2017 ES GM's Mock Draft is now in the books. FULL details in the OP.

[ComManDersFan57]

58 minutes ago, Butters20 said:

With their second 4th rd pick, the Indianapolis Colts select: Trey Hendrickson, DE, Florida Atlantic University.

 

Shucks. Wanted him for my pick.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Eagles trade upcoming. Bare with me. Doing a million and one things here right now. 

 

Hail. 

[goskins10]

1 minute ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said:

Eagles trade upcoming. Bare with me. Doing a million and one things here right now. 

 

Hail. 

 

So a million things are not enough. You need to do one more? Seems an odd number....

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

*TRADE ANNOUNCEMENT*

The Philadelphia Eagles and the Dallas Cowboys have reached a trade agreement. 

 

The Eagles send their 33rd selection in Round 4 (Pick #140) to the Dallas Cowboys in exchange for the Cowboys 10th selection in Round 7 (Pick #228) and Dallas' 2018 4th Round Pick. 

 

 

THE DALLAS COWBOYS ARE NOW ON THE CLOCK! 

 

For those keeping track ready to flame .....

 

Dallas Cowboys Draft Picks as we currently stand the next three drafts: 

 

2017. 6 Picks: Round 1, 2, 4 and 4 already picked. Round 4 and 7 left. 

2018. 5 Picks. Round 3, 4 (C), 5 (C), 6 (C) and 7. 

2019. 6 Picks. Round 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7. 

 

Again, we feel the next pick was FAR too good an opportunity to turn down as he's the perfect pick for the Dallas Cowboys. And we feel comfortable to be sat with the 11 picks the next two drafts to be able to make the moves we have in this draft to (hopefully) take our organisation back to where we so crave to be. 

 

Number 1!

 

Hail.

 

*Edit* Now let me do a quick write-up. 

 

 

[ZRagone]

Qualls was a nice value pick there. He was the highest rated guy I still had on my top 250, sitting at number 82. 

 

I only have one player left in the top 100. Getting into the fun time now with depth picks and hidden gems. 

When did vinny join up with Jerry down in big D? 

[Butters20]

I had Qualls and Siragusa ranked higher in player rankings, but lower on my updated draft board since I'd already drafter those positions in this draft.

 

I think both are 3rd round or earlier

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

5 minutes ago, ZRagone said:

.....

When did vinny join up with Jerry down in big D? 

1

 

When the Cowboys got something the Redskins are still searching for ..... A solid, quality roster already competing missing just a few key ingredients on D to afford them the luxury to make such calculated moves. .

 

Hail. 

[ComManDersFan57]

8 minutes ago, ZRagone said:

Qualls was a nice value pick there. He was the highest rated guy I still had on my top 250, sitting at number 82. 

 

I only have one player left in the top 100. Getting into the fun time now with depth picks and hidden gems. 

When did vinny join up with Jerry down in big D? 

Highest guy I had too. It's down to depth guys IMO, so it seemed like a good time to make a trade even though it was with Dallas.

[Butters20]

post removed*

[Wildbunny]

24 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said:

*Edit* Now let me do a quick write-up. 

Quick write-up?

 

If only you knew what that means.

 

Now, I'm starting to think that trading future draft picks is reaching out of hands. Maybe we should add a limit to this.

[ComManDersFan57]

8 minutes ago, Butters20 said:

Ahem, perhaps in the future we should be careful of trading when ones draft chart is known to the other.

 

NOT an affront at all, not questioning your integrity. Just a suggestion.

 

If I'm on my own island regarding this, I'll accept a proper tar and feathering

 

Thanks. I didn't think of that. Regardless, I got the guys I wanted. The remaining one was a "just in case" pick with little consequence. Gibbs didn't have my whole list so I think the trade was fair.

[Butters20]

2 minutes ago, skinfan57 said:

 

Thanks. I didn't think of that. Regardless, I got the guys I wanted. The remaining one was a "just in case" pick with little consequence. Gibbs didn't have my whole list so I think the trade was fair.

No worries. I thought a bit more on it and if neither party cares the other knows who they are targeting, I have no gripe.

 

My only question is that trades may only be made or not made because the parties have knowledge of the others draft board...but then again that ultimately could be discussed privately anyways so ultimately I guess it's inconsequential.

 

I just personally would keep it a secret, because then i'd be more likely to get the better end of the deal.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

15 minutes ago, Butters20 said:

Ahem, perhaps in the future we should be careful of trading when ones draft chart is known to the other.

 

NOT an affront at all, not questioning your integrity. Just a suggestion.

