$nyder at it again?

[>>Spearhead>>]

I read a thread indicating that the search feature was not yet completely functional so if this has been stated or belongs on the Tailgate, my apologies.

It is being reported that in addition to attempt a take over of Six Flags 'our owner' is also looking to start a movie and production studio to directly rival Disney, who owns ESPN.

On August 17 ESPN's VP of programming-Mark Shapiro- resigned to join Snyder's Red Zone LLC, the company that has applied to overtake Six Flags.

This was printed in Sept 7s Entertainment Weekly and was supposedly mentioned on ESPN's new Hollywood show(enough with this gargage 'original programming ESPN!!!! :mad: )

Take this for what its worth-my question to fellow skins fans who love and who hate The Danny is do we believe the stories of his love for the skins with his belt buckle and desire for winning or are 'experts' and ex-skins such as Riggins really right in saying that he is only here punch the registers.

A coincedence perhaps that a report just came out stating that Snyder has generated $300 million since '99 in effect doubling the teams worth??

I'm not saying one or the other as I really wonder sometimes but thought it would generate some good, interesting responses...

[Califan007 The Constipated]

He's spent way too much money on FA's and coaches over his short time here for it to be nothing more than $$$ he's after...he seems to sincerely want the Skins to return to the top again.

[Tarhog]

I read a thread indicating that the search feature was not yet completely functional so if this has been stated or belongs on the Tailgate, my apologies.

It is being reported that in addition to attempt a take over of Six Flags 'our owner' is also looking to start a movie and production studio to directly rival Disney, who owns ESPN.

On August 17 ESPN's VP of programming-Mark Shapiro- resigned to join Snyder's Red Zone LLC, the company that has applied to overtake Six Flags.

This was printed in Sept 7s Entertainment Weekly and was supposedly mentioned on ESPN's new Hollywood show(enough with this gargage 'original programming ESPN!!!! :mad: )

Take this for what its worth-my question to fellow skins fans who love and who hate The Danny is do we believe the stories of his love for the skins with his belt buckle and desire for winning or are 'experts' and ex-skins such as Riggins really right in saying that he is only here punch the registers.

A coincedence perhaps that a report just came out stating that Snyder has generated $300 million since '99 in effect doubling the teams worth??

I'm not saying one or the other as I really wonder sometimes but thought it would generate some good, interesting responses...

I guess the most obvious question is, are those two things mutually exclusive?

I don't believe they are. No businessman goes forward in a venture without making maximizing profit and the worth of his investment his chief goal.

Why is that considered some kind of fatal flaw?

I know there are those that beg to differ, and thats fine, but I find the experience I have at FedEx Field an exceptional one, and I'm pretty damn happy with the 'product' (except for on-the-field performance to date anyway).

And I believe Snyder loves his Redskins, and always has. But I had a Redskin's belt-buckle as a kid too, so I confess, I may be biased

[HOF44]

He definatly wants the skins to win and puts his money where his mouth is. If there was no salary cap we would be perinial super bowl contenders.

You can question his judgment, but not his burning desire to win.

HOF44

Bob

[Art]

Cali has it, but, since it's so obvious and clear, the question is how does a question LIKE the first post even get processed in the mind of a poster? Snyder has spent his own money improving an incomplete stadium. He's spent money, lavishly, on players. He's willing to give high percentages of guarantees, which is up front money for the most part, though Snyder does spread it.

And, yeah, he also makes some money. How's that a bad thing, exactly?

[BG]

Dan Snyder blocked my access to Google too.

[>>Spearhead>>]

the question is how does a question LIKE the first post even get processed in the mind of a poster?

because I can take the blinders off-

because no other owners have profitted this much in any other sport-ever(not to mention in this short of a period of time)

because no other owner paid that much for a team-ever

because bo other owner has generated as much flak lately for things like obstructed seats, charging for fan participation in offseason activities, and mandating club sanctioned funds as the only way to purchase tickets, etc

because there has been one playoff appearance since he bought the team

The list goes on- you've already heard it all

I think we could do a lot worse for an owner, and after all he got us Gibbs back, and its no crime to increase your wealth- Im not saying that. I am no Snyder hater by any stretch

Its perfectly valid to want to see what fellow fans think about the guy's latest extra curricular activities and hopefully get more insight on this rumor.

