Whats the deal about this Tookie Williams guy?

[Thinking Skins]

To all those who are bringing religion into the matter, does anyone know if Tookie was Christian? Our main interests should not be in this life but the afterlife. And if we invest in the afterlife, even a beheading (as John the Baptist endured) is not too much to endure because there is glory on the other side. But we as a society have turned into one where we use Christianity to argue our beliefs, but do not argue the beliefs of Christianity.

[rincewind]

Compare these two facts about the US policies on the Death Pealty:

1) A Black Person has NEVER been convicted of killing a White Person and LIVED!

2) A White Person has NEVER been convicted of killing a Black Person and DIED!

Those two facts alone should put some doubt into your heads about the death penalty. I mean, is Person A's life more valuable than Person B's?

Wow! so you mean all i have to do is be convicted of killing a Black Person (don't know why that is capitilized) and i gain immortality?

[nelms]

To the kids who were reading his books:

What, all 300 of them?

[airborneskins]

Compare these two facts about the US policies on the Death Pealty:

1) A Black Person has NEVER been convicted of killing a White Person and LIVED!

2) A White Person has NEVER been convicted of killing a Black Person and DIED!

Those two facts alone should put some doubt into your heads about the death penalty. I mean, is Person A's life more valuable than Person B's?

Link?

[dreamingwolf]

Link?

heres the link

www.suomynonAliestomakeapointaboutracistamerika.idiot

[nelms]

Link?

Good luck.

[Thinking Skins]

Link?

This is not from an online story.

These are facts I've done papers on over my lifetime. THe few cases where a White guy was executed and had killed a Black person, he had also killed a White person.

If you want a link though, here's a story which speaks about the value of life:

http://www.azstarnet.com/allheadlines/106264

"Studies abound. According to a September Associated Press story, a California study found that people who kill whites are three times more likely to be sentenced to death than those who kill black people. It suggests that in the legal system, white victims have a higher value than victims of color. The study was conducted in California, but its authors said the conclusions mirror the experiences of other states. "

[ntotoro]

What does all this have to do with Tookie?

He deserved to die. He deserved to die 50 times if he could. Eff Jamie Foxx. Eff Mike Farrel. Eff anyone out there supporting him.

People can look up stats and beat their chests until their knuckles are raw, but this guy was a true waste of oxygen and is hopefully burning in hell. He deserves no better.

[Thinking Skins]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/11/AR2005121100806.html

"WHEN MARYLAND put Wesley E. Baker to death last week, it highlighted just about all the disparities that afflict its use of capital punishment. Mr. Baker was an African American man who killed a white person in Baltimore County. Blacks who kill whites are substantially more likely to receive the death penalty in Maryland than are whites who kill blacks, and Baltimore County prosecutors are dramatically more likely to seek it than are their counterparts elsewhere. While Mr. Baker committed a horrible crime, his execution nonetheless poses the question of whether the justice system would have demanded his life had he or his victim looked different or had the crime taken place somewhere else."

[rincewind]

This is not from an online story.

These are facts I've done papers on over my lifetime. THe few cases where a White guy was executed and had killed a Black person, he had also killed a White person.

If you want a link though, here's a story which speaks about the value of life:

http://www.azstarnet.com/allheadlines/106264

"Studies abound. According to a September Associated Press story, a California study found that people who kill whites are three times more likely to be sentenced to death than those who kill black people. It suggests that in the legal system, white victims have a higher value than victims of color. The study was conducted in California, but its authors said the conclusions mirror the experiences of other states. "

Okay in your first post you said NEVER - now its 'only in certain cases' - those being when a white person (see it doesn't need to be capitilized) kills a black and a white person.

Also, you should be careful using the word never - especially since you capitilized that for emphasis. I'm sure there are plenty of black people in jail for killing white people, and are not on death row.

[Thinking Skins]

Okay in your first post you said NEVER - now its 'only in certain cases' - those being when a white person (see it doesn't need to be capitilized) kills a black and a white person.

Also, you should be careful using the word never - especially since you capitilized that for emphasis. I'm sure there are plenty of black people in jail for killing white people, and are not on death row.

So having 0 Whites killed is horrible, but since there may be 3 or 4, its okay?

