jbooma Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by NavyDave That is your opinion and opinions are like ........................ So if this happens to Navy let him live by a feeding tube and be a vegetable the rest of his life. IT has been noted Navy. Honestly I have nothing against that and respect your wishes. That is YOUR decision not your parents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portisizzle Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by NavyDave That is your opinion and opinions are like ........................ You are exactly right on. And I was wrong for suggesting you be banned for a day or two. But, hey, what is that? Ignor user button........ let's see what happens if I press this............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Hmmm...NavyDave making wild statements about things without backing them up...shocker there.... And for those that deny my statement about the Schindlers having access to their daughter until 10 minutes before she died....I guess their lawyer is lying(not that he doesn't before) http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/03/31/schiavo/index.html Schiavo dies amid legal, ethical battle Thursday, March 31, 2005 Posted: 12:32 PM EST (1732 GMT) Terri Schiavo, getting a kiss from her mother in 2002, had been without food or water since March 18. Image: ON CNN TV Life and Death: America Speaks Out (8 p.m. ET): The Terri Schiavo case has polarized the nation. Larry King hosts a live, three-hour national conversation about life and death. PINELLAS PARK, Florida (CNN) -- Terri Schiavo, the brain-damaged woman at the center of a family battle fought on a national stage, died Thursday morning, nearly two weeks after doctors removed her life-sustaining feeding tube. Demonstrators -- some who had been at the site for weeks as legal maneuvering intensified -- gasped, cried and prayed after hearing the news. Some sang hymns. (Full story) Minutes before the announcement of her death, Schiavo's parents, Mary and Bob Schindler, and her brother hurriedly entered the hospice in Pinellas Park, Florida. Brother Paul O'Donnell, a spokesman for the Schindlers, said police denied their request to be with Schiavo, 41, when she died, but that her parents had access to their daughter's body after her death and prayed. Michael Schiavo, Terri's husband and guardian, controlled who could visit her and when. John Centonze, the brother of Michael Schiavo's live-in girlfriend Jodi Centonze, said Michael Schiavo was with Terri Schiavo when she died. A friend who phoned Michael Schiavo soon after news broke of his wife's death said he couldn't talk. "He (Michael) couldn't speak, he was crying," Russ Hyden said. President Bush offered his condolences. "Today millions of Americans are saddened by the death of Terri Schiavo. ... I urge all those who honor Terri Schiavo to continue to work to build a culture of life where all Americans are welcomed and valued and protected. Florida Gov. Jeb Bush, who had intervened in the case to authorize continuing nourishment for Terri Schiavo in 2003, issued a written statement. "Many across our state and around the world are deeply grieved by the way Terri died. I feel that grief very sharply as well," his statement said. "I remain convinced, however, that Terri's death is a window through which we can see the many issues left unresolved in our families and in our society." Inside the Florida Statehouse, legislators observed a moment of silence at the news of Terri Schiavo's death. Final moments David Gibbs, a lawyer representing the Schindlers, said his clients were "with Terri up until 10 minutes before she passed. "This is indeed a sad day for this nation. This is a sad day for this family. Their faith in God remains consistent and strong," he said. "They are absolutely convinced God loves Terri more than they do." The Rev. Frank Pavone was with the Schindlers during their final visit. He said, "This is not only a death with all the sadness that brings, this is a killing. And for that we not only grieve that Terri has passed, but we grieve that our nation has allowed such an atrocity as this, and we pray that it will never happen again." Hours before Schiavo's death, Florida's Pinellas County Probate Court released nine of 11 videotapes of the brain-damaged from 2002. (Full story) Her relatives and friends never agreed on what Terri Schiavo's wishes would have been, but they all said the once-bashful woman would have shunned the spotlight her disability and death created. (Terri Schiavo's obituary) Before Schiavo's death, her best friend in high school, Diane Meyer, told The Miami Herald that Schiavo would have asked, " 'All this for me?' ...She just wanted to be your common, everyday, happy woman." Terri Schiavo had grown up chubby and preferred spending time alone or with animals, her friends and family said. And, they said, she loved romance novels and movies. As a teen, saw "An Officer and a Gentlemen" four times in one day and spent their free time window-shopping in bridal shops and planning the perfect wedding. Legal wrangling Wednesday, the Schindlers lost what their lawyer described as their "last meaningful legal appeal" in their desperate battle to have their brain-damaged daughter's feeding tube reinserted. The U.S. Supreme Court late Wednesday refused once again to hear an emergency appeal from the Schindlers. Pasco-Pinellas Circuit Judge George Greer in Clearwater, Florida, ordered the feeding tube removed March 18 at Michael Schiavo's request. He has said that his wife wouldn't have wanted to live in her condition -- what Florida courts have deemed a "persistent vegetative state." The parents believed otherwise and had sought to take guardianship of their daughter from her husband. Their bitter court