 

If I'm on my own island regarding this, I'll accept a proper tar and feathering

 

 

As Philly will attest to when I pick, the one player left on his three-name list wasn't anywhere near the guy I wanted. 

 

Hail. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Like the Cowboys last selection some 25 picks back in Round 4 of Chad Hansen; our latest selection is an unexpected opportunity that has presented itself as we honestly never expected this guy to still be in play the back end of the 4th. And like Hansen, and the injury dropped Moreau before him, we feel we've gotten somewhat of a steal. We had a 4th Round grade on our man. We just feel if he wasn't undersized, he'd doubtless go much higher as his exhilarating skillset befits. And we're genuinely surprised, if exceptionally thankful, that 12 other RB's have been selected before him. 

 

He was the only RB we had signalled out pre-draft as the perfect complimentary addition to Zeke who gives us exactly what we need across the board. But we never figured he'd still be here at this point as noted. But as he is, and as we feel there's nobody as good to fit perfectly with the Cowboys we have graded around this point in the 2018 NFL Draft, a small trade up again was a complete no-brainer. It was just a case of finding the right partner and the right time. 

 

With the 33rd pick in the 4th Round of the 2017 NFL Draft, and 140th overall selection, the Dallas Cowboys are delighted to welcome 

 

RB/KR. T.J. Logan. Snr. University of North Carolina at Chappel Hill. 

 

 

 

 

Before we look at what the undersized ( 5'9/ 196 LBS) Tyrone 'T.J.'' Logan brings to the table, let's look at why we feel he fits so perfectly in what we're looking for here at the Cowboys. After last year's phenomenal rookie season of who we believe to be the best back in the NFL, Ezekial Elliott, we were looking for the perfect complement to Zeke to give us a 3rd down, change of pace back who could be another serious threat to a defense. And with Darren McFadden's injury history, and Alfred Morris losing a step and regressing badly last season; an addition sooner rather than later the next few years in that regard was becoming apparent. But above and beyond that, we've also had a BIG void on our roster since 2015's loss of Dwayne Harris in FA to the New York Giants. Dwayne filled a key duel role for the Cowboys as a depth receiver, and more pertinently a highly productive return man who regularly flipped the field. Lucky Whitehead has been very disappointing in replacing Dwayne and hasn't improved his 2 years in Dallas. As was Lance Dunbar who's just moved on to the Rams in FA. To put our woeful kick return output in perspective ..... Dallas ranked 22nd league-wide last season. And the Cowboys haven't scored a kickoff return TD since the 2008 season! We were still playing at Texas Stadium in Irving back then for Pete's sake when rookie Felix Jones went the distance against the Eagles! And there's been no punt return TD in big D since Harris in the 2013 season. Simply put, we've sucked MASSIVELY in the return department for WAY too long now!

 

Which brings us to the latest Dallas Cowboy .....

 

A 4 star recruit out of High School, T.J. has always been a highly coveted player. One of the State of North Carolina's top overall players back in 2013, he was heavily recruited by the likes of Clemson and Ohio State among others. But chose to stay true to the home roots in choosing the Tar Heels. His production in Chappel Hill, whilst bizarrely playing second fiddle to the one-dimensional Elijah Hood, has been exhilarating to say the least.  Logan is the very definition of a playmaker. And a SERIOUS home run threat with his phenomenal play speed in all three phases. Running the football. Catching it out of the backfield. Or returning kick-offs. Through 4 years in school, he has 2,165 rushing yards through 398 carries for a 5.4-yard average. With 19 TD's to boot. He compliments that with another 663 receiving yards through 76 receptions and 4 TD's. Augmented with a ridiculous 4 kickoff return TD's, a UNC record, garnishing a career average 27.2 return yards. And the 32.9 yards per return average in his final senior year had him sat 2nd in overall FBS play. His 4,926 career all-purpose yards is 4th all time in the Tar Heels anals. Not too shabby for #2 back who for some strange reason was never afforded 20 touches in a game through his collegiate career. 