If you think that Tookie Williams was a bad guy in the 1970's, what about the guys who were/are lynching Blacks in the south before the Civil Rights Movement? Even the guys who get sentenced the death penalty are granted clemency although they show no remorse for what they did. (REMEMBER THE GUY IN MISSISSIPPI EARLIER THIS YEAR)

[Thinking Skins]

Okay in your first post you said NEVER - now its 'only in certain cases' - those being when a white person (see it doesn't need to be capitilized) kills a black and a white person.

Also, you should be careful using the word never - especially since you capitilized that for emphasis. I'm sure there are plenty of black people in jail for killing white people, and are not on death row.

Like I said in my original post, 'NEVER'. Thats based on my independent research and I stand by it until I'm convinced otherwise. But if you don't trust my research, then I have no problem with posting the research of others because although we may not both get zero, the numbers are gonna be awefully close.

Many of the Whites who are counted as being executed for killing Blacks have also killed Whites. I'm not counting them in my research because I'm talking about the value that America places on Black lives. Thats why I stand by my stats.

[rincewind]

So having 0 Whites killed is horrible, but since there may be 3 or 4, its okay?

If you think that Tookie Williams was a bad guy in the 1970's, what about the guys who were/are lynching Blacks in the south before the Civil Rights Movement? Even the guys who get sentenced the death penalty are granted clemency although they show no remorse for what they did. (REMEMBER THE GUY IN MISSISSIPPI EARLIER THIS YEAR)

Whhhooooaa... you are seriously putting words into my mouth there. I never said anything about it being alright for anybody to be killed. I was simply pointing out that your first post was horribly wrong. To say those things have or haven't EVER happened is just a joke.

Its like John Prine said "Jesus don't like killing, no matter what the reasons for."

[airborneskins]

heres the link

www.suomynonAliestomakeapointaboutracistamerika.idiot

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[Thinking Skins]

heres the link

www.suomynonAliestomakeapointaboutracistamerika.idiot

I admit, you got me too there. I was like whats this? ....Oh.:laugh:

[LegionOfDoom]

Whether he was sorry or not, they were still gonna execute....his past actions unrelated to the actual crime was the determining factor....founder of notorious street gang that killed many outweighed all of the good he did while in prison. If not for that past gang affiliations he "might" have been granted clemency. His death might have better served his cause in really bringing to light his good deeds and fight to end the bloodshed of street gangs in LA. Hopefully he left something behind to actually bring down the gang he was affiliated with.

[jbooma]

Like I said in my original post, 'NEVER'. Thats based on my independent research and I stand by it until I'm convinced otherwise. But if you don't trust my research, then I have no problem with posting the research of others because although we may not both get zero, the numbers are gonna be awefully close.

Many of the Whites who are counted as being executed for killing Blacks have also killed Whites. I'm not counting them in my research because I'm talking about the value that America places on Black lives. Thats why I stand by my stats.

so none of the white serial killers have never killed any blacks :doh: i highly doubt that

[gchwood]

This is not from an online story.

These are facts I've done papers on over my lifetime. THe few cases where a White guy was executed and had killed a Black person, he had also killed a White person.

If you want a link though, here's a story which speaks about the value of life:

http://www.azstarnet.com/allheadlines/106264

"Studies abound. According to a September Associated Press story, a California study found that people who kill whites are three times more likely to be sentenced to death than those who kill black people. It suggests that in the legal system, white victims have a higher value than victims of color. The study was conducted in California, but its authors said the conclusions mirror the experiences of other states. "

That fact is skewwed, have you noticed that there are 4 times as many white people than there are black people, and honestly there is much more black on black violence than there is black on white or even white on black.

[gchwood]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/11/AR2005121100806.html

"WHEN MARYLAND put Wesley E. Baker to death last week, it highlighted just about all the disparities that afflict its use of capital punishment. Mr. Baker was an African American man who killed a white person in Baltimore County. Blacks who kill whites are substantially more likely to receive the death penalty in Maryland than are whites who kill blacks, and Baltimore County prosecutors are dramatically more likely to seek it than are their counterparts elsewhere. While Mr. Baker committed a horrible crime, his execution nonetheless poses the question of whether the justice system would have demanded his life had he or his victim looked different or had the crime taken place somewhere else."

