hail2skins Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 7 minutes ago, AlwaysBeRedskins2Me said: You have links of SAS, Shannon Sharpe, Skip Bayless, and others from THOSE SHOWS, giving Joe Gibbs a bunch of praise and respect? You sure about that? I concede those shows don't, but the links (and others out there which mostly list Gibbs comfortably inside the top 10 all-time) render the first sentence of your statement false. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlwaysBeRedskins2Me Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 12 minutes ago, hail2skins said: I concede those shows don't, but the links (and others out there which mostly list Gibbs comfortably inside the top 10 all-time) render the first sentence of your statement false. Ok. I can respect that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 (edited) Ok, so there are people listing him top 10, which is easy since he's Top5 in SB wins, but in reality considering everything he should be top 2 or 3. Top10 is a joke. Not only did he win 3 SBs with 3 different QBs, but he won SBs 10 years apart with totally different teams. Belichick did that too, but all with the same QB. Has any other coach done that? Usually they won them in bunches with a single elite team. Like Shula and Landry and Noll. Also, what other coach won even 2 SBs with different QBSs? Parcels, but Simms started that whole year and they weren't prepared for Hostetler. And Parcels only has 2 anyway. Andy Reid came close with McNugget but he's only won with a goat, same as Belichick and Walsh Lombardi won all his with Starr also but he died before his had a chance to do it again with a different QB, and yes, at the time Starr was definitely a goat. Gibbs also won SB 22 with a QB that no other team even wanted as a backup QB and the guy won MVP. Not only that but he had a no name RB start that game and set the SB record for rushing yards. No other coach has come close to doing those kind of things. It'd be like if the Browns this year won the SB with Flacco and some UDFA RB. And the browns had the #1 D in the league, a proven RB. and couldn't get out of the first round with the coach of the year. Edited February 15 by SkinsFTW 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 (edited) Why is it a big deal? He's in the Hall of Fame. He's considered one of the best coaches ever. He was among the coaches in the NFL All time 100 team thingy. What more do people want? What does it matter if he's top 3, or top 5, or top 10. Does it give our current team any sort of advantage if Gibbs is ranked higher in some random all time coach power rank list? Edited February 15 by Warhead36 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 50 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: Why is it a big deal? He's in the Hall of Fame. He's considered one of the best coaches ever. He was among the coaches in the NFL All time 100 team thingy. What more do people want? What does it matter if he's top 3, or top 5, or top 10. Does it give our current team any sort of advantage if Gibbs is ranked higher in some random all time coach power rank list? The Commanders had an agreement with Ben Johnson, but when he found out Gibbs wasn't widely considered to be top 4 all-time, all bets were off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 Joe Gibbs is well respected by those that matter. Ask anyone that has been around football for longer than ten years and his name will be mentioned as one of the best coaches to ever do it. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlwaysBeRedskins2Me Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 4 minutes ago, illone said: Joe Gibbs is well respected by those that matter. Ask anyone that has been around football for longer than ten years and his name will be mentioned as one of the best coaches to ever do it. Doesn't count. Ross Tucker is a diehard Redskins fan. Lol. All of us know his greatness. It's fans, players, and coaches from the other 31 teams who have somehow never heard of Joe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 6 minutes ago, AlwaysBeRedskins2Me said: Doesn't count. Ross Tucker is a diehard Redskins fan. Lol. All of us know his greatness. It's fans, players, and coaches from the other 31 teams who have somehow never heard of Joe. 😂 I listen to Ross alot, I know he played here but didnt get the sense that he was a die hard. But I also get the sense that Gibbs has been out of the game long enough that it's more about recency bias than anything else. When pressed Im confident Gibbs would get some votes for best ever if the survey came out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunfer Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 Joe is a pre free agency coach. pre and post free agency seems like a different game in the coaching and FO world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 4 minutes ago, dunfer said: Joe is a pre free agency coach. pre and post free agency seems like a different game in the coaching and FO world Yet every single coach besides Gibbs won their Super Bowls with a single QB. Gibbs did it with 3 non HOF QB's. Shula couldn't even win 1 with Marino. Landry couldn't win one without Staubach. Reid couldn't win before Mahomes either. Seems to be a trend. