Yahoo: Israel vows no let-up, Hamas defiant, as Gaza toll tops 120

[jpyaks3]

Observing that these rockets seem to really suck, but they sure do seem to have an endless supply of them. 

 

(And a willingness to fire them off, even though they surely know that they aren't going to hit anything.  That the only result of firing them off will be to provoke more Israeli attacks.) 

 

(Which makes me wonder if that's what they want.  When somebody keeps doing X, and every time they do it, Y happens, you have to wonder if they're doing X because they want Y to happen.) 

 

But then, maybe I'm giving people too much credit for being rational. 

According the PFLP

"The rockets are both a practical and a symbolic representation of our resistance to the occupier. They are a constant reminder that the occupier is in fact an occupier, and that no matter how they may engage in sieges, massacres, fence us in, deny us the basic human needs of life, we will continue to resist and we will continue to hold fast to our fundamental rights, and we will not allow them to be destroyed. So long as one rocket is launched at the occupier, our people, our resistance and our cause is alive. This is why they targeted the rockets - the rockets do make the occupier insecure, because everyone is a symbol and a physical act of our rejection to their occupation, to their massacres, to their crimes, and to their continuing assaults on our people. Each rocket says that we will not allow their so-called "solutions" that are based on the abrogation and denial of our rights."

[visionary]

http://news.yahoo.com/israeli-shelling-north-gaza-un-school-kills-20-033934635.html;_ylt=AwrSyCVoa9hTgE0AZ2PQtDMD

Deadly Israeli shelling hits UN school as Hamas mulls truce

 

An Israeli shelling on a UN school in Gaza killed 20 people early Wednesday, medics said, as Palestinian factions were to head to Cairo to discuss a temporary humanitarian ceasefire.

 

As the conflict between Israel and Hamas entered its 23rd day, international efforts to bring an end to the bloodshed that has killed more than 1,260 people continued apace, and concern grew over the high civilian death toll, especially among children.

 

Since the war began on July 8, when Israel launched a campaign to stop rocket fire from Gaza and destroy attack tunnels, a series of concerted international efforts to bring a truce have fallen flat.

 

On Wednesday morning, an Israeli shell slammed into a UN school being used as a shelter for those displaced by fighting, killing 20 people, emergency services spokesman Ashraf al-Qudra said.

 

The shell hit the Palestinian refugee agency (UNRWA) girls' school in Jabalia refugee camp.

 

A UN official confirmed the shelling, saying it hit a bathroom and two classrooms in the school, but gave a lower initial death toll of 13 to 15.

Palestinian president Mahmud Abbas "was in touch with (Hamas chief Khaled) Meshaal yesterday and today. He proposed the 24 hour truce, Meshaal and Hamas agreed", senior Palestinian official Nabil Shaath told AFP on Tuesday.

 

What will Israel say this time?

 

 

 

http://www.haaretz.com/mobile/.premium-1.607841?v=B592E5F60850267D405B30508E7B7559

Gaza is trigger for American Jews’ tension and dissonance on Israel

 

It’s hard to sketch an absence or reproduce a silence. It’s easier to report whispers, but those who whisper often seek anonymity. And anecdotes, of course, are not data.

 

Yet anecdotally, in whispers and off-the-record comments, in sudden Facebook defriendings or empty chairs at services, Israel’s most recent wave of hostilities appears to be leading to increasing alienation for a number of American Jews, despite the call for solidarity. For many of these members of our community, the sensation comes as a deep, identity-shaking shock.

 

The sense has been building for some time – as Ori Nir reported in May, “Lately, American friends are asking me whether Israeli leaders are thinking straight, whether they realize how unreasonable their statements sound here in Washington… These are people who support Israel… who follow the news from Israel with genuine concern, and who cannot comprehend what seems to them like self-destructive behavior.”

 

But whereas outright war usually muffles such doubts, for many the current violence has created a powerful cognitive dissonance.

 

From Birthright returnees who now take Israel’s word with a grain of salt, to stalwart community leaders who admit to occasionally removing regularly-worn identifiers of their Jewish identity – whether to avoid conversation, or out of a stunned sense of disgrace – many are experiencing an anxiety that is new, and distancing.

 

 

https://twitter.com/johnlegend

So sick watching our Secretary of State have to grovel so hard to tell Israel how much he loves them while Israeli cabinet ****s on him

1:06 AM

Seems like more and more celebrities have been speaking out in support of Gaza or against Israel the last few days.