Superficially, white people seem to be the minority in Baltimore County so the majority of violence would seem to be coming from black people. Just as in Alaska, Utah, Arkansas, Colorado (middle america and less populated areas) you rarely see a black person convicted of a crime, because there aren't a whole lot of them there.

[Thinking Skins]

http://teacher.deathpenaltyinfo.msu.edu/c/about/arguments/argument4a.htm

"With respect to race, studies have repeatedly shown that a death sentence is far more likely where a white person is murdered than where a black person is murdered. The death penalty is racially divisive because it appears to count white lives as more valuable than black lives. Since the death penalty was reinstated in 1976, 202 black defendants have been executed for the murder of a white victim, while only 12 white defendants have been executed for the murder of a black victim. Such racial disparities have existed over the history of the death penalty and appear to be largely intractable. "

[Thinking Skins]

http://www.inmotionmagazine.com/penalty.html

There is no precedent for justice and equality in capital punishment

by Rose Sanders

Selma, Alabama

Now, I have no doubt. I am unequivocally against capital punishment. I was in downtown Manhattan en route to the United Nations when I heard the news. Henry Francis Hays, a white man and former Ku Klux Klansman, had been executed for killing Michael Donald, a 19 year-old black youth. Michael was in my family by marriage. We shared the same uncle. For a moment, I felt a strange sorrow. Initially it was unexplainable; history had been made. Death row is a familiar place for men of color, but white men have been extended an unspoken immunity for the unspeakable lynching, castration and murder of black men. Hays randomly hunted Michael like a wild animal, beat him 120 times with a limb, tortured him unmercifully and then hung him from a tree.

Justice! Revenge! My intellect tugged at my heart, but it could not dissipate this strange sorrow. My mind rushed back to the time Michael was killed. His vicious death reminded me of our persistent vulnerability in a nation where the rope and lynching of black people were once no more illegal than the slaughter of pigs. The silence and absence of white outrage revisited my consciousness .

Our society has devalued the humanity of people of color for over 400 years. Consequently, black life can be taken by a black man or a white man with relative impunity. Fertilized and cultivated by slavery, Jim Crow, segregation and tokenistic integration, those who planted this harvest of racial prejudice must share some responsibility for our current racial hate groups. Thirty years ago, hate crimes against blacks were ignored and rarely prosecuted. Even when the law ceased to plant and nurture seeds of racial hatred, it did not take the necessary precautions to remove the contaminated soil. Some wild seeds continued to grow, sometimes uncontrollably; prejudice has no boundaries. From non-violence, simple racial and class prejudice, sprouted the KKK, skin heads and the murderers of Michael Donald and 158 people in Oklahoma City.

Following the end of legal segregation, the seeds of racial prejudice reappeared in disguise. The devaluing of black children persisted through tracking and other unjust educational practices which separated and stigmatized black children and gave them far less. Albeit, the circle has not been broken. Be not deceived! The execution of Mr. Hays is not a sign of color blind justice. It is the deceptive attempt to further legitimate murder. More black men will continue to be executed than white men; more black men will continue to kill black men and escape the proverbial eye for an eye.

Black self-hatred, generated by the same conditions which allowed these hate crimes to grow and fester, also manifest in unprecedented Black on Black violence, but death row is rarely the final journey for the accused or the convicted. When a system devalues a man's life, it makes it easier for the devalued in that system to take a life. Racial prejudice is an infectious social disease that grows and spreads like wild fire, fueled by the poverty and "savage inequality" it creates.

I tried to comprehend the racism and hatred that caused a person, once an innocent child, to kill like a wild animal, a man he ironically perceived to be the animal. How did he arrive at this perception, how did he become the animal; why?

My mind then focused on Timothy McVeigh whose hatred had moved him to even kill his own; white women and children were among his massacred.

Again, I recalled the lack of righteous outrage, the kind that exploded with the death of Nicole Simpson. By this time, we had reached the U.N. where Jerusalem, my daughter of the heart, works. I wondered if there would ever be peace with justice in the world. Can there be peace when we take an eye for bn eye, a life for a life Where is the justice? Timothy McVeigh took 168 lives. Should we kill him 168 times? Where is the justice for a man who only took one life?

