Cooked Crack Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 (edited) And that's 16 million in 2018. These guys had 8 years! Edited July 26, 2017 by Cooked Crack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Of all the options, I think skinny repeal would be the worst. Insurance companies have to cover preexisting conditions, but absolutely nothing is done to force or encourage the healthy to maintain insurance? If the true goal is to hammer it out in committee, why not just pass Senate's ideal version? And if they are not doing that because they don't have an ideal version that's better than ACA and have enough votes to pass, maybe that's a pretty good sign that GOP needs to go back to the drawing board and focus on crafting a better bill. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 25 minutes ago, visionary said: Curious how they get "20% spike in premiums". I could see how repealing the mandate that cap premiums for us Old Folks at a ratio of the youngins might cause premiums for Old Folks to go up. but at a decrease for young folks. So where's the net increase coming from? Maybe they're scoring the effects of eliminating the subsidies that lots of folks currently get? (But are there really that many currently getting subsidies who wouldn't simply drop coverage entirely?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 35 minutes ago, visionary said: As one Faux News commentator said, "what good does it do to repeal Obamacare only to replace it with something worse?" #YOHEY 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 14 minutes ago, Larry said: Curious how they get "20% spike in premiums". I could see how repealing the mandate that cap premiums for us Old Folks at a ratio of the youngins might cause premiums for Old Folks to go up. but at a decrease for young folks. So where's the net increase coming from? Maybe they're scoring the effects of eliminating the subsidies that lots of folks currently get? (But are there really that many currently getting subsidies who wouldn't simply drop coverage entirely?) I think CBO is assuming (probably correctly) that if you repeal individual and employer mandates and have temporary 130% premium penalty (or is it nothing under skinny repeal?) as the barrier to health coverage, lot of healthy people will cancel insurance, thus raising the loss ratio and premiums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 23 minutes ago, AsburySkinsFan said: As one Faux News commentator said, "what good does it do to repeal Obamacare only to replace it with something worse?" #YOHEY Worse than something they have to force you to get?....damn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 26 minutes ago, AsburySkinsFan said: As one Faux News commentator said, "what good does it do to repeal Obamacare only to replace it with something worse?" #YOHEY 1). He was immediately fired, right? 2). And replacing it with something worse is the Republicans PURPOSE. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 17 minutes ago, twa said: Worse than something they have to force you to get?....damn Such a stupid argument. You can choose not to get health insurance and pay a fine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 1 minute ago, daveakl said: Such a stupid argument. You can choose not to get health insurance and pay a fine. You're right, oh wait....it's a tax. wrong again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Just now, twa said: You're right, oh wait....it's a tax. wrong again. It's not a tax. It's a penalty for not carrying health insurance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 1 minute ago, daveakl said: It's not a tax. It's a penalty for not carrying health insurance. a TAX penalty. until that becomes inconvenient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 1 minute ago, twa said: a TAX penalty. until that becomes inconvenient. I'm failing to see your point. Tax / fine / penalty you aren't forced to carry coverage but there is a consequence for choosing not to. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, daveakl said: It's not a tax. It's a penalty for not carrying health insurance. Twa is referring to the reasoning that SCOTUS used to uphold individual mandate. Twa, fwiw, I would argue that forcing healthy individuals to get health insurance is better than forcing insurance companies to cover preexisting conditions without influx of healthy customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 So the Tax / fine / penalty is simply encouragement rather than govt using it's power. Glad we cleared that up 1 minute ago, bearrock said: Twa is referring to the reasoning that SCOTUS used to uphold individual mandate. Twa, fwiw, I would argue that forcing healthy individuals to get health insurance is better than forcing insurance companies to cover preexisting conditions without influx of healthy customers. Indeed. I think a lot of behaviors are better....we need to start Tax / fine / penalty them as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 3 minutes ago, twa said: So the Tax / fine / penalty is simply encouragement rather than govt using it's power. Glad we cleared that up Unfortunately, IRS didn't buy "it's only an encouragement" argument from me. Maybe you'll have better luck? Quote Indeed. I think a lot of behaviors are better....we need to start Tax / fine / penalty them as well. There you go! Now you're thinking like a liberal! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 8 minutes ago, twa said: So the Tax / fine / penalty is simply encouragement rather than govt using it's power. Glad we cleared that up You've lost me in semantics. It's the government saying you have to either have health insurance or pay $ for choosing not to. It's the price you pay for being an American citizen living here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsFan44 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 5 minutes ago, twa said: So the Tax / fine / penalty is simply encouragement rather than govt using it's power. Glad we cleared that up Indeed. I think a lot of behaviors are better....we need to start Tax / fine / penalty them as well. Because governments have never been about controlling peoples behavior. Lots of behaviors are controlled, theft, murder, drug usage, you can be sent to war, if you're transgender you can't serve, etc. etc. Util we become so barbaric as to refuse treatment to people who can't prove they can pay for medical services before they are rendered I am ok with requiring health insurance. Personal responsibility and all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Just now, daveakl said: You've lost me in semantics. It's the government saying you have to either have health insurance or pay $ for choosing not to. It's the price you pay for being an American citizen living here. You lost me, they fine you if you don't get the approved ins. oh wait, it's a tax on not getting maternity ins at 64. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 1 minute ago, twa said: You lost me, they fine you if you don't get the approved ins. oh wait, it's a tax on not getting maternity ins at 64. Yes, in the United States of America you are required to either carry health insurance or pay a penalty for choosing not to. Are you not in favor of that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, daveakl said: Yes, in the United States of America you are required to either carry health insurance or pay a penalty for choosing not to. Are you not in favor of that? No, not in favor Nor does it demonstrate the value of what you want to force upon folk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Just now, twa said: No, not in favor Nor does it demonstrate the value of what you want to force upon folk. Fair enough. What value do I want to force upon folk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsFan44 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 11 minutes ago, twa said: You lost me, they fine you if you don't get the approved ins. oh wait, it's a tax on not getting maternity ins at 64. Single payer is going to make it so much simpler. If the Rs can push through a repeal we will get there faster. Edited July 27, 2017 by RedskinsFan44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Just now, RedskinsFan44 said: Single payer is going to make i so much simpler. If the Rs can push through a repeal we will get there faster. Cali seemed to take a pass on it, if it don't fly there where will it? We need some brave state to step up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsFan44 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Just now, twa said: Cali seemed to take a pass on it, if it don't fly there where will it? We need some brave state to step up. TX? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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