A whole lot of this money that he 'spent out of his pocket' came out of ours

[spanishomelette]

Perhaps now that he's left most of the football decision making to others, he has more time to spend exercising his foremost talent...Making money.

[>>Spearhead>>]

Perhaps now that he's left most of the football decision making to others, he has more time to spend exercising his foremost talent...Making money

good point- and its not to say he isn't smart enough and energetic enough to be active in the redskins and other ventures on a day to day basis, I just wonder what drives him more- Ws or $. :2cents:

[FS36]

good point- and its not to say he isn't smart enough and energetic enough to be active in the redskins and other ventures on a day to day basis, I just wonder what drives him more- Ws or $. :2cents:

Ever consider the simple fact that W's = $?

I'm sure Snyder is well beyond you in business savy and realizes this basic fact. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and not spell it out any further.

[SonnyandSam]

I was going to write why Snyder does what he does but this Forbes Article says it better than I can write it. Why people always assumes that someone who is a genius at making money has to have devious motives is beyond me. I think it just comes down to jealousy. Snyder loves the Skins so much he sold his company to buy the Skins and now is using his genius to make money. But I guess in the eyes of some that makes him a horrible person. Just remember, I'm a huge Snyder supporter.

________________________________

The $1 Billion Team

Brett Pulley, 09.20.04

The $1 Billion Football Team

Raised on the Redskins, Dan Snyder got a little too emotionally close to the team. To make a successful business out of the team, he had to step back a little.

My father taught me to love the Washington Redskins. Every fall we spent Sunday afternoons at the old Robert F. Kennedy Stadium in the nation's capital, idolizing Sonny Jurgensen and Art Monk and other stars of yesteryear. The unofficial mascot, politically incorrect in a full-feathered headdress, would whip up the crowd with a war dance up and down the steep stadium stairs. Today, seven years after my father's death, the four season tickets he first purchased in 1963 are in my hands, and I await the day when my young daughters will accompany me to the games.

Daniel Snyder's father taught him to love the Redskins, too--so much so that he acquired the team and the stadium. People close to him say he grows emotional when he speaks of how his own father worshipped the Skins; Gerald Snyder was a former writer for United Press International and National Geographic who died a year ago at age 69. Dan Snyder, 39, is married, with two young daughters and a son. "I had to have a boy to take to football games," he tells his friends.

In college Snyder started a charter travel service and by the age of 19 had earned his first million. He later launched direct-marketing firm Snyder Communications, which approached $1 billion in sales in the 1990s. Then, in 1999, he took on $495 million of debt to pay $750 million to buy the team (and the stadium) of his childhood fantasy, selling his marketing firm a year later for $2.3 billion. Today he has a net worth of $500 million.

Since then he has turned the Redskins into a marketing machine. With a value that FORBES estimates at $1.1 billion, the team is the richest franchise in U.S. sports and the first American team in FORBES rankings ever to clear the billion-dollar mark. Snyder has expanded the stadium to mythic proportions--it is the largest in professional football, holding 92,000--and plastered ads throughout the stadium and across a range of broadcast properties and publications. Executives eagerly fork over hundreds of thousands of dollars a year to occupy 234 corporate suites.

Despite the 47% appreciation in the value of the Redskins since Snyder bought them, he's left a lot of money on the table because he's been too meddlesome. He's doled out huge player contracts of dubious value to aging superstars like Deion Sanders (seven years, $56 million) and hired and fired coaches with alarming frequency (five different head coaches in five years). The strategy backfired, leaving the Redskins paying on the contracts long after the players retired.

HAIL TO THE CHEIF

The Redskins lead the NFL in virtually every revenue category, thanks to a loyal and wealthy fan base.

Average ticket price

$68 ($53 NFL Average)

number of suites

234 (143)

*Attendance

667,000 (529,000)

suite revenue

$35 million ($13 mil)

sponsorship/ad revenue

$32 million ($13 mil)

concessions/parking

$11 million ($4 mil)

All figures are for 2003 season. 1Excludes club seats and luxury-suite seats. Sources: Forbes; Team Marketing Report.