The pathetic portrayal of McVeigh af the good kid gone bad is painfully amusing. I closed my eyes and tried to imagine a black man on the front cover of Newsweek with the caption: "Should this man die? If a Black Panther or a black "anybody" had killed 168 people, the issue of the death penalty wouldn't have been debated. The recent debate is welcomed but also precipitated by the skin color of McVeigh. Regardless of the jury's decision to give McVeigh the death penalty, the debate, per se, again reminds us of the differences between black and white life in America.

When George Wallace was governor, I urged him to deny a pardon to a white man convicted of killing a black man. He responded by saying he was granting the pardon because the man had repented. Dead men can't repent. Neither can black men... is the message we hear loud and clear.

And what about the truly innocent How do we resurrect them from law-made graves? Do we expect our sorrow to return their life or do we care? Then my mind fell on Jesus. He was an innocent victim of capital punishment. Jesus forgave the guilty who hung beside him and emphatically renounced capital punishment.

The religious right, who claim to follow and love Jesus, reject his example with its adamant belief in capital punishment while fiercely opposing abortions. Of course, this belief is selective and far from color blind. Consequently, white humans have rarely received the death penalty for killing humans who happen to be black. At least Catholicism is consistent in its condemnation of abortion and capital punishment. Where is the consistency in our nation's administering the death penalty? The grossly disproportionate race statistics of the victims of capital punishment strongly foretell that this nation can never fairly decide who will live and who will die. The elimination of death by the state offers the only just solution.

The failure of the system to impose death on the takers of black life sends the message that black life is not as valuable as white life. Minimally, the abolishment of the death penalty would produce a peculiar equalizer. There is no precedent for justice and equality in capital punishment, nor can there ever be! Now, I have no doubt.

[rincewind]

Dude, who are you trying to prove a point to? Nobody said there isn't a huge discrepency between blacks and whites put to death. Gchwood just said maybe there is a reason for the discrepency. People, like me, were just pointing out that in your first post you emphasized that a white person has NEVER been sentenced to death for killing a black person, and a black person ALWAYS is put to death for killing a white person. Neither of which is true.

[DarkLadyRaven]

so none of the white serial killers have never killed any blacks :doh: i highly doubt that

Malvo was black but when the shootings started everyone was looking for a loner white guy-- why is this?

[gchwood]

http://teacher.deathpenaltyinfo.msu.edu/c/about/arguments/argument4a.htm

"With respect to race, studies have repeatedly shown that a death sentence is far more likely where a white person is murdered than where a black person is murdered. The death penalty is racially divisive because it appears to count white lives as more valuable than black lives. Since the death penalty was reinstated in 1976, 202 black defendants have been executed for the murder of a white victim, while only 12 white defendants have been executed for the murder of a black victim. Such racial disparities have existed over the history of the death penalty and appear to be largely intractable. "

kind of depends where they were convicted as well, as Tookie was the 12th person executed in Cali since 1977 (by the way he was convicted of not just killing a white dude but 3 koreans) maryland rarely executes anyone and massachusets it is "unconstitutional" according to that state

[Thinking Skins]

http://www.amnestyusa.org/education/lessonplans/dp6_georgia.html

Human Rights Education

Lesson Plans » Death Penalty » Racial Discrimination » Georgia

ACTIVITY HANDOUT

The Death Penalty in Georgia: Racist, Arbitrary and Unfair

JUNE 1996

The case of Wilburn Dobbs

Wilburn Dobbs, black, was sentenced to death in 1974 after a trial contaminated by racism. He was tried and found guilty of the murder of Roy Sizemore, white, during a robbery in December 1973. The offence occurred in the small, racially segregated community of Walker County, Georgia, which has a 96% white population. The trial started 12 days after Dobbs was indicted and only three days after the state announced it would seek the death penalty. At the trial, Dobbs was represented by a state-appointed attorney, who, on the morning of the trial, sought a delay stating that he was not prepared to go to trial and was in a better position to prosecute the case than defend it. The motion was denied and the trial went ahead.

During the trial Dobbs was referred to as colored and colored boy by the judge and defense attorney, and called by his first name by the prosecutor. Two of the jurors who sentenced Dobbs to death for the murder admitted after the trial to using the racial slur ******. Two female members of the jury stated that they feared blacks and found them to be scarier than whites. Another juror stated: I would fear one [a black man] on the street...I think all white women would have that fear.