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunfer Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 1 minute ago, SkinsFTW said: Yet every single coach besides Gibbs won their Super Bowls with a single QB. Gibbs did it with 3 non HOF QB's. Shula couldn't even win 1 with Marino. Landry couldn't win one without Staubach. Reid couldn't win before Mahomes either. Seems to be a trend. yeah i didnt read the thread to see whos on the rushmore. I love Joe but if I had to pick his weakness it was FA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 Joe Gibbs is one of the best Head Coaches in history. And he gets recognized as that from anyone who knows football. So I really dont understand this thread. 16 minutes ago, dunfer said: Joe is a pre free agency coach Not true. Joe signed Wilbur Marshall here. Here was the first NFL free agent to leave a team in 12 years. He embraced FA from the start of it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 (edited) 31 minutes ago, clskinsfan said: Not true. Joe signed Wilbur Marshall here. Here was the first NFL free agent to leave a team in 12 years. He embraced FA from the start of it. He probably meant Salary Cap. But when you look at the 80's Redskins you'd see that the team wasn't built on a bunch of high priced dudes like SF or Dallas was. They were almost all later round picks so the salary cap probably gives Beathard and Gibbs an advantage. He also almost got another SB with Schroeder, if not for having to face the elite Giants defense that year. Edited February 15 by SkinsFTW 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunfer Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 The free agency we know today started in 92 and 93 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 17 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said: He probably meant Salary Cap. But when you look at the 80's Redskins you'd see that the team wasn't built on a bunch of high priced dudes like SF or Dallas was. They were almost all later round picks so the salary cap probably gives Beathard an Gibbs and advantage. He also almost got another SB with Schroeder, if not for having to face the elite Giants defense that year. My point was even with having to deal with Casserly. Gibbs built championship level teams. He built them through the draft and free agency. He would stash guys on IR for just waiting to have them to develop. The guy was consistently at the top of everything a HC needs to be. And he is recognized for that. You dont get to the HOF as a coach after being out of the game for 3 years unless that was true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunfer Posted February 16 Share Posted February 16 just playing devils advocate again, but two lombardis were in strike years. Went back to the beginning of this thread and this rushmore is just some pregame guys talking about andy before the superbowl? Sorry to have replied Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted February 16 Share Posted February 16 I think the fact that there was no back-to-back hurts him. That's generally the mark of a great team/coach. I think he'd be considered differently, he they'd beat the Raiders (that would give him a back-to-back and 4 total). (Also probably would have put Theisman in the HOF.) Though I also remember a Sport article back in the day. They did an analysis of the most under rated coaches back in the day. They went back through their archives (started before SI) and looked at each year what they predicted each team's record would be, and then compared it to the teams' final records. The idea that teams that finished better than their predicted record had good coaching that wasn't taken in their predicting the teams' records. Today, I guess you'd do the same thing comparing the number of wins teams have to their Vegas over/under win total. The writer actually did it because George Allen thought he was under rated and begged the writer to find a way to prove it. Turns out Gibbs was 1 where they had consistently under rated his teams' number of wins. Allen ranked high too, but Gibbs was 1. And this was when Gibbs was still coaching (or maybe just after he retired the first time), so if he was under rated when he was current/recent coach only makes sense that he'd be under rated as you get further from his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted February 16 Share Posted February 16 19 minutes ago, PeterMP said: And this was when Gibbs was still coaching (or maybe just after he retired the first time), so if he was under rated when he was current/recent coach only makes sense that he'd be under rated as you get further from his career. I used to buy all the magazines back then. They almost always had the Redskins 7-9 or 8-8 then they'd win 11-12 games. That went on for almost all the years between 83 and 91. In 91 they actually thought they'd be good but not SB winning good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted February 16 Share Posted February 16 Hemorrhoids Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted February 16 Share Posted February 16 44 minutes ago, PeterMP said: I think the fact that there was no back-to-back hurts him. That's generally the mark of a great team/coach. I think he'd be considered differently, he they'd beat the Raiders (that would give him a back-to-back and 4 total). (Also probably would have put Theisman in the HOF.) Though I also remember a Sport article back in the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted February 16 Share Posted February 16 3 minutes ago, hail2skins said: Wow! That's some impressive work. And going from the name of the author, you find this WP article. https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/sports/1988/01/31/how-good-is-gibbs-great-but-not-greatest_yet/5d887d5a-82df-4ce0-888c-e104370cee39/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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