Elessar78 Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 My problem with that is $12,000 later, you're left with nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_Bleed_B&G Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 So you buy and lease 3 cars a year. If your are leasing for a business, then as I said earlier business leases make sense. If you did it personally, then you are a bull****ter. Not for a business and I'm not here to prove anything. Keep rambling on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Not for a business and I'm not here to prove anything. Keep rambling on. If I wanted to waste money I can certainly buy and lease 3 cars a year. What's your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_Bleed_B&G Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 If I wanted to waste money I can certainly buy and lease 3 cars a year. What's your point? I'm not wasting either. I enjoy my cars, don't like staying in them more than 3 years, no maintenance, etc.. I have cars that I have kept for years too. I don't put money down for a reason. why would i want to use my cash. If your smart you don't have to be upside down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 I'm not wasting either. I enjoy my cars, don't like staying in them more than 3 years, no maintenance, etc.. I have cars that I have kept for years too. I don't put money down for a reason. why would i want to use my cash. If your smart you don't have to be upside down. I enjoy my cars too, I also like my cash. There is zero financial gain to leasing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elessar78 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Interesting blog from NY Times on his car leasing experience http://bucks.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/08/what-i-learned-the-hard-way-about-leasing-a-car/?_r=0 http://marcfrons.com/lease.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mursilis Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Nice post, and I trust you actually believe this. The reason there is a high number of leased vehicles is because people want what they can't afford. It's cheaper to lease a Range Rover monthly than it is to buy one if you don't exceed your mileage. Americans are fiscally broke and irresponsible and only care about what the monthly payment is. Leasing is NEVER a great idea. On top of that, the fact that most shady dealers nail you on the residual value makes leasing even worse for the uninformed. Notice the thread starter didn't mention the residual value You're right in the first paragraph, but only mostly right in the second. Because a lot of less-than-brilliant people lease cars so they can have a ride which projects a flashy image they can't actually afford, dealers do love leases, but that doesn't mean financially-savvy people haven't negotiated leases to their own advantage. You admitted you knew a person that did well on a lease. I know several people like that who enjoy changing cars frequently and have been able to work the numbers to make leasing a better fiscal decision than buying. Of course the best option is usually to buy-and-hold, which is what I do (my daily driver is a 1997 Toyota), but if you want to upgrade cars frequently, leasing can be the better option IF you negotiate the right deal. Heck, if you don't know what you're doing at the dealership, you're going to get fleeced, leasing or buying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Interesting blog from NY Times on his car leasing experience http://bucks.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/08/what-i-learned-the-hard-way-about-leasing-a-car/?_r=0 http://marcfrons.com/lease.html Makes my point. You're right in the first paragraph, but only mostly right in the second. Because a lot of less-than-brilliant people lease cars so they can have a ride which projects a flashy image they can't actually afford, dealers do love leases, but that doesn't mean financially-savvy people haven't negotiated leases to their own advantage. You admitted you knew a person that did well on a lease. I know several people like that who enjoy changing cars frequently and have been able to work the numbers to make leasing a better fiscal decision than buying. Of course the best option is usually to buy-and-hold, which is what I do (my daily driver is a 1997 Toyota), but if you want to upgrade cars frequently, leasing can be the better option IF you negotiate the right deal. Heck, if you don't know what you're doing at the dealership, you're going to get fleeced, leasing or buying. Hey if you come to the table and say you like to change cars every couple of years and drive low mileage, lease and be merry. If you claim that lease is somehow a fiscally value proposition, that is incorrect. As you see in the links above, leasing is a mostly shady proposition for the uninformed. Now my buddy that "did well" on a lease. If you buy or lease any highly desired car, park it in the garage and never drive it, and dump it 3 years later. You might be able to get more than you owe. Doesn't make it a fiscally good investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Wife and I just leased a car last year. We have a 3yr/36,000 mile lease. To me it made sense on a few different levels. Yes, the monthly cost was cheaper than buying. And no, we didn't lease a Range Rover. It's a 2014 Chevy Traverse. We have a 3yr bumper to bumper and powertrain warranty, which means for the life of the lease, I'm pretty well covered if anything goes wrong with the car. Also, we have 2 free years of oil changes as well. So basically over 3 years, I don't have to worry about replacing just about anything that goes wrong with the car or pay for upkeep except for 2 oil changes the last year we have the car. I don't need to worry about brakes, tires, etc. Third, we don't drive very far. My wife has a 20 mile commute to and from work every