The trial judge, Judge Coker, formerly served in the Georgia House of Representatives and Georgia Senate from 1953 to 1963. During that time he participated with other members of the legislature in an effort to prevent racial integration. Judge Coker presided over four cases in which the death penalty was sought. All of the victims were white, with two of the cases involving white defendants and two black defendants. Both cases involving white defendants resulted in life sentences and both cases involving black defendants received death sentences.

At the penalty phase (A capital trial is divided into two phases. If the defendant is found guilty the trial continues into the penalty phase. During the penalty phase the defense attorney can present mitigating evidence as to why the jury should not recommend a sentence of death to the judge.) of the trial, the defense attorney presented no mitigating evidence as to why Dobbs should be spared the death penalty. His only argument was to indirectly suggest that a death sentence would not be carried out. At no time did he refer to Dobbs by name or even request that the jury return a verdict of life imprisonment. His final words to the jury were I only ask that in considering the punishment, that you inflict one that you feel you can live with. The jury were left unaware of the many mitigating factors in Dobbs life. For example, Dobbs mother was 12-years-old when she gave birth to him and he never knew his father, who died shortly afterwards. Dobbs started life in a home environment which included alcohol consumption, prostitution and association with a criminal element. Dobbs was eventually removed from his home by his grandmother and placed with a relative. Members of the black community Dobbs grew up in were denied the opportunity to speak for a sentence of life imprisonment by the defense attorney's lack of investigation into possible mitigating evidence.

After 25 minutes of deliberation over the sentence, the jury asked the judge a question concerning Dobbs eligibility for parole. The judge refused to answer the question. In less than an hour the jury returned a death sentence.

When describing the attitude of the defense lawyer towards blacks, the Federal District Court stated:

Dobbs trial attorney was outspoken about his views. He said that many blacks are uneducated and would not make good teachers, but do make good basketball players. He opined that blacks are less educated and less intelligent than whites because of their nature or because my granddaddy had slaves. He said that integration has led to deteriorating neighborhoods and schools and referred to the black community in Chattanooga as black boy jungle. He strongly implied that blacks have inferior morals by relating a story about sex in the classroom...

The attorney stated that he uses the word ****** jokingly.

The federal court determined that the racial prejudice of the judge, prosecutor, defense lawyer and jurors in the case did not require that the death sentence be set aside. The Court of Appeals found that although certain of jurors statements revealed racial prejudice, no juror stated that [he or she] viewed blacks as more prone to violence than whites. Since neither the trial judge nor defense lawyer decided the penalty, the Court held that apart from the trial judges and defense lawyers references to Dobbs as colored or colored boy, it cannot be said that the judges or the defense lawyers racial attitudes affected the jurors sentencing determination. After a reprimand from the US Supreme Court, the Federal District Court again held that Dobbs did not receive incompetent representation despite his lawyer's racism.

Wilburn Dobbs remains on death row. In at least five capital cases in Georgia the accused were referred to with racial slurs by their own lawyers at some time during the court proceedings. A court-appointed lawyers only reference to his client during the penalty phase of a Georgia capital case was: You have got a little ole ****** man over there that doesn't weigh over 135 pounds. He is poor and he is broke. Hes got an appointed lawyer...He is ignorant. I will venture to say he has an IQ of not over 80. The defendant was sentenced to death.

[...] Racial bias in the selection of jurors

The jury selection process, known as the voir dire, is commonly used in a racially biased manner in Georgia. In 1986, in the case of Batson v. Kentucky where , the US Supreme Court ruled that it was unconstitutional for prosecutors to remove potential jurors from the jury on grounds of race. However, on numerous occasions defendants in capital cases have been tried by juries not composed of a cross-section of the community.

Six of the 12 blacks executed in Georgia since 1983 were convicted and sentenced by all-white juries after prosecutors had removed all potential black jurors.

An attorney researching an unrelated civil case, came across a memorandum from the then District Attorney of Ocmulgee judicial district, Joseph Briley, asking the Putnam County jury commissioners precisely how many blacks and women they should add to the list of potential jurors. The purpose of the memorandum appeared to be to make the jury lists representative enough to avoid challenges from defense lawyers but not fully representative of the population. Briley admitted giving the jury commissioners the number of names needed to make the lists acceptable but denied there was any intention to discriminate. In the capital cases tried by Briley in which the defendant was black and the victim white, Briley used 94% - 96 out of 103 - of his jury challenges to remove black jurors. On 13 July 1995 Joseph Briley was quoted in the Macon Telegraph as stating: ...I recognize the fact that it [the death penalty] cannot be equally applied in our system. That's not to say it's unfair.