battles began in 1998. (Schiavo case timeline) The Schindlers, Gibbs said, "can know they have done everything possible under the law in letting government know that they wanted to fight for the life of their daughter." CNN's Ninette Sosa, Bob Franken, Rich Phillips and Susan Candiotti contributed to this report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 And for all those that keep harping on that it was only Michael that said she didn't want to live like this....there were several witnesses that backed him up..but guess what everybody seems to ignore them even though their statements haven't been refuted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenmdixon Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 NYTimes' op ed piece on Mrs. Schiavo's passing... http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/31/opinion/31cnd-edit.html?hp Theresa Marie Schiavo Published: March 31, 2005 One of the most astonishing things about the human experience is the realization that loved ones die. The first time it happens, we are invariably amazed that nearly everyone who has ever lived has weathered an experience so wrenching. We see other humans on the street and in the shops and marvel that they manage to simply go about their business that there is no constant, universal, primal scream in the face of such an awful fact. That level of grief seldom brings out the noblest emotions. The sufferers can barely make their way through the day, let alone summon their best reserves of patience and compassion for the lucky people who continue to be living. In the case of Terri Schiavo, the whole world got to witness what happens when that natural emotional frailty gets taken captive by politics. It was awful, and according to the polls, the American public shrank back from the sight of it. What little we know about Terri Schiavo the person as opposed to the videotape tells us that she would have been appalled by the last weeks of her life. What worse nightmare could a rather shy and affectionate young woman conjure up than 15 years of lingering unconsciousness, in which the entire globe became intimately familiar with the sight of her wasted limbs while the people she loved most engaged in a vicious court fight for control of her body? That kind of ordeal even if the victim was unaware she was enduring it deserves to be honored with some meaning. On the most pragmatic level, she has been the instrument of thousands, probably millions, of intimate conversations in which family members told each other what they would like to happen if their own bodies outlived their minds. In countless other cases, people recalled the day on which they said goodbye to someone they love, and perhaps many came closer to a peace with their own great loss. Americans are a deeply pragmatic people, who constantly shock ideologues of every persuasion with their willingness to accept whatever solution seems to work out best at the moment. Our great ideals, when they are boiled down at a moment of crisis, are mainly instincts for fairness, for the right of individual self-determination. Watching the Schiavo case unfold, most Americans quickly opted for the solution that would end the ordeal. Some people hold religious convictions so heartfelt that they could not bow to public opinion or the courts and accept the fact that Ms. Schiavo should be allowed to die. They deserve respect, just as her husband and her family members deserve sympathy. The frightening thing about the case was that other people, far more powerful and far less emotionally involved, looked at the world we live in today, in which politics is about maximizing hysteria at the margins, and concluded that the fight was one that would pay off in worldly terms as well. But today, finally, there is a moment of consensus. Rest in peace, Theresa Marie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by Funkyalligator And for all those that keep harping on that it was only Michael that said she didn't want to live like this....there were several witnesses that backed him up..but guess what everybody seems to ignore them even though their statements haven't been refuted. Exactly. Yet she never told her parents, so why is that?? I think the reason why the parents wanted to hold on maybe is they didn't have a great relationship with thier daughter, who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chomerics Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 RIP Terri, she can now FINALLY rest. Is it just me, or does anyone fine ND's posts quite blatently offensive? It's funny, in a thread trying to respect and honor Terri, you still hear the hate filled diatribes by the ignorant, the uninformed, and the zealots. . . and these are supposed religious people. I am still having a hard time finding any compassion for the religious nutjobs who do nothing except spew hate from their gutter ridden mouths. Finally, for christ sakes, why aren't these people working? I mean get a job and contribute to society instead of spewing your venom everywhere. Now, after the ND posts, the only thing missing from this thread is Jagsbtch telling us how Terri's death is the sign of the seven seals being broken and the forthcoming of the apocalypse. I mean come on now, the third is famine, the fourth death and the fifty martyrdom. All having to do with Terri. . . :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 There is the possibility that she did tell her parents but they choose to ignore her...remember there used to be a pretty good relationship between Michael and her parents...in fact he lived with them after she fell into the persistent vegitative state.... her parents were led astray by the evangelical christians who decided that this would be a great way to boost their pro-life doctrine....