day. Both our families live within 3 miles of us. So it's not like we have to worry about getting close to the mileage limit. Maybe leasing isn't for everyone, but to say it's stupid is ignorant IMO. Depending on situations and such, leasing makes pretty good sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elessar78 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Wife and I just leased a car last year. We have a 3yr/36,000 mile lease. To me it made sense on a few different levels. Yes, the monthly cost was cheaper than buying. And no, we didn't lease a Range Rover. It's a 2014 Chevy Traverse. We have a 3yr bumper to bumper and powertrain warranty, which means for the life of the lease, I'm pretty well covered if anything goes wrong with the car. Also, we have 2 free years of oil changes as well. So basically over 3 years, I don't have to worry about replacing just about anything that goes wrong with the car or pay for upkeep except for 2 oil changes the last year we have the car. I don't need to worry about brakes, tires, etc. Third, we don't drive very far. My wife has a 20 mile commute to and from work every day. Both our families live within 3 miles of us. So it's not like we have to worry about getting close to the mileage limit. Maybe leasing isn't for everyone, but to say it's stupid is ignorant IMO. Depending on situations and such, leasing makes pretty good sense. But why don't you care that you have nothing to show for your money at the end of 3 years?? The 3yr bumper to bumper is nice, but in most modern cars nothing is really going to go wrong and that is included in many purchased cars anyway. 2 years free oil changes, IMO, is just another incentive for you to get the scheduled maintenance so the residual value of the car stays up. Most brake pads go into 30K miles and tires in 36K miles most cases. No offense, but you got warrantied for stuff that had a very low probability of breaking anyway, so cost to dealer was essentially zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 But why don't you care that you have nothing to show for your money at the end of 3 years?? The 3yr bumper to bumper is nice, but in most modern cars nothing is really going to go wrong and that is included in many purchased cars anyway. 2 years free oil changes, IMO, is just another incentive for you to get the scheduled maintenance so the residual value of the car stays up. Most brake pads go into 30K miles and tires in 36K miles most cases. No offense, but you got warrantied for stuff that had a very low probability of breaking anyway, so cost to dealer was essentially zero. Right, but I don't have to worry about paying for any of that stuff while I have the car. By the time I'm done paying for the lease, I will have paid for less than a 1/3 of what the selling price was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 By the time I'm done paying for the lease, I will have paid for less than a 1/3 of what the selling price was. thats interesting- i would have thought you would pay more than that for a 3 year lease. btw-i really like the traverse. was about to get one when i settled on an equinox, mainly cuz they get decent gas mileage, but i would have like how spacious the traverse is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mursilis Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 But why don't you care that you have nothing to show for your money at the end of 3 years?? But then he still paid out less money than if he'd bought, so he'll have more money "to show for his money" after 3 years. Almost every car depreciates, so even buyers lose money with a purchase. The only question is, when considering buying vs. leasing, which option loses less money? thats interesting- i would have thought you would pay more than that for a 3 year lease. It all depends on the terms of the lease, which you can negotiate just like a purchase (and a lot of people don't know that - the salesperson will just say Ford/GM/Whoever sets the lease rates, and they can't change them, which isn't true). You've got to look at each lease individually to determine if it's a bad deal vs. buying. It's too simplistic to say leases are ALWAYS the wrong option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 thats interesting- i would have thought you would pay more than that for a 3 year lease. btw-i really like the traverse. was about to get one when i settled on an equinox, mainly cuz they get decent gas mileage, but i would have like how spacious the traverse is. Yup, we pay $248/month. So over 36 months, that comes out to $8,928. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Yup, we pay $248/month. So over 36 months, that comes out to $8,928. wow. thats pretty impressive. one thing that would probably prevent me from being able to lease is the mileage limit. what is for you? $12,000 a year? i commute about 20 miles 4-5 days a week to work. thats 10,400 miles a year (if i worked 5 days a week, 52 weeks a year, so its an esitmate). hmmm....could keep the wifes car for running around and other things. interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 wow. thats pretty impressive. one thing that would probably prevent me from being able to lease is the mileage limit. what is for you? $12,000 a year? i commute about 20 miles 4-5 days a week to work. thats 10,400 miles a year (if i worked 5 days a week, 52 weeks a year, so its an esitmate). hmmm....could keep the wifes car for running around and other things. interesting. Yeah we have 12,000/yr. The original offer they gave us was for 15k but we told them we didn't need all those and our price went down a good bit. My car isn't a lease, so if we know we're taking a long trip, we'll just take my car instead. Plus like I said earlier, everything we drive to on a daily basis is within a 15-20 mile radius. We've had it for almost 9 months and we're averaging a smidge less than 