd rather Tookie's death lead to discussions between Blacks and Whites about race relations than it leading to Blacks hating Whites and Whites hating Blacks. Its always better to move forward and if his death helps us move that way, then we should be thankful for the opportunity to gain wisdom from the mistakes of others. You've heard the old proverb haven't you? A smart man learns from his own mistakes, A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 three words - O J Simpson O.J. wasn't convicted. While I do have problems in general with the trial process. I'm just talking now about the process of giving the penalty of death and how its given exponentially more to Blacks who are convicted of killing Whites than it is to Whites who are convicted of killing Blacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 dude you still have not aknowledge that vast desparity of population of whites and blacks. or that fact that most violent crimes happen in that city. or that fact that most cities are populated with blacks as the vast majority. or the number of whites that are serving life sentances (many of you have said that life in prison is worse than the death penalty anyway) Ok I'll admit that. But it seems that you're trying to add little footnotes to the story while ignoring the main story. Of corse a Black can't kill a White in Mass and get CP if its Unconstitutional. But if CP is unconstitutional in Mass, then I'm not talking about them. I'm talking about the places that use it as an acceptable punishment. I don't want to compare which is better between life and death because peoples opinion on that as the sun rises and sets. I'm talking about concrete facts that you can look up for yourself if you don't believe me. I don't quite get the population argument, can you rephrase it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rincewind Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 O.J. wasn't convicted.While I do have problems in general with the trial process. I'm just talking now about the process of giving the penalty of death and how its given exponentially more to Blacks who are convicted of killing Whites than it is to Whites who are convicted of killing Blacks. Yeah but it plays into what gchwood was saying about money being the key, not necessarily race. Plus, you really think he would have been given the death penalty if he was convicted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 That fact is skewwed, have you noticed that there are 4 times as many white people than there are black people, and honestly there is much more black on black violence than there is black on white or even white on black. I haven't seen the stats to back this up, but it doesn't contradict my original post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 I am for the death penalty. It may not be perfect, but I feel it is necessary. I hate that this thread has turned into a racially charged discussion. I didnt post earlier on this thread because it had become a religiously charged discussion. suomynonA/Anonymous, if you please, How many blacks vs. whites are charged with violent crimes, and how many convicted ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Edgar Ray Killen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gchwood Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 I haven't seen the stats to back this up, but it doesn't contradict my original post. having lived outside of DC my whole life, it is easy to see that black on black violence is the major sector of violent crimes. Shoot most white people won't even set foot in South East unless there is a Nats game. The reason there is so little white on black violence is because we are too busy hunting and fishing and driving kids to freaking soccer practice. Besides white males would rather beat their wives than get killed in south east. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gchwood Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Fact is less than 20% of all violent crimes lead to an arrest. How can we accurately ascertain who is committing how many crimes. Maybe white people makes sure to just kill black people in states where there is no death penalty, maybe we premeditate our murders and black people have crimes of passion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gchwood Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Bill Cosby even says that there is a overriding problem with black on black violence. I mean seriously racism is such an over blown topic at this juncture of time. sure there are some extremist, but there are still black panther groups out there too. the real problem is the violence in the innercities, which unfortunately is commonly black on black Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Yeah but it plays into what gchwood was saying about money being the key, not necessarily race. Plus, you really think he would have been given the death penalty if he was convicted? I can agree with that, most who have money if comtemplating a crime think about all the actions etc... plan it out, where when you have some who are not as lucky don't think things out as well, or do not have the ability to cover it up. Take for example the young kid from PA that shot the parents of the girl he loved, he was not rich, acted more out of passion, and didn't think his crime out completely, and was caught days after. Now look at the congressman who killed his girlfriend in DC (never admitted it but we know he was behind it) They still have no clue about that, and that is sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 I am for the death penalty. It may not be perfect, but I feel it is necessary.I hate that this thread has turned into a racially charged discussion. I didnt post earlier on this thread because it had become a religiously charged discussion. suomynonA/Anonymous, if you please, How many blacks vs. whites are charged with violent crimes, and how many convicted ? I have no problem with opening the discussion up to this. What you're about to get into is stuff about jury selection and beating in police stations to force confessions, tampering with evidence. We can discuss these things if you'd like but its getting really off track from the point I was trying to make. So I'll just ask this, DOES ANYONE SEE ANY TRUTH TO THE STATEMENTS I MADE? or do you all just think I just wanted to be able to read my own thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gchwood Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 Edgar Ray Killen he was arrested on conspiracy to commit murder, not the actual act. He was convicted of manslaughter because of his negligence in preventing the act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 I have no problem with opening the discussion up to this. What you're about to get into is stuff about jury selection and beating in police stations to force confessions, tampering with evidence. We can discuss these things if you'd like but its getting really off track from the point I was trying to make. So I'll just ask this, DOES ANYONE SEE ANY TRUTH TO THE STATEMENTS I MADE? or do you all just think I just wanted to be able to read my own thoughts? I think you've done an excellent job of cherry picking specific facts that support your thesis, while ignoring others that would harm it. I oppose the Death Penalty (interesting that if you do a search of threads from years ago, I was a supporter, but changed due to conversations with people here, and my own research), but the sense I get from your argument is that the Death Penalty isnt your true motive, instead you have a problem with our justice system as a whole, which I totally DISagree with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gchwood Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 I have no problem with opening the discussion up to this. What you're about to get into is stuff about jury selection and beating in police stations to force confessions, tampering with evidence. We can discuss these things if you'd like but its getting really off track from the point I was trying to make. So I'll just ask this, DOES ANYONE SEE ANY TRUTH TO THE STATEMENTS I MADE? or do you all just think I just wanted to be able to read my own thoughts? I think that you are overblowing the race wars, this ain't 1964 anymore, I don't see segregation, and 99% of all encounters I see between blacks and whites are passive and involve no hostility. If we want to discuss racial problems, there has been a rise of violent crimes related to hispanics, violence to and violence from. They also represent a larger minority than blacks. Now they have some very radical gangs as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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