[twa]

another Hamas weapons dump explodes?

 

http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Protective-Edge/Rockets-found-at-UNRWA-school-for-third-time-369358

 

http://pjmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2014/07/29/gaza-continued-what-do-we-do-about-the-un/

[mistertim]

another Hamas weapons dump explodes?

 

http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Protective-Edge/Rockets-found-at-UNRWA-school-for-third-time-369358

 

http://pjmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2014/07/29/gaza-continued-what-do-we-do-about-the-un/

Even if this is true (who knows...we just have to take the IDF's word for it and also have to guess at what in the "vicinity" of the school means...does that mean from inside it or from 5 blocks away?) does it really invalidate that they shelled the **** out of the school where refugees from the fighting were KNOWN to be? It doesn't sound like there was an army of Hamas fighters holed up and doing a bunch of damage to the Israeli forces.

 

And ZOMG a THIRD UN school with munitions found? Out of...what, at least 200 they run? This definitely invalidates everything else going on. Is the implication here that the UN is working with Hamas militants or something? That seems to be the tenor of that "article" aka blog post. 

 

Please keep your eyes on the shiny objects folks, nothing else to see here. Those pools of blood-looking stuff are just uh...kool aid we're giving to Palestinian kids, or something. 

[twa]

if ya were truly concerned about the bloody lumps the reasons matter

 

it is not simply IDF's word, reporters on the ground as well as UN officials and video

 

hundreds of kids died tunneling ,they die from Hamas weapon mishaps, they die from being used as shields......and they certainy die from Israel going after Hamas

 

 

where are the adults?.......In Qatar getting a pedi????

[jpyaks3]

if ya were truly concerned about the bloody lumps the reasons matter

 

it is not simply IDF's word, reporters on the ground as well as UN officials and video

 

hundreds of kids died tunneling ,they die from Hamas weapon mishaps, they die from being used as shields......and they certainy die from Israel going after Hamas

 

 

where are the adults?.......In Qatar getting a pedi????

You have to be trolling because no one can actually believe that. 

And once again one side has been shown to use human shields and it isn't Hamas.

But go ahead keep defending the bombing of schools, mosques, and hospitals, keep defending the slaughter of innocent children. 

[twa]

one side???? 

 

 

You keep ignoring Hamas storing weapons in schools,mosques,and probably hospitals, as well as firing from around them......and of course building tunnels and bunkers underneath them for Hamas instead of civilians ,while bitterly clinging to your one side is evil shtick. 

 

 

tell where I'm wrong .

[jpyaks3]

one side???? 

 

 

You keep ignoring Hamas storing weapons in schools,mosques,and probably hospitals, as well as firing from around them......and of course building tunnels and bunkers underneath them for Hamas instead of civilians ,while bitterly clinging to your one side is evil shtick. 

 

 

tell where I'm wrong .

The Nation debunks the claim that Palestinians are using civilians as “human shields”

 

This is arguably one of Israel’s most insidious claims, because it blames Palestinians for their own death and deprives them of even their victimhood. Israel made the same argument in its war against Lebanon in 

2006

 and in its war against Palestinians in 

2008

. Notwithstanding its military 

cartoon sketches

, Israel has yet to prove that Hamas has used civilian infrastructure to store 

military weapons

. The two cases where Hamas indeed stored weapons in 

UNRWA schools

, the schools were empty. UNRWA discovered the rockets and publicly condemned the violation of its sanctity.

International human rights organizations that have investigated these claims have determined that they are 

not true

. It attributed the high death toll in Israel’s 2006 war on Lebanon to Israel’s indiscriminate attacks. 

Human Rights Watch

 notes:

 

The evidence Human Rights Watch uncovered in its on-the-ground investigations refutes [israel’s] argument…we found strong evidence that Hezbollah stored most of its rockets in bunkers and weapon storage facilities located in uninhabited fields and valleys, that in the vast majority of cases Hezbollah fighters left populated civilian areas as soon as the fighting started, and that Hezbollah fired the vast majority of its rockets from pre-prepared positions outside villages.

 

In fact, only 

Israeli soldiers

 have systematically used Palestinians as human shields. Since Israel’s incursion into the West Bank in 2002, it has used Palestinians as human shields by tying young Palestinians onto the 

hoods of their cars

 or forcing them to 

go into a home

where a potential militant may be hiding.

The Guardian reports:

 

These claims [that Hamas is using human shields] have not been backed up by independent reporting from international journalists covering the war from Gaza …. Many said nowhere in Gaza was safe, so they saw little point in abandoning their homes.