1k/month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elessar78 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Yup, we pay $248/month. So over 36 months, that comes out to $8,928. Comparatively, the SUV/Crossover I'm looking at is approx $175/mo over 60 months and at the end of that I still have an expected trade-in value of $3000-4000. So total cost for me is about $6500. It's apples to oranges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Comparatively, the SUV/Crossover I'm looking at is approx $175/mo over 60 months and at the end of that I still have an expected trade-in value of $3000-4000. So total cost for me is about $6500. It's apples to oranges. Like I said, it's all preference. I don't think leasing a car is a terrible idea. It all depends on situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elessar78 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 But then he still paid out less money than if he'd bought, so he'll have more money "to show for his money" after 3 years. Almost every car depreciates, so even buyers lose money with a purchase. The only question is, when considering buying vs. leasing, which option loses less money? $248 is a reasonable car payment for me. Let's say he rolls into two more leases for a decade, after ten years he's paid just shy of $30,000. If I pay off a used car in 5 years @ $248/month. That's only $14,880. Even if I have to put in $1,000/year in maintenance for the next 5 years, that's still only $20,000. So, still up by about $10,000. The original post was about leasing vs buying a used vehicle. Most of the depreciation has been taken on by the original owner. And when I trade it in or sell it private party, there's always some residual value left. So, add that to the $10K I estimated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 $248 is a reasonable car payment for me. Let's say he rolls into two more leases for a decade, after ten years he's paid just shy of $30,000. If I pay off a used car in 5 years @ $248/month. That's only $14,880. Even if I have to put in $1,000/year in maintenance for the next 5 years, that's still only $20,000. So, still up by about $10,000. The original post was about leasing vs buying a used vehicle. Most of the depreciation has been taken on by the original owner. And when I trade it in or sell it private party, there's always some residual value left. So, add that to the $10K I estimated. True, but the car I'm leasing is new vs buying used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Maybe leasing isn't for everyone, but to say it's stupid is ignorant IMO. Depending on situations and such, leasing makes pretty good sense. I am not sure anyone said it's stupid. Everyone posts on here in terms of a window. You post in terms of a 3 year window. The fact is, at 3 years you then have to do 1 of 3 things (assuming your wife needs a car). 1 - Buy the car anyways. 2 - Lease a new car and commit to 3 more years. 3 - Turn the car back in and buy another car. So yeah on a monthly basis in a 3 year window it may cost you less money assuming you stay below the mileage, but if you have to have a monthly payment into infinity, what sense does that make. My wife has an Acura RDX. It's been paid off now for a couple of years. She drives less than 30 miles a day, the car has low mileage, the car is in great shape, it's a vehicle with low maintenance requirements, and I don't have a monthly payment. I also don't need to sign up for another 3 years of monthly payments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
757SeanTaylor21 Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 Yeah I don't understand the concept of just going money away for nothing...that's like buying 300 dollars worth of clothes every month for 3 years just to either a) burn them all and start back over buy them again for a little cheaper price already (but you already paid for them) or c) return them for a little bit of value and then a) buy a used or new car or wash rinse repeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 Yeah I don't understand the concept of just going money away for nothing...that's like buying 300 dollars worth of clothes every month for 3 years just to either a) burn them all and start back over buy them again for a little cheaper price already (but you already paid for them) or c) return them for a little bit of value and then a) buy a used or new car or wash rinse repeat. LOL Well I_Bleed_B&G thinks you are wrong. He bobbles 9 cars a year given his 3 cars a year average buy and lease. LOL. Leasing is great. He likes his cars and buys 3 at a time every year I kid. I agree totally. It's not even anything debatable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsmarydu Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 My wife has an Acura RDX. It's been paid off now for a couple of years. She drives less than 30 miles a day, the car has low mileage, the car is in great shape, it's a vehicle with low maintenance requirements, and I don't have a monthly payment. I also don't need to sign up for another 3 years of monthly payments.Well said, chip. I drive a '99 Monte Carlo, less than 20 miles a day, it's been paid off since '03. We decided to invest in a full work-over about 2 years ago rather than get a newer car...I don't need no stinkin' nav system, LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 I don't mind spending money, but I hate wasting it. I put about 1600 bucks in my daily driver 2 years ago. Wife said: "Why don't you buy a new car and drive one of the other cars " (We have 3 other cars) Me: " Why should I ?, This car has been good to me and I'll drive it until the wheels fall off" Wife: "It just seems like a waste, and you don't like to waste money" (with that smartass smirk of hers) Me: " If this car lasts 2 years for 1600 bucks...What new car can I drive for 800 bucks a year ? " Wife: "I guess so" Me: "Ding" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.