After the end of last season, when the team had only 5 wins against 11 losses, head coach Steve Spurrier was so disenchanted with working for Snyder that he quit and walked away from $15 million remaining on his five-year, $25 million contract. The Redskins have a losing record over the past five years.

To his friends, even Snyder himself now confides: "We've made some mistakes."

While most of us are scrunched on top of each other in our seats, Snyder spends home games inside the cherrywood confines of his luxurious owner's suite, smoking cigars and drinking Scotch with dignitaries and celebrity friends. "C'mon, have some fun," he urges his guests, who include former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright, FCC Chairman Michael Powell and former CNN anchor Bernard Shaw. But as the new season begins, Snyder is, uncharacteristically, talking very little. Shouldering the blame as the Redskins rack up losses, he has come to realize that being a lifelong fan and toting a fat checkbook aren't enough.

So Snyder has reached back into the team's past for some help, bringing coach Joe Gibbs, 63, out of retirement. The Hall of Famer had led the Redskins to three Super Bowl championships in the 1980s and early 1990s; now he will reap $28 million over five years to serve as head coach and president.

The addition of Gibbs enhances one of the country's strongest sports brands, says Marc Ganis, who heads the Chicago sports marketing firm Sportscorp Ltd. More important, it diverts the spotlight from Snyder himself. "Snyder is now experienced enough that he is comfortable having someone who has the spotlight more on them," Ganis says.

On the night when the National Football League's free-agent negotiating period officially started this spring, Gibbs began calling prospective players at one minute past midnight. A year earlier coach Spurrier was away on vacation when the free-agent negotiations started. The overbearing Snyder handled everything. Gibbs, says Vinny Cerrato, the head of football operations, "is much more involved than any of the other coaches have been."

Gibbs redux already is adding value to the team's bottom line. In August, the day before the Redskins played their first home preseason game, Snyder excitedly walked around the stadium, inspecting 5,000 new seats that he added this summer. Three hundred of them are "dream seats," priced at $3,500 each per game and close enough to the action for fans to high-five players after they run off the field.

The new additions also include luxury loge seating, where fans can buy individual seats in catered, climate-controlled areas without springing for an entire corporate suite. Snyder also has added 150 seats to his "owner's club" area, where suites go for up to $200,000 per season and amenities include restrooms with individual TV screens over each urinal. The team's revenue from premium seating is expected to hit $75 million this year, which we estimate will be more than three times the league average. What made the new premium seats salable? Heightened interest after coach Gibbs was hired.

In five years Snyder has increased the team's revenue by 60% to $245 million per year. Some of it was easy, if a little mercenary. He sold stadium naming rights to FedEx for $207 million over 27 years, reaping the most lucrative deal of its kind. Never mind that the stadium, completed in 1997 a few months after the death of longtime Redskins owner Jack Kent Cooke, had been named in Cooke's honor; Snyder simply scrapped the moniker.

He also increased the number of team-owned radio and television shows, partnering with broadcasters to produce several programs and sell ads across myriad platforms to such sponsors as Nextel, Home Depot and E-Trade. "We don't just sell stadium signage,'' Snyder likes to boast. He personally courts advertisers. When he took over he discovered that one consumer products company was paying only $180,000 a year for an exclusive deal that prohibited the team from striking an agreement with a competitor. Snyder renegotiated, lifting the price to $2 million a year and getting rid of the exclusivity; then he sold a similar deal to the sponsor's rival for another $2 million a year.

Since 1999 annual revenue from marketing and sponsorship has gone from $2 million to $50 million. At the same time revenue from local radio broadcasts has increased tenfold to $10 million. Additionally, Snyder has expanded the team-owned retail outlets (where some jerseys sell for over $300) from a single, stadium store open only on game days to 12 stores in the Washington area. Snyder was also the first football owner to charge fans to watch their team practice.

Although the NFL limits players' salaries to 65% of revenues, Snyder has a big advantage over his rivals because signing bonuses are prorated over the life of a contract for salary cap purposes. The team signed tackle Jon Jansen to a six-year, $25 million contract to start with the coming season. Last year the Redskins had operating income (net before depreciation, interest and taxes) of $69.6 million, the highest in the NFL.