 

Others cited worries about not knowing the identities of people who would be their new neighbours; they could be evacuating a familiar neighbourhood for one that was a militant stronghold and others were simply too terrified to go out on the streets. Many media reports said there was no evidence of coercion by Hamas.

 

In fact, tens of thousands of people have fled their homes for what they hope is a safer place. UNRWA reports that more than 140,000 people have sought shelter in its properties; churches and mosques have been overwhelmed by displaced civilians; the grounds of the Shifa hospital in Gaza City have begun to resemble a makeshift refugee camp. These families are in fear of their lives, but they overwhelmingly cite Israeli bombing and shelling as the cause, rather than threats from Hamas.

Gaza is one of the most overcrowded places on earth. Almost two million people are crammed into a strip of land just 25 miles long and between three and a half and seven miles wide – roughly the same size as the Isle of Wight. In general there are few opportunities to leave; and in the midst of a conflict such as this, there is no exit.

The current war is not being fought on a conventional battlefield. Israel is pounding Gaza from the air, and its troops are increasingly fighting battles against a guerrilla army in densely populated urban areas – which constitute much of the Gaza Strip.

***

Israel, meanwhile, does not have an unblemished record in the use of human shields. In 2010, two soldiers were convicted in an IDF military court of using an 

11-year-old Palestinian boy

 as a human shield in its 2008-09 operation in Gaza. The pair ordered the child to search bags they suspected of being booby-trapped.

Indeed, Monique Buckner provocatively tweets:

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/07/falsely-associating-judaism-zionism-uses-jews-everywhere-human-shields.html

And one side has killed 1000+ civilians, including hundreds of children, don't forget that.

[s0crates]

Don't have time for a full reading. (It's really long). But the few minutes I spent browsing look very good.

I liked her conclusion:

Mostly, being a historian in a time of crisis is a heart-breaking business, especially when one becomes a historical witness to the profound lack of empathy on both sides of the conflict. Dehumanization is our worst enemy. How we can ever have peace without acknowledging the “other” as a person; without acknowledging the basic truth that they are human beings with human rights? How can we co-exist without compassion in the present? Perhaps it would be useful to reinvent the role of historian as a kind of ‘empatharian,’ one who teaches others how to empathize with the lived past, so that we can be encouraged to contemplate our future together.

Unfortunately, professors don’t have all the answers about how to solve the Arab-Israeli conflict. But the most important thing is to ask the right questions. Since I began teaching in England, I am often reminded of Shylock’s speech in The Merchant of Venice: “If you prick us, do we not bleed? If you tickle us, do we not laugh? If you poison us, do we not die? and if you wrong us, shall we not revenge? If we are like you in the rest, we will resemble you in that.”

If we can continue to remind ourselves that both Israelis and Palestinians are people deserving of human rights—and also capable of acts of vengeance—historical empathy may lead us one step closer to an enduring peace.

[twa]

 

The Nation debunks the claim that Palestinians are using civilians as “human shields”

 

 

the Nation is a liberals dream and the piece uses wordsmithing to escape reality

 

 

"yet to prove" 

[jpyaks3]

the Nation is a liberals dream and the piece uses wordsmithing to escape reality

 

 

"yet to prove" 

Ah so you don't even want to address the Human Rights Watch report or the Amnesty International Report, or what the Guardian reports. Keep posting things from pjmedia and claiming that international rights organizations are really the biased ones.

For content here is a good article from the New Yorker about how this isn't about Hamas or rockets or any of that.

 

Three days after the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu launched the current war in Gaza, he held a press conference in Tel Aviv during which he said, in Hebrew, according to the Times of Israel, “I think the Israeli people understand now what I always say: that there cannot be a situation, under any agreement, in which we relinquish security control of the territory west of the River Jordan.”

It’s worth listening carefully when Netanyahu speaks to the Israeli people. What is going on in Palestine today is not really about Hamas. It is not about rockets. It is not about “human shields” or terrorism or tunnels. It is about Israel’s permanent control over Palestinian land and Palestinian lives. That is what Netanyahu is really saying, and that is what he now admits he has “always” talked about. It is about an unswerving, decades-long Israeli policy of denying Palestine self-determination, freedom, and sovereignty

 

What Israel is doing in Gaza now is collective punishment. It is punishment for Gaza’s refusal to be a docile ghetto. It is punishment for the gall of Palestinians in unifying, and of Hamas and other factions in responding to Israel’s siege and its provocations with resistance, armed or otherwise, after Israel repeatedly reacted to unarmed protest with crushing force. Despite years of ceasefires and truces, the siege of Gaza has never been lifted.