Racial bias in seeking the death penalty

Georgia's death penalty statutes were rewritten following the 1972 US Supreme Court Furman decision. For the death penalty to be constitutional, states had to specify criteria for when district attorneys should seek a death sentence. Georgia's death penalty statute specifies 10 aggravating factors that would allow a district attorney to class a murder as capital. The 10 aggravating factors included in the statute would allow for most murders to be classed as capital. For example, if the murder could be described as wantonly vile, horrible or inhuman or that the murder was committed for the purpose of receiving money. This leaves a district attorney with almost unlimited discretion to decide whether to class a murder as capital. There are wide numerical discrepancies between how often different judicial circuits seek the death penalty; the most death sentences were sought by the judicial circuit of Stone Mountain - 86 between 1973 and 1995. During the same period the Appalachian judicial circuit only sought the death penalty twice.

[...]

The death penalty in Georgia is primarily sought against those accused of murdering people deemed more valuable by society; this may be by virtue of their social and economic standing, or their race. A study of capital cases brought before the courts in the judicial district of Chattahoochee, Georgia between 1973 and 1990 showed that 85% of defendants were accused of the murder of a white; in the same district blacks made up 65% of murder victims during the same period. Six percent of the capital trials involved a black-on-black murder. The death penalty was never sought for the murder of a black by a white during the 27 years covered by the study.

A statistical study of the use of the death penalty in the judicial district of Flint, Georgia (Complied by Professor Mike Radelet, Florida University, for use in the appeals of death row inmate Carzell Moore.), showed that the death penalty is sought six times more often if the victim is white. The death penalty had been sought in six of the 13 cases involving the murder of a white woman but had never been sought in the 11 cases involving the murder of a black woman.

The legal authorities continue to deny that the death penalty is used in a racially discriminating manner in Georgia. In July 1995, an Assistant Attorney General stated: I don't think we have a racist problem statewide. We're all human. People are not perfect, but we have too many checks and balances in the system that help reduce bias (Quoted in The Macon Telegraph 13 July 1995). (emphasis added).

On occasion, legal officials have refused to recognize that racial bias could interfere with the judicial process. During a 1990 legal hearing for William Brooks, black, on whether racial bias affected his original trial, defense attorneys questioned the district attorney on the lack of participation by ethnic minorities in the legal process: ...these five black men were all tried by all-white juries and defended by white lawyers, prosecuted by white lawyers, and tried by white judges. Does that offend your sense of justice? After further discussion on the issue the judge asked "What does my sense of justice have to do with it?" (Source: transcript of pre-trial hearings in State v. William Anthony Brooks.)

District attorneys often take into account the views of the relatives of white victims on whether to seek the death penalty against the defendant. The relatives of black victims may not be so privileged. The families of the victims of William Hance were not consulted on the possible sentences available. The district attorney who prosecuted Hance testified: I talked with, in most [death penalty] cases, the families of the victims...I'm sure that I talked to them in all...except for Hance...There was really no family to talk with... The district attorneys file on the victims told a different story; it contained the phone number and address of the mother of one of the victims. Had he contacted the victim's relatives he would have found them opposed to the execution of William Hance. Several family members of the victims submitted affidavits to the Georgia Board of Pardons and Paroles requesting that Hance not to be executed.

The district attorney responsible for seeking the death penalty against William Hance tried seven other capital cases during his tenure. The Hance case was the only one involving black victims; it was also the only one in which the views of the victim's relatives were not sought.

The family of Brooks victim were consulted and informed about legal proceedings. After a retrial was ordered by an appeal court, the district attorney called a press conference where he announced that, after consultation with the victim's family, he would again be seeking the death penalty. In 1982 Brooks father was murdered; the district attorneys office had no contact with the Brooks family. At a legal hearing held before Brooks retrial, relatives of three black murder victims (a husband, wife and father) gave testimony about their experiences with the district attorneys office after the murder of their loved-one; none of the three had been consulted by the district attorneys office or been informed about the progress of the case against those accused of the murder of their relatives.