"Snyder is a marketing genius," says Salvatore Galatioto, managing director of sports finance at Lehman Brothers. "If Gibbs turns things around on the field, Snyder will make even more money." Galatioto handled Snyder's recent sale of 30% of the team's equity to three investors: Federal Express founder and chairman Fred Smith, Virginia real estate developer Dwight C. Schar, and Robert Rothman, a Florida insurance executive. The equity stake sold for $225 million, which Snyder used to pay down debt that now totals $225 million. Other minority stakeholders in the team include Snyder's mother and sister, and Fred Drasner, a publishing executive.

Why such a low price for a 30% stake? Because suite and sponsorship revenue were not included. Those proceeds belong to a separate entity that includes the stadium. Snyder's brazen style has at times annoyed other owners. He once advertised his premium seats in the nearby Baltimore Ravens market, breaking an old gentlemen's agreement in the league not to poach. Four years ago he did an end run around league rules when he bought out a minority partner, real estate mogul Mortimer B. Zuckerman, without first getting the permission of the NFL.

Snyder's profligate spending continues: This season the Redskins will have the highest payroll in the league at $112 million (the team can exceed the salary cap because signing bonuses are prorated over the life of a player's contract). "Dan swings for the fences," says Cerrato, the Skins' operations chief. "He wants to win." But Snyder has changed his approach this year, giving the richest contracts to younger stars who will be around to earn the money, Cerrato says.

This isn't a game, this is a business. If Snyder's bet on Joe Gibbs works and the victories start rolling in, the owner will reward the loyal fans with a surprise, says one knowledgeable source: He will raise our ticket prices next season.

[>>Spearhead>>]

Ever consider the simple fact that W's = $?

I won't give you the same benefit of the doubt as buying theme parks has nothing to do with winning football games, genius.

Where do you get that I am comparing myself with the owner of the team?

:doh: And if Ws got Dan his $, he may be able to afford a them park ticket, not the franchise.

Go get your shine box

[>>Spearhead>>]

Good read LaVar- thanks. No doubt the guy has the business skills, the numbers don't lie and no one can argue that. I have to think that the financial gains had to factor in to buying the team as much if not more than the love for his team did, though. And thats fine -more power to the guy for earning the right to do so. Its just that a lot of fans feel some of his profit making means have hurt the fans and the team(and some will argue the league itself??), its not like Im gonna quit pulling for the Redskins over it-just makes for interesting discussion IMO

[Mark The Homer]

What everybody keeps forgeting, is that Snyder didn't bring Gibbs back. A minority owner of the Redskins took the initiative and made the call to Gibbs, testing his interest. Gibbs then,with the help of his wife, Pat, decided to come back to the Redskins.

While some say he's a genius, others find his methods unethical. He's certainly a genius at walking the thin line between ethics and revenue production. But every once in a while, he steps over the line, and has to be pushed back by the public (e.g. the Redskins mastercard scam, the obstructed-view no-refund policy, etc). This is why he isn't liked. But he will cross this line again and again, whenever possible, if it means he might make a buck.

[Art]

because I can take the blinders off-

because no other owners have profitted this much in any other sport-ever(not to mention in this short of a period of time)

because no other owner paid that much for a team-ever

because bo other owner has generated as much flak lately for things like obstructed seats, charging for fan participation in offseason activities, and mandating club sanctioned funds as the only way to purchase tickets, etc

because there has been one playoff appearance since he bought the team

The list goes on- you've already heard it all

I think we could do a lot worse for an owner, and after all he got us Gibbs back, and its no crime to increase your wealth- Im not saying that. I am no Snyder hater by any stretch

Its perfectly valid to want to see what fellow fans think about the guy's latest extra curricular activities and hopefully get more insight on this rumor.

A whole lot of this money that he 'spent out of his pocket' came out of ours

Spear,

It is amusing to see you suggest your view is one where you've taken off the blinders and really looked deeply at the situation to come up with a difficult, hard position you just can't avoid.

Your position is the typical goofy ignorance that IS the most common view out there. Your position possesses the wretched, dumb blindness common to people who don't care to actually pay attention to the facts, but, instead, ignore anything that doesn't support their vision that Snyder is bad.