(real smart on their part...not....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky21 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by chomerics RIP Terri, she can now FINALLY rest. Is it just me, or does anyone fine ND's posts quite blatently offensive? It's not just you. Totally inappropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red zone Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 No one should have the whole world watch them die that kind of death; no matter the clinical condition of their brain. That was a long two weeks for me. Rest her soul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footballhenry Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Why weren't Terri's parents allowed to be with their daughter when she passed away? I read a couple articles that Michael Schiavo wouldn't let them in until she passed. What did this accomplish? Before I become enraged at Michael Schiavo, let me understand what was done and why it was done.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 read the other thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 The entire debate between factions in this is tired and now moot. my major source of dissappointment is that her family was not allowed at her side at the moment of her death. There seems to be a dispute in exactly how long before they were with her (imagine that! Divergent "facts" in this case!) That's simply cruel to her loved ones to not allow them to even hold her hand as she passed on. What rationale is there for that decision? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 They were there up until 10 minutes before she died..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by NavyDave Hubby had no choice but to accept doing the autopsy since its florida law to do an autopsy before a cremation Myth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by Funkyalligator They were there up until 10 minutes before she died..... So what? and again, there are conflicting reports as to the amount of time prior to her death. Regardless, what purpose did it serve for her siblings and parents to not be allowed there at the exact moment she passed? It seems excessively vindictive and cruel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 The hatred between her parents and her husband is serious. Don't know what would have happened with both of them in the room at the same time. Remember they see him as thier child's murderer, and he see's them as the people who have ruined his life by telling people he's a murderer that abused their daughter. Those two being in the same room once she died could have resulted in a violent encounter. It is sad though isn't it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Okay then I guess the Schindler's lawyer lied about something else.......I believe that there was enough aggravation in this situation to let Michael mourn his wife without dealing with her lunatic parents.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucaro Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 I agree that is does seem a bit vindictive but the man has a right to spend his wifes last waking hours alone with her as well as the fact that her parents put him through 5-7 extra years of grief b/c of their efforts, tough not to be a bit vindictive in that situation (even though we would all say we wouldn't be) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by Destino The hatred between her parents and her husband is serious. Don't know what would have happened with both of them in the room at the same time. Remember they see him as thier child's murderer, and he see's them as the people who have ruined his life by telling people he's a murderer that abused their daughter. Those two being in the same room once she died could have resulted in a violent encounter. It is sad though isn't it. It's extremely sad. At that final moment some sincere fence mending could have been done by that simple act of courtesy. It wasnt a decision made by the police nor the hospice, it was one made by Michael alone. They needed to put aside their differences for just a few moments and show her their love and prayers to help her in her final moments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 I doubt there could have been any fences mended in that situation.....he made the right choice because of the situation.....I can't fault him for that...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by NavyDave And its pathetic that wanting someone to live is a bad thing in some circles. Can we use this technique on pedophiles, gays knowingly spreading Aids, terrorists and beached whales? Whenever I worry that I have stepped over the line on these boards and might get banned, I am always comforted by the fact that good old NavyDave has made hundreds, if not thousands, of hostile and hilariously ignorant posts over the years, and yet he is still here. So thanks, Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Originally posted by Funkyalligator I doubt there could have been any fences mended in that situation.....he made the right choice because of the situation.....I can't fault him for that...... How many huge fights and violent outbursts came from her parents and simblngs 15 minutes before she died then? Please, all can see how vindictive and cruel this was. Even those who totally disagree with the parents can see that part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 psst...predicto...make a donation...just kidding.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 No...its not...he let them in there up until 10 minutes before she died...they needed to let go a long time ago but never did... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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