 

As Netanyahu’s own words show, however, Israel will accept nothing short of the acquiescence of Palestinians to their own subordination. It will accept only a Palestinian “state” that is stripped of all the attributes of a real state: control over security, borders, airspace, maritime limits, contiguity, and, therefore, sovereignty. The twenty-three-year charade of the “peace process” has shown that this is all Israel is offering, with the full approval of Washington. Whenever the Palestinians have resisted that pathetic fate (as any nation would), Israel has punished them for their insolence. This is not new.

 

Punishing Palestinians for existing has a long history. It was Israel’s policy before Hamas and its rudimentary rockets were Israel’s boogeyman of the moment, and before Israel turned Gaza into an open-air prison, punching bag, and weapons laboratory. In 1948, Israel killed thousands of innocents, and terrorized and displaced hundreds of thousands more, in the name of creating a Jewish-majority state in a land that was then sixty-five per cent Arab. In 1967, it displaced hundreds of thousands of Palestinians again, occupying territory that it still largely controls, forty-seven years later.

 

In 1982, in a quest to expel the Palestine Liberation Organization and extinguish Palestinian nationalism, Israel invaded Lebanon, killing seventeen thousand people, mostly civilians. Since the late nineteen-eighties, when Palestinians under occupation rose up, mostly by throwing stones and staging general strikes, Israel has arrested tens of thousands of Palestinians: over seven hundred and fifty thousand people have spent time in Israeli prisons since 1967, a number that amounts to forty per cent of the adult male population today. They have emerged with accounts of torture, which are substantiated by human-rights groups like B’tselem. During the second intifada, which began in 2000, Israel reinvaded the West Bank (it had never fully left). The occupation and colonization of Palestinian land continued unabated throughout the “peace process” of the nineteen-nineties, and continues to this day. And yet, in America, the discussion ignores this crucial, constantly oppressive context, and is instead too often limited to Israeli “self-defense” and the Palestinians’ supposed responsibility for their own suffering.

 

In the past seven or more years, Israel has besieged, tormented, and regularly attacked the Gaza Strip. The pretexts change: they elected Hamas; they refused to be docile; they refused to recognize Israel; they fired rockets; they built tunnels to circumvent the siege; and on and on. But each pretext is a red herring, because the truth of ghettos—what happens when you imprison 1.8 million people in a hundred and forty square miles, about a third of the area of New York City, with no control of borders, almost no access to the sea for fishermen (three out of the twenty kilometres allowed by the Oslo accords), no real way in or out, and with drones buzzing overhead night and day—is that, eventually, the ghetto will fight back. It was true in Soweto and Belfast, and it is true in Gaza. We might not like Hamas or some of its methods, but that is not the same as accepting the proposition that Palestinians should supinely accept the denial of their right to exist as a free people in their ancestral homeland.

[twa]

Ah so you don't even want to address the Human Rights Watch report or the Amnesty International Report, or what the Guardian reports. Keep posting things from pjmedia and claiming that international rights organizations are really the biased ones.

 

HRW,Amnesty International and the Guardian are certainly biased.

 

pjmedia is as well

 

now do you want to address the weapons stored and fired ,and the tunnels in civilian areas......  or keep avoiding?

[jpyaks3]

HRW,Amnesty International and the Guardian are certainly biased.

 

pjmedia is as well

 

now do you want to address the weapons stored and fired ,and the tunnels in civilian areas......  or keep avoiding?

Where in the Gaza strip would you say isn't a "civilian" area? You do realize how densely packed it is right?

Also military actions around civilians does not excuse 1300 dead the vast, vast majority of which are civilians. Most of those bombs aren't falling storage facilities or areas where the fighting is occurring but in apartment buildings, schools, mosques, and hospitals, oh and the power plant and water treatment facilities as well as international media outlets. But I mean if its okay to just level a neighborhood because there might by militant activity then you believe that Hamas should be able to level Tel Aviv since there are military installations in different neighborhoods throughout the city? 

It's insane that people are defending bombing hospitals, schools, mosques, and the leveling of neighborhoods by an occupying force while trying to blame the victims, blows my mind. 

 

[twa]

insane is firing rockets and mortars from beside a civilian and expecting no one to die, but it keeps the donations coming.