You even go so far as to laughably assign Snyder's desire to expand his wealth and businesses by calling them extra curricular activities, as if once he owned the Redskins, he should stop all other functions as a businessman, and not only should he not maximize the stream from his Redskins business, but, he should stop making any other money anywhere else.

How blind are you to suggest you took blinders off?

The facts are clear, pure and simple here.

No owner has made as much and no owner has SPENT as much. You get that, right? It's not a one-part equation, which a blind person would indicate, as you've indicated. No owner has put as much of his cash into the product as Snyder during his span as the owner.

As an example, he didn't have to do anything to FedEx, but, he did.

He could have left it half complete as Cooke gave it to him. Instead, he spent over $100 million of his money to improve it. It isn't perfect, but, it's better than it was. He could have left the stadium the size it was, instead of bringing additional thousands in and off the waiting list.

He benefits from his actions. We benefit as well.

No owner pays as lavishly for the people who run his franchise. No owner pays as well the players those people wish to acquire. Hell, our owner will even simply let his coach dictate he possibly provide additional millions to a player who shouldn't get any more, simply to assure he's doing all he can for his people, which you just saw in the Lavar situation.

Unfortunately, you've chosen to ignore the reality and be blind. Caught being so, your only out is to suggest others are exactly what you've shown yourself to be.

[Mr. S]

Snyder wants to win, and he has been more hands off in recent years. However, do I think he is an a$$, yes. The guy seems like your typical shrewd businessman, which can be good or bad, but its definitely not like when Jack Kent Cooke owned the team. His attempts to overtake other things are interesting, and I wonder how they turn out. Personally, i wouldnt mind if he isnt able to take over six flags or anything else.

[TheDane]

This reeks of the typical accusation that someone who makes money is, therefore, stiffing other people. This argument simply forgets the concept that someone who makes money could just be better at it than other people.

Look at Lavar's numbers: Snyder is +$22m in suite revenue and +$19m in ad revenue. That's +$41m over the league, on average, in two items that have nothing to do with the average fan, but have everything to do with the ability of the owner to market the franchise. You could argue that the increase in attendance does that too, but, we've got such a loyal fan base and such a larger stadium that I won't make that parallel.

Anyway. We don't truly know Snyder's motives, but he certainly spends to win and certainly spends to improve the fan experience. And for a guy who is so cost conscious and aware of his checkbook, that's got to mean something.

[>>Spearhead>>]

Art

Your loyalty to your master is valiant and understandable. Your attempt to slam me and justify Dan Snyder isn't. You originally asked how anyone could even question The Danny- I responded with 5 reasons. All you can come up with is that he spends a lot of money on the team and finalized his unfinishided stadium as justification? Your right-he paid lots for Bruce and Deion and Marvin Lewis now justify how that has benefited his team our the fans. Putting more seats into his stadium makes more money which is logical, but don't use that in a lame defense of his desire to win football games. I'm sorry that a thread about a rumored business venture had to turn into such a personal issue with you. But I can live with being 'goofy, ignorant, dumb and blind to the blinders(whatever) and anything else you want to call me. But at least have some substance besides childish name calling. I don't see the facts? I listed the facts-you have distorted one of them to fit your 'argument'

But don't take my below average opinions for anything -take a poll on who enjoys going to FedEx to see Redskins games and you'll find that that $100 million stadium improvement justification you are trying to make is equally as worthless.

[tundey]

So what if Snyder is making boatloads of money from the Redskins? So what? So long as he does the right thing by opening his wallet and keeping his hands off, I really don't care what other businesses he has. Owning the redskins is not a religion.

[RDSKNfaithfull]

I read a thread indicating that the search feature was not yet completely functional so if this has been stated or belongs on the Tailgate, my apologies.

It is being reported that in addition to attempt a take over of Six Flags 'our owner' is also looking to start a movie and production studio to directly rival Disney, who owns ESPN.

On August 17 ESPN's VP of programming-Mark Shapiro- resigned to join Snyder's Red Zone LLC, the company that has applied to overtake Six Flags.