 

T.J. is rapid. He flat out FLYS! Not only testified by his lightening 4.37 40 at the Combine, the fastest of all 33 RB's in Indy (and it wasn't even close); but it translates to his actual game speed. His tape more than matches his workout in shorts which is all you're looking for. Sweeps/ in the slot/ downfield in the second level when he breaks one- SO many ways Logan can hurt you with his speed and agility. He accelerates to top speed in a flash, with a secondary burst to finish his runs for good measure! He's great at creating his own yardage with his electric feet and vision to set up his plays and make guys miss. It's like he's shot out of a pinball when he's gone. One cut and GO to wrack up yards in chunks! He has real sure hands catching out of the backfield, making catches away from his body and only having ONE drop his four years at UNC. (76 receptions.).  But it's that World Class speed that is what sends his value through the roof as far as everything we at Dallas are looking for in the role. We see him not only as the answer to our kick-return problem's, but the perfect compliment to Zeke. Where Elliott likes to run downhill breaking tackles in the middle, T.J. is the perfect change-up sweeping around the corner on edge runs and screens. That coupled with his phenomenal return ability leads us to believe he's the perfect fit for the role on our roster. And he's already well versed in playing second fiddle in a two-back mentality too in NC and more than happy to continue that way in Dallas. 

 

Logan's not without weakness of course. That's why he's available the late fourth. Mainly down to being undersized at 5'9 and 196 LBS. Without really having the frame to ever top 200 LBS, But within that he is one tough lil' SOB who leaves NOTHING on the field and hasn't missed a game the last three years. Benching 17 reps in Indy, coming in 14th out of the 33 RB's. many much bigger and stronger, just adds to his total commitment character that has him FAR bigger than his size in every respect.  He's a very willing blocker, who by his own admission prides himself on physical contact against bigger LB's. But that area can be improved some. And his best work comes outside. He's not built to take punishment between the tackles. But as we already have Zeke tearing it up there, we feel they'll compliment each others styles nicely to keep opposing D's on edge. And he's never so much as returned 1 punt in his career to date. But given how electirc he is on kick-off returns, it's something Coach Quinn is relishing adding to T.J.'s game on his teams unit. 

 

All in all the Cowboys are delighted to add the perfect complimentry piece that fits all our requirments for the role and adds another exhilarating piece behind the best line in football to our already stellar offensive weapon group. This added to the earlier, top quality restructioring of all three phases of our D leaves the Dallas Cowboys organisation excessively happy with their 2017 NFL Draft lot. 

 

 

 

 

 

THE LOS ANGELES RAMS ARE NOW ON THE CLOCK!

 

Hail. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

25 minutes ago, Wildbunny said:

.....

 

Now, I'm starting to think that trading future draft picks is reaching out of hands. Maybe we should add a limit to this.

 

 

Across the board, we're currently running at exactly the same futures traded as last year. 8. 

 

Don't recall an outcry then. Shrugs. 

 

Hail. 

[goskins10]

9 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said:

 

Across the board, we're currently running at exactly the same futures traded as last year. 8. 

 

Don't recall an outcry then. Shrugs. 

 

Hail. 

 

Not sure how you limit it. While it is unlikely that someone trades that many future picks away, it's not impossible. Our own George Allen would actually trade picks that he didn't have until people started wondering why 3 teams had the Redskins 4th rd draft pick for the next year - Gil Brandt reminded me of this last night!

 

It does need to be accounted when evaluating the draft results. There is a cost to trading future picks. So when grading the draft you have to some how account for the lost picks in future years. If you try to grade just how those players do and/or where they are drafted, not accounting for the future cost skews the results.

 

This is just brainstorming as I am not that concerned. It's a really fun exercise - but it is just an exercise. Just talking out loud.

 

Note: I will also add if other people are OK accepting future daft picks, kind of up to them.

[ComManDersFan57]

I attest and swear on my Redskins fan card that GHH's pick wasn't even close to the one of mine he knew about.

 

 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

23 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

Not sure how you limit it. While it is unlikely that someone trades that many future picks away, it's not impossible. Our own George Allen would actually trade picks that he didn't have until people started wondering why 3 teams had the Redskins 4th rd draft pick for the next year - Gil Brandt reminded me of this last night!

 

It does need to be accounted when evaluating the draft results. There is a cost to trading future picks. So when grading the draft you have to some how account for the lost picks in future years. If you try to grade just how those players do and/or where they are drafted, not accounting for the future cost skews the results.

 

This is just brainstorming as I am not that concerned. It's a really fun exercise - but it is just an exercise. Just talking out loud.

 

 

 

Absolutely. 

 

Which is why, FWIW, I keep putting up Dallas' future haul, along with accounting for the cap going forward as I've dealt with earlier in the thread;  to explain why, given how close the Cowboys are to making the next step, calculated gambles from all standpoints are worth taking IMHO. 

 

Nothing is taken lightly. People will form their own judgements on that but this sure isn't anything like a Redskins situation. Which seems to be what a lot equate everything to. 