[Special K]

At least for me, the innocent victims are not the ones being blamed.  

 

Hamas, the a internationally recognized terrorist organization that the Palestinians elected to lead their country, is who is largely to be blamed.  Israel deserves some blame as well as they should be doing everything possible to avoid civilian casualties, but it's hard for me to understand all the support for Hamas's actions (e.g. they're just little puny rockets, it's symbolic, the rockets don't land in populated areas anyway, etc.).  Give me a damn break.

[Larry]

Ah so you don't even want to address the Human Rights Watch report or the Amnesty International Report, or what the Guardian reports. Keep posting things from pjmedia and claiming that international rights organizations are really the biased ones.

Well, to be fair, organizations that believe in human rights do tend to avoid the modern conservative movement.

I don't know why.

Maybe it's because they don't apply them to corporations.

[jpyaks3]

At least for me, the innocent victims are not the ones being blamed.  

 

Hamas, the a internationally recognized terrorist organization that the Palestinians elected to lead their country, is who is largely to be blamed.  Israel deserves some blame as well as they should be doing everything possible to avoid civilian casualties, but it's hard for me to understand all the support for Hamas's actions (e.g. they're just little puny rockets, it's symbolic, the rockets don't land in populated areas anyway, etc.).  Give me a damn break.

I don't think it is necessarily support for Hamas but more horror at Israeli actions and the occupation.  Israel deserves almost all of the blame. They are the ones who are occupying Palestinian land, they are the ones who are stealing land, they are the ones who invaded (over what is looking more and more like false pretexts), and it is Israeli bombs and bullets that are killing hundreds of civilians not Hamas. To point that out isn't supporting Hamas it is just correctly diagnosing the situation.

To blame Hamas for any of that is ridiculous. Hamas is a reaction to that occupation, to that brutal suppression, and to the current Israeli policy. They aren't good guys but they are resistance to a colonial power and that is often ugly. 

The terrorist label is also dumb and pointless, unless you would agree that Mandela, Ghandi, and pretty much every independence or liberation movement in history are simply terrorist or terrorism because that inevitably gets trotted out by every power that can afford to kill from airplanes or with better weapons. If you want to argue that Hamas shouldn't be firing rockets unguided into Israel I don't think there are too many who would argue with you on that, but if you use those rockets to excuse the occupation, Israeli slaughter of civilians, and what is going on in Gaza right now is where you will hit resistance.

[Kilmer17]

Wait, are you claiming that Hamas is NOT a terrorist organization?

[jpyaks3]

Wait, are you claiming that Hamas is NOT a terrorist organization?

I am claiming a terrorist organization as a distinction is pretty dumb and shouldn't be used as an appeal to authority on anything. It will always be used by those in power to delegitimize resistance to oppression. 

So saying Hamas is a terrorist organization ergo we should dismiss them like a lot of people like to do is pretty pointless because throughout history people have done that to organizations that while violent are simply terrorist because they are against the current power structure. ANC in apartheid South Africa, Gandhi in India, both called terrorists by the colonial powers, it doesn't mean they were.

Want to discuss actual actions by Hamas that helps build the discussion, want to throw out the word terrorist and act like it entirely delegitimizes them and that is pretty pointless.

[Kilmer17]

The same could be said about Hamas' refusal to recognize Israel.  It delegitamizes them.

 

And comparing Hamas to Ghandi and Mandela is a bit of a reach.

[Special K]

I don't think it is necessarily support for Hamas but more horror at Israeli actions and the occupation.  Israel deserves almost all of the blame. They are the ones who are occupying Palestinian land, they are the ones who are stealing land, they are the ones who invaded (over what is looking more and more like false pretexts), and it is Israeli bombs and bullets that are killing hundreds of civilians not Hamas. To point that out isn't supporting Hamas it is just correctly diagnosing the situation.

To blame Hamas for any of that is ridiculous. Hamas is a reaction to that occupation, to that brutal suppression, and to the current Israeli policy. They aren't good guys but they are resistance to a colonial power and that is often ugly. 

The terrorist label is also dumb and pointless, unless you would agree that Mandela, Ghandi, and pretty much every independence or liberation movement in history are simply terrorist or terrorism because that inevitably gets trotted out by every power that can afford to kill from airplanes or with better weapons. If you want to argue that Hamas shouldn't be firing rockets unguided into Israel I don't think there are too many who would argue with you on that, but if you use those rockets to excuse the occupation, Israeli slaughter of civilians, and what is going on in Gaza right now is where you will hit resistance.