This was printed in Sept 7s Entertainment Weekly and was supposedly mentioned on ESPN's new Hollywood show(enough with this gargage 'original programming ESPN!!!! :mad: )

Take this for what its worth-my question to fellow skins fans who love and who hate The Danny is do we believe the stories of his love for the skins with his belt buckle and desire for winning or are 'experts' and ex-skins such as Riggins really right in saying that he is only here punch the registers.

A coincedence perhaps that a report just came out stating that Snyder has generated $300 million since '99 in effect doubling the teams worth??

I'm not saying one or the other as I really wonder sometimes but thought it would generate some good, interesting responses...

Off topic you ready for Monday night? :cool:

[jimster]

This reeks of the typical accusation that someone who makes money is, therefore, stiffing other people. This argument simply forgets the concept that someone who makes money could just be better at it than other people.

Exactly.

Art

Your loyalty to your master is valiant and understandable.

Wow.

Where you crying when JKC bought the Chrysler building too?

[DC_Native,NC_Fan]

Goodness, is it just me or did some people take the original post way out of context? I'm sorry, spearhed. Post on!

[thinker]

Spear,

The problem with your theory that somehow Snyder making money hurts the fans doesn't really make sense. Very admittedly so, to date, the team has not performed on the field the way any of us would have wanted. There is absolutely no denying that. 5 or 6 teams were desperate to hire Spurrier. Snyder got him at a huge price and then made over the roster for him - again at a hughe price. Many other teams would have done the same. But we did it. It seemed like a smart thing at the time - most people were incredibly excited about how the Skins would prosper under Spurrier. But SPURRIER failed not Snyder. Honestly speaking, last year Gibbs and the other coaches and players failed not Snyder. Because whoever his coaches were - he paid whatever he had to in order to get them what they asked for.

This didn't turn into wins on the field and I don't like that either. But it is Snyder's ability to generate money that allows us to retool again and again. I hope to G*d that this time will be the last time for a long while. But Snyder having a lot of money is GOOD for all of us because it gives the team options that poor owners and teams don't have. Until we win we'll still be unhappy. You can blame it on Snyder like much of the media does if you want. I would rather have Snyder than the Bidwell family or Donald Sterling who owns the NBA Clippers anytime though. These guys found a way to make money without having to even try to win. Now that REALLY s*cks.

[Art]

As I said, Spear, the only person being blind is you. You've chosen to ignore the substance or play ignorant about it. This is not calling you a name. It's calling your position names. Your position is worthy of such whether you are or not. Hiring the best defensive mind available to assist Spurrier is generally considered a smart decision. I was against it, to be honest, as Lewis is not my kind of defensive coordinator.

But, it's hard to argue with the intelligence from a football perspective and the benefit to fans of knowing the experience and expertise of the people Snyder gets to run his organization. You have blindly chosen to ignore the tremendous benefits our team received in defensive improvements of 2000 and the solid play of a guy like Bruce Smith on very solid defenses over a few seasons.

It is substantial to mention Snyder has spent his own money to complete the stadium. I went to every game in 1997 and 1998 at JKC Stadium. It was a FAR worse experience than it is today as access is far superior, as well as sound. Would I like to see more replays? You bet. Would I like the band featured more. You bet.

Until fans reject the stadium experience, as hard as you may find it to believe, it is possible they like it. It is true I tend to appreciate the efforts Snyder has undertaken as our owner. The best reply you have is that somehow makes him my master. Are you sure you are all that worried about substance in this discussion?

[Xameil]

Blah blah blah..Snyder makes money off the Redskins...wants to buy a theme park...

At least he didn't show his face on The Apprentice like umm..Kraft. I'm sure he wasn't making money off him being the owner of the Patriots right?

Snyder has always loved the Redskins. He spends the money for it. And, if there is no salary cap in 2007 due to no agreement among owners, then we'll all see him open up his purse just like Jack did for Coach Gibbs in the day before the cap.

So if he makes money from owning the Redskins...well we are a capitalist society. But I have no doubt of his love for the 'Skins.

Also, don't you think Gibbs coaching for the 'Skins, and being in FedEx field had anything to do with his new race team being sponsored by FedEx.

So, I think anyone of us would try and make money off our investment, as well as get them as many W's as possible.