 

Not entirely sure what Frenchies gripe is as he's partaken in such trades but hey ho. 

 

Hail. 

[goskins10]

3 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said:

 

Absolutely. 

 

Which is why, FWIW, I keep putting up Dallas' future haul, along with accounting for the cap going forward as I've dealt with earlier in the thread;  to explain why, given how close the Cowboys are to making the next step, calculated gambles from all standpoints are worth taking IMHO. 

 

Nothing is taken lightly. People will form their own judgements on that but this sure isn't anything like a Redskins situation. Which seems to be what a lot equate everything to. 

 

Npt entirely sure what Frenchies gripe is as he's partaken in such trades but hey ho. 

 

Hail. 

 

You know the French, have to whining about something... lol  Totally kidding my French friend! Could not help myself.....

 

[Wildbunny]

30 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said:

 

Across the board, we're currently running at exactly the same futures traded as last year. 8. 

 

Don't recall an outcry then. Shrugs. 

 

Hail. 

Well, what I don't want is see people trading them as they have no real impact and completly mortgage the future of their team.

I have no problem how it went this year, but just like the first time when we agreed on trading players it quickly went out of hands with people dealing everything as possible and this looking like a complete mess.

 

We don't want people starting doing stupid things with future picks like trading all their future picks next year to trade up this year. This would have no sense at all.

 

13 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

You know the French, have to whining about something... lol  Totally kidding my French friend! Could not help myself.....

I would not be french if I wasn't whinning...

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

2 minutes ago, Wildbunny said:

Well, what I don't want is see people trading them as they have no real impact and completly mortgage the future of their team.

I have no problem how it went this year, but just like the first time when we agreed on trading players it quickly went out of hands with people dealing everything as possible and this looking like a complete mess.

 

We don't want people starting doing stupid things with future picks like trading all their future picks next year to trade up this year. This would have no sense at all.

...

1

 

Which is sound and why we added the trade veto option to the rules this year for any trades that were ridiculously lopsided. Then if the explanation wasn't plausible,  the community would decide 'yay or nay.'

 

I've been working on allowing anything within a 90/100 point differential leeway off the trade chart and realistic futures within that. As yet, I've seen nothing to really question. Which presumably has been the same for everyone else as nobody has. 

 

Hail. 

[ZRagone]

I get wilds point. While the amount of next year picks is about the same, I'd wager heavily that the spread of those trades across multiple people is less. 

 

IE, if there were 8 both years...the difference between 8 by 8 different team and 8 by 4 different teams, with one of them accounting for 5 of the trade picks. 

 

And I think that's why it likely feels different to some folks now. As with all systems, once it seems that someone has found a way to maximize it significantly more than everyone else, people begin to start questioning the system. 

 

Does it feel a bit like GHH is taking full advantage of the fact that there's zero consequences to trading next year's picks in order to maximize what he can take this year? For me, to a point, yes. BUT, I don't really think how he's done it is a problem (and not close to the player trading fiasco). I get the slippery slope worry, but until people actually go sliding down it, I don't see the need to worry. 

 

And as already stated, while there's no formal judging of the drafts, it does happen and it's a bragging rights thing (Ajayi vs Zenner anyone?). While he, naturally, us trying to downplay it with the "Washington viewpoint" comments, the reality is many folks value future year picks and I'm sure that will play into how the draft is viewed. Not just his, but those drafts where people got the future picks. 

 

So I get what and why Wild is making his statement, I just don't think there's a big need to change the rules for something that's not widespread or massively problematic in its isolated uses. IF it gets more extreme, then maybe. But not a problem right now 

[Butters20]

And I also think it makes a difference what team it is. If we had, say, the Jaguars or Browns trading all of their future picks for this years draft, that would seem way more phony than a team who is in contention and maybe a piece or two away from the big show doing it.

[Wildbunny]

2 minutes ago, ZRagone said:

Does it feel a bit like GHH is taking advantage of the fact that there's zero consequences to trading next year's picks in order to maximize what he can take this year? To a point, yes.

 

I would agree to this point if he was drafting studs, but he's using the system to drafts duds...

So it evens up I'd say...

1 minute ago, Butters20 said:

And I also think it makes a difference what team it is. If we had, say, the Jaguars or Browns trading all of their future picks for this years draft, that would seem way more phony than a team who is in contention and maybe a piece or two away from the big show doing it.

I would have loved to see GHH do a Mike Ditka this year

[ZRagone]

Just now, Wildbunny said:

 

I would agree to this point if he was drafting studs, but he's using the system to drafts duds...

So it evens up I'd say...