Eh, Hamas is recognized by many, many countries, including the EU, as a terrorist organization and their actions have done little to disprove otherwise.

 

I'm not condoning the Israeli air strikes on innocent civilians, but I don't think anyone can deny the fact that any action in Gaza is going to lead to a lot of deaths simply due to the nature of the strip's overcrowded conditions & reports of where some of these weapons caches are being stored. This whole thing sucks and I don't think Israel is doing itself any favors in the international community's eyes right now.  However, I'm just not going to sit and make excuses for Hamas either.  They're firing those rockets knowing full well what's going to happen to in response and as far as I'm concerned, they want that response from Israel because those are really the only chips they have to play in this cluster:  high civilian casualty numbers and international outrage at Israel.  That's one of the only reasons I can think of as to why Hamas militants would blow off the 4-hr humanitarian ceasefire authorized by Israel today and continue launching rockets.

 

This whole thing is just never ending.  I just don't think there's ever going to be peace over there because 1.  Hamas won't even recognize Israel and 2.  there is no way Hamas will coexist with Israel no matter how much more territory Israel disengages from.  They've made that pretty clear.

[jpyaks3]

Eh, Hamas is recognized by many, many countries, including the EU, as a terrorist organization and their actions have done little to disprove otherwise.

 

I'm not condoning the Israeli air strikes on innocent civilians, but I don't think anyone can deny the fact that any action in Gaza is going to lead to a lot of deaths simply due to the nature of the strip's overcrowded conditions & reports of where some of these weapons caches are being stored. This whole thing sucks and I don't think Israel is doing itself any favors in the international community's eyes right now.  However, I'm just not going to sit and make excuses for Hamas either.  They're firing those rockets knowing full well what's going to happen to in response and as far as I'm concerned, they want that response from Israel because those are really the only chips they have to play in this cluster:  high civilian casualty numbers and international outrage at Israel.  That's one of the only reasons I can think of as to why Hamas militants would blow off the 4-hr humanitarian ceasefire authorized by Israel today and continue launching rockets.

 

This whole thing is just never ending.  I just don't think there's ever going to be peace over there because 1.  Hamas won't even recognize Israel and 2.  there is no way Hamas will coexist with Israel no matter how much more territory Israel disengages from.  They've made that pretty clear.

That distinction once again was made about the ANC and a hell of a lot of other organizations, now shooting rockets into Israel I would say is terrorism, but I would also say the blockade and collective punishment that Israel is currently and has been engaged in is terrorism too, but calling people terrorists and washing your hands and saying we can't deal with them goes nowhere.

During that 4 hour unilateral ceasefire Israel bombed a market killing 19 and wounding 150. Israeli "ceasefires" are PR stunts thats all.  And even then the blockade would still be up, which means no building materials, no ability to rebuild the hospitals, mosques, schools, homes that Israeli attacks have leveled. 

Hamas has already said they would accept a 10 year truce (among very reasonable terms). Israel refused to even acknowledge it. They refuse to even talk to Hamas. Hamas has said pending a referendum they will recognize a state of Israel along 67 borders. Also Hamas has nothing to do with the West Bank but Israel continues to colonize the West Bank and violate Palestinian sovereignty so I don't think Hamas is the side you need to worry about living peacefully with Israelis it is the opposite.

The same could be said about Hamas' refusal to recognize Israel.  It delegitamizes them.

 

And comparing Hamas to Ghandi and Mandela is a bit of a reach.

What about Israel's refusal to recognize a Palestinian state? Are they delegitimized?  

[Kilmer17]

Hamas has said repeatedly that they will not recognize Israel.  Why should Israel talk with them?

[Larry]

The same could be said about Hamas' refusal to recognize Israel.  It delegitamizes them.

And Israel's refusal to recognize Palestine?

[jpyaks3]

Hamas has said repeatedly that they will not recognize Israel.  Why should Israel talk with them?

You must have missed this: 

 

What about Israel's refusal to recognize a Palestinian state? Are they delegitimized?  

Why must Palestinians be the ones to recognize Israel and not the reverse?

Also 

(Reuters) - Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas signaled on Saturday that he remains committed to troubled U.S.-backed peace talks, saying that any unity government agreed with the militant group Hamas would recognize Israel.

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/26/us-palestinian-abbas-talks-idUSBREA3P08820140426

What has that gotten Palestinians other than more settlers and less land?